I think you guys are making a big mistake

[sgtppr]

Are domainers making a mistake?

cliffs notes at bottom

ok so i studied long and hard for probably 30 hours over the last three days. i think the advice on www.domainnewbie.com and much of the advice on this board is really short-sighted and wrong.

this is the hypothesis i have formulated which i'd like feedback on. if im wrong, tell me why.



the advice passed around on this board, boards like it and by the various gurus, primarily boils down to telling people how to get good at flipping domains. how to select domains that will be highly liquid on the open market, which you can sell for a fast profit.


true or false?





ok well to me thats a retarded strategy unless you just have some aversion to getting a normal job, or you think you can make more doing that than you could doing something else...or because you like the perks of domain flipping over another job etc. those are all fine ends, but those are not the only ends.




i have a deep love affair with the internet, web 2.0, businesss 2.0, technology and all it can do for us as humans. i express that love by taking part in the revolution that is taking place all around us. i build websites and products and services i think people will like. isn't that what a domain name is for? to build something on?



if i have a choice between these two domains:



models.tv

and

wie.com


i would take models.tv in an instant

sure i'm probably going to pay less for models.tv, but this isn't about money, its about which one i can develop into a better site some day, or which one somebody else might make into a great site by leasing the domain from me or though some kind of partnership. its not about which one appeals to a broader market of potential buyers. great artists don't decide what to paint based upon how many people might buy their painting. in fact many of them were ridiculed until after their death! i think the same will happen with domainers. once you guys stop churning domains with each other and making money for sedo, godaddy and paypal, the market for all these stupid domains will hit the floor. you want to know what end users think about qkft.com? they think its lame unless their company happens to have those initials


cliffs notes

good domain selection should be based on how usable a domain is by an end-user, not on how likely you are to flip it to another domainer

 

[Gene]

Some people like to build cars. Others like to drive them.
Some people like to flip houses, others like to become landlords.

:::shrug:::

 

[Michelle]

We here at namepros are here to help not to flame on people. So if you want to hear our opinions on a subject we will try to help as much as possible. At namepros we can offer OPINIONS and EXPERIENCE. Take the information how ever you want and apply it into whatever situation it is best formatted into. Just please be polite. Everyone has their own opinions on a subject and yours is a valid one but dont flame on us for our opinions.

:tu:

 

[StoneRoses]

PokerPie i can see what you are saying, but i think people should be allowed to make their own decisions as to which way they go, some are flippers some are developers but at the end of the day ,each to their own imo.

i must venture out from .tv land more often i am glued to this thread.

 

[Mark]

Prime example of differing opinions already in this thread

Traffic leakage as stated by Gene - 100% spot on. I own and have interest in developing some .tv's - But most any marketing I would do at this point would only be via my time ... I wouldn't sink much actual cash into advertising. Yes "Time is money" - But it's my time. I'd build a site and submit to a few engines/directories and possibly exchange links with a few relevant sites. After that - Fresh content would have to drive it. I like my traffic to be as natural as possible more or less - So I know what I've got and what I can do to monetize it. The same goes for a few other extensions - .info .us etc ... I'm not afraid to Dev them - But It would probably have to be a .com for me to spend a ton on marketing/advertising.

Is my opinion wrong ? To many people , It probably is ..... But it doesn't mean it doesn't work.

As far as the "Nobody Cares" statement ..... - Thanks, I needed a good laugh. The market for LLL.com's says otherwise. And no ... they aren't all being sold to other domainers.

 

[Diabro]

PokerPie i can see what you are saying, but i think people should be allowed to make their own decisions as to which way they go, some are flippers some are developers but at the end of the day ,each to their own imo.

Very intereSting thread though, i must venture out from .tv land more often

My only problem with what he is saying is that he is stating it as a fact that there is only one true way to do things and any other way is wrong. It just so happens that his way would benefit him most now. A business person cannot go around and say “This is the way it should be”….unless there is some huge injustice or social issue…..they have to adapt to the way things are. Too many of my friends wasted their potential worrying about the way things “should” be….not the way things are. :imho:

 

[TheBulldog]

i must venture out from .tv land more often i am glued to this thread.

Don't stay out to long, the mind control wears off and you won't want the red cool-aid anymore.

 

[StoneRoses]

Don't stay out to long, the mind control wears off and you won't want the red cool-aid anymore.

Lol, i know i am sweating up and hallucinating already

 

[Diabro]

Lol, i know i am sweating up and hallucinating already

HAHAHAHA! :tu:

 

[Michelle]

OK rewinding alittle here..


Pokerpie first off welcome. I see you are new around

Namepros is full of information shared by many domainers over many years. Your views are as valid as anyones.

:hi:

 

[snoop]

if i have a choice between these two domains:



models.tv

and

wie.com


i would take models.tv in an instant

sure i'm probably going to pay less for models.tv, but this isn't about money, its about which one i can develop into a better site some day,

This sounds illogical to me. You have a choice between two names and you'd take the one which is worth less. And to say it isn't about money lol

As far as development goes that is very different to domaining. Domaining involves making money from the domains themselves not your development skills. We are talking about two quite different business models here.

 

[Diabro]

Back to the thread, can developing a premium name actually hurt the value? Say you had cars.com and a budget of $200 and put up a REALLY bad site. The site was there for years. Could that hurt the resale value as a site was up, people went there and were turned off...or is the name cars so marketable that it would not matter?

 

[TheBulldog]

the name cars.com is so marketable that you could put up an lizard picture site and it would not matter.

 

[Keith]

Pokerpie, I think you under estimate the growth rate of domain names. Flipping is natural because a name worth $10 today can be worth $100 tomorrow. Why monkey around when the quick cash is there? If you get good at buying low and selling high you're all set!

 

[Michael]

The market for LLL.com's says otherwise. And no ... they aren't all being sold to other domainers.

NameBio did a sample of 33 LLL.com domains that were sold recently and 82% of them were parked after the sale, which would most likely indicate that they were purchased by domainers. Just an interesting tidbit.

 

[Diabro]

NameBio did a sample of 33 LLL.com domains that were sold recently and 82% of them were parked after the sale, which would most likely indicate that they were purchased by domainers. Just an interesting tidbit.

Interesting.

 

[Mark]

NameBio did a sample of 33 LLL.com domains that were sold recently and 82% of them were parked after the sale, which would most likely indicate that they were purchased by domainers. Just an interesting tidbit.

I agree but It could also mean they aren't ready to put up a site as well. Please note I said "Not All" are/were sold to domainers.

And even if they are ALL sold to domainers - It's the sellers choice to do so - Profit is Profit no matter how you look at it. Many flip domains for fun and as a side job (I personally get just as big a thrill out of finding available domains as I do selling them) , many flip them because they are easily bored with ideas (I fit in there ), Some flip domains as a living (And I know several pulling down NICE incomes doing so). Nothing wrong with it ~ IMO


To each his own.

Pokerpie, I think you under estimate the growth rate of domain names. Flipping is natural because a name worth $10 today can be worth $100 tomorrow. Why monkey around when the quick cash is there? If you get good at buying low and selling high you're all set!

Exactly - And you have more Working Capital for projects where you have an interest as well.

 

[sgtppr]

Diabro,

I think the value has gone up now that it was Cars.com as its current business, but say CarsDirect bought that and they decided to make Cars.com a parked page instead of re-directing the traffic, and then after a year of being parked, they now wanted to sell it for xx,xxx,xxx+ at auction, i think the value at auction would be higher because it was such a recognizable and high quality site about cars, prior. though the minimum value i think could only ever be whatever value it would have if you had nothing on it. even if people hate the site, they will still go to it and maybe click links (like ppl who hate howard stern or the kkk im sure go to their websites sometimes) and then over time after people forget the name you can sell it to an end user. if you have a name people will never forget, as i said, thats going to be a very valuable parked page imo

 

[Ross]

Diabro,

I think the value has gone up now that it was Cars.com as its current business, but say CarsDirect bought that and they decided to make Cars.com a parked page instead of re-directing the traffic, and then after a year of being parked, they now wanted to sell it for xx,xxx,xxx+ at auction, i think the value at auction would be higher because it was such a recognizable and high quality site about cars, prior. though the minimum value i think could only ever be whatever value it would have if you had nothing on it. even if people hate the site, they will still go to it and maybe click links (like ppl who hate howard stern or the kkk im sure go to their websites sometimes) and then over time after people forget the name you can sell it to an end user. if you have a name people will never forget, as i said, thats going to be a very valuable parked page imo

If CarsDirect bought cars.com im pretty sure you would NEVER see that name become available again. This is why VALUE on generics like this are so HIGH. I know for a fact they would make more money if they redirected the traffic to their site or even put their own site up on Cars.com. The reason why is because they will make more money selling THEIR product than if they take the measly $.20 per click a parking company would offer.

 

[sgtppr]

Interesting.

There is nothing interesting about that other than the fact that you guys find it interesting. It was obvious to me after I studied the available literature on domaining and looked at the various auctions on sedo, godaddy and the sales histories on moniker, afertnic and others.

i would say that 95% of the VOLUME of domain sales is being done domainer to domainer. however that 5% is where 95% of the $xx,xxx domains are sold and also probably a sizable amount of the profits i have no idea if the total $ amounts in domains flipped is higher at the top or the bottom, the 95% domainers churn amongst themselves is probably a very large share of the total domain churn each year...but if domainers stopped selling to each other and only sold to end users...the marketplace would imo look very very very very very differnet and you would not see domains like LLL.com unpronoucable selling for anything at auction. the only people who would even register it would be end users and people who think end users might come asking for it someday.

 

[Ross]

A LOT of sales are done privately by the way. There are domains that sell for millions that no one knows about because the people that sell or buy them dont want the public to know. That is where alot of end users are and if you want to sell a domain for $xxxx value you have to do your homework and contact these people.