Why are all domainers so Damn scared?

[DnPresident]

I've seen so many threads started over the last couple of months asking: Who is the best parking service? The correct answer seems to be, no one parking service. Certain parking services pay more than others for certain categories/subjects.

So, Why are all domainers so Damn scared to post what each parking program pays per category? I see nothing to lose but everything to gain.

Some have told me that it would hurt the industry, How? Since the industry is based on domainers, domainers should know who pays what.

I think it's time for second guessing to stop on who pays what for what. There should be set standards , a pay scale of some sort.

The wondering only hurts the domain owner. Reveron T may get $2.70 per click while Reveron b Gets only .06 is wrong.

If we could get that straight then we can work on a system to stop the click shaving. Click shaving is when you get for example 100 visitors and 150 clicks but the parking company only shows 100 visitors and 101 clicks.

Dave Crutcher

 

[Badger]

It always surprises me that people think their domains are worth more than a few cents a click...

Like Ive said soooo many times recently, its not about traffic volumes anymore, its about traffic quality. The root feed providers have moved the goalposts, rewarding those that provide traffic that converts and punishing those that dont.

Chasing high paying keywords is just a fruitless exercise and sooooooo 2004.

 

[verbster]

www.parkfight.com - This is similar to what you guys are looking for, right?

Where did this come from? Can't speak for others, but there is absolutely no way Sedo pays more than all others.

 

[DnPresident]

It always surprises me that people think their domains are worth more than a few cents a click...

Like Ive said soooo many times recently, its not about traffic volumes anymore, its about traffic quality. The root feed providers have moved the goalposts, rewarding those that provide traffic that converts and punishing those that dont.

Chasing high paying keywords is just a fruitless exercise and sooooooo 2004.

Even though the thread I started has nothing to do with adsense and nothing to do with chasing high paying keywords for adsense

I agree with the traffic quality and quantity part.

I do not agree with you insinuating a click is worth no more than a few cents. If I have CaliforniaMonuments.graves and a visitor shows up on my lander and clicks a related link which in turn converts into a $5,000 grave monument being sold in which the mark up is $2,000 then yeah I believe it's worth much more than a few cents and much more than even a few dollars and I'm sure the person wouldn't mind paying a nice CPC.

You may even be hinting the parking company should get more than the domain holder.

A few cents :yell:

I hope you don't have anything to do with running a parking company!

 

[SharonTucci]

I think a lot of people on here are confusing the original idea of this thread, which I beleive was which parking company pays the most for which types of domains, into which keywords pay the most for those domains.

It isn't JUST about categories. It does come down to a keyword level along with other factors.

If a parking company is using Google or Yahoo/Overture and you do a bit of legwork, it is rather easy to figure out what a parking company's rev share is from the feed if you know YOUR cut. Even if you don't know your cut, just by comparing the EPC on a few keywords to what Google or Yahoo/Overture are charging advertisers, you can guesstimate what your EPC will be.

The thing here is that it goes well beyond best paying keywords and EPC when talking about parking programs. Another big variable here are the landing pages. There are big differences from one to another.

You can't even compare CPM because some parking companies filter out traffic.

 

[Badger]

Even though the thread I started has nothing to do with adsense and nothing to do with chasing high paying keywords for adsense

Then what are you on about?? Just Yahoo Domain Match clicks?

I do not agree with you insinuating a click is worth no more than a few cents. If I have CaliforniaMonuments.graves and a visitor shows up on my lander and clicks a related link which in turn converts into a $5,000 grave monument being sold in which the mark up is $2,000 then yeah I believe it's worth much more than a few cents and I'm sure the person wouldn't mind paying a nice CPC.

Yeah, nice example, thats just what managing hundred of thousands of domains is all about, each one converting to a $3000 profit for the advertiser. Hell, then youre right, clicks in your realistic instance should be worth at least $1000 a time. Shoot, everyones getting ripped off by parking companies... OMG... There was me thinking it was a continuous battle against click fraud, advertisers complaining to the feed providers about the domain channel and parking companies trying to reward the good and extinguish the bad.. How far off base could i be..

You may even be hinting the parking company should get more than the domain holder.

I hope you don't have anything to do with running a parking company!

Now youve lost all credibility... Am I trying to reason with a kid here...????

 

[Kenny]

Missed that whole listen part.
Listening is the great educator, and it is very hard to listen while speaking.

This forum has a Tradition of top-quality, unselfish members willing to help US learn and understand the subtle in's and out's that are the difference between a "collector" and a "Domainer". The equivalence of a Harvard or Oxford education, taught by the best in the world, and all you have to do is pay attention, listen, ask, listen some more, thank people for their time, listen some more, help contribute when and where possible, listen some more, and when you think you really might know something and want to comment in a senior members thread or help to appraise a two letter .org for someone... Drink another big cup of S-T-F-U and listen some more, and thank someone!

 

[DnPresident]

Now youve lost all credibility... Am I trying to reason with a kid here...????

Just tell me you do not have anything to do with running a parking company and I will feel Sooooo much better about your comment on clicks from domains don't deserve more than a few cents.

 

[Kenny]

LeeRyder resurrected.

 

[Badger]

Just tell me you do not have anything to do with running a parking company and I will feel Sooooo much better about your comment on clicks from domains don't deserve more than a few cents.

Sure, I'll confirm this fact as soon as you confirm you dont expect $ clicks from domains such usoceanfrontproperty.com, chi-nese.com..

Maybe you can give us an example of one of your domains you believe you should be getting dollar+ clicks on??

 

[DnPresident]

Sure, I'll confirm this fact as soon as you confirm you dont expect $ clicks from domains such usoceanfrontproperty.com, chi-nese.com..

Maybe you can give us an example of one of your domains you believe you should be getting dollar+ clicks on??

You first, I'll give you a list of 350-400 to choose from ,,,

Don't tell me dooceed.net or what ever it is or even better Dollar.sg (Killer names

 

[Badger]

You first, I'll give you a list of 350-400 to choose from ,,,

Don't tell me dooceed.net or what ever it is

Jeez man, how many edits you gonna do...

I count about 60 or so on your godaddy free hosted twilight page - you have the jems tucked away elsewhere?

 

[DnPresident]

Jeez man, how many edits you gonna do...

I count about 60 or so on your godaddy free hosted twilight page - you have the jems tucked away elsewhere?

Surely not, Thanks for counting those for me.

 

[Varon]

Like Ive said soooo many times recently, its not about traffic volumes anymore, its about traffic quality. The root feed providers have moved the goalposts, rewarding those that provide traffic that converts and punishing those that dont.

You mean the root feed providers like Yahoo, Google and Ask have started penalizing bad parking traffic providers who in turn are paying low payouts to domaineers?

That would mean that the current low paying parking companies are on the red flag list of feed providers? I would assume these low converting bad quality traffic companies are presumably Sedo and a few others?

Advertisers have also to realize that bad products get low conversions. If you check the products being sold, you would easily realize why the conversions are so low. And if the feed providers start weaning out the low performing domain traffic (which accounts for a huge chunk), the time will slowly come when there will be no publishers or domains left to get even a trickle of traffic to the advertisers wanting the world out of their worthless products. If you notice, most of the products are affiliate sales ads with totally junk services.

The other part being, we no longer live in a world where there are some "rare" researched keywords which are privy to a few lucky ones. If we live in the thought that we have brilliantly researched and toiled over months to find a keyword that pays 80 cents a click which nobody else knows about, its prehistoric. If some parking company would ever be kind enough to let out stats, you would be shocked to learn that your very "rare keyword" is being used by thousands of others without actually diluting any market "supply demand chains" or econometric models. One glance at the adwords tool and other resources can give even a new domaineer insights as to what good keywords really exist. Honestly speaking, it takes me 5 minutes these days to figure out a good paying keyword. I'm getting 90 cents on guess what... "granny porn" links at PP. I sincerely feel that those who are researching keywords for CPC for months...finding one..and then only being let down a few days later to see the same fall...and starting the process over and over again are wasting their time for a fruitless end. They'd rather be better off using that time to research high KEI domains.

This being a fair market, and not a monopoly, demand supply inequalities have to be balanced by even higher bids for those same keywords to retain top visibility by advertisers. That is why you still see DUI keywords retaining their high CPC even though your have thousands of sites using those keywords. Advertisers now have to pay more to get noticed for that keyword.

I'm not sure whom we are supporting here... our "closely guarded keywords" or the parking companies? It should be our goal to actively get more transparency and ween out the bad parking providers who in turn may have been flagged by feed providers. No point doing business with them. Why should we? Even if a parking provider A pays 20 cents less, why should we keep our domains with them? Don't we all try to save our dimes and nickels via coupons and rebates and try to get the best deal on our buys? Why should our domains not enjoy the same liberty? These are our own time spent researched buys and we need to make the most out of them. We need to know where to park them at without being in the dark forever.

Btw, my posts have never been targeted to disrespect anyones opinions and are purely my own thoughts which are open to being flawed at times. I hope that we can all work together and just not dismiss a particular line of thinking without giving it some real deep unbiased thought.

 

[Michael]

Everyone taking their sites in a certain category to a parking company that pays well for that category will not affect supply in and of itself.

However, consider this scenario: Someone is cruising the thread and sees someone saying "Company X paid me $1 for <category> while company Y paid me $9," they are going to buy a bunch of domains in that category and park them at company Y, which will water down the payouts.

There is no point to share unless you are feeling generous or mentoring someone out of the kindness of your heart.

 

[Kenny]

^^^^^^^^^ Varon is an example of someone that has done his homework.

 

[Badger]

You mean the root feed providers like Yahoo, Google and Ask have started penalizing bad parking traffic providers who in turn are paying low payouts to domaineers?

Absolutely... Smartpricing is attached to a parking companies google client ID. Same for Yahoo's panama project. If their algo determines that a parking companies client ID is serving up crap then punished it shall be. It forces parking companies to bring their house to order.

unfortunately, there are so many bad affiliates in the marketplace that good guys like you folk here suffer.

Right also about bad parking companies, the root feed providers seriously think that there will consolidation in the parking market, the bad parking companies who dont police their traffic being forced from the marketplace.

The good news is, things will get better for the good guys but obtaining and holding a parking account will be harder in the future.

ASK simply have a sub syndicatable google feed, the same as namedrive, sedo, DS etc etc.

 

[Varon]

Absolutely... Smartpricing is attached to a parking companies google client ID. Same for Yahoo's panama project. If their algo determines that a parking companies client ID is serving up crap then punished it shall be. It forces parking companies to bring their house to order.

unfortunately, there are so many bad affiliates in the marketplace that good guys like you folk here suffer.

Right also about bad parking companies, the root feed providers seriously think that there will consolidation in the parking market, the bad parking companies who dont police their traffic being forced from the marketplace.

The good news is, things will get better for the good guys but obtaining and holding a parking account will be harder in the future.

ASK simply have a sub syndicatable google feed, the same as namedrive, sedo, DS etc etc.

Badger you somehow tend to reveal great information at crucial times which makes things so interesting. I also remember the bit about the feed provider that provides bulk figures and not itemized CPC... lol...that really shocked me. Thanks for your inputs again Badger.

I'm gonna write a long post in a few minutes again...lol... a carefully researched one and in the meantime to ease things.... have a look at my swissmilf... in my siggy...she's not getting any attention...

 

[verbster]

However, consider this scenario: Someone is cruising the thread and sees someone saying "Company X paid me $1 for <category> while company Y paid me $9," they are going to buy a bunch of domains in that category and park them at company Y, which will water down the payouts.

Not necessarily. It's been very public knowlege that some parking services pay more than others for certain niches, yet the EPC is still high. For example, (regardless of what "parkfight,com" shows) Fabulous has been paying very high EPC for polker and loan domains for years. Even with domainers knowing this, and parking there, they still pay out $1+ on them.

 

[Kenny]

Not necessarily. It's been very public knowlege that some parking services pay more than others for certain niches, yet the EPC is still high. For example, (regardless of what "parkfight,com" shows) Fabulous has been paying very high EPC for polker and loan domains for years. Even with domainers knowing this, and parking there, they still pay out $1+ on them.

This is because Fab only accepts high quality names, thus they filter out the low return crappola and strike a better deal with the upstream provider.
And that is the way the Parking Services are going to go.

We (NamePros) are still in the process of putting together the Parking & Domain Monetization Online Conference and inviting the Services to answer our questions. We have several reps that have agreed already, and with some hard work this will come to pass.

You guys want transparency... we deliver.

 

[Varon]

Thanks Cyberian. I need to get in touch with -X- and follow up on some things over the conference plans.

Continuing from where I left, lets take a look at how our advertisers use their campaign funds and then cry when they see low conversions and blame it all on the "quality of traffic".

Here's a search for the keyword "va discount carpets". Not a great keyword and needs around 5 cents CPC to be in the 1-3 ad position. Very nice. But look at who we have in the top 1-2 positions. Totally unrelated advertisers wanting to sell me floorings instead of carpets.

Thanks to Google's nice light colored shading and "mountain view researched algorithmic color combos"( I'm sorry but Google loves that word.. "algorithmic", it somehow makes them sound brilliant each time), I would be tempted to visit the flooring companies while I was actually looking for carpets. What do you suppose I would do? Most likely bounce out in a minute and they end up paying the 5 cents to google and maybe even lesser to a content network ad.

Here's a parking page ad...

The keyword was "indian movies". Now let us visit lowpriceshopper and search for the same keywords. We come up with 8 results and mostly irrelevant. Would someone really buy from that page? Most likely NO.

Advertisers have to realize that their current practice of just getting a wordtracker keyword list and inserting it into their campaign is meaningless without knowing the relevance of the keywords with their offered products. This is the main reason why their sales are suffering and not because of the quality of traffic. Their adword campaigns have misleading words and their end goal is totally lost. They feel that the more keywords they add to their list, the more visitors they will get. This is true, but whats the point of having someone searching for carpets come to your flooring site? And later when these advertisers check their adwords expense account, they start getting frustrated and in turn direct their wrath at Google and the whole chain starts, finally affecting the publisher and domaineer.

I am an adwords customer too and I use the adwords campaign to get visitors to my domain parking site. But.. I've made sure to throw out words like "free domain parking". Why? Because, that visitor is actually not intending to spend a 100 bucks or even 2 bucks on a parking solution. My using that keyword would be a total waste of effort and I really cannot blame Google for it.

The day seems too distant when advertisers really spend some time researching their keywords and relative value to their offered service.

The point here is, lets not blame our plight on the quality of our domain traffic and other factors. I know, that feed providers no longer care, but we should know for sure, that we have humans visiting our sites (in most cases...lol) and every visitor is top quality monetary potential wasted by advertisers and their misrepresented products and ad campaigns.

Unfortunately we are constantly blamed for the folly of others. Sad but true..

 

[nielsencl]

For what it's worth, I have a friend that has about 8,000 domains. He has been working at this for a number of years and he has been awesome in his sharing of information (not bragging).

What he told me (as a newbie, 250 hyphen-infested domains) is that he uses a lot of different parking services and if a domain does not work well, he tries it somewhere else for a while. Sometimes they just work better at one than another. When he gets a return he is happy with, it stays there. If he can't get the return he likes, he sells it to a sucker like me (just kidding, but he does sell them for fair prices so he can reinvest in better domains).

I've tried about 4 services now, and found one that I am spending most of my time with. I did try DomainEmbarking.com, but they never approved my domain or responded to any of my emails. I would see if you can make a personal contact with someone there before trying them.

 

[mmurch03]

Hopefully this is appropriate in this thread, but as an adwords user, I can't expect anyone to make very much per click from the keywords I pay for when I am only paying $0.10 per click. Google takes their cut and then the domain owner gets theirs, but it's really only out of $0.10...and that's the highest I will pay. I imagine there are a lot of people like me out there.

Hope that adds something to this discussion.

 

[DnPresident]

Hopefully this is appropriate in this thread, but as an adwords user, I can't expect anyone to make very much per click from the keywords I pay for when I am only paying $0.10 per click. Google takes their cut and then the domain owner gets theirs, but it's really only out of $0.10...and that's the highest I will pay. I imagine there are a lot of people like me out there.

Hope that adds something to this discussion.

Hi mmurcho3,

I'm sure there are a lot of people like you out there that pay .10 or less but I pay over $1 per click for some of the keywords in my Adword type campaigns. I'm sure there are people like that as well.

..
Maybe you can give us an example of one of your domains you believe you should be getting dollar+ clicks on??

Hi Badger,

It's not the ones I believe I should get $1 but the ones I do get over $1 that I could tell you about.

usOceanfrontproperty.com gets .70 per click by the way and I guess I don't expect $1 clicks from these two. ((( So if you can keep your word and confirm that you have nothing to do with operating or controlling a parking program?

And Chinese was spelled Chi-nese by Americans through the 1950's, Kind of a historicle thing.

I don't remember asking you what you thought of them and I'm not sure why your bringing these two names of mine into the thread.

Sure, I'll confirm this fact as soon as you confirm you dont expect $ clicks from domains such usoceanfrontproperty.com, chi-nese.com..

Maybe you can give us an example of one of your domains you believe you should be getting dollar+ clicks on??

 

[Kenny]

I've seen so many threads started over the last couple of months asking: Who is the best parking service? The correct answer seems to be, no one parking service. Certain parking services pay more than others for certain categories/subjects.

So, Why are all domainers so Damn scared to post what each parking program pays per category? I see nothing to lose but everything to gain.

Some have told me that it would hurt the industry, How? Since the industry is based on domainers, domainers should know who pays what.

I think it's time for second guessing to stop on who pays what for what. There should be set standards , a pay scale of some sort.

The wondering only hurts the domain owner. Reveron T may get $2.70 per click while Reveron b Gets only .06 is wrong.

If we could get that straight then we can work on a system to stop the click shaving. Click shaving is when you get for example 100 visitors and 150 clicks but the parking company only shows 100 visitors and 101 clicks.

Dave Crutcher

You are just not getting it Dave.

Your question has been answered time and again in this thread, but I guess you dont read what others are posting... some people dont listen, they are just waiting their turn to talk.

You already have all the answers... fine, why did you ask?

You want people to post their category/kw... post yours!

Some well thought out and informational posts have been made in this thread and I want to thank those that contributed. I know I learned a few things here.

Talkers and doers... man what a difference.
It's not hard to tell who's who.

Cy

 

[DnPresident]

You are just not getting it Dave.

Your question has been answered time and again in this thread, but I guess you dont read what others are posting... some people dont listen, they are just waiting their turn to talk.

You already have all the answers... fine, why did you ask?

You want people to post their category/kw... post yours!

Some well thought out and informational posts have been made in this thread and I want to thank those that contributed. I know I learned a few things here.

Talkers and doers... man what a difference.
It's not hard to tell who's who.

Cy

I wouldn't have had anything else to say if he hadn't made the comment about domainers not deserving more than a few cents per click, When it appears he has IMOTO in the works , What ever that is!

Then he pulls two of my names out of his bag of Sh** a** remarks and puts them front and center.

I'm a considerate, caring individual that wants the best for myself and the domain industry in general. I still have a hell of a lot to learn, that goes without saying. Not too many people don't have a lot to learn with only 2 years in. I don't try to make newbies or vets look like idiots by choosing a couple of names out of 400 and saying::" tell me you don't think they deserve $1 per click"" Where is he even getting I think that about those names?

I don't even care any more, The thread should have never been ruined by him. A newb I could understand, not a vet.