NamesCon2020

Logical Outbound Discussion

Labeled as discuss in Domain Selling and Domain Sales started by ThatNameGuy, Oct 28, 2019.

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  1. ThatNameGuy

    ThatNameGuy Upgraded Member Gold Account VIP

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    There seems to be a lot of conversation and consternation around inbound marketing of domains vs. outbound. Domains sold strictly via inbound might be considered, "Buy and Hold" or "Buy and Hoard", while outbound marketing is more of a progressive/aggressive approach.

    As a business guy with almost 50 years of marketing/selling experience (see my Linkedin bio here on NP via information page). In my prior business life, 80% of my sales have been a result of outbound efforts. Much of it has been a result of what has been traditionally referred to as "cold calling" which seems to be a lost art with the advent of the internet.

    Domain professionals here on NP and elsewhere seem to think outbound marketing won't work, although they claim to have tried it, and FAILED miserably:xf.frown: Personally I believe it will work, "if" done right. In my case, the first thing I need to do is attract a savvy technical individual who has nothing to lose, and everything to gain. By that I mean they are either unemployed, are a visionary or are an entrepreneur like me.

    btw, there isn't just one way to succeed at outbound marketing. Targeted email marketing is one way, direct mail marketing is another and phone sales and follow up is another way. All three of these techniques still work today in other industries, and there's no reason why they shouldn't be able to work in the domain industry imo.

    I'm not asking NP members why outbound won't work, but rather why outbound will work. If some of you think it can work, I would like to hear from you. I'll start with "targeted" outbound marketing, for if you don't know your target, you're sure to fail.

    Let's revolutionize domaining like the Wright Brothers revolutionized travel. What do you say:xf.grin: This can't be that hard...or can it?
     
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  2. Ategy.com

    Ategy.com NameCult.com Gold Account VIP

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    Why don't you just do it yourself?

    Seriously .. If you're such an amazing business person .. just do it! If you're half as persistent at brokering your own domains as you are at boasting about your skills/accomplishments, and as you are at looking/fishing for partners/brokers/workers/helpers, then instead of wasting time with all these self-glorification/fishing posts .. maybe you'd sell a domain or two ... and maybe even one of your big business plans.
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2019
  3. ThatNameGuy

    ThatNameGuy Upgraded Member Gold Account VIP

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    Would you just cut the crap Ateguy..."if" I could do it myself I would, but haven't you heard me say as nauseum, some of my very best partnership arrangements is when I had a partner who complimented my strengths. It's even more important now that I attract someone who could handle the technical side of this business. You might make such a partner, but you're such a jerk, we'd never get along. Haven't you heard me talk about S.W.O.T. Strengths, Weaknesses, Opportunities and Threats? Please stop wasting your time and mine Ateguy for I'll NEVER listen to anything you have to say because it's of such little value to me:xf.rolleyes:
     
  4. Joe Nichols

    Joe Nichols Common sense consultant VIP

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    Rich, I think you're misunderstanding the advice you've been given.

    No one is saying outbound doesn't work. There are several domainers here on NP that employ outbound marketing tactics successfully. I myself realized my largest sale to date last year thanks to direct outbound marketing.

    The advice you were given was that the style of name you typically register is very difficult to sell via outbound methods. You tend to buy names with the intention of selling them as promotional/campaign names, or as clever names for startups in a specific industry. It's very difficult to target specific buyers for these names, since you're selling an idea/concept instead of an actual need.

    MakeMyShave.com is a great example. You approached the Dollar Shave Club with the name because, hey, they're a shaving products company so they must be interested in this subjectively appealing name for a shaving promo/campaign, right? This approach is akin to trying to sell someone a new bicycle, when they aren't looking for one, because they happen to have two legs. Yes, you may eventually find someone willing to buy... but how much of your time and resources will be used up in the attempt? And how much will you ultimately make from the sale? The cost/benefit model doesn't work.

    The best outbound names are very often names that match an exact product or service. When you have the right type of these exact match names, and you approach the right buyers, you're presenting them with an actual need/opportunity to enhance their brand authority and decrease competition online. For example: selling RunningShoes.com to Nike.

    Now the issue with these domains is that it can be very difficult to acquire quality outbound-worthy names for cheap. This in turn means that you typically end up putting in long hours of searching and emailing/calling in order to make sales in the low to high $XXX range. Can it work? Yes, but you need to hustle your butt off and you absolutely need to be well-educated on what types of names will sell. It's a volume game (if you want to make decent money at it), and you need to be very well-organized; this includes ensuring all your names are listed on landing pages, and setting up a professional storefront-type presence.

    The names you own might very well appeal to certain buyers, but your odds of finding them through targeted marketing is very very low. In most cases, they will come to you, and you'll get the best prices from these inbound enquiries because these buyers are willing to pay for the name they want. This is what @Rob Monster was trying to tell you.
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2019
  5. Joe Nichols

    Joe Nichols Common sense consultant VIP

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  6. ThatNameGuy

    ThatNameGuy Upgraded Member Gold Account VIP

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    Joe...I do believe now you're trying to help, but you're wrong on several fronts. For example, I own well over a hundred domains that apply specifically to the real estate and trades industry...nothing like MakeMyShave.com rather DistinctionHomes.com, Johnson.Homes and 757Waterfront.com Joe, these domains are meant for a targeted group of professionals. I own the very same types of domains targeted to the healthcare industry, and the food services industries. These are names I can take directly to realty and builder conventions, healthcare conventions (you forget I use to be in the medical billing business), and the food/restaurant industries where I can sell domains to the likes of culinary students who will be working in the restaurant industry the rest of their lives. Note Joe, these industries are HUGE and they generate BILLIONS of dollars in revs annually.

    Sure there isn't much of a market for MakeMyShave.com (the example you gave), but that's a small percentage of my domains. Make sense?

    Email marketing is very limited when it comes to certain names, but it has all sorts of potential when domains for the likes of real estate, healthcare, food services etc. are the target.

    Finally, i don't see it mentioned much here, but Branding and Rebranding is a BIG DEAL...i know because I've branded and rebranded my own businesses, and I'm helping my region of the country to rebrand. I own domains like; BrandWik.com, ReBrandCorp and BrandableRx for loss leaders to get in front of anyone who owns a business, and at last count there are MILLIONS of businesses who have domains and names around the world.

    Thanks for those links Joe...i'll check them out to see if we can help each other.
     
  7. Ategy.com

    Ategy.com NameCult.com Gold Account VIP

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    All the most successful brokers (domains and otherwise) all say the best way to sell good outbound-worthy domains is to pick up the phone! What do you need a tech guy for? You claim to have years and years of sales and outbound experience .. do you not remember how to use a phone? How to write an email? Seriously .. what more do you need?

    Honestly .. you talk about outbound being the solution one paragraph after saying you have massive experience in outbound sales .. it just doesn't make any sense ?!?! WHAT .. IS .. STOPPING .. YOU .. from picking up a phone or writing emails? Or are you just trying to use this as another excuse to try to get others to invest their time and/or money in your schemes?

    https://www.namepros.com/threads/broker-needed.1160721/#post-7461648
    https://www.namepros.com/threads/wh...r-brandables-here.795094/page-50#post-7350562
    https://www.namepros.com/threads/broker-commissions-and-the-extra-mile.1159433/page-4#post-7459074
    https://www.namepros.com/threads/an...or-sale-in-publications.1135200/#post-7223764
    https://www.namepros.com/threads/homes-re-released.1118934/page-29#post-7242016
    https://www.namepros.com/threads/political-domains-and-events.1129640/#post-7167313

    https://www.namepros.com/threads/any-brokers-who-go-above-and-beyond.1138516/


    Note to everyone else .. please do not report any of TheNameGuy's posts directed towards me. I was so tired of all his rudeness constantly being deleted and thus hidding his true nature, that I actually asked that his posts not be deleted so they can stand as a record of his character.

    https://www.namepros.com/threads/deplorable-domains.1143339/
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2019
  8. Recons.Com

    Recons.Com Top Member VIP

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    To complement your strength... And what are those? Your hand reg names? If one is a visionary or tech guy or skilled seller or combo, he doesn't need you. He can make his own portfolio and keep 100%. He would collect better collection too.
     
  9. NameDeck

    NameDeck Design. Develop. Deploy. VIP

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    I skipped all stuff above but keep this in mind regarding:

    That's actually illegal in some parts of the EU. Just so you know.
     
  10. Soofi

    Soofi Top Member PRO VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    You are rude AF imso, but leaving that one aside, would you care to elaborate on how's it done right, sir "experienced in outbound sales"?

     
  11. Bob Hawkes

    Bob Hawkes formerly MetBob NameTalent Gold Account VIP Trusted Blogger

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    The eBook by @Darryl Lopes has a good amount about outbound and negotiation. It is a short, fast read, written by someone with a proven track record, and is relatively inexpensive. He started a NamePros thread about it here...
    https://www.namepros.com/threads/ebook-how-to-get-started-in-domain-names.1149465/

    It seems to me the most valuable thread on outbound on NamePros is the one already mentioned by @rohitgoyal. In particular he put a lot of effort into answering the questions, so don't just read the initial post but the entire thread.
    https://www.namepros.com/threads/outbound-process-for-beginners.1101291/

    This NamePros blog post by @James Iles based on an interview with @Mike Robertson has a wealth of good information
    https://www.namepros.com/blog/how-t...ith-mike-robertson-part-1-the-basics.1120129/

    There have also been a few DNW podcast issues on the topic, and of course Domain Sherpa or taking the Domain Name Academy course.

    I personally dislike doing outbound, and in any case Canadian spam laws make it difficult to do, but I do realize that effective outbound will increase sell through rate and also make sales of some domain names that would not otherwise sell.

    I think we should not necessarily view outbound or inbound as the only two extremes. Some domain investors effectively use social media, especially platforms like LinkedIn and Twitter, to make that first connection that will later open doors to a fuller approach in some cases.

    For brandable domain names it is nice that the brandable marketplaces in essence find buyers, to at least some degree. There is no similar venue for phrase type domain names, however, at least to my knowledge.

    Bob
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2019
  12. ThatNameGuy

    ThatNameGuy Upgraded Member Gold Account VIP

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    Soofi...i really would suggest you take a look at my Linkedin bio and judge for yourself whether or not I may have experience with "outbound sales" of any kind. It was Verisign who identified the major problem with your industry is the "Hoarding" of domains thus they call the majority of you hoarders. Do you even know what they were referring to? I see both "truth" and "opportunity" in their description, and I saw it when I arrived here at NP just 24 months ago.

    Regardless of what you think of me, I don't appreciate the stalking and harassment on this message board the likes of what I've been subjected to since I arrived here. I know you wouldn't like it if it were happening to you either.
     
  13. karmaco

    karmaco Top Member VIP

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    Yes illegal in some parts. The reason its a lost art is nobody likes to be “sold” or hounded to buy something they didn’t ask for. Thats a 1950 brain stance and how old school marketing in general has a very bad rap.

    The current marketing models that have more success with newer generations establish a relationship and familiarity FIRST via campaigns,social media, you tube, etc THEN try to sell.

    Some domainers function this way as well on Linked In, Facebook, etc. to get their names out there to the right people, The right people often don’t like marketers so its a fine line to walk. Domain sales are not like other sales in that value is not easily persuadable. They either see the value or they don’t. The best marketing tactics are subtle not aggressive IMO. They need to think they made the find or decision not you shoving it down their throat.

    Outbounding can work but its a hell of alot of work for a relatively small payout.
     
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2019
  14. ThatNameGuy

    ThatNameGuy Upgraded Member Gold Account VIP

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    Thanks Bob...as usual you shared a lot and I trust you. I understand why you dislike doing outbound, but I need to find someone who likes it and is challenged by it like me. I duly note your links, and will follow up as soon as I can find the time, for 9Time™ is consuming a lot of my time....and that's a good thing:xf.wink:
     
  15. wurdd

    wurdd Established Member

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    LOL. Thanks for the laugh you made my day bulloney!
     
  16. ThatNameGuy

    ThatNameGuy Upgraded Member Gold Account VIP

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    Thanks Karmaco...I wasn't necessarily referring to traditional "cold calling", but rather cold emails, direct mail and trade shows etc that are regularly attended by executives in each of the industries I've mentioned I'm intimately familiar with. It's been my experience most people and that includes "end user's) don't know this industry exists leaving the door open to a savvy seller.
     
  17. ThatNameGuy

    ThatNameGuy Upgraded Member Gold Account VIP

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    I'm really glad you're so entertained. Hint wurrd, if you want to learn something new, read an old book , and if that doesn't work reach out to me, and I'll do my best to help you:xf.rolleyes:
     
  18. ThatNameGuy

    ThatNameGuy Upgraded Member Gold Account VIP

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    My heritage is EU Jew, and I'm sure some of my ancestor's can help:xf.wink:
     
  19. ThatNameGuy

    ThatNameGuy Upgraded Member Gold Account VIP

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    So Recon...where have you been. My strengths, and I'm sure you said that facetiously, but who's counting:xf.rolleyes: You might want to check out how I complimented my partner in the medical billing business AcSel (that I also named:xf.wink: before you were born). I started AcSel in 1980 and it's still in business today much to your chagrin, I'm sure:xf.eek: The "average" tech guy needs me more than I need him/her, but you'll never get it:xf.grin:
     
  20. wurdd

    wurdd Established Member

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    LOL again. You're killing me tonight.
     
  21. Joe Nichols

    Joe Nichols Common sense consultant VIP

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    I think perhaps there's a perspective issue happening in relation to your comment that I bolded above.

    You're implying that if end users were familiar with the domain aftermarket, they would be more likely to want to buy additional domain names for higher-than-reg-fee prices. I think the opposite is true. If business owners were more familiar with the market, they would be more savvy as buyers, and would be less likely to pay end user prices... instead seeking opportunities to acquire names at re-seller prices.

    The complexities of profitable domain name buying and selling, and of knowing how to seek out desirable names, is exactly what allows there to be end user pricing. The service we provide is one of discovery and procurement. If buyers become familiar with this industry, why bother dealing with us?

    Additionally, Rich - I think you're viewing domain name sales as being comparable to the selling of other goods and services. The two cannot be compared, because most businesses don't perceive domain names as a need. This is a completely opposite attitude to debt collection services, where you would be approaching companies who already make use of such services, but you're selling them on why yours is better (i.e. cheaper commission, better conversion, or any other way where value is easy to see).

    Buyers don't need domain names until they decide they need them. They cannot easily be shown the value of buying more.

    And in the case of marketing aftermarket names to agents, doctors, or other graduates who are starting businesses... how do you propose to convince them that your recently registered $2,000 name is 200 times better than another clever name they could hand reg themselves? Where is the value to them?
     
  22. Soofi

    Soofi Top Member PRO VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    I will take a look at your Linkedin bio, only if you care to answer my question of "how's it done right"? :)

    Please allow me to ask this one; what in the world are you doing in our industry? Oh wait, I mean in hoarders industry? :wonders:

    You have my full empathy, but I'm sure you arent helping yourself by making such posts around here :(

    Have fun!
     
  23. Recons.Com

    Recons.Com Top Member VIP

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    You should have finished with "..., but you will never get it™"

    I am sure you were complimenting your partner with beautiful words, and maybe even complementing him in some way, but that is irrelevant for the industry.

    As, your lack of sales have proven that you are exceptionally bad at this. If you were just average, you should have had tens of sales already just from inbound. For last two years, my average portfolio size was under 2000 names and I have sold 65+ names inbound.

    If your names are mostly worth zero, multiplying it by someone's vision, sales skills etc. will result again in zero. Maybe, you should have stuck with medical billing. You know, "struck it, stuck with it™"
     
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2019
  24. JB Lions

    JB Lions Top Member VIP

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    You've been here 2 years now. And stuff newbies would pick up in their first month, you still haven't - http://cheesecakerealty.com/?reqp=1&reqr=

    I think I posted about this last year. You still haven't figured out a landing page. The ones you keeping using have it where somebody needs to pay $70 for a GD broker to contact you. You're still not listing your domains in the various marketplaces. 2 years and not seeing much learning take place.

    This thread is like all your others. Back in the day I blah blah blah, check my LinkedIn blah blah blah. Now it's you trying to find some broker to sell your names, willing to give them ridiculous amounts. This business simply isn't for you. You don't get it, you've shown no indication that you ever will.
     
  25. rohitgoyal

    rohitgoyal Upgraded Member Gold Account VIP

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