discuss Baffled by people against hand reg

[Laguna]

As many of you know, I hand reg all my domains. Most posts I have read are all against it. I am baffled by this as ALL domains were originally hand reg . Your comments and opinions are welcome but NO personal comments about my way of doing things please.

 

[Jay Ha]

Hand regging can seriously burn your fingers and although I've only been around for a mere 4 months but I already seen some people on here with 1000's of hand regs and 0 sales.

Don't be like those guys.

On the other hand, lots of made up words (brandables) are still available. Startups have the option to pay big money (high xx,xxx to xxx,xxx) for a single dictionary word .com, or go for the 'brandable' route (low x,xxx to low xx,xxx). Also, new technologies keep on coming up with new terms that have the potential to become trends. You can hand reg that niche. It needs some research and knowing the market prior to regging your names though.

Listen mate I'm on the same boat as you are. I'm at around 65 domains in my portfolio and only ~10 names were bought from the aftermarket. No name was purchased for more than 20 bucks. Still haven't had a single sale and maybe just a couple lame inquiries. Why? Because the majority of my names are hand regs. You are gonna have to wait 2-3 yrs to start receiving inquiries for this type of names (if you receive any), and you have to be OK with this.

I'm still new and learning here. Won't spend xxx for reselling unless I'm very well informed. However, closeouts can have some really nice names that you wouldn't even dream find while hand regging. I suggest you go through the NP threads that contain lists of handpicked closeouts names. Some members here are spending some valuable time screening those lists.

Every time I find a topic about hand regs I feel that there should be one that opens the discussion to categorize types of hand regs:

1. first time hand regs (never previously regged)
2. drops, which can be categorized into:

Frequency:

• 1st-time droppers (previously held names)
• previously and continuously dropped names

Duration:

• dropped and left behind (as in dropped in like 2013 and never regged since then)
• just dropped (as in dropped in less than a year ago)

I believe that not all hand regs (and mostly dropped names) are equal.

 

[johnnie018]

They are not random.

The portfolio is bad, either learn from it or keep wasting money. On the wrong track completely.

 

[NonHipster]

"Beauty Is In The Eye Of The End User" Quote by NonHipster

 

[johnnie018]

"Beauty Is In The Eye Of The End User" Quote by NonHipster

Doesn’t work when you are banking on someone else buying it, matters what others think, not the domainer who registers it.

 

[.X.]

Hand reging is very very strategic, time consuming as hell and sometimes very frustrating. Name reging has been the backbone of domaining for me. It has kept me afloat.

But not without expense and the need for much much patience, to continue to be able to hand reg names effectively, I had to have a script written that wasn't native to other domainers, that cost me 2k initially, that back in 2012, I have had to 4 updates done to the script since 2012 costing $500 per update. the updates were very important for me to able to stay two steps ahead of average domain spinners. then add in the "Mistake" names, names that you hand reg, but let drop because you see the name is not near as attractive as it was when you reged it, most everyone makes these mistakes but is an expense at the end of each year.

The hold time: There is a hold time required in almost all hand reged names, with a few exceptions. the hold time is most usually 1 to 2 years, sometimes longer, I get offers on newer handreg names, but they are usually pretty low offers. $100 to $300 on names less than 1 year old. so patience is a must.

Don't Harvest hand reg names, This is the key to keeping your head above water, harvesting hand reg names unless you have a high capital budget, is not a good thing at all, a diversified portfolio of liquid names, nice names purchased from auctions is a must IMO.

As many people say, the best names are already registered, this is very true. they aren't hating on the hand reg, just telling the truth, the fact is, people resorted to reverse keyword version of already reged names. Example: Coffeebean to BeanCoffee, in general, this type of hand reging is a waste IMO. although in RARE cases reversing keywords can work pretty nice.

Nice domain names, in general, are hard to come by at a price affordable to be able to make some money without a decent hold time. Hand reg names are getting to the point of being very very hard to find. the best of best have been registered for years, tier 2 and 3 names are most usually not available until they have dropped and passed through auction houses without being purchased. Thier are some tier 4 and tier 5 names that might be able to be hand reged , but if you register those names, you have 3 tiers of names ahead of you for people to purchase.

This is why you see the scrutiny surrounding hand registered names here at other places. IMO , But I will continue to hand reg until the well runs dry, I just love doing it that much. It is much harder for me to replace my inventory of sold hand reg names these days, I guess I am a glutton for punishment lol

 

[3sixty]

Recent handreg domains can sell with enough hustle but don't expect huge ROI unless you are a slick rick with your words and find someone who really really needs that name (in other words- Perfect Timing).

With HugeDomains strategy of buying practically everything the quality of handreg is really sparce right now.

We sold a few recently in the low hundreds with offers in the $xx range on other handregged names.

If those are the margins you want to play at and it is a hobby as you say, then continue with it.

But if you want to play at a higher level than the domain quality will need to naturally be a higher level.

If your a soccer fan then it is no different than the analogy of signing a player already contracted to a club compared to signing a free agent who who had no club offers when his club expired.

EDIT and Disclaimer

What I said above is based on my recent experience handregging with .com domains.

 

[jideofor]

hmmmm

 

[Laguna]

Hand reging is very very strategic, time consuming as hell and sometimes very frustrating. Name reging has been the backbone of domaining for me. It has kept me afloat.

But not without expense and the need for much much patience, to continue to be able to hand reg names effectively, I had to have a script written that wasn't native to other domainers, that cost me 2k initially, that back in 2012, I have had to 4 updates done to the script since 2012 costing $500 per update. the updates were very important for me to able to stay two steps ahead of average domain spinners. then add in the "Mistake" names, names that you hand reg, but let drop because you see the name is not near as attractive as it was when you reged it, most everyone makes these mistakes but is an expense at the end of each year.

The hold time: There is a hold time required in almost all hand reged names, with a few exceptions. the hold time is most usually 1 to 2 years, sometimes longer, I get offers on newer handreg names, but they are usually pretty low offers. $100 to $300 on names less than 1 year old. so patience is a must.

Don't Harvest hand reg names, This is the key to keeping your head above water, harvesting hand reg names unless you have a high capital budget, is not a good thing at all, a diversified portfolio of liquid names, nice names purchased from auctions is a must IMO.

As many people say, the best names are already registered, this is very true. they aren't hating on the hand reg, just telling the truth, the fact is, people resorted to reverse keyword version of already reged names. Example: Coffeebean to BeanCoffee, in general, this type of hand reging is a waste IMO. although in RARE cases reversing keywords can work pretty nice.

Nice domain names, in general, are hard to come by at a price affordable to be able to make some money without a decent hold time. Hand reg names are getting to the point of being very very hard to find. the best of best have been registered for years, tier 2 and 3 names are most usually not available until they have dropped and passed through auction houses without being purchased. Thier are some tier 4 and tier 5 names that might be able to be hand reged , but if you register those names, you have 3 tiers of names ahead of you for people to purchase.

This is why you see the scrutiny surrounding hand registered names here at other places. IMO , But I will continue to hand reg until the well runs dry, I just love doing it that much. It is much harder for me to replace my inventory of sold hand reg names these days, I guess I am a glutton for punishment lol

Great post, very informative

 

[DT13]

I hand reg sind 2014 and sold a lot of names. i made a lot of profit and had made even more profit if I was not so greedy. I have rejected more money than earned. I have a nice portfolio that only becomes more valuable with time. My strategy was future tech names and not inventing names. I have sold several hand regs for 1k and 2k. So it is possible. cctld with good future tech is recommended. Just not be greedy and sell when there is a hype or be prepaired to whait.

 

[Laguna]

Hand reging is very very strategic, time consuming as hell and sometimes very frustrating. Name reging has been the backbone of domaining for me. It has kept me afloat.

But not without expense and the need for much much patience, to continue to be able to hand reg names effectively, I had to have a script written that wasn't native to other domainers, that cost me 2k initially, that back in 2012, I have had to 4 updates done to the script since 2012 costing $500 per update. the updates were very important for me to able to stay two steps ahead of average domain spinners. then add in the "Mistake" names, names that you hand reg, but let drop because you see the name is not near as attractive as it was when you reged it, most everyone makes these mistakes but is an expense at the end of each year.

The hold time: There is a hold time required in almost all hand reged names, with a few exceptions. the hold time is most usually 1 to 2 years, sometimes longer, I get offers on newer handreg names, but they are usually pretty low offers. $100 to $300 on names less than 1 year old. so patience is a must.

Don't Harvest hand reg names, This is the key to keeping your head above water, harvesting hand reg names unless you have a high capital budget, is not a good thing at all, a diversified portfolio of liquid names, nice names purchased from auctions is a must IMO.

As many people say, the best names are already registered, this is very true. they aren't hating on the hand reg, just telling the truth, the fact is, people resorted to reverse keyword version of already reged names. Example: Coffeebean to BeanCoffee, in general, this type of hand reging is a waste IMO. although in RARE cases reversing keywords can work pretty nice.

Nice domain names, in general, are hard to come by at a price affordable to be able to make some money without a decent hold time. Hand reg names are getting to the point of being very very hard to find. the best of best have been registered for years, tier 2 and 3 names are most usually not available until they have dropped and passed through auction houses without being purchased. Thier are some tier 4 and tier 5 names that might be able to be hand reged , but if you register those names, you have 3 tiers of names ahead of you for people to purchase.

This is why you see the scrutiny surrounding hand registered names here at other places. IMO , But I will continue to hand reg until the well runs dry, I just love doing it that much. It is much harder for me to replace my inventory of sold hand reg names these days, I guess I am a glutton for punishment lol

Great post, very informative

I hand reg sind 2014 and sold a lot of names. i made a lot of profit and had made even more profit if I was not so greedy. I have rejected more money than earned. I have a nice portfolio that only becomes more valuable with time. My strategy was future tech names and not inventing names. I have sold several hand regs for 1k and 2k. So it is possible. cctld with good future tech is recommended. Just not be greedy and sell when there is a hype or be prepaired to whait.

Thanks for your feedback. As one of my hand regged is
Futuristictech.uk I am on the right path

 

[mr-x]

Thanks to all that contributed to this debate. Was very informative as usual.

Advice from Mike Mann; if your not registering a .com, choose a popular single word.

 

[Bob Hawkes]

First of all Happy New Year to all my domain friends on NPs and the very best wishes to everyone for 2019 to be a successful one for you. I started the new year right spending most of the day with grandchildren, exploring our urban parks and walks, and did not notice this thread until much was written (and then contributed my sorry attempt at humour re the hypothetical Bob in @JB Lions post, sorry). But on to the topic at hand....

To hand-reg or not has been discussed quite a few times, but still I found insights in a number of the well reasoned arguments in this thread. I have no doubt that hand-reg continues to work well for some. I also have no doubt that the majority, perhaps after trying hand-reg in the early days, find it more profitable now to invest in auctions or drops. I also know that the majority of truly high value sales are names that have remained registered for many years.

I also would suggest that almost all of us could agree that there are situations where hand-reg makes sense. These would include emerging technologies, made up brandables, new social trends, and possibly some geo based names.

One of the strongest arguments against hand registration by new domainers is that easy hand registration may promote quantity over quality in a portfolio. If you are investing $60 you will think more whether the name is indeed worthwhile. That being said, it seems to me that there are lots of names that will never sell being offered on auctions and drops, so that alone is no guarantee of quality (just as age alone may be a filter but is no guarantee of quality).

I think this question could be answered by an analysis (and may try to do one in the future). I did some time ago look at a batch of sales on NameBio and it is true that the majority had been held for some time. However, remember that NameJet and GoDaddy auctions, and DropCatch represent many of the sales automatically reported to NameBio, and by definition many of these are dropping previously held names. Since sales at Affternic, Effty sites, Undeveloped, etc. are not normally reported, the data may have a significant bias.

A second way to test, that would remove this bias but add its own self-report biases. In preparing this post I did read through the last 6 pages of the Report Completed Sales thread. In many cases it shows clearly whether the name was a hand reg or not. It seemed to me that a significant number of the sales on NP sales thread were indeed hand regs (I define that as 2 or fewer renewals and original registration), including sales that were at high $$$ and $$$$ ranges.

As well as logic and statistical data, another possible piece of evidence is whether highly successful domain investors still hand-reg. Some have chimed in to this thread. I would point out that Mike Mann hand registered as recently as 2012 almost 15,000 domain names in a single day. Also, his sales posts that in general give acquisition data, have shown success with some hand registrations since then. Note however that while he registered them in a short period, he did this based on a desired list he had researched over an extended time. If you hand-register never do it on impulse - research and consider the names over a significant time.

I think it is true that even those with high value profiles occasionally hand-register. For example in his recent post about acquisitions in 2018 Elliot Silver points out that he hand registered more than usual in 2018 (he does not give the number but is supposedly high enough if he does not know it without checking) . He has a very strong portfolio and this year has turned down high 5 figure offers. I respect his judgement a lot, and to me this suggests that there is a place for hand registration even in 2019.

Whether to hand register or not is one question that we should all be sure not to confuse what works best for us personally with what is the only route for others to follow.

Some car salespeople sell only new cars, some only high end used cars, some used cars at the low end, and some a mix. There are definitely successful sales people in all categories. The traits to be successful are different in the different categories. The same is true in real estate. Think carefully and decide what is best for you. Listen to arguments of others, but don't blindly accept advice from anyone.

Whether you hand register or drop catch or follow auctions, my main advice is to do your research, stick to niches you understand, think from an end user perspective, emphasize quality over quantity, go slowly in building your portfolio, and play to your strengths. But that is just what I think. It is what you think that counts for you!

Have a happy and prosperous 2019 everyone.

Bob

 

[Bob Hawkes]

I just spent a few hours going through over a month of sales reported on the NP thread for completed sales, looking at TLD, price, sales venue and whether hand reg or not (not clear in all cases but in majority it is). It will take me awhile to put it into a spreadsheet and give complete analysis, but it is clear just in doing it so far that a surprising number were hand regs (I think it will be more than 50% by number but will tell you precisely when I have done it. I defined hand reg as no more than 2 renewals paid.

In terms of Venue, look forward to seeing the exact results by dollar volume, but at least by numbers Undeveloped and Afternic will clearly lead I think.

Anyway, more later, but wanted to share these somewhat surprising to me results that do have bearing on the question of the hand reg question of this thread.

Bob

 

[NonHipster]

Doesn’t work when you are banking on someone else buying it, matters what others think, not the domainer who registers it.

YOU PROVE OUR POINT SO WELL! Like we said -
"Beauty Is In The Eye Of The End User" Quote by NonHipster

 

[Vito]

I just spent a few hours going through over a month of sales reported on the NP thread for completed sales, looking at TLD, price, sales venue and whether hand reg or not (not clear in all cases but in majority it is). It will take me awhile to put it into a spreadsheet and give complete analysis, but it is clear just in doing it so far that a surprising number were hand regs (I think it will be more than 50% by number but will tell you precisely when I have done it. I defined hand reg as no more than 2 renewals paid.

In terms of Venue, look forward to seeing the exact results by dollar volume, but at least by numbers Undeveloped and Afternic will clearly lead I think.

Anyway, more later, but wanted to share these somewhat surprising to me results that do have bearing on the question of the hand reg question of this thread.

Bob

I really like statistics of verified reported domain sales.

That would be an awesome article/spreadsheet to see.

Surprised if it even came close to 50%. Although i would think most important stat of these hand regged verified sales is the timeline of hand reg. Whether those veeified hand-reged somain sales were all regged in last year, couple years as opposed to lets say 10 yr ago hand reg's

Really looking forward to seeing that spreadsheet/article if you do that and post it somewhere.

 

[Bob Hawkes]

I really like statistics of verified reported domain sales.

That would be an awesome article/spreadsheet to see.

Surprised if it even came close to 50%. Although i would think most important stat of these hand regged verified sales is the timeline of hand reg. Whether those veeified hand-reged somain sales were all regged in last year, couple years as opposed to lets say 10 yr ago hand reg's

Really looking forward to seeing that spreadsheet/article if you do that and post it somewhere.

Thanks for our comment. I will definitely be doing an article that will go on NameTalent, and with a summary on NPs and link, but it will be awhile as I want to do more than a simple presentation.

There are a few where it is not clear, and I have a few queries out, but re hand reg I did not count it as hand reg if they said hand reg but it was like 4 years ago. Essentially if it was anything more than 2 renewals I counted it as NOT a hand reg. I started recording hold time, but it was so variably reported I decided to not bother with it.

As you allude, it is self-reported, so that needs to be taken into account. I earlier did an analysis of venue for about a month, and someone suggested that the price info was needed, therefore this time I include TLD and that as well as if apparent hand-reg. There is no doubt the fraction hand-reg will go down for .com only, and down further for high value .com. It may go below 50%. probably will, but there are a lot of sales of hand reg.

I was surprised again this month there were not as many at Sedo as I would have expected. Also surprised how few .net.

I may at some point try to use NameBio with some filters and look at Whois to try to split out hand-reg for some data set, but that is even more work.

Bob

 

[.X.]

Thanks @Bob Hawkes , the census should be very interesting.

I sold 41 hand reg names in 2018, only 8 of them were 2 renewals or less, the rest were 2+ renewals.

I have hand reg names still in my portfolio that go back to 2007 , a lot of renewal fees there, but I go by how many and what $$$ offers I have gotten and do get for them as to thier worth, so paying , so at average of 8.32 a renewal for 11 years is $92.29 per domain name, I hand reged 218 LLLL.coms back in 2006 to 2008, I have only sold 6 of those, so I have 212 4L.coms with 10+ years of renewal fees, but all the original 218 I reged, were straight up fresh hand reged.

I got offers on 314 names that were hand reg in 2018, looking in my Sedo acct, I expect I will able to sell 172 of them in 2019, as the offers on those 172 were close to hitting the sweet spot to sell. But, 167 of those names have 2 + years of renewals.

The ROI on the names I sold that had less than two renewals was beer money, Cheaptoo.com $188 on undeveloped, I posted the receipt in some thread here, another hand reg thread I believe it was. The hold time was 1 renewal on that one.

In my case, I do far better holding my hand reggies for 2 years or more, a slow and going process, but worth it in the end.

I always replace my sold hand reg inventory with more hand reg inventory. I have been doing that since I started domaining, or should I say actually started making domain name sales that actually made more than a $50 ROI, which didn’t start until my third year of domaining.

So I have been doing the so called rinse and repeat with hand reg names for some 15 years now.

I don’t have any stats on how many hand reg names I have let drop through the years, more than I would care to think about I am sure, so those count as money losses of course. Some 0.99 back in the Godaddy hay days, most I would guess regular reg fee between $5.99 to $7.00 a name.

hand Reg names are awesome when you get the prize, but lonely while you are waiting for the prize.

 

[lock]

Nearly all of my domains are hand reg domains and I believe I have some great domains. The other side is you can buy dropped domains that someone else thought it wasn't worth renewing. Can you color in or are you an artist? You either have a creative mind to dream up next big thing or you can watch what is dropped and valuate those keywords search terms. The end of the day a domain is either available or unavailable. How good is it when something relevant hasn't been taken your heart skips a beat as sale goes though.
Thing with expired domains you find something so you start you muck around doing a bit of homework before buying it only to miss out on it. This happens so often it becomes disheartening. The real idea is dream up what YOU want be your own end user find the gem and keep a piece of the pie.

 

[Bob Hawkes]

In case not noticed, user @Trent1000 has just posted a superb analysis of domain sales self-reported on the completed sales NPs thread for the past year. Now he only studied outbound (201 sales in total) but for that data he reports that 78% had been hand-registered. You can see his full detailed analysis here:

https://www.namepros.com/threads/namepros-reported-outbound-sales-of-2018-analysis.1117029/

It is likely that the percentage hand-registered is higher for outbound than inbound, but still this supports the idea that indeed hand reg are being sold.

Bob

 

[xynames]

OP not seeking advice. He’s seeking justification.

 

[johnnie018]

In case not noticed, user @Trent1000 has just posted a superb analysis of domain sales self-reported on the completed sales NPs thread for the past year. Now he only studied outbound (201 sales in total) but for that data he reports that 78% had been hand-registered. You can see his full detailed analysis here:

It is likely that the percentage hand-registered is higher for outbound than inbound, but still this supports the idea that indeed hand reg are being sold.

Bob

Problem is that almost everything owned by NP members is hand reges names so it like taking a group of people wearing blue jumpers and then from those people calculating statistics showing everyone wears blue jumpers.

The vast majority also sold for peanuts so it rules out high quality dropped names.

 

[DomainRecap]

Panning for gold, drilling for oil, buying stock, bitcoin and tons more had their infancy as well, but good luck gong back to basics on those. I think this is the message people are trying to relay..

If there is one trend you are going to notice going forward, it's smart businesses snapping up short and expensive domains before they are gone for good. We saw a lot of that towards the end of 2018 and I almost couldn't load Twitter each morning without another big announcement, and those are only the public sales.

As any market matures, the more the smart money goes towards the very top-end of the scale, such as businesses upgrading to smaller and tighter domain names to match their name in 2019 (i.e. XYZTechnology.com to XZY.com or JonesConsulting.com to Jones.com) before prices really get out of hand.

Not only does this serve a true business need, there is also a lot of prestige associated with upgrading to a higher-end domain - then you can send out a press release and have your competitors and business partners nodding their heads and scratching their chins.

"Hey, it looks like XYZ has finally arrived."

 

[Silentptnr]

I just read a bit about this...
https://morganlinton.com/too-often-people-confuse-domain-age-with-domain-value/

 

[mistressbellek]

My first introduction post on NP was May of last year and it was specifically about the large number of hand regs I had. I still hand register domains, but I also buy some on the auctions and close outs. I’m not here to rush sell my domains. My long term goal is to develop some of them as well as create branding ideas and logos for others. I intentionally hand register a good number of names for emerging and evolving technologies and industries. Sex and tech are two great things and the future of sex is evolving quickly. Over the last few months I’ve focused on domains relating to cannabis, sex, blockchain, 5g, bionics, haptics, neural networks, deep learning, solar power, autonomous vehicles, AI, AR, VR, XR, telehealth etc . I feel strongly that 5g will disrupt many industries such as gaming, aviation, telehealth, robotics..... and so many more. I am well aware of the risk and the fact I make mistakes, but that just drives my ambition and confidence to improve.

The good news is I get weekly inquiries and so far mostly low ball offers, but I have loaned a few xxx adult industry names as redirects ( mainly bodyrub + geo )

Between hand regs and domains I’ve acquired through auctions and close outs I have around 1500 now. A good bit of them are on my site but you have to scroll too much and that’s one of my mistakes therefore I’m hiring a web developer to revamp my site.


Here are a few of my recent hand regs, followed by others I have acquired. I always welcome constructive criticism, but I don’t tolerate domain bullying.
Hand Reg:
Neuralpowered dot com
Microneurology dot com
EngagedBank dot com
5gaviation dot com
Genitalai dot com
BionicAsset dot com
DAppout dot com
DAppem dot com

Gd auction

Fetishclubs dot com
Gened dot com
Leafwallet dot com
Binaryeye dot com
Aiavn dot com
Digitalchain dot com
Primecbdoil dot com
PlantsX dot com

Closeout Domains between $5-11

Riverbud dot com
RebelHash dot com
Locojet dot com
Hotglide dot com
Highhousing dot com
Linkedmobility dot com
Holoheads dot com
Biotransplants dot com

Private deal

Prescribepot dot com

@Lagunaboy I think you have good names . My favorite is vibrogasm

 

[johnnie018]

Here are a few of my recent hand regs, followed by others I have acquired. I always welcome constructive criticism, but I don’t tolerate domain bullying.
Hand Reg:
Neuralpowered dot com
Microneurology dot com
EngagedBank dot com
5gaviation dot com
Genitalai dot com
BionicAsset dot com
DAppout dot com
DAppem dot com

People used to register tens of thousands of 3g domains, mostly a huge waste of money.

Rarely will an enduser "brand" with a tech term and even rarely will they be willing to go to the aftermarket for one and pay a premium price. The above names are extremely poor quality. 5g will soon become 6g and eventually 17g. Endusers know not brand a company with such dating or restrictive terms.

@Lagunaboy I think you have good names.

Oh dear.