The USA Political Thread

[lennco]

Here you can spout your USA political views.

Rules:
1. Keep it clean
2. No fighting
3. Respect the views of others.
4. US Political views, No Religious views
5. Have fun

:wave:

 

[Domainace]

I just think it makes for an interesting discussion, and it's something that's at least indirectly present in most of our lives, especially if you have kids (which I do).

Well, I think my kids will agree that its definitely in the top 5000 things that are indirectly present in our lives. To me, it's a sign of an unserious society - making trivial matters important while important matters are trivialized. Thinking one can choose a unique gender/pronoun for themselves is the height of narcissism - and I just cannot take anyone who does that seriously.

So far as sports and gender, i am fine with people behaving and dressing any way they want as long as they are not hurting others. Wear a tutu, have the offending part shrunken, removed, reformed into a fake labia or cut it off and have a French chef serve it up at a party as one guy in Tokyo did. We all should be free to make whatever choices we want, but none of us has the right to demand society change everything so that we can feel good about every choice we make. And we don't have a right to discriminate against young women who want to compete in sports. We also don't have a right to invade women's showers and toilets because we claim to feel like a woman ourselves. Most of this is common sense, which I know is especially unfashionable in the West these days.

 

[Joe N]

Well, I think my kids will agree that its definitely in the top 5000 things that are indirectly present in our lives. To me, it's a sign of an unserious society - making trivial matters important while important matters are trivialized. Thinking one can choose a unique gender/pronoun for themselves is the height of narcissism.

Just imagine... next thing you know people are going to want to be able to legally change their name.

Great thing about freedom of speech is that we can openly discuss anything we want, trivial or not. I understand the desire to be dismissive with this issue, though... Between the four of you I have yet to read a coherent argument supported by anything more than your own opinions.

 

[Domainace]

next thing you know people are going to want to be able to legally change their name

That's a non sequitur, not an argument.

Between the four of you I have yet to read a coherent argument supported by anything more than your own opinions.

See above.

 

[Joe N]

That's a non sequitur, not an argument.

It's having the right to identify yourself, and to be identified, in the way you choose. Exact same thing.

 

[Domainace]

It's having the right to identify yourself, and to be identified, in the way you choose. Exact same thing.

No. This shouldn't have to be explained, but you are comparing changing one's name to changing the fundamentals of a language to appease one individual. That doesn't work in a sane society - though cults do some version of that. It's beyond Orwell and into farce. It certainly would never be confused with a coherent argument. Ask you kids - they usually have a pretty good bullshit meter, especially with their parents.

 

[Joe N]

No. This shouldn't have to be explained, but you are comparing changing one's name to changing the fundamentals of a language to appease one individual. That doesn't work in a sane society - though cults do some version of that. It's beyond Orwell and into farce. It certainly would never be confused with a coherent argument. Ask you kids - they usually have a pretty good bullshit meter, especially with their parents.

There's nothing new or crazy happening on the language front. Have some new English terms been created to fill a gap that exists in gender definition? Absolutely. But the concept itself is older than Jesus. Hindu culture... Indigenous culture... Indonesian... and several others all have centuries old references to multiple genders.

The concept of gender as we know it in the western world is very much a socially conceived convenience.

And this isn't an issue of appeasing one individual. As I mentioned before, there are over a million people in the US alone who identify as non-binary. And Ipsos conducted a global poll that identified 1.4% of the population as either transgender, nonbinary, gender-nonconforming, or gender-fluid.

Like it or not, this is very much a global reality that will only become more and more accepted over the years.

 

[HotKey]

Like it or not, this is very much a global reality that will only become more and more accepted over the years.

Joe, honestly to me it's more of an imposed or forced reality than a genuine acceptance. Time will tell, but this stuff hasn't stabilized yet because it flipflops so much.. one day we identify as this, the next we identify as that and I mean it all just seems like superficial attention seeking gone awry. And the kids thing, I mean kids have always experimented some grow out of it others find their place in it but regardless that direction should never be mandated by people outside the given family.

 

[GILSAN]

Show attachment 208842

Why waste my precious time on a irrelevant subject with someone without any common sense, who lives in Planet Trans, doesn't talk about other much more important matters, is as stubborn as a mule, despite all the true facts being thrown at him and is trying so fucking hard to convince normal people that he is right!

As Sleepy Joe says: C'mon Man... I mean, C'mon person... I mean C'mon, er, whatever!

 

[RogueWriter]

 

[Cannuck]

"Ah, breaker one-nine, this here’s the Rubber Duck. You gotta copy on me, Pig Pen, c’mon?

Ah, yeah, 10-4, Pig Pen, fer shure, fer shure. By golly, it’s clean clear to Flag Town, c’mon.

Yeah, that’s a big 10-4 there, Pig Pen, yeah, we definitely got the front door, good buddy. Mercy sakes alive, looks like we got us a convoy… - CW McCall

Initially organized to protest vaccine mandates for US/Canada cross-border truckers, The BIG RIG convoy has turned into a media circus and non-affiliated rogue and extreme groups have joined the troupe to spread their narrative. Even Jr. has piped up... man, I'll have what he's smokin'

https://www.facebook.com/DonaldJTru...tands-up-to-medical-tyranny/2712087222431976/

 

[Joe N]

Joe, honestly to me it's more of an imposed or forced reality than a genuine acceptance. Time will tell, but this stuff hasn't stabilized yet because it flipflops so much.. one day we identify as this, the next we identify as that and I mean it all just seems like superficial attention seeking gone awry. And the kids thing, I mean kids have always experimented some grow out of it others find their place in it but regardless that direction should never be mandated by people outside the given family.

So do you believe that no one in the world is actually non-binary? That the millions of people who identify as such are either mentally ill or are seeking attention?

 

[Joe N]

Why waste my precious time on a irrelevant subject with someone without any common sense, who lives in Planet Trans, doesn't talk about other much more important matters, is as stubborn as a mule, despite all the true facts being thrown at him and is trying so fucking hard to convince normal people that he is right!

As Sleepy Joe says: C'mon Man... I mean, C'mon person... I mean C'mon, er, whatever!

I see why you like to stick to the memes.

 

[Domainace]

There's nothing new or crazy happening on the language front. Have some new English terms been created to fill a gap that exists in gender definition? Absolutely. But the concept itself is older than Jesus. Hindu culture... Indigenous culture... Indonesian... and several others all have centuries old references to multiple genders.

I often read spurious claims of "it works in (insert name of country)". These are often blatantly false, but work because most people who repeat them understand little about the country used. I have spent time in all these places, but am hardly an expert. However what little I know about Indonesian is that its pronouns lack any reference to gender. Like the English pronouns you, I, they, etc. So what? That's a grammatical quirk, not a recognition that gender is a social construct. In fact, most transgenders are oppressed in Indonesia. Simple, English lacks a gender-free singular 3rd person pronoun. Feel free to invent one. Just one. We will all thank you.

But a list of absurd pronouns that must be adjusted for each new narcissist who we meet is what I would call something crazy happening in the language front. And I majored in Linguistics. At a top university. (Though no doubt they are spouting the same totalitarian propaganda as most of US academia these days.)

 

[Demned]

Why waste my precious time on a irrelevant subject with someone without any common sense, who lives in Planet Trans, doesn't talk about other much more important matters, is as stubborn as a mule, despite all the true facts being thrown at him and is trying so fucking hard to convince normal people that he is right!

As Sleepy Joe says: C'mon Man... I mean, C'mon person... I mean C'mon, er, whatever!

Said not bad ))

 

[Joe N]

I often read spurious claims of "it works in (insert name of country)". These are often blatantly false, but work because most people who repeat them understand little about the country used. I have spent time in all these places, but am hardly an expert. However what little I know about Indonesian is that its pronouns lack any reference to gender. Like the English pronouns you, I, they, etc. So what? That's a grammatical quirk, not a recognition that gender is a social construct. In fact, most transgenders are oppressed in Indonesia. Simple, English lacks a gender-free singular 3rd person pronoun. Feel free to invent one. Just one. We will all thank you.

But a list of absurd pronouns that must be adjusted for each new narcissist who we meet is what I would call something crazy happening in the language front. And I majored in Linguistics. At a top university. (Though no doubt they are spouting the same totalitarian propaganda as most of US academia these days.)

Well now you're actually putting words in my mouth just to make your argument. I never said that it worked. Right now all I'm doing is simply showing that non-binary people do in fact exist, and that it is not a mental illness or plea for attention.

You already seem to understand that they exist, so we're on the same page here. I'm not sure why you keep trying to rebut me on something you agree with.

Actually all of you seem to be in slightly different places in terms of your beliefs and opinions, and some of your are trying to debate multiple issues at once, so it's tough to keep the discussion focused.

If you and I can both agree that non-binary people do indeed exist, and deserve some kind of rights to be able to self-identify and be identified, then I'm happy to go from there and discuss the use of multiple pronouns.

 

[mr-x]

@mr-x I'm sure you're a nice person, but I just don't find there's any common ground on which to base a discussion here. I understand some of your concerns, but ultimately they look to me like a veil for some very deep-rooted prejudices, and a need to seek out stories to justify them.

Objecting to the truth, denying the obvious and accusing other of intolerance isn't a moral argument.

Stripping people of their rights to provide privileges for a few is the opposite of tolerance, it's tyranny. In five years when today's children are adults and can speak for themselves, you will be proven wrong.

 

[mr-x]

Show attachment 208833

 

[mr-x]

Can you imagine being so stupidly liberal, you can't tolerate any opinions that have not been approved by corporate media and the democrat party?

 

[mr-x]

Show attachment 208842

You're allowed to create your own too.

 

[mr-x]

Well, I think my kids will agree that its definitely in the top 5000 things that are indirectly present in our lives. To me, it's a sign of an unserious society - making trivial matters important while important matters are trivialized. Thinking one can choose a unique gender/pronoun for themselves is the height of narcissism - and I just cannot take anyone who does that seriously.

So far as sports and gender, i am fine with people behaving and dressing any way they want as long as they are not hurting others. Wear a tutu, have the offending part shrunken, removed, reformed into a fake labia or cut it off and have a French chef serve it up at a party as one guy in Tokyo did. We all should be free to make whatever choices we want, but none of us has the right to demand society change everything so that we can feel good about every choice we make. And we don't have a right to discriminate against young women who want to compete in sports. We also don't have a right to invade women's showers and toilets because we claim to feel like a woman ourselves. Most of this is common sense, which I know is especially unfashionable in the West these days.

100%. Could not have said it better.

 

[Joe N]

Can you imagine being so stupidly liberal, you can't tolerate any opinions that have not been approved by corporate media and the democrat party?

Show attachment 208886

Kind of odd to only support protest for people that share your views...

 

[mr-x]

Just imagine... next thing you know people are going to want to be able to legally change their name.

This is a strawman and happens all the time, nobody suggest it shouldn't.

You don't get to make up words / genders and demand other people use made up words when they refer to you.

Great thing about freedom of speech is that we can openly discuss anything we want, trivial or not. I understand the desire to be dismissive with this issue, though...

Between the four of you I have yet to read a coherent argument supported by anything more than your own opinions.

You accuse others of what you are doing, trivializing the harm caused by political polices and laws designed to give special privileges to a small group of people.

Two teenage girls sodomized, a third assaulted and the crimes were covered up so a school could declare all bathrooms available to any gender.

Women are being marginalized, excluded and physically harmed all over the USA and Canada.

 

[Joe N]

You don't get to make up words / genders and demand other people use made up words when they refer to you.

You believe that being non-binary is a mental illness. Since we share no common ground on the existence of non-binary people, there's no point in discussing the associated rights and expectations.

 

[mr-x]

You believe that being non-binary is a mental illness. Since we share no common ground on the existence of non-binary people, there's no point in discussing the associated rights and expectations.

People can "feel" however they want. There is a long history of people being attracted to the same sex or both sexes, effeminate men and masculine women.

Nobody is denying anything. I'm saying you don't get to make up pronouns to describe your "special" condition.

Womanhood and manhood are not "abstract" ideas.

 

[Cannuck]

Kind of odd to only support protest for people that share your views...

Not odd, it's more like the norm today. Do people really want to know the truth, or believe only the narratives that support their ideological/religious/political views?