question Yes we can transfer newly registered domains?!

[branding]

This might sound like a newbie question but I'm genuinely curious.

Why can't we transfer out domains that are within their 60 day period after initial registration aka handregs?

I've been into domaining for as long as I can remember and back in the day this was never questioned, it was ICANN policy. I believe it was in 2016 when they made some (relatively big) changes that would allow you to opt out of locks after transfers, owner changes etc.

Yet I never questioned the newly registered domain 'rule'. It's common knowledge right?

Now let's see. Today I registered a domain. I automate a lot so I have my backend scripted to alert me as soon as a domain comes up eligible for transfer. Funnily enough I get a notice right after registration. I was thinking it was a bug so I spent an hour or so going over my code. No surprises there.

Next step I pulled the whois and EPP status code and to my surprise it showed as status 'ok'. This basically means I will be able to transfer out the domain.

So I decided to check out ICANN, questioning myself, doubting my own knowledge.

On one of their FAQs (https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/name-holder-faqs-2017-10-10-en) they state:

There are certain situations that can prevent a domain name from being transferred to a different registrar, such as a new registration. Your registrar may deny a transfer request if the domain name is within 60 days of initial registration.

So this makes me questioning the 'new registration' 60 days lock. Is it a lock imposed upon us by the registrars rather than ICANN policy? If so, not taking into account it's a good security measure, why do registrars always point out ICANN policy as ICANN basically leaves it up to the registrars? Am I misinterpreting this?

So the question is, why do they limit us in our fair use of our domains which benefits only the registrar, not the domainer?

 

[Sutruk]

Next step I pulled the whois and EPP status code and to my surprise it showed as status 'ok'. This basically means I will be able to transfer out the domain.

Go ahead and try to transfer out the domain, to follow the experiment.
You can get the status code as "ok", at registrar level.
At registry level, Verisign won't let you transfer the domain until it passes 60 days from its registration.
At least, in my experience.

 

[biggie]

So the question is, why do they limit us in our fair use of our domains which benefits only the registrar, not the domainer?

Hi,


fair use "includes nominative (commercial) use that is fair and Constitutionally protected speech".

so, if above quote is your premise for this argument, then:

your "fair use" potential for the domain is not limited, by a 60 day lock for new registrations, in any way.

also, domainers don't get special rights or privileges , when it comes to domain registration....unless you own the registrar.

just saying....


imo....

 

[Spex]

As someone who is not very technical when it comes to locks, why are newly registered domains protected so much? Wouldn't an older domain need more default-protection than a fresh reg?

 

[Name Trader]

I know some registrars also block transfers (aged domains) on their end if it has been less than 60 days since previous transfer where others allow it.

There's a few errors in this statement. there may be a few registrars which block transfers of registered domains up to 60 days after a previous transfer, although the rule from ICANN is that you can do the transfer at any time after a previous renewal/transfer, but if it is transfered within 45 days of the previous transfer, you will not get an additional year added to the expiry date. Why? Because they refund the previous registrar for the renewal and then the payment for the transfer, just brings the domain back up to the current registration date.

I have successfully argued with the previous registrar that because they have been refunded, they should refund me. And been refunded. But most registrars, and now including the registrar that refunded me, will refuse to refund you, quoting some clause in their ToS (usually), which is borderline stealing funds which rightfully belong to us. Which we cannot argue with since we have accepted their ToS.

 

[pb]

As someone who is not very technical when it comes to locks, why are newly registered domains protected so much? Wouldn't an older domain need more default-protection than a fresh reg?

It's not about the domain. It protects the registrar against many kinds of frauds, such as chargebacks. That's why there is also a lock after transfer (since .com transfers are connected with renewals).

 

[pb]

That's what I thought. But that lock is a registrar imposed lock. The registry (verisign in this case) and ICANN allow you to transfer again within 60 days. I tried that earlier this year and it worked fine.

Yes, because it's the registrar who wants to protect themselves form frauds, registries and icann don't care, they'll get get their money from the registrar either way.

 

[biggie]

So since the buyer has never heard of Epik they will wait until I can transfer it to GoDaddy

lol

maybe use godaddy, or wait until after 60 days before trying to sell your names.

then, you might get a chance to learn something about them, during that time.

if you don't know anything about the name, except it's name.....
then how do you know you're getting equitable price for it?

imo...

 

[frank-germany]

Epik (my favorite reg)

everybody and his grandmom
knew that already, Samer

 

[Sutruk]

That's a fair point you make. I haven't looked into the registry part of this. But wouldn't ICANN 'outrank' verisign?

Mh... So maybe verisign is the evil corporation locking our 'precious' assets.

I've never seen a status ok on a new domain. All commonly used registrars lock your name by default.

I know some registrars also block transfers (aged domains) on their end if it has been less than 60 days since previous transfer where others allow it.

I see the 60 days lock as a safety measure, same way as when you transfer the domain from a registrar to a new registrar.
I haven't searched into the matter too much, but if they have placed the 60 days lock I think it's for something.
I could be worse, let's say 6 months? For me just 60 days is not too much to worry about.
If you sell a new registered domain, the buyer just has to create an account at the domain registrar and do a domain push. Then 60 days later they can transfer the domain where they want.
In my opinion.

 

[Sutruk]

I've never seen a status ok on a new domain. All commonly used registrars lock your name by default.

Some time ago I tried to transfer out a new registered domain, I got the registrar ok status and also started the domain transfer (if I remember well, this was a few years ago), but the transfer failed due to the registry lock.

 

[Spex]

You've never had a transfer take 5-7 days to transfer?

For domains older than 60 days

Ahh, ok. Now I understand what that means

 

[lock]

The 60 days is here to protect everyone. I am comfortable with the wait as @biggie mentions but doesn't make it clear you can push between accounts at godaddy.

 

[branding]

Go ahead and try to transfer out the domain, to follow the experiment.
You can get the status code as "ok", at registrar level.
At registry level, Verisign won't let you transfer the domain until it passes 60 days from its registration.
At least, in my experience.

That's a fair point you make. I haven't looked into the registry part of this. But wouldn't ICANN 'outrank' verisign?

Mh... So maybe verisign is the evil corporation locking our 'precious' assets.

I've never seen a status ok on a new domain. All commonly used registrars lock your name by default.

I know some registrars also block transfers (aged domains) on their end if it has been less than 60 days since previous transfer where others allow it.

 

[Samer]

Same reason some registrars take 5-7 days
AND 60 day transfer lock. ICANN are geezers.
(Like registrars chose keep this archaic rules)
unilaterally impose abolish“safety” rules, which are just “safely” killing liquidity IMO.

Great question. Always leads back to ICANN.

 

[NickB]

Same reason some registrars take 5-7 days
AND 60 day transfer lock. ICANN are geezers.
(Like registrars chose keep this archaic rules)
unilaterally impose abolish“safety” rules, which are just “safely” killing liquidity IMO.

Great question. Always leads back to ICANN.

Is it back to ICAAN though?

@NameDeck posted "Your registrar may deny a transfer request if the domain name is within 60 days of initial registration." (from ICAAN website)

Does this mean it is discretionary, dependent on the registrar?

I don't know, this is why I am asking......

 

[Samer]

Is it back to ICAAN though?

@NameDeck posted "Your registrar may deny a transfer request if the domain name is within 60 days of initial registration." (from ICAAN website)

Does this mean it is discretionary, dependent on the registrar?

I don't know, this is why I am asking......

Yes, it is.

Epik (my favorite reg) allows fast transfer.
Even Godaddy. (#1 marketshare) fast transfer.

But Hall of Shame remains;
Network Solutions, eNom, moniker so forth.
60 day lock is another sham; lock prevents transfer away another registrar; but Push OK. The 60 day lock BS is more implemented; but tolerable; since it just req suffer w/ em 60 days.

 

[branding]

Hi,


fair use "includes nominative (commercial) use that is fair and Constitutionally protected speech".

so, if above quote is your premise for this argument, then:

your "fair use" potential for the domain is not limited, by a 60 day lock for new registrations, in any way.

also, domainers don't get special rights or privileges , when it comes to domain registration....unless you own the registrar.

just saying....


imo....

Ah, you got me there I agree domainers shouldn't be treated differently, but no matter who the registrant is, if it's not ICANN, who's limiting the option to transfer?

I never had issues pushing domains in the past when I couldn't transfer but the option to transfer to the buyers registrar of choice, even within 60 days of initial registration, would streamline the process much more.

 

[Samer]

Ah, you got me there I agree domainers shouldn't be treated differently, but no matter who the registrant is, if it's not ICANN, who's limiting the option to transfer?

I never had issues pushing domains in the past when I couldn't transfer but the option to transfer to the buyers registrar of choice, even within 60 days of initial registration, would streamline the process much more.

Yup, you bring up one of my (many) gripes

Thanks, all in all; it would streamline proces.

The one you mentioned; is often overlooked.

 

[Spex]

Epik (my favorite reg) allows fast transfer

For handregs? If so, this is false. I registered a name at Epik at the end of September and sold it early October via Afternic fast transfer (buyer bought it via GoDaddy's registration path). And as much as I pleaded, Epik can't remove the 60-day lock

So since the buyer has never heard of Epik they will wait until I can transfer it to GoDaddy so the transaction and payment to me won't be finalized until late November

 

[Abdullah Abdullah]

You get that status everytime, however, you will not be able to transfer once you initiate it as you would need to wait for the 60 days rule to end.

 

[Cannuck]

If you hand register a new name and change the owner registration name in your account at GD, they send a confirmation email giving you the option of: "lock for 60 days" or "unlock prior to 60 days".

An auto message confirms, says it will take 5-7 days to complete. I don't know if that makes a difference? I always thought it was a 60 day hold from the start (ICANN), maybe it's possible prior, I haven't tried

 

[branding]

Some time ago I tried to transfer out a new registered domain, I got the registrar ok status and also started the domain transfer (if I remember well, this was a few years ago), but the transfer failed due to the registry lock.

Lol, I never even considered to try and transfer a newly registered (gTLD) domain. I think I recall noticing some registrars won't let you unlock it. Not sure.

Like you said, best way to know/try is by moving the domain. It's registered for a project I'm working on. Gotta wait to make sure DNS propagated globally. I was hoping Namecheap would be running a promo as they're quite progressive when it comes to domain locks. Might be worth the extra couple of bucks if it serves the experiment. Or maybe wait and see what next month brings us in terms of transfer deals

 

[Sutruk]

Lol, I never even considered to try and transfer a newly registered (gTLD) domain. I think I recall noticing some registrars won't let you unlock it. Not sure.

It was a drop-catched domain, registered at a remote and weird registrar... I ran away as soon as I could!
Otherwise I would not have tried to transfer out a new domain registered by myself.

 

[alcy]

prolly some biz move..that icann or registrars may call something else.. to increase odds of keeping u and yer name with them as clients