I think you guys are making a big mistake

[sgtppr]

Are domainers making a mistake?

cliffs notes at bottom

ok so i studied long and hard for probably 30 hours over the last three days. i think the advice on www.domainnewbie.com and much of the advice on this board is really short-sighted and wrong.

this is the hypothesis i have formulated which i'd like feedback on. if im wrong, tell me why.



the advice passed around on this board, boards like it and by the various gurus, primarily boils down to telling people how to get good at flipping domains. how to select domains that will be highly liquid on the open market, which you can sell for a fast profit.


true or false?





ok well to me thats a retarded strategy unless you just have some aversion to getting a normal job, or you think you can make more doing that than you could doing something else...or because you like the perks of domain flipping over another job etc. those are all fine ends, but those are not the only ends.




i have a deep love affair with the internet, web 2.0, businesss 2.0, technology and all it can do for us as humans. i express that love by taking part in the revolution that is taking place all around us. i build websites and products and services i think people will like. isn't that what a domain name is for? to build something on?



if i have a choice between these two domains:



models.tv

and

wie.com


i would take models.tv in an instant

sure i'm probably going to pay less for models.tv, but this isn't about money, its about which one i can develop into a better site some day, or which one somebody else might make into a great site by leasing the domain from me or though some kind of partnership. its not about which one appeals to a broader market of potential buyers. great artists don't decide what to paint based upon how many people might buy their painting. in fact many of them were ridiculed until after their death! i think the same will happen with domainers. once you guys stop churning domains with each other and making money for sedo, godaddy and paypal, the market for all these stupid domains will hit the floor. you want to know what end users think about qkft.com? they think its lame unless their company happens to have those initials


cliffs notes

good domain selection should be based on how usable a domain is by an end-user, not on how likely you are to flip it to another domainer

 

[equity78]

you have all of these domains at auction and 95% of them are really lame and unpronouncable. huge strings of lame and unpronouncable domains. then you read this forum and how they are all great and you have all these terms for how to describe a 54 letter unpronoucable word with 5 dashes in it lol its just obvious

With statements like that its not a great bet

I'd like to be a domainer. I'm learning. Pretty fast I think, I bet I know more than most people do after 4 days

 

[tpruby]

ya well i dont really care what anybodys opinion is is the point

Then why have you initiated this discussion and why have you continued to engage?

You are a walking contradiction.

 

[TheBulldog]

What is your portfolio? You get Models.TV yet?

Found it for you:

pokerpie.com
hornyinterns.com
design.fm
busty.la
mvp.la
nebulous.tv
pokerforum.fm
rakeback.bz (rakeback.com is worth at least $200k, as in i would gladly pay that much for it, and so would many others...it is also not a trademark...anybody know if i can make it one from owning this domain?)
runway.la
toosoon.tv
casinopudong.com (pudong is what the business district and a huge part of shanghai china is called)
pudongpoker.com
farangmarket.com (farang is what a foreigner is refered to in thailand)
forclosureconnection.com
torrentmarketing.com
glotation.com (not a word, but it should be)
luckyluckycasino.com
luckyluckypoker.com (chinese people always say 'lucky lucky' or 'heng heng' when they gamble, they have the same meaning)
henghengcasino.com
henghengpoker.com
junctiongaming.com
patrikpoker.com (patrik antonious is a huge poker celebrity)
pokergiveaways.com
thairai.com (a rai is the unit of measurement of land in thailand, and i think other countries...they dont use acre...this is like having CalAcre.com or something like that)
TravelSaversPlus.com
TheConsumerSavingsNetwork.com
WatchPokerOnline.com
OnlinePokerShow.com
RakeStats.com (rake is a poker term)
RakeBreaker.com
PokerTrafficSolutions.com


Anything worth over reg fee? Registering is a hobby of mine. If these were baseball cards I just picked out the best ones I have, IMO


Let me have it. What do you think of the whole list? Do I suck or should I quit my dayjob?


In addition, if you have similar domains which are better/shorter and serve the same purpose as any of these, feel free to PM me. All of them I registered because a) i think they have value AND b) i might one day develop them/i have an idea for how i might do so, if i were so inclined

 

[sgtppr]

What is your portfolio? You get Models.TV yet?

I've yet to pay over reg for for a domain and from what people in the domain appraisal forum said the only domain I have that might be worth over reg fee is hornyinterns.com hehe

I like design.fm runway.la and pokerpie.com though i have development plans for them. That said, if I decided I could not develop them, I would expect to be able to sell them someday to somebody for a lot of money, and would not let them go cheap myself (im talking xx,xxx) which evidently nobody would pay now...but that doesnt mean the right person in the right position pitched in the right way (marketing!) wouldn't pay it. ever owned a gucci bag? i have a stupid laptop bag that was $800. its about 50% high quality than one that is $100. that is, its 50% nicer than the about the nicest bag you can buy...its not 800% nicer!! you pay a lot for that name and that quality. if design.fm were pitched in that way through an edgy web 2.0 firm to a rich design firm client with some chic who looked like qwen stefani as our 'marketing consultant', we could get a japanese firm to pay $100k for it, i know it could be done. its just timing and patience and luck and skill. i cant see why anybody would waste there time selling any domain for $50 when you have some retarded crap like MarketingToday.com selling for $1.5mm or lots of others you see at auction. what was that one i just read, Brazillian-Transexuals.info for a few grand. those names are obviously going to end users. thats where it appears the money is, to me.

 

[accent]

PokerPie I love your energy.

Folks, this guy is not trying to insult or tic off anyone, he is saying what he sees, and some of what he sees does not add up to him. His delivery is a little rough, I suggest we concentrate more on what he is trying to say.

Sometimes (most of the time) he is missing the background fabric that holds the apparently disconnected parts together. But an inteligent (IMHO) questioning attitude is a huge factor in great success in business, in any form. Look up Tulip Mania if you do not believe a market can lose touch with the real world.

Posted by Ronald Regging namepros, July, 2007:

So if you're looking to follow in the footsteps of others, you're already lacking the necessary skill to do what they did.

I saved that from another Noob thread, I think RR hit it right between the eyes.

 

[tpruby]

...if design.fm were pitched in that way through an edgy web 2.0 firm to a rich design firm client with some chic who looked like qwen stefani as our 'marketing consultant', we could get a japanese firm to pay $100k for it, i know it could be done.

Yes, the Japanese are well known for spending ridiculous amounts of money in direct proportion to how attractive the marketing consultant is.

You have figured out the secret to instant riches....amazing.

Best of luck to you, you'll make millions!

 

[equity78]

SO Gwen Stefani or a look alike is needed to pitch to the Japanese? They would probably want the .com/.net or the .jp Marketingtoday.com is retarded ? to a guy in marketing ? really?

if design.fm were pitched in that way through an edgy web 2.0 firm to a rich design firm client with some chic who looked like qwen stefani as our 'marketing consultant', we could get a japanese firm to pay $100k for it, i know it could be done. its just timing and patience and luck and skill. i cant see why anybody would waste there time selling any domain for $50 when you have some retarded crap like MarketingToday.com selling for $1.5mm or lots of others you see at auction.

Secondly any domain with luck and the perfect end user and timing can sell, you could also hit the lottery with the right luck and timing.

 

[sgtppr]

SO Gwen Stefani or a look alike is needed to pitch to the Japanese? They would probably want the .com/.net or the .jp Marketingtoday.com is retarded ? to a guy in marketing ? really?



Secondly any domain with luck and the perfect end user and timing can sell, you could also hit the lottery with the right luck and timing.

'the harder i work the luckier i get'


i dont know if you guys are joking about what i said about the japenese. if you have never been to japan and seen chibuya i do not thiink you are qualified to poke fun at what i said. it is 100% true.

another truism about marketing to them (and i assume the new rich in china, cultures are similar)

-if its more expensive and they can afford it, they think its better and they will buy it. they are buying image more than anything and they know this. the japenese (the young rich for sure) are all about image. if you dont agree w/ this in any way go research the placement of retail stores for designer goods throughout the world, i've never done this but i'll bet any reasonable amount of money it matches where japanese tourists go nearly exactly. you'll see strange places with a Louis Vuitton retail store, and other very well known spots who don't have it. its the japanese.

 

[Diabro]

Found it for you:

Thank you TheBulldog.

 

[sgtppr]

warren buffet has an interesting saying that i always consider in times like this.

something about when everybody is headed one way, you should head the other. but when a tsunami is coming at you, everybody is headed one way as well, does that mean you should walk into it?

hehe i'm reading the thread and im starting to think people don't understand what i meant by that. that was my way of saying 'should i continue to hold these views or agree with the 20 NP members who just told me i was wrong'. obviously only a fool would continue thinking wie.com were a bad name after this thread...so ya, 50 posts ago, as i said, i was largely wrong.




however......


one thing i said awhile back which i still think is true. this whole industry could use more of a focus toward selling to end users. we have all of these smart people on forums trying to crack the nut of churning on sedo....what if all of those same people thought all day about how to brand, market and sell domain names to end users? is there a namepro's type community FULLY focused on that? just selling to end users? i'll bet there aren't nearly as many brains on that task!

 

[equity78]

But no offense no one would look at Design.fm as the GUCCI of domains, I am well aware of brands and how luxury brands sell. Selling Louis Vuitton in Japan absolutely, Coach is just starting to make a foray into Japan I own the stock so I follow luxury brands in Japan. Problem is .fm is not luxury .com is luxury, .fm is target AGAIN IMO

 

[Diabro]

one thing i said awhile back which i still think is true. this whole industry could use more of a focus toward selling to end users. we have all of these smart people on forums trying to crack the nut of churning on sedo....what if all of those same people thought all day about how to brand, market and sell domain names to end users? is there a namepro's type community FULLY focused on that? just selling to end users? i'll bet there aren't nearly as many brains on that task!

Two points:

1. If you develop a domain to the point where it is high-dollar then it is probably making high-dollar so you may not sell.

2. I am not a flipper but a good flipper could start with your portfolio and be able to buy a premium domain for development or money to develop sites.

That is how a person like you gets Models.TV

Flipping to me seems time consuming and risky but someone who is good could certainly work their way up.

 

[Sameh]

As for being a good marketer, we did over $5,000,000 in 2007 in Internet Marketing, so I'd like to think I'm good at it. Maybe its all dumb luck

I know that many people do better than 5 mil a year from Internet Marketing but your attitude doesn't look like them. anyway...

What kind of "Internet Marketing" we are talking about here ?

This >>

The job will pay $100 and will be fairly easy and fun for the right girls. You wear either a provided uniform or you dress like you just broke up with your boyfriend and are determined to have a one night stand. The event will be at a popular bar or restaurant that we lease and most of our clients in attendance will be young, single, guys. Your job is to make sure they have a good time. Drink, dance, talk, have a good time. Thats all you have to do. Hopefully it wont even feel like work and you'll stay when you are allowed to leave, though you'll be free to go after 4-5 hours.

We are also seeking models for a number of photo-shoots and private events though we'll use the 'party girls' to find qualified candidates for this.

By any chance do you know what "private events" means in this quote ?

 

[Devil_Dog]

ya thanks. thats all it was really. i knew when i posted much of what i said would be proven wrong. i was just sharing my opinion that i had after studying for four days, now i have a new one and tomorrow i'll have another.

<it might be my top secret strategy to troll forums to extract valuable information quicker...this thread is a gold mine of information for me for instance :hehe: im done now though, no more instigating out of me>

4 entire days?!?!?! True veteran here.

 

[sgtppr]

Nice find on the CL posting lol. Poker tournaments mostly. That was a pretty fun little party

 

[Sameh]

Poker tournaments mostly

I own over 20 poker websites

Okie .. Good luck.

One more thing. Please don't call that an "Internet Marketing" .. Because Searching online for "Models/or whatever" is not related to Internet Marketing at all!

 

[sgtppr]

Okie .. Good luck.

One more thing. Please don't call that an "Internet Marketing" .. Because Searching online for "Models/or whatever" is not related to Internet Marketing at all!

lol riiiiiiiiight

 

[SpareDomains]

cliffs notes

good domain selection should be based on how usable a domain is by an end-user, not on how likely you are to flip it to another domainer

some domainers flip thousands of domains a year and make a nice income, other domainers only sell a good handful of domains a year but only sell to end users or to domainers that are willing to pay end user pricing, kinda like godaddy selling tons of domains cheap and enom selling less domains but at 3x the price, I prefer having the patience for the end user mainly because I would rather sell 5-10 a year and make the same amount of income as selling 1500 a year as it is less work not only in moving all of those sold domains but also having to replace that sold inventory, a domainer is generally looking at ppc value or a low price in order to resell where an end user will buy a domain at 1-10k+ strictly based on the sound of the domain or the keywords it contains with no ppc stats shown, here are 3 of my sales from december...

1,000
5,000
6,500

not the highest prices in the world, but all 3 of those were $7.15 domains that I sat on from 6-21 months each so that calculates to a very high return on investment percentage, either method works based on your business model, not saying I agree with everything you said but I do lean toward your above quote as being true.

 

[sgtppr]

some domainers flip thousands of domains a year and make a nice income, other domainers only sell a good handful of domains a year but only sell to end users or to domainers that are willing to pay end user pricing, kinda like godaddy selling tons of domains cheap and enom selling less domains but at 3x the price, I prefer having the patience for the end user mainly because I would rather sell 5-10 a year and make the same amount of income as selling 1500 a year as it is less work not only in moving all of those sold domains but also having to replace that sold inventory, a domainer is generally looking at ppc value or a low price in order to resell where an end user will buy a domain at 1-10k+ strictly based on the sound of the domain or the keywords it contains with no ppc stats shown, here are 3 of my sales from december...

1,000
5,000
6,500

not the highest prices in the world, but all 3 of those were $7.15 domains that I sat on from 6-21 months each so that calculates to a very high return on investment percentage, either method works based on your business model, not saying I agree with everything you said but I do lean toward your above quote as being true.

zing!

 

[raredn.com]

Sure PokerPie .tv over .com anyday, I would definately want the absolutely overwhelmingly huge population of Tuvalu to have priority seo... Any .com is going to seo higher than a .tv for the American population in google etc, but if you want to make money from a website, who needs the American market anyway. Tuvalu all the way! : ) its best to have your .tv website 'buried' under a million .coms in the search engine listings with pride

The .tv Tuvalu population have far more money to spend, apparently the government give every single person in Tuvalu one 'billion dollars' of disposable income, hence the popularity of wanting to develop .tv websites

Viva Tuvalu Models!


Also people, remember it is 'illegal' to have a normal job and do domaining at the same time. Keep this in mind unless you want to be arrested. You do one or the other not both, ok!

 

[brackis]

Guys you are all idiots and making a big mistake...


....Traditional domaining is a big waste of time when you could be out there trying to woo Michelle Wie and her millions. 18 year old reg date, prolly 200-300 hits/day depending on her practice schedule, highly brandable.

 

[Krossat]

You asked: Why Flip amongst each other instead of searching for end users

Answer: The flips being done here you can see. But how do you know we dont sell to end users too? That you cant see becoz we dont post those sales :\
And end users dont like to see the purchase values being posted post sales.

To keep up, you need to take various paths, develop, flip, sell to end users. What order you take, is your business plan.

 

[cache]

money does not lie, if one thing is more expensive most of the time, it must have a good reason.

 

[sgtppr]

nobody can accuse you guys of not having a second of humor!

'18 year reg date, highly brandable' LOL

 

[VURG]

You can't create demand. Some people seem to give the impression that Namepros members created this massive demand for 4 letter domains. The fact of the matter is that there has been over $7million spent on registration fees just in the past 3 years. Now it is over $3million per year. While shortness may not be appealling to everyone, it is very desirable for some! Namepros members have been buying the best 4 letter domains that they could for years and years and helping others do the same. As the supply depleted, features of the remaining domains became more desirable (for all 4 letter domain purchasers/not just Namepros) until there reached a point where anything that short was considered good and they all went.

Are you just upset that you didn't the appraisals that you wanted to hear? The appraisals in this forum are usually very conservative. You can always get a huge sale for any name if you wait long enough or market/develope well enough but different names can be liquidated a lot easier than others.