question Yes we can transfer newly registered domains?!

[dirk]

This might sound like a newbie question but I'm genuinely curious.

Why can't we transfer out domains that are within their 60 day period after initial registration aka handregs?

I've been into domaining for as long as I can remember and back in the day this was never questioned, it was ICANN policy. I believe it was in 2016 when they made some (relatively big) changes that would allow you to opt out of locks after transfers, owner changes etc.

Yet I never questioned the newly registered domain 'rule'. It's common knowledge right?

Now let's see. Today I registered a domain. I automate a lot so I have my backend scripted to alert me as soon as a domain comes up eligible for transfer. Funnily enough I get a notice right after registration. I was thinking it was a bug so I spent an hour or so going over my code. No surprises there.

Next step I pulled the whois and EPP status code and to my surprise it showed as status 'ok'. This basically means I will be able to transfer out the domain.

So I decided to check out ICANN, questioning myself, doubting my own knowledge.

On one of their FAQs (https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/name-holder-faqs-2017-10-10-en) they state:

There are certain situations that can prevent a domain name from being transferred to a different registrar, such as a new registration. Your registrar may deny a transfer request if the domain name is within 60 days of initial registration.

So this makes me questioning the 'new registration' 60 days lock. Is it a lock imposed upon us by the registrars rather than ICANN policy? If so, not taking into account it's a good security measure, why do registrars always point out ICANN policy as ICANN basically leaves it up to the registrars? Am I misinterpreting this?

So the question is, why do they limit us in our fair use of our domains which benefits only the registrar, not the domainer?

 

[Samer]

For handregs? If so, this is false. I registered a name at Epik at the end of September and sold it early October via Afternic fast transfer (buyer bought it via GoDaddy's registration path). And as much as I pleaded, Epik can't remove the 60-day lock

So since the buyer never heard of Epik, the transaction won't be finalized until late November

Noooo; for 5-7 transfer time I was alluding to;

the pains that make streamlining the process hard.

 

[Spex]

Noooo; for 5-7 transfer time I was alluding to;

the pains that make streamlining the process hard.

5-7?

 

[Samer]

For handregs? If so, this is false. I registered a name at Epik at the end of September and sold it early October via Afternic fast transfer (buyer bought it via GoDaddy's registration path). And as much as I pleaded, Epik can't remove the 60-day lock

So since the buyer has never heard of Epik they will wait until I can transfer it to GoDaddy so the transaction and payment to me won't be finalized until late November

Those are two seperate things;

afternic (Godaddy-owned) offers the most exposure.

Nor egistrar gets around stupid 60 day age lock

 

[Samer]

5-7?

You've never had a transfer take 5-7 days to transfer?

For domains older than 60 days

 

[pb]

That's what I thought. But that lock is a registrar imposed lock. The registry (verisign in this case) and ICANN allow you to transfer again within 60 days. I tried that earlier this year and it worked fine.

Yes, because it's the registrar who wants to protect themselves form frauds, registries and icann don't care, they'll get get their money from the registrar either way.

 

[Spex]

You've never had a transfer take 5-7 days to transfer?

For domains older than 60 days

Ahh, ok. Now I understand what that means

 

[Name Trader]

I know some registrars also block transfers (aged domains) on their end if it has been less than 60 days since previous transfer where others allow it.

There's a few errors in this statement. there may be a few registrars which block transfers of registered domains up to 60 days after a previous transfer, although the rule from ICANN is that you can do the transfer at any time after a previous renewal/transfer, but if it is transfered within 45 days of the previous transfer, you will not get an additional year added to the expiry date. Why? Because they refund the previous registrar for the renewal and then the payment for the transfer, just brings the domain back up to the current registration date.

I have successfully argued with the previous registrar that because they have been refunded, they should refund me. And been refunded. But most registrars, and now including the registrar that refunded me, will refuse to refund you, quoting some clause in their ToS (usually), which is borderline stealing funds which rightfully belong to us. Which we cannot argue with since we have accepted their ToS.

 

[dirk]

There's a few errors in this statement. there may be a few registrars which block transfers of registered domains up to 60 days after a previous transfer, although the rule from ICANN is that you can do the transfer at any time after a previous renewal/transfer, but if it is transfered within 45 days of the previous transfer, you will not get an additional year added to the expiry date. Why? Because they refund the previous registrar for the renewal and then the payment for the transfer, just brings the domain back up to the current registration date.

I have successfully argued with the previous registrar that because they have been refunded, they should refund me. And been refunded. But most registrars, and now including the registrar that refunded me, will refuse to refund you, quoting some clause in their ToS (usually), which is borderline stealing funds which rightfully belong to us. Which we cannot argue with since we have accepted their ToS.

Thanks for that. Never knew. Like I said, it's something I never actually tried untill earlier this year. I think it was between day 50-60.

 

[Abdillahi Abdillahi]

You get that status everytime, however, you will not be able to transfer once you initiate it as you would need to wait for the 60 days rule to end.

 

[dirk]

You get that status everytime, however, you will not be able to transfer once you initiate it as you would need to wait for the 60 days rule to end.

Are you sure? I checked 100 newly registered domains spread across the most popular registrars and none of them come up with EPP status: ok.

I don't have a handreg young enough to try and unlock.

I get the 60 day rule but as mentioned in the opening thread, that rule is not imposed on us by ICANN so who's rule is it?

 

[Abdillahi Abdillahi]

Are you sure? I checked 100 newly registered domains spread across the most popular registrars and none of them come up with EPP status: ok.

I don't have a handreg young enough to try and unlock.

I get the 60 day rule but as mentioned in the opening thread, that rule is not imposed on us by ICANN so who's rule is it?

Every Dynadot registration for example gets that status, however, you cant transfer it. I have seen with other registrars too

 

[alcy]

There's a few errors in this statement. there may be a few registrars which block transfers of registered domains up to 60 days after a previous transfer, although the rule from ICANN is that you can do the transfer at any time after a previous renewal/transfer, but if it is transfered within 45 days of the previous transfer, you will not get an additional year added to the expiry date. Why? Because they refund the previous registrar for the renewal and then the payment for the transfer, just brings the domain back up to the current registration date.

I have successfully argued with the previous registrar that because they have been refunded, they should refund me. And been refunded. But most registrars, and now including the registrar that refunded me, will refuse to refund you, quoting some clause in their ToS (usually), which is borderline stealing funds which rightfully belong to us. Which we cannot argue with since we have accepted their ToS.

hmmm I deal or dealt with some 15 registrars. all of them block transfer within 60 days of both regging and transfering to them. so as far as I know it is not some ..as u say it

 

[biggie]

So since the buyer has never heard of Epik they will wait until I can transfer it to GoDaddy

lol

maybe use godaddy, or wait until after 60 days before trying to sell your names.

then, you might get a chance to learn something about them, during that time.

if you don't know anything about the name, except it's name.....
then how do you know you're getting equitable price for it?

imo...

 

[lock]

The 60 days is here to protect everyone. I am comfortable with the wait as @biggie mentions but doesn't make it clear you can push between accounts at godaddy.

 

[AEProgram]

It was a drop-catched domain, registered at a remote and weird registrar... I ran away as soon as I could!
Otherwise I would not have tried to transfer out a new domain registered by myself.

Via SN? I think they work with registrars on Venus

 

[frank-germany]

Epik (my favorite reg)

everybody and his grandmom
knew that already, Samer

 

[Spex]

lol

maybe use godaddy, or wait until after 60 days before trying to sell your names.

then, you might get a chance to learn something about them, during that time.

if you don't know anything about the name, except it's name.....
then how do you know you're getting equitable price for it?

imo...

What does this even mean? It was an inbound, so I wasn't actively trying to sell it...I just got lucky

And as for getting an equitable price. I priced it based on some research and the buyer bought it at the BIN price. So I'm happy and they seem to be happy too

Other than the delay in transferring the name/getting paid, I'm quite happy with the situation. But then again, I'm not sure what your post means so maybe I'm missing something?

 

[Name Trader]

hmmm I deal or dealt with some 15 registrars. all of them block transfer within 60 days of both regging and transfering to them. so as far as I know it is not some ..as u say it

See https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/transfer-policy-2016-06-01-en
3.9 Instances when the requested change of Registrar may not be denied include, but are not limited to:
3.9.4 Domain name registration period time constraints, other than during the first 60 days of initial registration, during the first 60 days after a registrar transfer, or during the 60-day lock following a Change of Registrant pursuant to Section II.C.2.

This seems to confirm your experience, and the transfer policy is dated 2016. Way before my experience. But I can assure you that I have certainly been able to transfer domains away from NameSilo between 45-60 days were up in the last 18 months. But I've stopped buying in their auctions. So don't know if they now have made that 60 days. But the transfer policy seems quite complicated for mere mortals to understand easily. I certainly recall there being a 45 day rule restriction on adding a 1 year renewal on transfers. Which I don't see any more in this policy. But NameSilo still refer to it.

"As mentioned above, 1 year will be added to the existing expiration date upon transfer completion.
** The only times the extra year is not added to the expiration date is if the domain had been renewed at the previous registrar within 45 days of the transfer" So either they are out of date, or this is addressed in some other document. (this is inbound, but I suffered from this on outbound too, when they released the domain 1 day earlier than ICANN dates, and they gave me a refund).

Which is why I expressed my viewpoint so confidently. But I'm always happy to stand corrected, although I'm not convinced I am 100% wrong

rgds
stu

 

[dirk]

* The only times the extra year is not added to the expiration date is if the domain had been renewed at the previous registrar within 45 days of the transfer" So either they are out of date, or this is addressed in some other document. (this is inbound, but I suffered from this on outbound too, when they released the domain 1 day earlier than ICANN dates, and they gave me a refund).

Interesting. Just to be clear, so that would mean that when you renew and transfer away, let's say the day after you renewed, you wouldn't get an (second) additional year of registration at your new registrar? That can't be right.

 

[Cannuck]

If you hand register a new name and change the owner registration name in your account at GD, they send a confirmation email giving you the option of: "lock for 60 days" or "unlock prior to 60 days".

An auto message confirms, says it will take 5-7 days to complete. I don't know if that makes a difference? I always thought it was a 60 day hold from the start (ICANN), maybe it's possible prior, I haven't tried