NameSilo

Yes we can transfer newly registered domains?!

Labeled as question in General Domain Discussion, started by NameDeck, Oct 19, 2020

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  1. NameDeck

    NameDeck NotElected.com VIP

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    This might sound like a newbie question but I'm genuinely curious.

    Why can't we transfer out domains that are within their 60 day period after initial registration aka handregs?

    I've been into domaining for as long as I can remember and back in the day this was never questioned, it was ICANN policy. I believe it was in 2016 when they made some (relatively big) changes that would allow you to opt out of locks after transfers, owner changes etc.

    Yet I never questioned the newly registered domain 'rule'. It's common knowledge right?

    Now let's see. Today I registered a domain. I automate a lot so I have my backend scripted to alert me as soon as a domain comes up eligible for transfer. Funnily enough I get a notice right after registration. I was thinking it was a bug so I spent an hour or so going over my code. No surprises there.

    Next step I pulled the whois and EPP status code and to my surprise it showed as status 'ok'. This basically means I will be able to transfer out the domain.

    So I decided to check out ICANN, questioning myself, doubting my own knowledge.

    On one of their FAQs (https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/name-holder-faqs-2017-10-10-en) they state:

    There are certain situations that can prevent a domain name from being transferred to a different registrar, such as a new registration. Your registrar may deny a transfer request if the domain name is within 60 days of initial registration.

    So this makes me questioning the 'new registration' 60 days lock. Is it a lock imposed upon us by the registrars rather than ICANN policy? If so, not taking into account it's a good security measure, why do registrars always point out ICANN policy as ICANN basically leaves it up to the registrars? Am I misinterpreting this?

    So the question is, why do they limit us in our fair use of our domains which benefits only the registrar, not the domainer?
     
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  2. Sutruk

    Sutruk Top Contributor VIP

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    Go ahead and try to transfer out the domain, to follow the experiment.
    You can get the status code as "ok", at registrar level.
    At registry level, Verisign won't let you transfer the domain until it passes 60 days from its registration.
    At least, in my experience.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2020
  3. NameDeck

    NameDeck NotElected.com VIP

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    That's a fair point you make. I haven't looked into the registry part of this. But wouldn't ICANN 'outrank' verisign?

    Mh... So maybe verisign is the evil corporation locking our 'precious' assets.

    I've never seen a status ok on a new domain. All commonly used registrars lock your name by default.

    I know some registrars also block transfers (aged domains) on their end if it has been less than 60 days since previous transfer where others allow it.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2020
  4. Sutruk

    Sutruk Top Contributor VIP

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    I see the 60 days lock as a safety measure, same way as when you transfer the domain from a registrar to a new registrar.
    I haven't searched into the matter too much, but if they have placed the 60 days lock I think it's for something.
    I could be worse, let's say 6 months? For me just 60 days is not too much to worry about.
    If you sell a new registered domain, the buyer just has to create an account at the domain registrar and do a domain push. Then 60 days later they can transfer the domain where they want.
    In my opinion.
     
  5. Sutruk

    Sutruk Top Contributor VIP

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    Some time ago I tried to transfer out a new registered domain, I got the registrar ok status and also started the domain transfer (if I remember well, this was a few years ago), but the transfer failed due to the registry lock.
     
  6. NameDeck

    NameDeck NotElected.com VIP

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    Lol, I never even considered to try and transfer a newly registered (gTLD) domain. I think I recall noticing some registrars won't let you unlock it. Not sure.

    Like you said, best way to know/try is by moving the domain. It's registered for a project I'm working on. Gotta wait to make sure DNS propagated globally. I was hoping Namecheap would be running a promo as they're quite progressive when it comes to domain locks. Might be worth the extra couple of bucks if it serves the experiment. Or maybe wait and see what next month brings us in terms of transfer deals :)
     
  7. Sutruk

    Sutruk Top Contributor VIP

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    It was a drop-catched domain, registered at a remote and weird registrar... I ran away as soon as I could!
    Otherwise I would not have tried to transfer out a new domain registered by myself.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2020
  8. biggie

    biggie GreenFriendly.com VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    Hi,


    fair use "includes nominative (commercial) use that is fair and Constitutionally protected speech".

    so, if above quote is your premise for this argument, then:

    your "fair use" potential for the domain is not limited, by a 60 day lock for new registrations, in any way.

    also, domainers don't get special rights or privileges , when it comes to domain registration....unless you own the registrar.

    just saying....


    imo....
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2020
  9. Samer

    Samer Top Contributor VIP

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    Same reason some registrars take 5-7 days
    AND 60 day transfer lock. ICANN are geezers.
    (Like registrars chose keep this archaic rules)
    unilaterally impose abolish“safety” rules, which are just “safely” killing liquidity IMO.

    Great question. Always leads back to ICANN.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2020
  10. NickB

    NickB Wales.org VIP

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    Is it back to ICAAN though?

    @NameDeck posted "Your registrar may deny a transfer request if the domain name is within 60 days of initial registration." (from ICAAN website)

    Does this mean it is discretionary, dependent on the registrar?

    I don't know, this is why I am asking......
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2020
  11. Spex

    Spex Established Member

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    As someone who is not very technical when it comes to locks, why are newly registered domains protected so much? Wouldn't an older domain need more default-protection than a fresh reg?
     
  12. Samer

    Samer Top Contributor VIP

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    Yes, it is.

    Epik (my favorite reg) allows fast transfer.
    Even Godaddy. (#1 marketshare) fast transfer.

    But Hall of Shame remains;
    Network Solutions, eNom, moniker so forth.
    60 day lock is another sham; lock prevents transfer away another registrar; but Push OK. The 60 day lock BS is more implemented; but tolerable; since it just req suffer w/ em 60 days.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2020
  13. alcy

    alcy Top Contributor VIP

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    prolly some biz move..that icann or registrars may call something else.. to increase odds of keeping u and yer name with them as clients
     
  14. Samer

    Samer Top Contributor VIP

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    “increase the odds”

    aliyun the “Godaddy of China” (Alibaba Cloud) makes you wait 7 long days for transfer away.
    They will defer to “China rules” which is wrong.
    ICANN rules (imo) 22 & ename have fast xfer.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2020
  15. NameDeck

    NameDeck NotElected.com VIP

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    Ah, you got me there :) I agree domainers shouldn't be treated differently, but no matter who the registrant is, if it's not ICANN, who's limiting the option to transfer?

    I never had issues pushing domains in the past when I couldn't transfer but the option to transfer to the buyers registrar of choice, even within 60 days of initial registration, would streamline the process much more.
     
  16. Samer

    Samer Top Contributor VIP

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    Yup, you bring up one of my (many) gripes :)

    Thanks, all in all; it would streamline proces.

    The one you mentioned; is often overlooked.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2020
  17. NameDeck

    NameDeck NotElected.com VIP

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    Probably right. Which is fair enough. I don't mind. It's sales. It's business. What's lacking most of the time is the transparency about this. Registrars are quoting outdated ICANN policy way to easily.
     
  18. pb

    pb Top Contributor VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    It's not about the domain. It protects the registrar against many kinds of frauds, such as chargebacks. That's why there is also a lock after transfer (since .com transfers are connected with renewals).
     
  19. NameDeck

    NameDeck NotElected.com VIP

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    That's what I thought. But that lock is a registrar imposed lock. The registry (verisign in this case) and ICANN allow you to transfer again within 60 days. I tried that earlier this year and it worked fine.
     
  20. Spex

    Spex Established Member

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    For handregs? If so, this is false. I registered a name at Epik at the end of September and sold it early October via Afternic fast transfer (buyer bought it via GoDaddy's registration path). And as much as I pleaded, Epik can't remove the 60-day lock

    So since the buyer has never heard of Epik they will wait until I can transfer it to GoDaddy so the transaction and payment to me won't be finalized until late November
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2020
  21. Samer

    Samer Top Contributor VIP

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    Noooo; for 5-7 transfer time I was alluding to;

    the pains that make streamlining the process hard.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2020
  22. Spex

    Spex Established Member

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    5-7?
     
  23. Samer

    Samer Top Contributor VIP

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    Those are two seperate things;

    afternic (Godaddy-owned) offers the most exposure.

    Nor egistrar gets around stupid 60 day age lock
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2020
  24. Samer

    Samer Top Contributor VIP

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    You've never had a transfer take 5-7 days to transfer?

    For domains older than 60 days
     
  25. pb

    pb Top Contributor VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    Yes, because it's the registrar who wants to protect themselves form frauds, registries and icann don't care, they'll get get their money from the registrar either way.
     

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