"The King is full of it"

[Sull]

I don't know Rick and have absolutely no opinion on this whatsoever, but thought I would share this YouTube video.

EPISODE I: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4CdP2Z4jGxE

EPISODE II: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uuIRvFaMhls

 

[Rubber Duck]

Yes, iReport was a success, but I think Rick was lucky he was dealing with people that had more on their mind than UDRP. As we know, things are not always that straight forward.

 

[Sameh]

For everyone else, here is the link to Episode II. "The King is DOWN."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uuIRvFaMhls

Have a nice weekend.

For the second time :lol:

Three things I liked in the second video :

1. Many valid points you made in this video.
2. Your laugh.
3. Your msg to Rick in the end (Old Woman)


Looking forward for next Episode :tu:

 

[Rubber Duck]

it is sad that you have two wealthy individuals- and only one of them gets it. and i dont mean domaining.

To be fair to Rick, few wanted to listen when what he had to say was of value, and it would have made a difference to him.

Now everyone wants access when frankly he has run out of ideas and is flapping around trying to find direction, but is wealthy enough to not to have to worry about it all.

I am hoping I might be in a similar situation. I have tried to share my knowledge on IDNs at a time when it would really benefited others greatly to find out more. It would also have developed the market quicker that would have benefited me. In a years time, I probably won't have to worry about things. Everybody will have have woken up, but generally far too late to strike it big. Will I be interested in telling everyone all about it at that stage or wondering how I can help them. I very much doubt it.

The bottom line is that those that have made it rich through their own initiative don't actually owe anyone anything.

 

[wikes82]

I hand regged domainpresident.com this morning (it was dropped on 5/13).. :hehe:

 

[italiandragon]

I take note of this and if I make it to TRAFFIC in Queensland next November I`ll be questioning Mister Schwartz about his parking pages.

 

[RJ]

In a years time, I probably won't have to worry about things. Everybody will have have woken up, but generally far too late to strike it big. Will I be interested in telling everyone all about it at that stage or wondering how I can help them. I very much doubt it.

Add 5-10 years to your timeframe and I'll agree with you on the IDN's. The Internet progresses slower now than it used to. Compare the 5 year period of 1997-2002 to the same length stretch of 2003-2008 and you'll see what I mean.

 

[Rubber Duck]

Add 5-10 years to your timeframe and I'll agree with you on the IDN's. The Internet progresses slower now than it used to.

Sorry, I have to call nonsense on that.

Things have gone off the boil in the US, but in Asia things are coming up quickly from a very low base. This is all going to start to explode from the Paris meeting. In the next three years there will be nearly a thousand New TLDs many of them IDNs. Everyone has been keeping their powder dry, but there is going to be a mad scramble for Extensions after Paris, and ICANN has a massive budget set aside for getting the IDN message out there.

At the moment, you are witnessing the eery silence before the storm. 5-10 years, it has been going 10 years already and much of the delay has been down to Microsoft and their neglect due to a monopoly situation in the browser market. That situation is nearly behind us now. This issuance of IDN TLDs is what everyone has been waiting for. There is confusion over pecking order. Once the new TLDs are established that will evaporate. If it doesn't happen this year, then it probably won't happen at all. It didn't take this bloody long to put a man on the moon.

The next meeting is the 32nd ICANN meeting. Can anyone tell me how many years there have been without at least one meeting in the US? This year it is Delhi, Paris, Cairo. The World is changing. Horizons are broadening, but domainers are generally just ploughing the same tired furrows.

 

[italiandragon]

Sorry, I have to call nonsense on that.

Things have gone off the boil in the US, but in Asia things are coming up quickly from a very low base. This is all going to start to explode from the Paris meeting. In the next three years there will be nearly a thousand New TLDs many of them IDNs. Everyone has been keeping their powder dry, but there is going to be a mad scramble for Extensions after Paris, and ICANN has a massive budget set aside for getting the IDN message out there.

At the moment, you are witnessing the eery silence before the storm. 5-10 years, it has been going 10 years already and much of the delay has been down to Microsoft and their neglect due to a monopoly situation in the browser market. That situation is nearly behind us now. This issuance of IDN TLDs is what everyone has been waiting for. There is confusion over pecking order. Once the new TLDs are established that will evaporate. If it doesn't happen this year, then it probably won't happen at all. It didn't take this bloody long to put a man on the moon.

The next meeting is the 32nd ICANN meeting. Can anyone tell me how many years there have been without at least one meeting in the US? This year it is Delhi, Paris, Cairo. The World is changing. Horizons are broadening, but domainers are generally just ploughing the same tired furrows.

Interesting, this will bring more interest in all domain industry, both IDN and NON IDN.

I have not followed lately IDNs: so I ask you what is hapening now to the old IDNs ? Are thy going to be worthless and replaced by:

IDN.IDNccTLDs ?

Thanks

 

[Kate]

I take note of this and if I make it to TRAFFIC in Queensland next November I`ll be questioning Mister Schwartz about his parking pages.

Don't forget to ask about his parked TM names :blink:

 

[RJ]

The next meeting is the 32nd ICANN meeting. Can anyone tell me how many years there have been without at least one meeting in the US? This year it is Delhi, Paris, Cairo. The World is changing. Horizons are broadening, but domainers are generally just ploughing the same tired furrows.

Not a very good gauge there. ICANN meets three times a year, and in the seven year period of 2002 to 2008 ICANN held just one of the meetings in the USA. They've always held their meetings at obscure locales. Domain registrants are footing the bill, so why not. http://public.icann.org/meetingarchives

Nothing against IDN's. It's great to see them being used in the markets they are intended for. I'm only noting the timeframes that IDN'rs cling to are way too optimistic. We pretty much could of had this same conversation two years ago, and probably will again two years from now.

 

[Rubber Duck]

Well it is a complexed situation, which is why everything is hanging in the air.

One IDN.IDNccTLD already exists but it cannot be resolved through the ICANN Root which is why there has been so much talk of China breaking the Internet. These work well in China. All that has really happened is that fit under and are aliased to dot CN. To make them work, the ISPs simply append dot CN to the end of the strings. After Paris these will quickly work Worldwide you will be able to resolve them outside China as well as inside as it will happen within the ICANN Root. The IDN equivalent of dot CN will be aliased to dot CN. We know this will happen because they have been twined at registration. You could not register one without the other.

We know that a lot of important ccTLDs will also go IDN at the same time, but is not clear that they will be twinned. In the Russian case to avoid Phishing it is almost certain that a separate registry will be set up. In India, it is likely that there will be a dozen different aliases of dot IN.

The big question is how this all affects IDN.Com. Well, I have to go know but I will come back and answer that question as best I can later.

Interesting, this will bring more interest in all domain industry, both IDN and NON IDN.

I have not followed lately IDNs: so I ask you what is hapening now to the old IDNs ? Are thy going to be worthless and replaced by:

IDN.IDNccTLDs ?

Thanks

 

[-db-]

I want to clear up one thing, just so there's no misunderstanding my posts that have been split between these two threads.

There is nothing wrong with parking your domains. It's a perfectly honest, legitimate business.

Yes I feel there are too many of them clogging up the Internet, and yes I'm sick of it, and yes I feel some topics should be handled with special care, like health, religion, depression/suicide... etc. and that's my personal opinion.

But I would hope that in addition to just parking names, domainers would see themselves as MORE, and would at least TRY to develop something. Try to add some type of honest-to-goodness meaningful contribution to the web, even if it's just 1 site. Just pick one domain from your portfolio and build something on it. See what happens!

 

[RJ]

I'll tell you what we need an exposé on. Failed domainers who present themselves as experts and hype-up small niches of domains as the "next big thing," suckering countless people into pissing away their money the same way they did.

We know, the big money is always "coming soon". (not)

 

[Sameh]

But I would hope that in addition to just parking names, domainers would see themselves as MORE, and would at least TRY to develop something. Try to add some type of honest-to-goodness meaningful contribution to the web, even if it's just 1 site. Just pick one domain from your portfolio and build something on it. See what happens!

Actually, Developing is a good addition to any domainer for many reasons:

1. Secure & excellent Cash flow.
2. It will make you understand "better" what exactly end-users are looking for. Which will improve your buying & selling skills.
3. Instead of selling domain makes $100 from Parking monthly for roughly $1200 - $3000 into money machine that will make +$750 every month (minimum)

IMO.

 

[italiandragon]

Well it is a complexed situation, which is why everything is hanging in the air.

One IDN.IDNccTLD already exists but it cannot be resolved through the ICANN Root which is why there has been so much talk of China breaking the Internet. These work well in China. All that has really happened is that fit under and are aliased to dot CN. To make them work, the ISPs simply append dot CN to the end of the strings. After Paris these will quickly work Worldwide you will be able to resolve them outside China as well as inside as it will happen within the ICANN Root. The IDN equivalent of dot CN will be aliased to dot CN. We know this will happen because they have been twined at registration. You could not register one without the other.

We know that a lot of important ccTLDs will also go IDN at the same time, but is not clear that they will be twinned. In the Russian case to avoid Phishing it is almost certain that a separate registry will be set up. In India, it is likely that there will be a dozen different aliases of dot IN.

The big question is how this all affects IDN.Com. Well, I have to go know but I will come back and answer that question as best I can later.

Thanks David, that is very interesting, I guess if you want you should open a new discussion over this so we don`t ruine this thread

Kind Regards

 

[Rubber Duck]

Apologies for the commercial break.

...The point is that it will be 99% certain that the policy will be in place after Paris. What happens to a large extent happens depends on the Registries. Of course registration is not limited to the existing registries but they have already passed the hurdles in terms of showing technical and financial competence. They will also have prior rights that they will be in a position to exercise. However, it is not clear whether they will have complete freedom to exercise those rights as they see fit or how they intend to proceed. This will start to come pretty clear once the applications have been lodged.

There has been a lot of speculation that Verisign would wish to set up a whole slew of parallel dot com registries to make more money. There has also been suggestions that other registries would be given the rights in other languages. Of course at this stage we cannot know for sure, which is why the secondary market has not taken off. Everyone is waiting for clarity. It is, however, pretty clear that nobody else is going to get equivalents of existing TLDs in other languages. The draft policy makes that pretty clear.

So will Verisign want to run parallel dot com registries? Will it make sense for them to do so? Is is even essential they do aliasing at all?

Well taking the last one first, in most languages it is not and in many languages aliasing may not be that significant. Chinese and Japanese characters are most often generated from the inputting of ASCII characters, although there are alternative ways of doing this. Putting extensions in Latin characters presents no challenges whatsoever. The challenge is remembering the strings which are in foreign script to the users. However, many many short abbreviations turn up in Latin characters in most languages. These are generally things that are so unforgeable that it really doesn't matter. The sorts of thing I mean are IP, MP3, TV etc. Of course dot Com in Latin characters is already a mega global brand, probably bigger than Coca Cola and IBM combined. Nobody will have a problem with dot com per se, although there may be some countries where the ccTLD is all pervasive. This is certainly the case in Germany and many thought it would be the case with Russian, but we are already getting good traffic on Cyrillic dot coms, so that seems to put the lie to that one. In Japan and China, dot Com is very well established and preferred by most of the really big sites. When it comes to Arabic there is no direct competition, although it is likely than a Pan Arab extension will emerge, it is not clear whether this can be organised fast enough to compete with dot com. What is clear, however, is that there is an imperative to have aliasing in the Arabic script because of the problem of having bi-directional strings. It is unlikely that ASCII string will really work with right to left languages even though they already generate significant traffic.

Verisign could try to cash in by having separate registries, but it may be that this would not sit comfortably with claims that have prior rights. The rights are there to stop other causing string confusion. It might not be accepted that Verisign then go on to do this themselves. Their actions to date, particularly the DName proposal suggest that they would prefer to have multiple aliases to the same registry. This might sound odd, but the number of strings available in each language is finite, and it is unlikely that different version of dot com can all co-exist successfully side by side, so the potential to sell more name is limited, and dilution of the brand might prove very counter productive, making them uncompetitive against the ccTLD extensions. For this reason, I don't think it makes any sense for Verisign to try to run multiple registries. There is the potential to sell several hundred million more dot coms in the short-term without gambling with the integrity of their mega brand.

The problem is all though this makes perfect sense to me, most speculators are sitting on their hands waiting to see which way the wind blows, but they probably don't appreciate how fast thing is going to move. In China the dot CN alternative is already pretty much sold out already. There just aren't likely to be any new major extension IDNs period. In Russia, there will be a landrush for the New Cyrillic dot RF if things go to form, but actually moving on those as a Western speculator is likely to be a tough call. In India, it is almost 100% certain dot IN will be aliased and I think Japan will go that route as well. Dot Arab could take 5 years or more to set up, by which time IDN.com is likely to well established in an aliased form. So whilst there will be further opportunities from the launches of new extensions general the scope for speculation is likely to be fairly limited and it is not clear how most of these will compete with dot Com that is hugely established in the minds of the local populace albeit largely associated with ASCII strings.

Will ASCII strings survive. Almost certainly. A handful or so in each language will even continue to thrive, but it is expecting too much of people to remember more than an handful of sites in an alien script. It just won't happen. So IDN will dominate Eastern and Northern Europe, the Middle East and virtually the whole of Asia. There usage in Western and Southern Europe will be more patchy, but already the market is not differentiating between IDN.de and ASCII.de.

At the same time, we are getting close to critical mass on browser support in most locations although Japan for one lags seriously behind. There are also different customs for web navigation in some parts. The Japanese have always navigated by Search and Bookmarking because direct navigation has never been an option. In this market, there may be a slight further lag whilst they become more used to using the address bar, which to date has been a bit of White Elephant.

Anyway, to conclude, these major changes are all about to unfold and the will change the shape and structure of the global internet. Most of the Internet Growth areas are those that will also adopt IDN. So is it going to take 5 years? Absolutely not! One maybe two at the most. However, many of our names are already paying for themselves many times over, but on balance our portfolio is not self-sustaining. However, the up tick in traffic that will be required to achieve this is really quite slight and I would expect that to be achieved in the next couple of months. Will we be millionaires over night? Probably not, but we should be able to have a self-financing situation fairly quickly and earn a modest living very soon after the Paris launch. It may take several years to build up a full head of steam, but we have thousands of genuine generics in key commercial terms in a whole slew of languages. I am very confident that we will be able to make most of the established ASCII crowd look rather second rate, but there are a few IDNers out there that will have done much better than us, so I will be sticking the moniker Rubber Duck.

 

[Pred]

Once again a thread hijacked, by yours Rubber Duck

................ back to the 'King' LOL

 

[-db-]

Spoken like a man who's invested heavily in IDN's, I would say.

-db- smashes Arnie upside the head with a dirty toothbrush for beating him by 4 seconds.

 

[michaeldotcom]

I'd like to try and get this interesting thread back on track.

There is nothing wrong with parking your domains. It's a perfectly honest, legitimate business.

But I would hope that in addition to just parking names, domainers would see themselves as MORE, and would at least TRY to develop something. Try to add some type of honest-to-goodness meaningful contribution to the web, even if it's just 1 site. Just pick one domain from your portfolio and build something on it. See what happens!

I completely agree with you on this point, db.

Many domainers on NP and elsewhere have hundreds, thousands or more domains. It's obviously impossible to develop them all and many domains are handregged/purchased only for flipping or selling to end-users.

They're indeed absolutely nothing wrong with parking, as it can provide some well-needed cash to keep up with renewals and to finance other projects.

However I also think that all domainers should as much as possible try and develop some of their names.
Many NPers have developed brilliant websites, and I know that many of them (including me) are currently working hard to develop some of their domains. They're doing so at the same time as buying/selling names, parking some and often having other jobs too.

What slows down development can often be a lack of available funds. But you would expect that the "top domainers" who are often very wealthy and earn lots from parking, would be able to develop many more great websites than most "regular domainers", precisely because they have those funds.

It's indeed sad to see that some of these "top domainers" are just not interested in developing any of their great names.

I think it would give a much better reputation to the domaining industry if more of these well-known domainers were also involved of developing great websites, and possibly even setting up online businesses and creating jobs (just like Amazon did, despite what Rick is saying about them).

 

[Rubber Duck]

The problem is that developing great names generally has little impact on the amount of cash they generate. Unless you turn a Super Generic into a major business, it is unlikely to get the web ranking needed to boost the traffic. Putting up a few pages of information doesn't really cut it and in general experience will have shown that they end up doing a lot of work just to detract from their bottom lines.

If you do the same thing with a mediocre domain, the converse is true. You can easily boost your earnings as the initial type in is often negligible.

If and when it make commercial sense to do it, it will happen.

I'd like to try and get this interesting thread back on track.




I completely agree with you on this point, db.

Many domainers on NP and elsewhere have hundreds, thousands or more domains. It's obviously impossible to develop them all and many domains are handregged/purchased only for flipping or selling to end-users.

They're indeed absolutely nothing wrong with parking, as it can provide some well-needed cash to keep up with renewals and to finance other projects.

However I also think that all domainers should as much as possible try and develop some of their names.
Many NPers have developed brilliant websites, and I know that many of them (including me) are currently working hard to develop some of their domains. They're doing so at the same time as buying/selling names, parking some and often having other jobs too.

What slows down development can often be a lack of available funds. But you would expect that the "top domainers" who are often very wealthy and earn lots from parking, would be able to develop many more great websites than most "regular domainers", precisely because they have those funds.

It's indeed sad to see that some of these "top domainers" are just not interested in developing any of their great names.

I think it would give a much better reputation to the domaining industry if more of these well-known domainers were also involved of developing great websites, and possibly even setting up online businesses and creating jobs (just like Amazon did, despite what Rick is saying about them).

 

[michaeldotcom]

The problem is that developing great names generally has little impact on the amount of cash they generate. Unless you turn a Super Generic into a major business, it is unlikely to get the web ranking needed to boost the traffic. Putting up a few pages of information doesn't really cut it and in general experience will have shown that they end up doing a lot of work just to detract from their bottom lines.

I wasn't really talking of developing minisites with just a few pages of information.

But come on, when you have some serious disposable income and you own a domain like candy.com, wouldn't it be possible to set up a solid online business selling candy online ? That would make a real contribution to the Internet, would create real jobs and would give the domaining industry a much better reputation.
Candy.com is obviously just an example taken from the Angry Domainer video, but it could be applied to any other great domain.

If and when it make commercial sense to do it, it will happen.

I understand what you mean, but there's much more about it than just short-term cash. It's about the whole of the domaining industry, rather than a certain short-sightedness of some "top domainers" who were just lucky to come into the game early but don't have much of a long-term vision.

 

[equity78]

I think the point being overlooked here is just because you were smart,lucky,whatever to reg a quality domain does not mean you can run a business. Turning Candy.com into a business is a major development and you can go from having an asset to having many liabilities overnight if you do not know how to run a business.

and again Welcome Back TIM hope you are feeling better.

 

[Rubber Duck]

Well, I am not sure the Candy.com is the best example. I would prefer to use something like Insurance.com. The competition for ranking is intense, so even if you threw a couple of hundred thousand at the project, you could still end up down on page 10, and because the landing pages would not really be set up like parking pages, your click conversion would be a lot lower. You would end up losing money hand over-fist vis-a-vis simply parking it.

There is also a common understanding that the way to make domains in an extension valuable is for the domainers to throw up thousands of sites. I am convinced that this has no real impact on the overall viability of an extension. It seems me that it is offline advertising spend that makes or breaks extensions, not the commitment of domainers to develop.

 

[michaeldotcom]

I think the point being overlooked here is just because you were smart,lucky,whatever to reg a quality domain does not mean you can run a business. Turning Candy.com into a business is a major development and you can go from having an asset to having many liabilities overnight if you do not know how to run a business.

Very good point indeed.

But that's probably why I tend to have much more respect for people who have developed wonderful websites and set up very successful online businesses rather than for people who have just regged quality domains early in the 90s.

Don't get me wrong. There's nothing wrong with being a domainer only (who wouldn't develop websites or set up businesses). They'a very legit activity.

But well maybe there's no need to be very impressed with people whose only merit was to come into the game very early.

And at the same time, I still think that they could put some efforts into contributing to the Internet (that has given so much to them). They do have the funds to hire developers and people who know how to run businesses, so there's really no excuse there.

 

[Rubber Duck]

Absolutely right. Domainers come into this business in the hope or having a substantial income derived from minimal overhead. Why would they try to launch a business in an industry that they probably have no experience of?

I think the point being overlooked here is just because you were smart,lucky,whatever to reg a quality domain does not mean you can run a business. Turning Candy.com into a business is a major development and you can go from having an asset to having many liabilities overnight if you do not know how to run a business.

and again Welcome Back TIM hope you are feeling better.