discuss Full Time Domainer?

[Pattern]

There are lots of different types of domainers out there. Full time, part time, on the fence, and so on. Would love to hear stories from all over the spectrum, what are the positives and negatives, etc.

 

[lock]

Really not enough options in poll to be a full time depends on your definition. A full time domainer might also be a marketer or a web developer or designer also. To only earn a living buying and selling domains would be a fairy tale and to make use of traffic domains you purchased would make you more than a domainer.

 

[slimjim270]

What constitutes a domainer? Is there a job title for that?

I do much more than buy and sell domain names, but it is full time.

Title.... how does "Domaintologist" sound?

From the "Church of Domaintology"...

Or "Domainalyst"... one part Domainer... one part Analyst...

Or "Domainiture"... one part Domainer... one part furniture... (my wife says I'm a couch potato)

-Jim

ps: Domainer P/T. My "day job" covers the mortgage, domaining pays for toys.

 

[N-A]

ps: Domainer P/T. My "day job" covers the mortgage, domaining pays for toys.

Domaining pays for both.

What was intended by that question was clarification on what a "domainer" is being referred to as.

Is it one whom solely buys and sells domain names? One that parks? One that develops? One that purchases as a long term investment? Etc., ...add in the social (IM) aspect and micro-management of some of them.

A "domainer" is a broad term. A "domain name investor" is as well because the name could have been bought for various reasons.

So, yes, I am a full time domainer, but I do by far more than invest in names; though everything I do revolves around domains.

 

[slimjim270]

Domaining pays for both.

What was intended by that question was clarification on what a "domainer" is being referred to as.

Is it one whom solely buys and sells domain names? One that parks? One that develops? One that purchases as a long term investment? Etc., ...add in the social (IM) aspect and micro-management of some of them.

A "domainer" is a broad term. A "domain name investor" is as well because the name could have been bought for various reasons.

So, yes, I am a full time domainer, but I do by far more than invest in names; though everything I do revolves around domains.

@David Walker -

Thanks for the reply.

In the "ps", I mentioned "Domainer P/T" as I buy/sell domains part time and doing so is not my sole income.

I did the title spin as a fun word blend to highlight there is likely a wide view of what a "domainer" is and that some have more passion than others on their beliefs of whether buying/selling domains is a passion or their bread & butter (sole income) or both.

I hope you took my reply as such and didn't take it in a negative sense.

Regards,

-Jim

 

[N-A]

I hope you took my reply as such and didn't take it in a negative sense.

Not at all. Hopefully, if you desire, you can be a full time domainer as well.

 

[Joseph Green]

But I suspect you'd be on to better things as soon as you hit a few hundred thousand, and that's when you'll start to see domaining as a means to an end.

Every business is a means to an end if you're not passionate about it. It has nothing to do with the business and everything to do with your personal preference.

Five years ago I graduated from uni and in attempt to avoid having to get a real job again, working for bosses that I didn't like, I tried to make some money online. Five years later I'm still making a full-time living online. During that time all these things have been true, although most are no longer true:

• I've owned a network of sites generating 1m+ unique visitors per month.
• Made $5000+ a month affiliate marketing
• Made $2000+ a month through Adsense
• Been hired as an SEO consultant
• Managed a PPC campaign for a Fortune 500 company
• Flipped a few domains and sites
• Made $3000+ a month selling kindle books
• Had two years in which I've cleared $100k in profit

After all of the above collapsed / was dissolved at various points I now import and sell physical products on ebay. See, there are 101 ways to make money online, of which domaining is just one.

Perhaps considering my start point you could say that we even have some similarities. I can identify various pros and cons, some of the pros are:

1. I've actually had a fair bit of money, at times.
2. My life can't be made miserable by a boss who sucks
3. It can be liberating at times
4. I can take a day off when I want
5. I save shitloads in fuel costs with no daily commute
6. I get a bit more time in bed in the morning and can work in my PJs

Some of the cons are:

1. It can be worrying when you rely entirely on yourself
2. It can be lonely
3. I don't get enough natural sunlight
4. A lack of real life social interaction
5. You can become insular and introverted
6. It could be difficult for me to get a real job after 5 years of self employment, due to a lack of references.
7. You need to be REALLY self-disciplined
8. I'm paying my own heating/cooling bills

I got a real buzz out of the first 18 months of working for myself, online, it was really exciting. That does wear off.

Actually, now it feels a bit limiting and unfulfilling. I miss working in a team, the camaraderie of getting through something as a group, and the pats on the back when you do something right, having an xmas party at the end of the year.

I just feel that it is fair to point out that making a full time living online from your bedroom (or loft conversion, in my case) isn't always a dream or glamorous. Sometimes it really sucks.

If you are willing to take any advice from somebody who is probably more similar to you than you think, and has been at the stage you are currently at, then here are two pieces:

1. Get yourself an SAD lamp to make up for the lack of natural sunlight
2. Go and do half a day a week volunteering or something, for the reference and the semi-formal social interaction.

You are also choosing a "career" as you call it (I'd really start viewing and seeing it as a business venture) which may or may not have a long term future.

Do you see yourself being a domainer in 10 years time? What happens if you are a full-time domainer for 5 years and then have to get a real job? Where are your references? What transferable skills do you have?

The natural progression would be to build some capital and build a real online business.

And that's why I say that you should dream big.

You want a full-time career selling domain names on flippa.... I say that you should aim to one day build the next flippa (and by that I mean an online business, not a copy cat site).

Why just domaining? Why not also developing? Why do you want to become a domainer selling names to people who build million dollar businesses, why not one day acquire the domain upon which YOU will build one of those businesses for yourself.

You think that I am being negative towards your dream here. I'm not, I'm actually saying that YOU should be MORE positive, by aiming HIGHER and thinking about what become successful at domaining would enable you to achieve. I'm just telling people that domaining should be a stepping stone towards achieving a dream which has been formulated with more foresight and ambition.

So no, I don't think that domaining would be particularly "fulfilling" in the long term. I honestly think that by that time you'll have moved on to bigger and better things.

These are not industry-related limitations; they are your limitations, probably due to your own choices or having a non-sustainable business model that doesn't allow you to grow your business(es).

Build a viable business, open an office, hire a team, repeat. Then you'll have people around you every day. Camaraderie at every turn. Plenty of domainers have done this. Others choose to work from home.

A successful online business (including domain-related) gives you the freedom to do whatever you want: have an office with lots of employees or work in your underwear. It's your choice. The domain business doesn't dictate one or the other. Many businesses do, but not a domain business. That is the benefit of building one.

I've pointed out that people should be aiming higher in life and using domaning as a means to an end.

This is a billion dollar industry; it's not possible to aim much higher than that.

Building a domain empire would offer just as much as, if not more than, the majority of other businesses in the world. None of the businesses you've mentioned are better. They scale much slower, actually. Sales are sales. It doesn't matter what you're selling: domains, traffic, candy, or anything else. Research and development are more beneficial to the world than sales, but neither can exist in a business without sales. They are interdependent.

And ultimately, that vision of utopia where you can travel around with a laptop isn't as fantastic as people make out, because you'd still end up spending 60 hours a week glued to a laptop surrounded by four walls, self-employment online = long hours indoors.

That's your choice. If you have a real online business with profits, you can afford to hire people and delegate.

 

[DomainGist]

Every business is a means to an end if you're not passionate about it. It has nothing to do with the business and everything to do with your personal preference.

That's true, I suppose.

These are not industry-related limitations; they are your limitations, probably due to your own choices or having a non-sustainable business model that doesn't allow you to grow your business(es).

Build a viable business, open an office, hire a team, repeat. Then you'll have people around you every day. Camaraderie at every turn. Plenty of domainers have done this. Others choose to work from home.

A successful online business (including domain-related) gives you the freedom to do whatever you want: have an office with lots of employees or work in your underwear. It's your choice. The domain business doesn't dictate one or the other. Many businesses do, but not a domain business. That is the benefit of building one.

Can you provide a single example of a successful domainer who pays somebody a salary to sit and do domaining for them? How long until that person becomes a competitor, copying your methods?

This is a billion dollar industry; it's not possible to aim much higher than that.

That's a small industry!

Building a domain empire would offer just as much as, if not more than, the majority of other businesses in the world.

Are you seriously suggesting that somebody starting in 2015 flipping a few domains has the potential to build what you call a "domain empire"? You started 8 years ago if we go by your start date, hows it going? Where's your empire? You've already said that the entire industry is worth just $1bn per year, how many "empires" can exist within that? Considering ebay has $9bn in cash reserves...... and that 3D prototyping is already worth $6bn a year.

None of the businesses you've mentioned are better. They scale much slower, actually. Sales are sales.

Bit confused here actually, what businesses have I mentioned? If you mean the ways that I've earned money, then this is a mute point, because I wasn't telling people they are better than domaining. You have probably taken this wrong, I was just illustrating that I have actually made a living online.

That's your choice. If you have a real online business with profits, you can afford to hire people and delegate.

I do run a real business, with profits, with an employee (just one at the moment). So again, not really sure what your point is here. I don't think many domainers would hire people to manage their domain assets in fairness, brokers perhaps for specific names, direct sales to generate leads perhaps, but it would require a lot of trust to allow them to sit and reg domains for you, or trust them with your cash to purchase?

If you taught somebody how to buy valuable domains and sell them for huge profits, how long are they going to sit and take your salary to make you rich, when will they decide to start regging domains for themselves?

Domaining is a solitary business, it seems ludicrious to me that you think that somebody could employ a team of domainers to do domaining for them...... I'm happy to be corrected if you can provide an example, just can't see it myself. Perhaps two high net worth individuals could pool their cash together to invest in premium domains, but they'd still be regging and buying on their own!

 

[Joseph Green]

Can you provide a single example of a successful domainer who pays somebody a salary to sit and do domaining for them? How long until that person becomes a competitor, copying your methods?

Compartmentalize... Many companies do it on their own portfolios: ArcheoDomains.com, HugeDomains.com, DomainMarket.com, BuyDomains.com, etc.

That's a small industry!

I'd agree with you if I meant "one billion," but since no one knows the exact number, I used a generic phrase that can apply to any industry worth at least one billion and less than one trillion. Social is a billion dollar industry, too.

Are you seriously suggesting that somebody starting in 2015 flipping a few domains has the potential to build what you call a "domain empire"?

Yes, without a doubt.

I do run a real business, with profits, with an employee (just one at the moment). So again, not really sure what your point is here.

My point is that the cons and limitations that you listed are not the result of a domain business or any online business.

I don't think many domainers would hire people to manage their domain assets in fairness, brokers perhaps for specific names, direct sales to generate leads perhaps, but it would require a lot of trust to allow them to sit and reg domains for you, or trust them with your cash to purchase?

If you taught somebody how to buy valuable domains and sell them for huge profits, how long are they going to sit and take your salary to make you rich, when will they decide to start regging domains for themselves?

You've oversimplified the process. I don't have the time to explain it in detail to you, but Morgan Linton has written about doing this with his domain business on his blog. You can read about it on there. Many others have done the same thing.

 

[DomainGist]

Look, I wish anybody the best of luck if they pIursue domaining as a business, and I do believe that there is some good money to be made.

I just think that if they do build up some capital they would be looking to diversify into other areas and other industries, and it would be fair to point out that some of the most famous and successful domainers are not exclusively domainers.

It seems a bit limiting to dedicate yourself entirely to one niche industry when it goes hand in hand with so many others.

Almost all of the well known domainers have developed web businesses. Surely these all go hand in hand:

• Web development
• Web design
• Domaning
• SEO
• Investing

Why become a 'domainer', why not become an 'internet entreprenuer'?

Domaining could be just just one facet of a multi-faceted business. Entreprenuers are always looking for opportunities. That's why I said that domaining isn't a "career", who's going to give you a promotion? It's a "business venture", and I stand by that.

Businessmen / entreprenuers are always looking for opportunities and looking to diversify. Adam Dicker, for example, claims to own 12 successful businesses. Look at his linkedin profile and you will find 3 that are domain related.

He isn't a domainer, he's an entrepreneur who owns several domain related businesses.

Domaining = business.

If somebody wants to be a full-time entrepreneur then good on them, if domain trading forms a large part of their business operations then good on them.

It still isn't a "career" though, its a business, like any other which involves buying something and then selling it. Whether that's a domain name or a smartphone.

 

[Joseph Green]

It can be a career, by every definition of the word.

(Business context)

 

[Kate]

Are you seriously suggesting that somebody starting in 2015 flipping a few domains has the potential to build what you call a "domain empire"? You started 8 years ago if we go by your start date, hows it going? Where's your empire?

Frank Shilling started around 2002, he's a latecomer. But he did well eventually. He took big chances too.

I think it's never too late. But to do domaining today, you need funding. It's almost impossible to build a healthy portfolio on handregs nowadays.

Frank Shilling belongs to a very unique and restricted circle. Maybe there are 20 individuals like him and Rick, who make a living from domaining. They are not representative at all.
But there are more people making a living from domaining, on a smaller scale.

For most domainers, domaining is a hobby. It's not a business.

The registrars and the registries are also making a living on domains right
I think we could say Donuts is a domain empire.

 

[Joseph Green]

A more recent public example is Andrew Rosener:

remember that Drew and his company built this portfolio in 5 years. Rather than get jealous, be inspired. It shows what can be accomplished even if you’re “late to the game”.

—DomainShane

 

[N-A]

A more recent public example is Andrew Rosener:
—DomainShane

Jealousy and envy can be more time consuming than actually putting your thoughts together and building a business without regards of caring about what everyone else is doing.

Eight hours a day and you spend 3 of them asking yourself, "Why can't that be me?" or on a good, free, training course, a business plan, or anything productive.

5 years is a feasible goal for anyone.

I've made my mistakes (5 year member, more in late 90's with other names, but a whole 'nother story on its own that if I look back on, it would only revert back to my statement of jealousy and envy, except regret).

I learned, and keep pushing forward.

 

[DomainGist]

It can be a career, by every definition of the word.

Not by most of the definitions that I can find.

 

[Joseph Green]

Not by most of the definitions that I can find.

Here's one: "an occupation or profession, especially one requiring special training"

You've already stated that domaining requires special training in your previous posts, so you're arguing that it's not an occupation or profession?

I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree.

 

[DomainGist]

A more recent public example is Andrew Rosener:
—DomainShane

Well thank you for supporting my assertion that most domainers are in fact "internet entrepreneurs", you've just named somebody who had previously started a software company, and then had a career in business, and has numerous developed websites!

Now please explain how providing him as an example in any way counters assertion that domainers should aim higher and cast their nets wider by become developers, and build businesses instead of merely flipping domains?

Andrew Rosener owns various developed sites, he is doing precisely what I advocate!

 

[Joseph Green]

Now please explain how providing him as an example in any way counters assertion that domainers should aim higher and cast their nets wider by become developers, and build businesses instead of merely flipping domains?

I never said there was anything wrong with that. In fact, if you read my first post in this thread, you'd see that's my preference too. One of my points from the beginning is that you don't need to do anything else other than flip domains to build a domain empire. It's a personal preference whether you build/run additional businesses as well. Neither choice is more admirable than the other. They're just different flavors of entrepreneurship.

Andrew Rosener has shown that it's possible even if you begin at a time when all the lazy people tell you that it's impossible.

No one said it was easy, but it is possible.

* Edited to add clarification.

 

[DomainGist]

My point from the beginning is that you don't need to do anything else other than flip domains to build a domain empire

And my point from the beginning is that people should aim for the stars.

I hope you aren't implying that I've said that success is impossible by the way, as I feel that would be disingenuous and inaccurate.

 

[S-B]

I think we need a new poll. We should ask about revenue. There is no way 24% of respondents do this full-time. I wish we could see who voted for what.

 

[equity78]

Look, I wish anybody the best of luck if they pIursue domaining as a business, and I do believe that there is some good money to be made.

I just think that if they do build up some capital they would be looking to diversify into other areas and other industries, and it would be fair to point out that some of the most famous and successful domainers are not exclusively domainers.

It seems a bit limiting to dedicate yourself entirely to one niche industry when it goes hand in hand with so many others.

Almost all of the well known domainers have developed web businesses. Surely these all go hand in hand:

• Web development
• Web design
• Domaning
• SEO
• Investing

Why become a 'domainer', why not become an 'internet entreprenuer'?

Domaining could be just just one facet of a multi-faceted business. Entreprenuers are always looking for opportunities. That's why I said that domaining isn't a "career", who's going to give you a promotion? It's a "business venture", and I stand by that.

Businessmen / entreprenuers are always looking for opportunities and looking to diversify. Adam Dicker, for example, claims to own 12 successful businesses. Look at his linkedin profile and you will find 3 that are domain related.

He isn't a domainer, he's an entrepreneur who owns several domain related businesses.

Domaining = business.

If somebody wants to be a full-time entrepreneur then good on them, if domain trading forms a large part of their business operations then good on them.

It still isn't a "career" though, its a business, like any other which involves buying something and then selling it. Whether that's a domain name or a smartphone.

You used the phrase I always use Pug, Internet Entrepreneur that way it encompasses everything like how @David Walker mentioned.