What's going on with Epik and Rob Monster?

[MapleDots]

I'm catching the tail end of this, seems to be some kind of controversy...

https://domaingang.com/domain-news/rob-monster-off-twitter-after-christchurch-massacre-controversy/

Must be something odd to evoke this type of a response from one of our members.

 

[DapperJane]

The function of the CEO is to assimilate input, make decisions and manage risk. I do that, and am comfortable with my abilities even though some sensibilities may be offended by my allowance for competing views on the Internet.

There is a Board, and there is a very healthy debate in the Boardroom about how to contend with the "free speech" issue. We are not actually a free speech company. We are a commercial enterprise that simply has not bowed down to the SJW Brigade.

In short, the world changed. Epik did not. The world now wants Epik to change to accommodate their newfound intolerance for competing narratives. We are listening to their input but are relatively immune to social pressures, and don't tolerate bullies.

All that said, as discussed separately, I do welcome a robust discussion from well-meaning independent thinkers whose logic and data can help inform the policy and product direction of Epik as a closely-held private company.

Check your Epik August 6 tweet, the replies include:

Rip Epik, kneel to the feds

There’s free speech or no free speech, period.

You needed a little social pressure to start breaking the promises you made

And so on. Seems some feel differently

 

[Rob Monster]

Check your Epik August 6 tweet, the replies include:

Rip Epik, kneel to the feds

There’s free speech or no free speech, period.

You needed a little social pressure to start breaking the promises you made

And so on. Seems some feel differently

We can't please everyone. We try but it is not possible. I believe our position on the need for 8 Chan to have more than 3 moderators for their 1 million active users is a reasonable position to take in the wake of high profile tragedies.

 

[TCK]

We can't please everyone. We try but it is not possible. I believe our position on the need for 8 Chan to have more than 3 moderators for their 1 million active users is a reasonable position to take in the wake of high profile tragedies.

Who are you trying to please? What if 8 Chan gets 1 more moderator so they have 4?

 

[Rob Monster]

Who are you trying to please? What if 8 Chan gets 1 more moderator so they have 4?

8Chan would probably need 100 trained moderators fluent in various languages plus establish a cultural norm to become collectively vigilant. I do believe their management understands the gravity of the situation, particularly in the jury of public opinion. This is why they have elected to stay offline while they review their processes and work with law enforcement and US homeland security.

I do believe it can be done. Gab is doing it and I believe this was a catalyst:

https://gab.com/epik/posts/8989771640261844

That was my opening post after Gab came back online. Since the migration to Mastodon some metadata was lost but what followed was a successful transition from "anarchy" to "personal sovereignty with personal accountability". I am not sure 8Chan's leadership is capable of leading that transition which is why Epik sat on the sidelines while they sorted themselves out. As mentioned elsewhere, I really don't know the site.

 

[TCK]

I feel we need more participation from folks like @DapperJane, who seems to be a "free speech" proponent. I welcome their perspective. I find Rob's take on "free speech" somewhat inconsistent and a little confusing. So it would be good to have insight from people that don't have a business agenda. If such an individual is inclined to post here I would welcome it and encourage everyone to treat that person with respect and reply in a well thought out and articulated post.

 

[oldtimer]

I believe the fact that Rob is so engaged with the domaining community here is a good thing, as more and more domainers become involved with Epik I am sure that they will collectively keep an eye on what is in theirs and Epik's long term interest and advise Rob accordingly. I believe that Rob has already adjusted his thinking and strategy as to not to peruse things that might put the future of Epik at risk. It looks like that Rob is now more interested in expanding Epik's services through input from those here who like to see more innovation in the domain Industry. Now this doesn’t mean that Rob has turned his back on free speech, it just means that he has come to realize that he has to draw the line somewhere specially when it comes to people or groups who want to abuse free speech by stoking violence or encouraging or causing bodily harm to others. IMO

 

[Rob Monster]

I believe the fact that Rob is so engaged with the domaining community here is a good thing, as more and more domainers become involved with Epik I am sure that they will collectively keep an eye on what is in theirs and Epik's long term interest and advise Rob accordingly. I believe that Rob has already adjusted his thinking and strategy as to not to peruse things that might put the future of Epik at risk. It looks like that Rob is now more interested in expanding Epik's services through input from those here who like to see more innovation in the domain Industry. Now this doesn’t mean that Rob has turned his back on free speech, it just means that he has come to realize that he has to draw the line somewhere specially when it comes to people or groups who want to abuse free speech by stoking violence or encouraging or causing bodily harm to others. IMO

 

[shorterwinters]

 

[offthehandle]

Neuronootropic.org I see is being protected from Legitscript.com now with Epik and doing essentially the same “infomercial” website as the neuronootropic.com version was taken from the registrant for and which is in still in name.com’s preventative detention. The sites appear similar so probably the same under privacy registrant, or his next door neighbor. Doesnt matter who really.

https://www.namepros.com/threads/legitscript-and-name-com-holding-domains-hostage.1141035/

What I find strange is your support of these questionable web sites for drug sales. I don’t read your bible but I am sure there are a few sins here in condoning going around or dancing around and potentially breaking man’s “laws”, how to info on buying chemicals that are for modifying your brain, etc.

So, you are OK with a registrant making money off Affilliate links to grey area legal-illegal schedule IV restricted or clone drug sales? I know, legitscript and big pharma is evil, and I know, I lack context you said before. This stuff isn’t fish oil or harmless vitamins.

Go to the neuronootropic.org website and see for yourself, it has all sorts of disclaimers and double talk. It actually was well written to stay out of trouble, also blocked it appears on archive.org.

And btw neuronootropic.com was flagged by IBM as a spammer:

https://connect.security.ibm.com/app/threat-intelligence-insights/report/url/neuronootropic.com

 

[Rob Monster]

Neuronootropic.org I see is being protected from Legitscript.com now with Epik and doing essentially the same “infomercial” website as the neuronootropic.com version was taken from the registrant for and which is in still in name.com’s preventative detention. The sites appear similar so probably the same under privacy registrant, or his next door neighbor. Doesnt matter who really.

https://www.namepros.com/threads/legitscript-and-name-com-holding-domains-hostage.1141035/

What I find strange is your support of these questionable web sites for drug sales. I don’t read your bible but I am sure there are a few sins here in condoning going around or dancing around and potentially breaking man’s “laws”, how to info on buying chemicals that are for modifying your brain, etc.

So, you are OK with a registrant making money off Affilliate links to grey area legal-illegal schedule IV restricted or clone drug sales? I know, legitscript and big pharma is evil, and I know, I lack context you said before. This stuff isn’t fish oil or harmless vitamins.

Go to the neuronootropic.org website and see for yourself, it has all sorts of disclaimers and double talk. It actually was well written to stay out of trouble, also blocked it appears on archive.org.

And btw neuronootropic.com was flagged by IBM as a spammer:

https://connect.security.ibm.com/app/threat-intelligence-insights/report/url/neuronootropic.com

Read our statement on Legitscript:

https://epik.com/blog/why-i-stood-up-to-legitscript.html

It is simple. We are not here to adjudicate who is or is not promoting or selling efficacious therapies. If there is a court order, we enforce it.

On the other hand, if uninsured citizens can get necessary medications at the same price they would get with their insurance plan, why should we stop them?

For the record, there is very little profit in these customers. They register few names. They use them and we get harassed by Legitscript and their ilk or their proxies.

 

[frank-germany]

OK, Frank.

Any relation to Heinrich Mueller? I know this is before your time but curious on the family connection there since the Nazi stuff really seems to get your goat.

as you started
to take a path
beyond the line


I'm going to ignore you
and leave this threat

 

[Mister Funsky]

I have also asked our staff to be more engaged here and they are responding to that request and are actively listening to the community for feedback.

Great to hear...it is a smart move and I have always wondered (been a lurker here for years before I joined) why ANYONE with ties to the domain industry would not establish themselves here.

If you and the staff continue interaction with domainers in the way you have been in the last several months, it will certainly benefit Epik and us as well. Already there are some cool changes happening with new things at Epik and it has certainly revitalized me.

 

[Ghodeous]

8Chan would probably need 100 trained moderators fluent in various languages plus establish a cultural norm to become collectively vigilant. I do believe their management understands the gravity of the situation, particularly in the jury of public opinion. This is why they have elected to stay offline while they review their processes and work with law enforcement and US homeland security.

I do believe it can be done. Gab is doing it and I believe this was a catalyst:


That was my opening post after Gab came back online. Since the migration to Mastodon some metadata was lost but what followed was a successful transition from "anarchy" to "personal sovereignty with personal accountability". I am not sure 8Chan's leadership is capable of leading that transition which is why Epik sat on the sidelines while they sorted themselves out. As mentioned elsewhere, I really don't know the site.

Wow @Rob Monster. I am impressed. You did a script and stayed on it for once. I am looking forward to hearing from you saying the herein. Now use this same method on those other bums and keep them offline until they get it.

The business of business is staying in business. Its impressive how many business owners dont understand what business is all about. If 8chan's leadership is bet on being a cesspool, that is underwhelmed by the needs of an adapting civilized society then they deserve to be out of business. Not anyone elses problem but theirs.

 

[Rob Monster]

Wow @Rob Monster. I am impressed. You did a script and stayed on it for once. I am looking forward to hearing from you saying the herein. Now use this same method on those other bums and keep them offline until they get it.

The business of business is staying in business. Its impressive how many business owners dont understand what business is all about. If 8chan's leadership is bet on being a cesspool, that is underwhelmed by the needs of an adapting civilized society then they deserve to be out of business. Not anyone elses problem but theirs.

As I see it, the problem with the intolerant left is that they are incapable of compromise. Gab.com is an example of compromise. It is a heavily moderated site filled with people that found FB and Twitter to be oppressive, or don't trust their data privacy practices. The result is that moderate conservatives are "going Galt" and the intolerant left apparently struggles with that completely predictable outcome. You did not have to read a page of Ayn Rand to see that coming.

 

[Ghodeous]

As I see it, the problem with the intolerant left is that they are incapable of compromise. Gab.com is an example of compromise. It is a heavily moderated site filled with people that found FB and Twitter to be oppressive, or don't trust their data privacy practices. The result is that moderate conservatives are "going Galt" and the intolerant left apparently struggles with that completely predictable outcome. You did not have to read a page of Ayn Rand to see that coming.

Show attachment 126993

Speechless.

 

[Rob Monster]

Speechless.

I am not sure there's a cure but here is a possible diagnosis.

 

[Ghodeous]

I am not sure there's a cure but here is a possible diagnosis.

Show attachment 126998

None of the above. Causation is repulsiveness to artificial labels such as "left", and "conservative". I like people being people.

My position is informed by an issue of The American Journal of Psychology that concluded that "Categorical labeling is a tool that humans use to resolve the impossible complexity of the environments we grapple to perceive. Like so many human faculties, it's adaptive and miraculous, but it also contributes to some of the deepest problems that face our species".

In Linguistic relativity hypothesis, Benjamin Whorf proposed that the words we use to describe what we see aren't just idle placeholders--they actually determine what we see.

When we put people in boxes, all we see is the descriptive nature of those boxes not the richness in individuality, I think

 

[Rob Monster]

None of the above. Causation is repulsiveness to artificial labels such as "left", and "conservative". I like people being people.

My position is informed by an issue of The American Journal of Psychology that concluded that "Categorical labeling is a tool that humans use to resolve the impossible complexity of the environments we grapple to perceive. Like so many human faculties, it's adaptive and miraculous, but it also contributes to some of the deepest problems that face our species".

In Linguistic relativity hypothesis, Benjamin Whorf proposed that the words we use to describe what we see aren't just idle placeholders--they actually determine what we see.

When we put people in boxes, all we see is the descriptive nature of those boxes not the richness in individuality, I think

If the shoe fits.

With all due respect, I am not sure how else you can reconcile the complete intolerance of the people that put a site like an actively moderated and professionally managed Gab in the same bucket as an 8Chan which was digital anarchy by design.

As for humans as "species", that is a secular humanist mental construct that treats mankind as an evolved monkey. I don't have to read the latest Yuval Noah Harari manifesto to realize that this mindset is ruinous.

If you don't like the playground you visited because there is a skateboard park next to it that has kids without helmets doing aerials, take your kids to another playground.

 

[Ankit Puri]

Proof?



Proof? You can dismiss any media you disagree with or don't like using loaded labels.

@TCK Well I dont think he has to prove anything to anyone here. His actions are wise enough to proof than his words or writing here.

 

[DapperJane]

I feel we need more participation from folks like @DapperJane, who seems to be a "free speech" proponent. I welcome their perspective. I find Rob's take on "free speech" somewhat inconsistent and a little confusing. So it would be good to have insight from people that don't have a business agenda. If such an individual is inclined to post here I would welcome it and encourage everyone to treat that person with respect and reply in a well thought out and articulated post.

It was more noticing people who see free speech as more than a business opportunity, people who really believe in it, making those comments.

Rob is very responsive, makes changes etc, those are good things.

Problem is he can’t get the other stuff right. It’s kind of like people having hope trump will act more decent, presidential, it’s just not who he is.

I see Epik as a registrar for the right and that’s because of Robs comments in this forum. He gets excited by page views like trump gets excited about crowd size. Those views aren’t because of business, it’s side show, circus stuff which I feel isn’t good for Epik.

I noticed him the other day calling someone who disagreed with him a communist, today using terms like intolerant left, SJW etc. there are plenty of other registrars out there.