Transfer domain from GD to Epik with 60-day lock

[Kassey Lee]

I just acquired a domain in GD closeout and want to transfer it out immediately to Epik but there is a 60-day lock. Is there any way to get around it?

 

[Samer]

story of my life, Kassey

if no, change it.. terrible feeling, held hostage...

it’s even worse; they do the same with pushes

 

[Samer]

@Joe Styler any way around this?

60 day transfer lock is bane of my existence

you are pros at it from pushes to closeout

Samer

 

[eternaldomains]

Guaranteed no way. Evil rich companies collaborating with evil rich organizations will force investors, especially poor ones, to suffer the most. "Sold" one domain before the 60 days but until now no money because the end user didn't want to complete his registrar account and is now completely abandoning the deal.

The only way to "go around it" is to get a rich-but-good-natured domainer who will perform a hostile takeover of ICANN and get rid of policies purposely made to punish domainers and policies that punish poorer domainers even more heavily.

 

[Kassey Lee]

I figured while push within registrar is possible, there's not way to transfer out within 60 days. I'll just have to wait for the 60 days to be over. I want to consolidate all my domains at only one registrar, learn how to use it best, and simplify my domain management. Thanks for the comments.

 

[Rob Monster]

I just acquired a domain in GD closeout and want to transfer it out immediately to Epik but there is a 60-day lock. Is there any way to get around it?

You can add it for free as an external domain to your Epik account and also use:

- Free DNS
- Free email and domain forwarding
- Free WHOIS privacy (anonymize.com)

And then at Day 60, hit transfer.

It is the next best thing.

Rob

 

[Joe Styler]

I just acquired a domain in GD closeout and want to transfer it out immediately to Epik but there is a 60-day lock. Is there any way to get around it?

You can email [email protected] and explain how you bought it and that you were not given the option to opt out of the lock if that is true and they will review it.

 

[Kassey Lee]

You can email [email protected] and explain how you bought it and that you were not given the option to opt out of the lock if that is true and they will review it.

I usually don't read the details. At the check-out page when buying a Closeout domain, is there any option to opt out of the lock? Thanks.

 

[SuperBrander]

@Joe Styler Whenever a domain is bought at Godaddy, the aftermarket team transfers the domain to the buyer without waiving the 60 day lock so the owner has no choice but stay. When I emailed Review60 about a domain I bought at Godaddy auctions and had an imposed lock after Godaddy pushed it into my account they said- the domain "was opted into a 60-day lock during a registrant change. This lock was placed by ICANN and we are unable to remove it.".

@Kassey Lee's domain was bought at closeouts so Godaddy as a default let it enter the account with an imposed lock. Referring people to Review60 when Godaddy is the one that's forcing these locks just to have Review60 give their automatic response that ICANN enforces it is quite ridiculous. You guys have an option to waive the lock when the domain enters the account- so stop imposing it automatically and then send people to review60 whose only answer is that it can't be unlocked. Godaddy can't create a problem and then send the person to another department that just shrugs and says it's somebody else's fault and nothing can be done about it. That's Kafkaesque and unfair.

 

[Kassey Lee]

@Joe Styler Whenever a domain is bought at Godaddy, the aftermarket team transfers the domain to the buyer without waiving the 60 day lock so the owner has no choice but stay. When I emailed Review60 about a domain I bought at Godaddy auctions and had an imposed lock after Godaddy pushed it into my account they said- the domain "was opted into a 60-day lock during a registrant change. This lock was placed by ICANN and we are unable to remove it.".

Thanks. Now I know the rest of the story. No wonder I did not get a chance to opt out.

 

[Joe Styler]

@Joe Styler Whenever a domain is bought at Godaddy, the aftermarket team transfers the domain to the buyer without waiving the 60 day lock so the owner has no choice but stay. When I emailed Review60 about a domain I bought at Godaddy auctions and had an imposed lock after Godaddy pushed it into my account they said- the domain "was opted into a 60-day lock during a registrant change. This lock was placed by ICANN and we are unable to remove it.".

@Kassey Lee's domain was bought at closeouts so Godaddy as a default let it enter the account with an imposed lock. Referring people to Review60 when Godaddy is the one that's forcing these locks just to have Review60 give their automatic response that ICANN enforces it is quite ridiculous. You guys have an option to waive the lock when the domain enters the account- so stop imposing it automatically and then send people to review60 whose only answer is that it can't be unlocked. Godaddy can't create a problem and then send the person to another department that just shrugs and says it's somebody else's fault and nothing can be done about it. That's Kafkaesque and unfair.

It is not that easy unfortunately. We have a legal team and a compliance team and there is policy that we develop based on feedback from those teams. We can do what you are suggesting about the lock, but to do so we would have to change the terms people agree to (it has been a year or two since I was involved in the policy conversations with the legal teams so I am going from memory here and I may be a bit off) The best of my recollection was we had to change the terms to make the domain buyer and expired domain owner agree to use GoDaddy as more or less a designated agent acting on their behalf with power of attorney in changing the domain info in order to make it work. This opens up a myriad of other concerns. In the end we decided to move it with the lock but you can ask to be opted out via that email and they will look at it.
It wasn't as easy as checking a box.

 

[SuperBrander]

@Joe Styler Thanks for the response. As I mentioned, I asked review60 to remove the lock and got this exact answer: "the domain was opted into a 60-day lock during a registrant change. This lock was placed by ICANN and we are unable to remove it". The domain was bought at Godaddy auctions and was pushed to my account by GD. So... what's the use of sending people to review60? It's pointless. You guys impose the lock as a policy and then send people to a department that tells them that it can't be removed and that it's ICANN's fault. It's comedy gold, but totally unhelpful.

I really appreciate you being here, answering questions and helping when you can. I hope that GD's new CEO will be true to his word, listen to domainers more and reexamine some aspects of GD. My top ones, as I partially mentioned to you in another thread: 1. The 60 day lock (I don't understand the legal problem your team had when you reviewed this matter, but I know that the lock can be waived because it's being done elsewhere). 2. The discount club that ends up costing domainers way more than most major registrars charge without a discount club. There's really no incentive to renew at GD and if the lock is scheduled to interfere with renewal, domainers are better off buying aftermarket domains elsewhere if the same domain is available in other marketplaces. 3. The bug that allows two people to buy the same domain from Godaddy auctions and Godaddy Premium during the day of the purchase. And 4. Eliminate the paid Reserve so GD Auctions can be more like NameJet.

Thanks again.

 

[ArielT]

I undertand that the lock for .com is not mandatory

 

[Ategy]

I undertand that the lock for .com is not mandatory

There was a change to this one or two years ago .. not sure of the details (I seem to recall @Rob Monster referring to once as Epik tinkered with their locking options last year .. unfortunately I forget the details).

Also .. while I do complain about GoDaddy a lot (sorry @Joe Styler and @Paul Nicks .. lol) , it's important to give them a break here .. you all need to note that the 60 day lock is a VERY IMPORTANT security protocol that reduces chances of domain theft significantly.

That being said .. if GoDaddy claims they have the right to take away ownership of an expired domain from the original owner, then I don't see it as being a stretch that they remove the lock from 60 day domains. Unless in fact they aren't 100% about the legal right of selling someone else's expired domain and keep the lock in the rare case where this who system is called into question.

There also are legal issues here as GoDaddy and ALL other registrars (I don't want to single out GoDaddy here) who resell expired domains, are going around the spirit of the registration rules. Way back at the dawn of the internet (or at least a very long time ago), the registrar expiration period was intended as a safeguard to allow the domain owner a buffer to keep/renew their domain in case it expired. After that the REGISTRY BLOCKOUT (the next ~35 days before Verisign deletes/drops the domain) was in place SPECIFICALLY so a different entity would NOT procure the domain and lead to the potential assumption of it being the owned by the same owner (very important for secure emails to get bounced for a blackout period).

So in effect the whole system/process never intended for registrars to claim/take/steal the original owner's domains to resell at the registrar's profit. This is actually something I continuously question both the legality (I'm assuming GD's lawyers say it's ok .. lol) and morality of. That being said .. I can't really complain because the vast majority of my acquisitions (and profit) come from expired domains at auction or closeout .. lol.

I'm actually curious as to how this reselling of expired inventory came to be and how it was ever allowed in the first place.

It's why I happy to see the development of some registrars potentially starting to automatically give the profits of expired domains back to the theoretical original owner.

 

[Samer]

Also .. while I do complain about GoDaddy a lot (sorry @Joe Styler and @Paul Nicks .. lol) , it's important to give them a break here .. you all need to note that the 60 day lock is a VERY IMPORTANT security protocol that reduces chances of domain theft significantly.

That being said .. if GoDaddy claims they have the right to take away ownership of an expired domain from the original owner, then I don't see it as being a stretch that they remove the lock from 60 day domains. Unless in fact they aren't 100% about the legal right of selling someone else's expired domain and keep the lock in the rare case where this who system is called into question.

There also are legal issues here as GoDaddy and ALL other registrars (I don't want to single out GoDaddy here) who resell expired domains, are going around the spirit of the registration rules. Way back at the dawn of the internet (or at least a very long time ago), the registrar expiration period was intended as a safeguard to allow the domain owner a buffer to keep/renew their domain in case it expired. After that the REGISTRY BLOCKOUT (the next ~35 days before Verisign deletes/drops the domain) was in place SPECIFICALLY so a different entity would NOT procure the domain and lead to the potential assumption of it being the owned by the same owner (very important for secure emails to get bounced for a blackout period).

So in effect the whole system/process never intended for registrars to claim/take/steal the original owner's domains to resell at the registrar's profit. This is actually something I continuously question both the legality (I'm assuming GD's lawyers say it's ok .. lol) and morality of. That being said .. I can't really complain because the vast majority of my acquisitions (and profit) come from expired domains at auction or closeout .. lol.

I'm actually curious as to how this reselling of expired inventory came to be and how it was ever allowed in the first place.

It's why I happy to see the development of some registrars potentially starting to automatically give the profits of expired domains back to the theoretical original owner.

I disliked for the first two. "security" if anything, it's less secure, if forget and expires? Why Not like stocks, mill instantly, only require a pass?

DNs should be too. hide "60 day ICANN " policy by antiquated; Net Sol, LCN, eNom.

Why is Godaddy backwards? Forced 60 day; no one sans GD & aforementioned registrars..
Hurts Liquidity, more than help imo; stop being stuck in the past.

Samer

 

[Sutruk]

you all need to note that the 60 day lock is a VERY IMPORTANT security protocol that reduces chances of domain theft significantly.

I totally agree on this. The 60 day lock it's a security measure, and I am happy with that.
If something changes in your domain info, you know there will be a 60 day lock, and the purpose is to increase the security of your own domains.

And the same lock applies when a domain is transferred to another registrar. For the same purpose, for security.

 

[SuperBrander]

In my case, I wasn't referring to an expired domain. I bought a domain from a seller. Why do I need to be stuck for 60 days when there's an option to waive the lock? That's especially the case if both the buyer and seller are known to Godaddy. BTW in Godaddy's current system, in two different transactions- even when I was dealing with a seller who asked to opt out of the lock and I also requested to opt out- the domains still got locked for 60 days. So I don't have a clue what Godaddy is doing with the lock but the whole system is currently problematic. Regarding closeouts and expired auctions- if godaddy lists a domain, then of course it's legal for them to handle it. The owner lost ownership and it's up for grabs. I don't see any reason to lock the domain in those cases either. Either way, if it's impossible to opt out of it after Godaddy locks it- then sending people to review60 is pointless.

 

[Ategy]

I disliked for the first two. "security my a--" if anything, it's less secure, forgot about and expires? Why Not like stocks, which sell millions instantly, only require password?
Domains should be too. They hide "60 day ICANN " same policy used by antiquated; Network Solutions, LCN, eNom.
Godaddy, isnt progress, this backwards..? hate 60 day, no one except u aforementioned dinosaurs

Samer .. the problem is that while domains might be considered "commodities", they weren't created or intended for that purpose.

They are intended as a means to UNIQUELY identify a person or business on the internet.

Even in real estate there are safeties and checks in place so that a person does not become homeless 1 minute after they miss their first mortgage payment.

Domains are digital entities intended to connect the owner with their ideas, products, messages to the world. It is ethically questionable to remove that presumed connection (aka the domain) without fail-safes like a notable blackout period. Because what's at stake is more than just the domain itself, it's the reputation, authority and good will of the original registrant.


I know what I say isn't ideal from a domainer's perspective .. but it is the ethical and moral viewpoint. If anything, for things to be originally as intended from a moral perspective, regardless as to when the domain is auctioned, there should still be the theoretical blackout period that was always intended to help protect the intellectual property and good will of the original owners.

Despite knowing that this would hurt me as a domainer, I'd definitely vote for such a maditory blackout period between the unintended ownership changes that happens with an expired domain auction/closeout .. because it's the right thing to do.


Conversely .. I also feel strongly that after an appropriate blackout period a domain should indeed be available again.

Ultimately domains exist because of the original creativity of the original registrant .. there most certainly is value in that .. which is why I feel that it's good for the original owner to profit from the expired domain's sale.

 

[Ategy]

In my case, I wasn't referring to an expired domain. I bought a domain from a seller. Why do I need to be stuck for 60 days when there's an option to waive the lock? That's especially the case if both the buyer and seller are known to Godaddy. BTW in Godaddy's current system, in two different transactions- even when I was dealing with a seller who asked to opt out of the lock and I also requested to opt out- the domains still got locked for 60 days. So I don't have a clue what Godaddy is doing with the lock but the whole system is currently problematic.

lol .. I wouldn't necessarily assume this was GoDaddy's actual intent .. there was a very longstanding account issue at GoDaddy for a very longtime (at least a year, likely more), where you could not push between accounts while keeping/changing the WhoIs. I wrote keeping/changing because I know for sure it was one of those options (pretty sure it was if set to change WhoIs to the new account's), but forget which one as I haven't done a GD>GD push in a while.

When I called in, I had a laugh with the person on the phone because we both knew it was a VERY long term bug with no hope of solving during that call or any time soon. He just honestly said to do the push (I think without a WhoIs change) and be sure to remind the new owner to change their WhoIs (which ironically can also be buggy)!

 

[SuperBrander]

@Ategy I think the bottom line of all of this is that Godaddy needs to look into their push system. It's still buggy and problematic. While they're at it they should reexamine the lock issue. I'm not against a lock as a form of security. But in some cases it isn't needed, IMO. And if it is needed and can't be waived after the lock is in place- then review60 shouldn't be a place domainers are sent to because it's a waste of time for everybody involved.

 

[Ategy]

@SuperBrander .. lol .. I can't argue with you there .. but again .. just because GoDaddy wants to do something, doesn't mean they technically or legally can. We need to keep in mind GoDaddy has severe platform security issues as well as communications and logic integrity issues. I'm sure they WANT to fix their raging disaster of a platform .. but they just don't and haven't for years despite making some changes and some superficial tweaks. At this point we have to assume that the problems in the platform are just too overwhelming to expect them to fix any time soon.

In the case of expired domains I do agree that it makes ZERO sense to have the lock, because in theory the domain WAS SOLD BY GODADDY ... GoDaddy receives 100% of the funds, so that would mean the legal owner of the domain (whether moral or not) was GoDaddy at the moment of sale .. and as such, as the domain owner they would have the right to waive the lock.

Unless of course the lock isn't based on when you bought the domain from GoDaddy, but from when GoDaddy took ownership from the original registrant (who obviously let the domain expire and didn't get an opportunity to waive the lock. So since I think GoDaddy now claims domains on day 30, and the auction is on day 35 (closeouts from day 35 to day 40), and the domain actually usually gets transfered to you around the 41st .. then in theory the lock from the original owner would still be effective about another 40-51 days.

Many are assuming here that expiration overrides any lock .. which while it would make sense, might not be the actual case legally on paper.


It ultimately depends on how the expiration process is structured. When exactly (legally) does GD actually take ownership of the domain .. I would think presumably at least as far back as the moment you pay for it .. or maybe bid on it .. or maybe when it expires? Maybe @Joe Styler or @Paul Nicks could get an answer to that question from their legal department?

 

[oldtimer]

Below are the rules from ICANN, still not clear if the registrars have to give the full recovery period for expired domains or whether it's at their discretion when to put it on auction and sell it to someone else, I have noticed valuable domains that have been transferred to new owners shortly after expiration without going through redemption and deletion process which used to take up to around 75 days from expiration. I have also noticed expired domains that just linger there for several months without being released back to the public. I suspect that the ICANN insiders have worked with the registrars to make it possible for them to get away with registrants rights as far as giving them the full period allowed to recover and renew their domains.

IMO

https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/errp-2013-02-28-en


https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/lost-domain-names


https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/about-transfer-policy-2017-10-10-en


https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/renewal-2013-05-03-en


https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/gtld-lifecycle-2012-02-25-en


https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/registars/accreditation/eddp-en

 

[Kassey Lee]

In the case of expired domains I do agree that it makes ZERO sense to have the lock, because in theory the domain WAS SOLD BY GODADDY ... GoDaddy receives 100% of the funds, so that would mean the legal owner of the domain (whether moral or not) was GoDaddy at the moment of sale .. and as such, as the domain owner they would have the right to waive the lock.

Very well said.

 

[tonyk2000]

As a side note, 60 days looks and smells like potential chargeback period (with at least some credit/debit card issuers). Exactly 60, not 50 or 75 days. This makes at least some sense to apply it for online purchases. Had it be the only reason, GD might remove said lock by request (trusted customer, bankwire funding, etc.). Will they? It is unlikely. Should a previous owner with a good legal team "wake up" and promise all sorts of lawsuits - it would be more practical for a registrar to reverse the expired sale. Which must be the real reason why we still see the lock.

 

[Joe Styler]

Very well said.

I think you guys missed what I said about our legal and policy teams. Technically speaking it is possible but the ICANN policy team and legal team do not like us going this route as it has other implications.