Who shall be responsible for this backorder，Hexonet，.Co registry or Dock.ly?

[domainnews]

Hello all domainers in the group i need your help.

The story goes like this ， i placed a backorder at Hexonet last month ，the extention is (.Co，German word). and the domain registry deletion time is 24，Nov according to the registry whois info and Hexonet system data，howere，this is registry liquid domain which placed a backorder fee is 106 USD （gross ）and rest will be paid if the registrar caught it， then paid Hexonet via Paypal 106 USD in 21，Nov，as you can see in the screenshots attached ， to my surprise，the backorder status didn't active when I paid successfully as i checkered into my Hexonet account，at first beginning，im suppose that maybe the system delays and it will works soon（i mean status will active soon）.

The next day(22，Nov)， i loggined into my Hexonet account to see it be actived or not， while its status still shown Requested(This means my backorder did not be successful at that time)，then i checked the backorder domain in the Hexonet search bar ，to my surprise again，the backorder price had changed into （310 USD for that backorder，no email sent to me that this domain pricing is changed by their staff during the backorder process，after that， i sent to their backorder team support immediately wonder why the order did not be actived or did I need to pay extra money ( the rest 204USD)，but the support team did not get back to me（the day not Sunday or statuary）. considering the backorder day is just around the corner，therefore， i paid the rest money via paypal again and received an email，order actived on 24，Nov (on which the date is registry deletion date 2 hours than Dockly，my order time is15:35 24，Nov while Docky is 17:55，24 Nov） as you can see in the screenshots.

OK，lets talk about. Co registry ， the domain deletion date is 24 ，Nover setted by the .Co registry ，howere，the registry system did not deleted it on time ， and the status of that domain still was pending-deleted
although 5 days had passed (30，Nov)，then i email the original registrar （namesilo） and .co registry to see what happened ， but both of them there is no response （not Sunday or Saturday）， and today（1，Dec) i have received an email from Namesilo but the .co registry still not get back to me yet ， and i emailed .co registry again this morning and wait for their replys .

There is one thing that really shocked me a lot， that is ， the whois info of the domain changed into Grepapps.com(GrepApps.com)although the the domain status is still in pending deleted period and the original registrar is still Namesilo ，but whois says
(reservation elibility start date 24，Nov to Reservation Eligibility end date is 28， as a matter of fact， the domain still not be deleted until 30， Nov after I emailed to .co registry to ask why the domain did not be resolved) you can see the screenshot attached .

The hexonet support sent to me that the domain they did not catch it in 1， Dec and its very hard to provide the reason said by their staff，to be honest， im extremely mad ，disappointed and quite unsatisfied with such reason of hexonet， then i sent 3 emails to their support immediately and not get back to them yet until now， im quite suspicious that Hexonet is greedy and want it to be theirs at that time，I'm suppose that Hexonet and docky are associated and Shared API because the docky.ly of GrepApps .com registed in Taiwan) and supports German language，several days ago ，their website(GrepApps.com) can not be opened as i visited and i meet the same thing today.)

Here is my questions are：

（1） Why I placed backorder at HEXONET and paid Successfully but the status didn't be active?

(2) Why the Hexonet placed order much easier than docky but failed?(original order date is 21，Nov， Docky，24 Nov)

(3) Why the domain still in pending-deleted period ，but the registry can change its whois info to another one， Abuse?

（4）Why the deleted date is 24 Nov seted by .co registry，howere，the domain did not resolved on time although 5 days had passed it still in pending-deleted？ and delected it immediately after i sent the email to .co registry?

（5） I have sent 3 emails to Hexonet and 1 to Docky to see if they are associated but no response ， what they are afraid of？

（6）Who shall be responsible for this unexpected result or who shall be piority to this domain?

Some screenshots attached.

I'm a domainer and need all to help to give me some good advice ， honesty speaking，my English is not as good as yours， but feel free to ask me if you can not understand in the thread！

Much appreciated in advanced！

 

[domainnews]

MORE ATATCHMENTS

 

[domainnews]

screenshot

 

[domainnews]

The backorder active in 24，Nov， as you see the date delays 3 days ， because my first backorder date is 21，Nov and paid successfully but they dont active it

 

[domainnews]

BTW，this is registry liquid domain ， therefore， First come First serve， without bidding，It will be yours if you place a backorder earier than others ，on other hand，if needed to bid ，so why its domain whois has changed into another person or entires freely even though
the domain is still in pending -deleted period ？ make sense? if needed to bid， i conclude ，the .CO registry Abuse Power！

 

[domainnews]

DATA comprison：

Docky.ly : Reservation elibility start date: Dec 24，17：53 ：11z，2023

Hexonet 1 time: Dec 21，2023 （paid via Paypal successfully but not
Hexonet system does not Active）

Hexonet 2nd : Dec 24，15：53：11z，2023

 

[pb]

According to whois, the domain was reserved by GrepApps Technology Inc., so Hexonet was not able to secure that domain for you. The .co registry has this special procedure where (sadly only) registrars can place a reservation for $100 (I think) in the pendingDelete period so it's a race on who does it first rather than a race of who registers the domain after it drops.

 

[domainnews]

According to whois, the domain was reserved by GrepApps Technology Inc., so Hexonet was not able to secure that domain for you. The .co registry has this special procedure where (sadly only) registrars can place a reservation for $100 (I think) in the pendingDelete period so it's a race on who does it first rather than a race of who registers the domain after it drops.

You are totally right，in the pendingDelete period so it's a race on who does it first rather than a race of who registers the domain after it drops.

but ，hexonet much earlier than docky does，why the domain doesn't belongs to Hexonet？even their staff says its hard to provide the reason，or first time when i placed the backorder and paid successfully but hexonet sysmtem doesn't work（Active），and the second time active successfully still above docky，therefore，Hexonet shall be responsible for it due to their first time system erro or .Co registry doesn't play a fair game?

 

[domainnews]

According to whois, the domain was reserved by GrepApps Technology Inc., so Hexonet was not able to secure that domain for you. The .co registry has this special procedure where (sadly only) registrars can place a reservation for $100 (I think) in the pendingDelete period so it's a race on who does it first rather than a race of who registers the domain after it drops.

Hi，GrepApps.com is just Docky.ly

 

[pb]

You may have placed the order at Hexonet earlier, but it doesn't change the fact that the reservation window opened on 2023-11-24 17:53:11 and it was the registrar who first placed the reservation order after that time who gets to register the domain. Maybe docky.ly also had open orders, or maybe they did it preemptively in hope of attracting backorders, but anyway they succeeded and hexonet did not.

 

[domainnews]

You may have placed the order at Hexonet earlier, but it doesn't change the fact that the reservation window opened on 2023-11-24 17:53:11 and it was the registrar who first placed the reservation order after that time who gets to register the domain. Maybe docky.ly also had open orders, or maybe they did it preemptively in hope of attracting backorders, but anyway they succeeded and hexonet did not.

you can clearly see the 2 screenshots

Docky： Reservation elibility start date Dec 24~28

Hexonet：Dec24~27

 

[pb]

It doesn't matter, only the data from registry whois matters. Hexonet doesn't magically get a 2h headstart just because they show an earlier time in their panel. Besides, I don't think it's "their" time, just "your" time - i.e. the deadline for you to place a backorder. It makes sense that it's 2h earlier than the actual deadline, because they need time to set up their systems.

 

[domainnews]

It doesn't matter, only the data from registry whois matters. Hexonet doesn't magically get a 2h headstart just because they show an earlier time in their panel. Besides, I don't think it's "their" time, just "your" time - i.e. the deadline for you to place a backorder. It makes sense that it's 2h earlier than the actual deadline, because they need time to set up their systems.

as you know U.S time is slower12～ 13 hrs than Beijing ，Colunbia time does the same，if it was my time ，then it shall be Dec 24~ 26，Germany time slower 8 hrs than Beijing time which means Germany time faster 3~4 hrs than U.S or Columbia，its clear to see the backorder time is Germany time

 

[domainnews]

It doesn't matter, only the data from registry whois matters. Hexonet doesn't magically get a 2h headstart just because they show an earlier time in their panel. Besides, I don't think it's "their" time, just "your" time - i.e. the deadline for you to place a backorder. It makes sense that it's 2h earlier than the actual deadline, because they need time to set up their systems.

You can see my last payment is 23 Nov after paid i checked my account is 310 USD，its realtime，not bank transfer

 

[domainnews]

It doesn't matter, only the data from registry whois matters. Hexonet doesn't magically get a 2h headstart just because they show an earlier time in their panel. Besides, I don't think it's "their" time, just "your" time - i.e. the deadline for you to place a backorder. It makes sense that it's 2h earlier than the actual deadline, because they need time to set up their systems.

Your can also see first time Dec 21 ，hexonet required me to pay 106 USD to backorder that domain then I paid but the domain doesn't be active， i dont know why？

 

[pb]

Obviously they need to refund you, but other than that I don't see what else. The fact that they require prepayment for backorders doesn't magically secure the backorder. There are other catchers that do that, like pool.com and realtime.at. It's just safer for them, especially if they need to hand out a large sum to the registry.

If you want 100% fair and secure backorders, look into .pl futures and .dk waitlist services. They are open to all registrants (not registrars), you purchase these services at your own time and discretion and they give you 100% priority over everyone else if the domain expires. The .co registry had the right idea but failed with the execution. Or maybe they also caved in to please the registrars, just like verisign/icann did in 2002.

 

[DomainNature]

It seems that the domain was too good to give it to you, they for sure have some inside priorities which can bypass end users, I had similar exp with sav where they backordered my domain for themselves because the domain was really good, but maybe I m wrong because sometimes they failed to dropcatch my domains and I was able to hand reg them, maybe it was their backorder system that have failed, who knows.
In short if a domain is too good the big corps will take it before you wake.

 

[pb]

It seems that the domain was too good to give it to you, they for sure have some inside priorities which can bypass end users, I had similar exp with sav where they backordered my domain for themselves because the domain was really good, but maybe I m wrong because sometimes they failed to dropcatch my domains and I was able to hand reg them, maybe it was their backorder system that have failed, who knows.
In short if a domain is too good the big corps will take it before you wake.

Yes, that's why it's unfair to enable the reservation system (in .co) just to the registrars and not the registrants. This way we need to use intermediaries who may or may not be honest in what they do with the data. Also, in this system, even if you're the first to backorder the domain, the registrar who manages to place the reservation will still auction it off if they get more orders in the last days (and they are pretty much guaranteed to get more orders, since they're listed in the whois as the ones who have exclusive rights to the domain after it drops). The only fair part of this system is that the reservations are only possible in pending delete, so it always drops, i.e. the money paid is actually spent and not gambled.

By comparison .pl (which I consider a great registry in many aspects) has a reservation (futures) system that works like that: at any point the domain is active, you (a regular user) can buy a 3-year future and *if* the domain drops in this period, it is yours. If it doesn't the money is wasted, but you can keep renewing if you really care. Most domains that people consider valuable have active futures, but importantly, they were placed by a whole lot of different people, and registrars are actually forbidden from buying futures, so it's all regular investors. Of course many of these futures will never realize so it's free money for the registry but an occasional golden shot is totally worth it for gamblers/investors who partake in this system. The only shitty thing is that they recently doubled the price of placing a future order, but it's still worth it for the best domains. Another drawback is that you can't place the future order when the domain is already expiring, only when it's active, which is of course aimed at creating FOMO and making more money for the registry, since lots of the domains are reactivated in the first few days after expiring.

Another example is .dk, which, while being a generally shitty registry (one of the worst, who recently introduced KYC which cost them 10% of the domains so far and who is proactively aggressive towards investors, with domain sales ban not even being the worst, but that's a story for another day) amazingly did one thing right, and that is waitlist. At any point in the domain's life cycle, even if it's expiring, you can sign up for a waitlist, and you can do it directly at the registry, no intermediaries at all. What is more, you can sign up for a place on waitlist even if there are already others who did the same - something that can't be done anywhere else afaik. Whether it's sensible or not, it's for individual interpretation, but it's there. Personally, if a domain would be super important to me, I'd take 2nd or even 3rd place in the waitlist, because it has to be renewed yearly and the guys from the first spots might not renew, and I'd move up. And if the domain drops and guy number 1 gets it, I also move up. I think it's a very fair and transparent system. It's a shitty registry but this function I like.

And to imagine we could have had such a system in .com and .net, and possibly more tlds, were it not for the greedy registrars who of course would never give up their right to just snatch each and every domain of their clients' and auction it off. Who need fair solutions when they can just have it all. (for reference)