New Rules Proposed for Expired Domain Names

[Dave_Z]

This came in from DomainNameWire:

http://domainnamewire.com/2011/02/21/new-rules-proposed-for-expired-domain-names/

The actual ICANN link:

http://www.icann.org/en/announcements/announcement-2-21feb11-en.htm

Recommendation #1: Define "Registered Name Holder at Expiration" (RNHaE) to clearly identify the entity or individual that was eligible to renew the domain name registration immediately prior to expiration.

Recommendation #2: Provide a minimum of 8 days after expiration when the RNHaE can renew, and disable normal operation during that time to attract the attention of the RNHaE.

Recommendation #3: Changes to WHOIS after expiration must not alter the RNHaE ability to renew.

Recommendation #4: All unsponsored gTLD Registries shall offer the Redemption Grace Period (RGP).

Recommendation #5: If a Registrar offers registrations in a gTLD that supports the RGP, the Registrar must allow the Registered Name Holder at Expiration to redeem the Registered Name after it has entered RGP.

Recommendation #6: Registrar website should state any fee(s) charged for the post-expiration renewal of a domain name.

Recommendation #7: Registrars who have a web presence, shall provide a link to ICANN published web content providing educational materials with respect to registrant responsibilities and the gTLD domain life-cycle.

Recommendation #8: ICANN, with the support of Registrars, ALAC and other interested parties, is to develop educational materials about how to properly steward a domain name and how to prevent unintended loss.

Recommendation #9: The registration agreement and Registrar web site (if one is used) must clearly indicate what methods will be used to deliver pre- and post-expiration notifications.

Recommendation #10: Registrar must notify Registered name Holder of impending expiration no less than two times. Subject to an exceptions policy, the timing of such notices is specified.

Recommendation #11: Notifications of impending expiration must include method(s) that do not require explicit action other than standard e-mail receipt in order to receive such notifications.

Recommendation #12: Unless the Registered Name is deleted by the Registrar, at least one notification must be sent after expiration.

Recommendation #13: If at any time after expiration when the Registered Name is still renewable by the RNHaE, the Registrar changes the DNS resolution path to effect a different landing website than the one used by the RNHaE prior to expiration, the page shown must explicitly say that the domain has expired and give instructions on how to recover the domain.

Recommendation #14: Best Practice: If post-expiration notifications are normally sent to a point of contact using the domain in question, and delivery is known to have been interrupted by post-expiration actions, post-expiration notifications should be sent to some other contact point associated with the registrant if one exists.

Comments are welcome via e-mail to pednr-proposed-final-report AT icann DOT org until 7 April 2011.

I figured I'd place it here so folks can readily see and comment. Speaking of which, don't forget to actually email your feedback to ICANN directly aside from commenting here.

 

[BeautifulDomainNames]

Great read Dave.



- Dar

 

[mrjohn]

I don't see that doing much to reduce the number of expiring domains that get orphaned.

 

[Dave_Z]

I don't see that doing much to reduce the number of expiring domains that get orphaned.

Probably not. If anything, it's to set standards on how registrars can proactively "inform" people to lessen the chances of losing their domains because of expiry.

 

[DotSauce]

Nice to see some straight-forward regulations to protect domain holders. #13 seems to be particularly helpful and is something that not many registrars are complying with at the moment.

 

[dnpimping.com]

I think the rules make sense for the most part, but then again who know until they are implemented.

 

[Archangel]

The only change I care about will likely never be seen again:

STOP WITH THE AUCTIONS!

If ACE.com wasn't renewed, it should go into a standard deletion period like all domains and be dropped the same.

But nah, that was the 1990s and early 2000's. Bastards like Snapnames want OUR MONEY and act accordingly to get it.

 

[DU]

The only change I care about will likely never be seen again:

STOP WITH THE AUCTIONS!

If ACE.com wasn't renewed, it should go into a standard deletion period like all domains and be dropped the same.

But nah, that was the 1990s and early 2000's. Bastards like Snapnames want OUR MONEY and act accordingly to get it.

Add :

Random Interval Drop - that is non-deterministic to prevent registrar drop-catch.

Prevent drop-catching by registrars by specific limits per name.

And I'm with you 100%

OR

Some method of single entity request with randomized awarding of name.

ANYTHING to put NJ, Snapnames, etc out of business.

 

[Archangel]

They say that with most contests, ppl associated with the sponsoring company cannot enter. Similar would be good here: No registrar or persons associated with a registrar should be capable of pursuing and/or backordering a domain. That could help a lot.

Add :

Random Interval Drop - that is non-deterministic to prevent registrar drop-catch.

Prevent drop-catching by registrars by specific limits per name.

And I'm with you 100%

OR

Some method of single entity request with randomized awarding of name.

ANYTHING to put NJ, Snapnames, etc out of business.

 

[Erdy]

Random Interval Drop - that is non-deterministic to prevent registrar drop-catch.

This is currently how .de domains are set but it doesn't work. What happens is there are no dropcatchers because there is no dropping time. Domains can stay on transit for up to 2 years.

Also there are no soon to drop lists. There is no way to know what domains will drop. These two things (random drop and no list) have killed .de dropcatching.

But still a handful of people have solution to both problems and they keep registering the domains they drop.

The situation with .de is much worse. Now nobody has any chance of getting any domain.

Prevent drop-catching by registrars by specific limits per name.

This will not prevent it. Snapnames calculates the exact milisecond for each dropping domain. They don't need to send a new request every second. They already send only one request per registrar at the exact correct time. However they don't use one registrar. They use more than 50.

The result will be those who can calculate the exact drop time will continue getting the domains. This calculation is technically very difficult because of the huge amount of data you need to process.

At the moment the problem is not dropcatching. Last time I checked only %34 of expired domains made it to pending delete without being auction during pre-release. In other words, even if you completely get rid of pending delete, snapnames and namejet would still continue because most of the domains they have listed are not pending delete.

You need to prevent the registrar taking over the ownership of the domain and sending it to auction. A solution to this would be to reduce the free auto renewal time from 45 days to 10 days and to give all of it to the previous owner.

Currently registrars can keep expired domains for free (without paying any money to the registry) for 45 days and they use it to auction the domain. However even if this was done still it wouldn't solve the problem. You need to avoid anybody from the registrar to take ownership of any client domains. Because otherwise they will not send the domain to auction but instead they will keep to themselves.

 

[DU]

This is currently how .de domains are set but it doesn't work. What happens is there are no dropcatchers because there is no dropping time. Domains can stay on transit for up to 2 years.

Also there are no soon to drop lists. There is no way to know what domains will drop. These two things (random drop and no list) have killed .de dropcatching.

But still a handful of people have solution to both problems and they keep registering the domains they drop.

The situation with .de is much worse. Now nobody has any chance of getting any domain.



This will not prevent it. Snapnames calculates the exact milisecond for each dropping domain. They don't need to send a new request every second. They already send only one request per registrar at the exact correct time. However they don't use one registrar. They use more than 50.

The result will be those who can calculate the exact drop time will continue getting the domains. This calculation is technically very difficult because of the huge amount of data you need to process.

I meant the two combined. I'm not sure what the issue you have is.. that there's no drop catch industry?

I'd assume the reuse time to be somewhat less than two years - perhaps as short as a month. This combined with limits to the number of requests will make the name drop game go away.

I would think domainers would like this as it actually would encourage a much more vibrant after market (you'd have to buy not rely on drop/auction) but that activity would also involve notification of the current registrant giving them a chance to renew.

Don't forget this is combined with only registrant can renew and no automatic/registrar take over.

Not perfect but better.

 

[Erdy]

defaultuser,

With expired domains there is no drop game anymore that is worth talking about. Most expired domains don't make it into the drop stage without going through an auction earlier. A domain will drop 75 days after expiry. Go and check some godaddy auctions, namejet auctions or snapnames auctions. Those domains are sold always before day 45. There is no dropping. When you buy an expired pre-release domain it will maintain its original creation date.

Most dropping domains have already gone through a pre-release auction. Even if you eliminate dropcathing you are only eliminating the last auction which is not so important anyway.

Let's say I'm running an auction house. I'm sending the items through a first auction. And then I take those that are not sold and auction them again. The first auction is called pre-release. The second is called pending delete. Pending delete is a collective waste of what was not sold during the first auction.

The big problem is the free auto renewal by the registry. It gives registrars extra time to keep the domain under their control for free.

 

[DU]

defaultuser,

With expired domains there is no drop game anymore that is worth talking about. Expired domains don't make it into the drop stage. .

Remember the first quoted text from Archangel.

If ACE.com wasn't renewed, it should go into a standard deletion period like all domains and be dropped the same.

In other words - no pre-release, no registrar/registrar employee take over of names.. everything drops. No TDNAM, No Namejet, NoSnapNames :lala:

Will have the aforementioned domainer owner/aftermarket benefits... that is removing the bogus middleman.

 

[Erdy]

Unless domains are considered property and taking over client domains becomes theft, registrars will continue doing what they do.

Godaddy terms of service says my domain is a service that godaddy provides to me and they can cancel the service any time. BS. Firstly, a domain is not a service. A hosting is a service. Phone line rental is a service. Domains are not a service. They are property. I can take away my domain from that registrar and put it elsewhere.

We need domains to be recognised as property and this should be shown in registrar terms.

At the moment registrars are stealing client domains but it is not considered theft because they made up those stupid rules that say they were providing me a service.

Check this domain:

Domain Name: FEMINISM.COM
Registrar: REGISTER.COM, INC.
Whois Server: whois.register.com
Referral URL: http://www.register.com
Name Server: NS1.EXPIREDDOMAINS.REGISTER.COM
Name Server: NS2.EXPIREDDOMAINS.REGISTER.COM
Status: clientTransferProhibited
Updated Date: 08-feb-2011
Creation Date: 07-feb-1998
Expiration Date: 06-feb-2012

It expired on 6 Feb 2011. The registrar took over ownership. They are now selling it for 15.000 USD at snapnames. Domain theft by registrars is the sweatest theft ever. There is no punishment and the awards are amazing.

Edit: Here is a snapnames screenshot:
http://i55.tinypic.com/nn9ttf.gif
.
.

 

[mwzd]

Registrars need to actually drop expired domains instead of auctioning them or selling them via drop services, both in-house or external.

Since a registrar has already been paid for the registration, they should have no further rights on a domain past expiry.

And that 8 day dns change is basically authority for them to monetize your expired domain with their ads.

 

[Archangel]

All 3 of the above posts make perfect sense. I can't even pick through the for the best parts.

 

[DubDubDubDot]

Unless domains are considered property and taking over client domains becomes theft, registrars will continue doing what they do.


Check this domain:

Domain Name: FEMINISM.COM

...

It expired on 6 Feb 2011. The registrar took over ownership. They are now selling it for 15.000 USD at snapnames. Domain theft by registrars is the sweatest theft ever. There is no punishment and the awards are amazing.

After the redemption period of the undeveloped and generic Feminism.com, what rights to the domain do you believe the registrant retained?

Even in an alternative universe where domains are considered property, they still did nothing wrong because the registrant forfeited their rights to this particular domain by not renewing ownership of it.

 

[DU]

After the redemption period of the undeveloped and generic Feminism.com, what rights to the domain do you believe the registrant retained?

Even in an alternative universe where domains are considered property, they still did nothing wrong because the registrant forfeited their rights to this particular domain by not renewing ownership of it.

So what rights should the registrar have in this situation ?

I quote ICANN:

At the conclusion of the registration period, failure by or on behalf of the Registered Name Holder to consent that the registration be renewed within the time specified in a second notice or reminder shall, in the absence of extenuating circumstances, result in cancellation of the registration by the end of the auto-renew grace period (although Registrar may choose to cancel the name earlier).

 

[Erdy]

DubDubDubDot,
I didn't suggest the previous owner should have rights. I suggested the registrar shouldn't have rights.

As for the property rights, my point is, currently you don't own a domain. Even if you have spent 100K for a domain and you have moved it between 10 registrars, you don't own it. The last registrar does. This is absurd. If you check the terms of for instance Godaddy you will see this.

This doesn't match with the reality. Domain names are valuable assets that can be transferred between registrars and bought and sold between people. However if you read the registrar terms they basically tell you they can take over your domain for whatever reason. They have done this before. familyalbum.com was stolen by godaddy from its owner and it was sold in auction. The reason: the owner didn't answer his emails.

My point is, if you let the registrars dictate that the domains belong to them and they can do as they please, they have no problem at all grabbing the domains for themselves after they expire.

However if domainers had property rights and registrars were defined as only a record keeper, then they would not take ower the domains for themselves.

At the moment registrars are actually only record keepers. However they define themselves as providing the domain. That's not true. Then they turn around and change the record to themselves.

Who gives the right to the registrar to change your name into theirs and take over ownership? This is theft.

 

[Archangel]

As the 'news' element had lived its purpose and the thread was never completely about news but rather, just proposed rules, it seemed to me as though moving this thread was the smart thing to do.