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This train has probably left. Domaining... as in starting right now from scratch.

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I think it's too late for someone to start domaining these days.

( Yeah, I know a few might eventually succeed - but that'll be quite rare, I think. )

I mean, what are the odds now for someone who has no skills but just the will to try it?

I started domaining just a few years ago. But then, it was still the real bonanza. Whatever you had, it sold. Price high, price low, nevertheless it sold. That's how I made it into profit in my third year, gradually improving.

Auctions were cheap, domains were cheaper, drops were full of juice. Closeouts, good stuff still falling through the net for us to grab.

Not anymore. 2022 came and passed.

Everything is overpriced now, people probably holding stuff waiting for better times OR for future plans, who knows. And yeah it's clear that you can't make a living when buying domains retail price from the market. You might recoup the monies in a few years, who knows, but it's too risky. And you'll have the money locked in it. And unless you have the $ to buy few high-value names, you are going to also burn money in renewals.

Don't get me wrong - I'm not complaining. This isn't about me. I'm alright, and at least in portfolio quality I'm definitely seeing betterment. And yeah, it's also not about the top investors who are still rolling cash although the numbers have diminished a little lately.

It's about someone new, willing to take the plunge and start today. I really don't see it to happen. The sales squeeze means that growing portfolio in the first place from $500 and some beginners luck ain't going to work anymore.

You need a serious budget to start with. And some itch to see it all spent soon...? And you need to make that budget triple at least; as for the next few years you're going to burn through it like there's no tomorrow. And after those years, maybe then, you're going to finally see the end of the tunnel that is the current market and if you have improved enough, then maybe, just maybe you'll see some return on all this hard work, money spent and risk taken.

I look at these guys and dunno if I should encourage them or tell them what they are getting into, and what are the odds.

Your thoughts?
 
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The views expressed on this page by users and staff are their own, not those of NamePros.
The last sentence explains everything. But I find it impossible to make pre-orders for millions of domains.
And if there is a functioning website on the domain, hardly anyone will think that it will be ever time expired. Here is my last purchase, HutRent.com was dropped on February 19 2023 and was purchased by me for $9. This domain was first registered more than 20 years ago, has a good history, personally I consider it promising for sale in the region of $3000. And yet, it didn't make it to the auction. And there are tens of thousands of such domains. Therefore, there is always an opportunity for a novice domainer to become successful even in such a difficult time. I consider domaining an art. For me, a real domainer is a creator who registered a previously non-existent domain and breathed into life, made customers believe in this domain. How did it happen to PainQuell.com I came up with this name from scratch and registered the domain. Three years later, I sold it for $2,700 Now this site is working and brings benefits to people. And to buy at auction and then resell much more expensive is just speculation, not art.
You're more of the creative domainer it looks.

In that, there's always some gold to be found if you dig a lot. Guess not everybody does that though.

DC backorder guys are going more for the obvious names instead. So are most buyers as well, but not everyone. Also certain names aren't in the middle of the mainstream.

HutRent, that ain't the obvious kind. Though short, and it sold.

Also DC people look at TLDs registered, certain words... etc. Rent and pain, again ain't the ones they commonly want. You're going to be unimpressed about the creative part of them... but the stuff they get, it does sell pretty well, that I can tell you.
 
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Also DC people look at TLDs registered, certain words... etc. Rent and pain, again ain't the ones they commonly want. You're going to be unimpressed about the creative part of them... but the stuff they get, it does sell pretty well, that I can tell you.
You are right, I lack business acumen and the desire to overpower myself and become like all other domainers who devote a lot of time to auctions. I'm trying to find a middle ground between business and creativity. That's why I'm reading this forum : 0)

Edit: My last sale was a domain Olympire.com when creating the verbal construction, I blend Olympus - the mountain of the Greek gods and the empire. Unfortunately, if the domainer is not rich enough, only creativity and hand registration can help to stay in this business.
 
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You are right, I lack business acumen and the desire to overpower myself and become like all other domainers who devote a lot of time to auctions. I'm trying to find a middle ground between business and creativity. That's why I'm reading this forum : 0)

Edit: My last sale was a domain Olympire.com when creating the verbal construction, I blend Olympus - the mountain of the Greek gods and the empire. Unfortunately, if the domainer is not rich enough, only creativity and hand registration can help to stay in this business.

It's a good option if you ask me. But not everyone is suited for this.

I'd encourage you to continue.
 
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I think it's too late for someone to start domaining these days.

( Yeah, I know a few might eventually succeed - but that'll be quite rare, I think. )

I mean, what are the odds now for someone who has no skills but just the will to try it?

I started domaining just a few years ago. But then, it was still the real bonanza. Whatever you had, it sold. Price high, price low, nevertheless it sold. That's how I made it into profit in my third year, gradually improving.

Auctions were cheap, domains were cheaper, drops were full of juice. Closeouts, good stuff still falling through the net for us to grab.

Not anymore. 2022 came and passed.

Everything is overpriced now, people probably holding stuff waiting for better times OR for future plans, who knows. And yeah it's clear that you can't make a living when buying domains retail price from the market. You might recoup the monies in a few years, who knows, but it's too risky. And you'll have the money locked in it. And unless you have the $ to buy few high-value names, you are going to also burn money in renewals.

Don't get me wrong - I'm not complaining. This isn't about me. I'm alright, and at least in portfolio quality I'm definitely seeing betterment. And yeah, it's also not about the top investors who are still rolling cash although the numbers have diminished a little lately.

It's about someone new, willing to take the plunge and start today. I really don't see it to happen. The sales squeeze means that growing portfolio in the first place from $500 and some beginners luck ain't going to work anymore.

You need a serious budget to start with. And some itch to see it all spent soon...? And you need to make that budget triple at least; as for the next few years you're going to burn through it like there's no tomorrow. And after those years, maybe then, you're going to finally see the end of the tunnel that is the current market and if you have improved enough, then maybe, just maybe you'll see some return on all this hard work, money spent and risk taken.

I look at these guys and dunno if I should encourage them or tell them what they are getting into, and what are the odds.

Your thoughts?
You need funds to buy quality domains these days or be astute and fast in registering domains in areas ready to boom - cloud in 2006, crypto in 2012, web3 and dao, meta, defi and nft in 2020-21, ai now, maybe xr in 2024-25

auctions have become more competitive...i had bids in 2 GD auctions this week, with bids under 100 USD with less than 1 minute left..both domains ended up selling for 4 figures each - i dropped out at 500 usd each

there is so much luck in this industry...those who were prescient to reg those 6 and 7 figure keyword domains in the 1990s, then others after 2000 who saw the trends and grabbed the domains or got lucky registering or acquiring keywords in extension that got hot...or even more lucky, owning a brandable domain that just happens to be the name a giant company paid a branding company 750 k to come up with a new name for a rebrand, or division or product brand, and voila, you own the .com...this happens...a lot
 
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I have a question for old-timers, on what principle domains get into DropCatch.

I have seen a fair number of my dropped names get grabbed by Dropcatch. Even some hand-registered Meta+word names, ones that got downvoted on NP.

As far as principle, if they are catching my names then apparently their principles must have a pretty low threshold.
 
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I have seen a fair number of my dropped names get grabbed by Dropcatch. Even some hand-registered Meta+word names, ones that got downvoted on NP.

As far as principle, if they are catching my names then apparently their principles must have a pretty low threshold.

There are many buyer segments bidding on DC.

One segment is those who enter a stampede when a 30-tld taken .COM gets dropped and snapped by DC. Final buyer is often a big investor with lots of $$$ (if the name is great).

Another segment is DC partners (investors) that are not made public by DC. I know this segment's preferences and they're not bad at all, these are the same names I aim for on a daily bases, and in most cases I won't be able to get. How do I know: Their names never go to auction, therefore they bid less than $59 where all names go to auction. Also been watching is long enough to do various statistics. My bet is, the biggest domain holder companies out there are behind it, as the selection is NOT done by hand (in my opinion) but by good tools instead.

The third segment is domainers (okay-ish, or wannabees) who might bid for your names under the discount club, price anywhere from $11 to $58. These might have more relaxed criteria.

Finally there are some end users there (probably lots of) who would gladly pay $59 at least on your domain.

You can't generally say "their principles must have a pretty low threshold" because there's no such thing as a single class of people there. Lots of different segments and I might have not covered them all.

Final notes, the "partners" that we don't know of are quite good, if you ask me. I know their selection. All names they pick are in good demand and from $3K upwards at least, sometimes much more. We're aiming for the same domains day after day so I've tested this long enough, these are my direct competitors. Can't bid $59 cause then my names go into auction and they will end up way overpriced anyway...

Also, the end users (not partners) who get names at auction, often highly overpriced: These guys generally don't have a clue about domain value in general. I feel sorry for them as they pay a lot in the auctions. But who knows... emotional attachment on a name, maybe, certain brand or the sorts, a specific email addy they need revived, etc. Different possible things.
 
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You can't generally say "their principles must have a pretty low threshold" because there's no such thing as a single class of people there

Fair enough. Though I should clarify that the few names were caught by Huge Domains and now are listed above $3k.
 
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Fair enough. Though I should clarify that the few names were caught by Huge Domains and now are listed above $3k.
Then that might be their potential.

However, potential doesn't guarantee a sale.

You have half a point there as well. (at least)
 
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You need funds to buy quality domains these days or be astute and fast in registering domains in areas ready to boom - cloud in 2006, crypto in 2012, web3 and dao, meta, defi and nft in 2020-21, ai now, maybe xr in 2024-25

auctions have become more competitive...i had bids in 2 GD auctions this week, with bids under 100 USD with less than 1 minute left..both domains ended up selling for 4 figures each - i dropped out at 500 usd each

These are great points.

I joined 10 backorder auctions over the last month or so on several auction platforms. The average winning bid was $1,800. I didn't win any but was always a top 5 bidder

Specifically, I was the 3rd runner-up in a NameJet auction 2 weeks ago, and the winner is a rumored shill bidder on NJ as reported here on Namepros by others. The winning bidder pushed it to $3K.

Mind you, I tapped out at $1K, and the 4th runner up bid $500. I'm glad I lost, because I never intended to bid above $500. Yet, this is the nature of auctions.

Not surprisingly, the NJ payment deadline has arrived but the domain remains unpaid. I kept great screenprint records too because the final price didn't make sense for wholesale.

I'm betting it will be relisted in a week or so because as I said, the winning bidder has a track record on NJ of not paying for NJ wins.

This is the environment that newcomers enter, not just unprecedented competition for dot-Coms of any value, but there are a lot of insider schemes and shill bidding exposed often as well.

Not to mention more end users are wisely joining auctions, see Medal *com $185K auction: https://www.namepros.com/threads/medal-com-sold-for-185-728-dreamboy-com-for-17-263.1281394/

Too many overlook the facts of retail end user sales based on mega sales announced by DN Journal. But the fact remains, the average domain sells for about $2,300 retail.

Yet, every auction I joined the last 4-6 weeks fetched a winning bid of nearly $2K.

So, the margin opportunity is shrinking on average.

I'm going on 7 years of domaining, and my portfolio is just under 200 assets.

There is no doubt being a rookie in 2023 is more expensive than ever with lower chance of success. But the gifted, prudent, and persistent will find ways to get to the $$$.
 
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Hey Twiki, what ends of brands are most sellable, example +ify, +sly, +tily, +less and others?
Do you have a list?
 
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Hey Twiki, what ends of brands are most sellable, example +ify, +sly, +tily, +less and others?
Do you have a list?

I don't. It's pretty random if you ask me. Guess it's in the eye of the beholder.

Sold +sily domains quite well, although they phonetically end in "silly"....

But you can check Namebio and take a pick if you want. However there's no guarantee the sales will match any of that, I haven't seen a correlation that you can follow.

( Edit: I wouldn't personally use a +sily domain, ever. But they spent 4-fig on that. )
 
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I don't. It's pretty random if you ask me. Guess it's in the eye of the beholder.

Sold +sily domains quite well, although they phonetically end in "silly"....

But you can check Namebio and take a pick if you want. However there's no guarantee the sales will match any of that, I haven't seen a correlation that you can follow.

( Edit: I wouldn't personally use a +sily domain, ever. But they spent 4-fig on that. )
Yes have observed that it sounds as silly, that is why i go with +sly in one combo as it sounds better and is shorter for a brandable.
I have look on namebio and see that best sales are with below ones, but no sale results for +sily as suffix.
1.+less
2.+tify
3.+ness
4.+full
5.+sly
6.+evy/+evi
7.+tily
 
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interesting chat
Personally I'm about to start my jounrey with a small budget but also using the right software tools hopefully. I'm hoping this is similar to realestate. I also noticed noone here has mentioned analysing the domain for seo value not just name value. I feel like getting good priced seo domains is really like renting a store with foottraffic in a way if you have the skills to build simple sites using the seo you're purchasing with the domain

Is this a correct way of looking at it. I have no experience and about to take the leap in the next few weeks
 
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interesting chat
Personally I'm about to start my jounrey with a small budget but also using the right software tools hopefully. I'm hoping this is similar to realestate. I also noticed noone here has mentioned analysing the domain for seo value not just name value. I feel like getting good priced seo domains is really like renting a store with foottraffic in a way if you have the skills to build simple sites using the seo you're purchasing with the domain

Is this a correct way of looking at it. I have no experience and about to take the leap in the next few weeks

Seo domains are sellable, but beware, there is crushing competition in this area. The problem is in the buy, not the sale.

From what you said, I doubt you have the budget for any of that.

Anyway, good luck.
 
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Seo domains are sellable, but beware, there is crushing competition in this area. The problem is in the buy, not the sale.

From what you said, I doubt you have the budget for any of that.

Anyway, good luck.
What do you recommend for a budget to start SEO domains?
 
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What do you recommend for a budget to start SEO domains?
I don't have a number, but:

Fairly moderate seo domains expiring end up mid 4-fig in auction or more. And they're difficult to sell for much more. Those buying usually use them themselves for PBNs, so these are end user sales in most cases.

Great seo domains, 5 to 6 figures in auction. And they're not many.

For $500 or less you can get a rather crappy one. Hard to sell for a profit.

For $200 or less you can likely get one which has been already spammed to death and therefore only a fool will purchase something like that. (been that fool early in my ventures)

It's much easier to source names where value comes from the name itself. Anyway, now you can make your own budget....
 
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I don't have a number, but:

Fairly moderate seo domains expiring end up mid 4-fig in auction or more. And they're difficult to sell for much more. Those buying usually use them themselves for PBNs, so these are end user sales in most cases.

Great seo domains, 5 to 6 figures in auction. And they're not many.

For $500 or less you can get a rather crappy one. Hard to sell for a profit.

For $200 or less you can likely get one which has been already spammed to death and therefore only a fool will purchase something like that. (been that fool early in my ventures)

It's much easier to source names where value comes from the name itself. Anyway, now you can make your own budget.
That's interesting. I had the feeling I'd need to make a commitment because the barrier of entry for domains going for under $50 that you would potentially sell for mid 3 figures or 4 figures would be very low so I never really expected that. Opens the competition to anyone with an extra $300 in their pockets all around the world. idk if that makes sense but I feel like there's a lot of people not in first world countries trying to make a quick buck because it stretches really far in their countries which also increases competition like crazy. You gotto make a commitment in my expereince

I'm still new so doing my research. I think from where I'm looking from right now I'd prefer a a few domains around 200-600 dollars each instead of heaps of under $50 domains. Have a feeling these won't sell and you'll be bagholding alot of cheap domains especially if they have no seo value at all. The more expensive ones may not sell either though which is what I'm also worried about. Gotto jump into the deep end and work it out I guess

Appreciate the advice. I got software tools recently to make sure they havn't been spammed and stuff like that. hoping the software I paid for helps with finding the right domains.
 
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When you have gems like jmszyyy.com, xzdrdz.com, ytthzz.com, dglyz.com, and hdxhzdx.com selling for $3,100, $2600 and $2050 respectively, then one has to ask is it easier than ever for newbies, or is the market messed up and dodgy?

Courtesy of DN journal:
https://www.dnjournal.com/domainsales.htm
 
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When you have gems like jmszyyy.com, xzdrdz.com, ytthzz.com, dglyz.com, and hdxhzdx.com selling for $3,100, $2600 and $2050 respectively, then one has to ask is it easier than ever for newbies, or is the market messed up and dodgy?

Courtesy of DN journal:
https://www.dnjournal.com/domainsales.htm

There are cases where a business might choose to buy a domain like this, for reasons that aren't illegal per se (like money laundering) but sometimes questionable as it is about changing the purpose of the payment.

For example. Some contractor did a job for the firm and needs paid. But for certain reasons the firm can't pay for their services; but only in another form.

There's a difference between buying a domain and paying for a service; the service will be an expense while the domain can be logged in books as an virtual asset. It depends from country to country but anyway.

Reasons to do this: Trying to keep profits high for the year, either to keep shareholders happier OR company credit score good (even though in cashflow there is a hit).

Or in certain cases they aren't allowed to buy that due to their company formation documents or whatever rule; other running contracts that prevent this; risks of losing a grant that specifies certain conditions on how the money can be used (e.g. grant money for digitalization of the company can be used to purchase a domain but not to pay for a painter job).

So in such case, a company may tell the payee, hey, buy this domain and we'll take it off from you for $X amount.

Things in this line, grey area if you want.
 
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When you have gems like jmszyyy.com, xzdrdz.com, ytthzz.com, dglyz.com, and hdxhzdx.com selling for $3,100, $2600 and $2050 respectively, then one has to ask is it easier than ever for newbies, or is the market messed up and dodgy?

Courtesy of DN journal:
https://www.dnjournal.com/domainsales.htm
I have search on the internet one of such recently sold domain, then I see some Chinese websites, I remembered in old times a secret website where I was grabbing iPhone/iPad schematics which no one had at that time, their domain was something like (tjwxy,com) not remember proper the name, so it can be the reason why they need such domains, some are not crawled by search engines and hard to find, only the insiders knew about it, such domains can have high traffic but not because of search engines, but because of real organic traffic of those who knew about the website. So the buyers can be Chinese most likely.
edit: found that domain (h t t p : / / 1 6 8 . t j w c n . n e t /) the domain is still registered.
 
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I think it's too late for someone to start domaining these days.

I mean, what are the odds now for someone who has no skills but just the will to try it?

I started domaining just a few years ago. But then, it was still the real bonanza. Whatever you had, it sold. Price high, price low, nevertheless it sold. That's how I made it into profit in my third year, gradually improving.

Auctions were cheap, domains were cheaper, drops were full of juice. Closeouts, good stuff still falling through the net for us to grab.

Not anymore. 2022 came and passed.

Interesting that you think that "a few years ago" was "the real bonanza" as for those of us involved for longer, we'd say that a few years ago 2018-2019 was a major slowdown from a few years before that! 2014-2015.
 
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Interesting that you think that "a few years ago" was "the real bonanza" as for those of us involved for longer, we'd say that a few years ago 2018-2019 was a major slowdown from a few years before that! 2014-2015.
It is meant in a different (time) context.

I meant it was bonanza in comparison with now, 2022-2023. I've seen a slowdown ever since I started although 2020-2021 went good for me. But not with what was since the beginning of time.... cant compare with that.

And it is also the context of my post subject, which is about someone starting right now. Established domainers with good portfolios had been much less affected by 2022 slowdown in comparison with beginners. Some even experienced growth as their high-figure domains went up lately.

You've obviously been in this for much longer, unlike myself.

I didn't catch 2015. I jumped in this bandwagon later. Or, to be more specific, jumped in much earlier (think it was 2004 or something?), had a big lot of 4-L .coms and other sorts back then, then I gave up; only to start again many years later, somewhat by accident.
 
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I think it's too late for someone to start domaining these days.

( Yeah, I know a few might eventually succeed - but that'll be quite rare, I think. )

I mean, what are the odds now for someone who has no skills but just the will to try it?

I started domaining just a few years ago. But then, it was still the real bonanza. Whatever you had, it sold. Price high, price low, nevertheless it sold. That's how I made it into profit in my third year, gradually improving.

Auctions were cheap, domains were cheaper, drops were full of juice. Closeouts, good stuff still falling through the net for us to grab.

Not anymore. 2022 came and passed.

Everything is overpriced now, people probably holding stuff waiting for better times OR for future plans, who knows. And yeah it's clear that you can't make a living when buying domains retail price from the market. You might recoup the monies in a few years, who knows, but it's too risky. And you'll have the money locked in it. And unless you have the $ to buy few high-value names, you are going to also burn money in renewals.

Don't get me wrong - I'm not complaining. This isn't about me. I'm alright, and at least in portfolio quality I'm definitely seeing betterment. And yeah, it's also not about the top investors who are still rolling cash although the numbers have diminished a little lately.

It's about someone new, willing to take the plunge and start today. I really don't see it to happen. The sales squeeze means that growing portfolio in the first place from $500 and some beginners luck ain't going to work anymore.

You need a serious budget to start with. And some itch to see it all spent soon...? And you need to make that budget triple at least; as for the next few years you're going to burn through it like there's no tomorrow. And after those years, maybe then, you're going to finally see the end of the tunnel that is the current market and if you have improved enough, then maybe, just maybe you'll see some return on all this hard work, money spent and risk taken.

I look at these guys and dunno if I should encourage them or tell them what they are getting into, and what are the odds.

Your thoughts?
Twiki.....it's NEVER too late to start something your mind and heart have a desire to accomplish, and at 75 years young I'm a perfect example.

I'm blessed to have both a creative and a "can do" attitude. Speaking of a $500 investment, just a few months ago i hand registered over 50+ domains like Humanitarian.link and Grapes.link for $8.59 each, and they renew for $8.59. So for $500 someone could own a portfolio like mine worth tens of thousands if only they knew how to sell ice to the Eskimos:unsure:
 
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I think there’s a trend going on possibly, a
Twiki.....it's NEVER too late to start something your mind and heart have a desire to accomplish, and at 75 years young I'm a perfect example.

I'm blessed to have both a creative and a "can do" attitude. Speaking of a $500 investment, just a few months ago i hand registered over 50+ domains like Humanitarian.link and Grapes.link for $8.59 each, and they renew for $8.59. So for $500 someone could own a portfolio like mine worth tens of thousands if only they knew how to sell ice to the Eskimos:unsure:
owning and having portfolio value feels nice in domains, but if there isn’t any liquidity and no one wants to buy it for the price it’s valued at it’s not really worth that much

I bought 5-6 domains in the last week which is the first attempt at this, looked good on GoDaddy appraisal
Later found out a few days ago that I was reading the seo value wrong so the 5-6 domains were actually worth alot less. Had good dr and ur but wasn’t ranking for any keywords and the backlinks weren’t really relevant more just seo sites. A few sites backlinks were entirely a different language then English which I feel like will make ranking for English keywords possibly difficult? Still going through a learning curve

Pretty much out those down to a loss apart from building a few out and hoping the dr ur by itself will rank for seo keywords
 
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