Do you support GoDaddy's decision to cancel a domain?

[Internet.Domains]

Do you support Godaddy's recent decision to cancel a domain because of the content exhibited?

Read the News here about the domain:
https://www.namepros.com/threads/neo-nazi-website-daily-stormer-to-lose-domain-name.1035543/

 

[Joe Styler]

I find that rather troubling.

If a domain is allowed to exist under Verisign policy, then a registrar should not be able to just arbitrarily cancel a domain on their own whim.

Stopping hosting is one thing, cancelling the domain is another entirely.

Brad

We did not cancel the domain. We told them to find another registrar within 24 hours. The reasoning behind it was that it was inciting violence which is against the law. People do things that are illegal on domain names and we need to step in as our lawyers see fit. For instance we do this with things like child porn. It is one thing to object to the content (which speaking for myself and not as a GoDaddy employee, I strongly do in the strongest terms, with no exceptions or caveats) but it is important to note that this removal was not done for moral reasons or PR reasons but for legal reasons as our legal team saw fit. I'm not a lawyer, I won't pretend to speak for what is legal or illegal but I think it is important to note that our legal team said that the content was deemed illegal and that is the reason it was removed in violation of our terms of service.

 

[bmugford]

It is a slippery slope. Unless the content violates the law, then what is acceptable is entirely subjective.

Brad

 

[hookbox]

Do you support Godaddy's recent decision to cancel a domain because of the content exhibited?

Read the News here about the domain:
https://www.namepros.com/threads/neo-nazi-website-daily-stormer-to-lose-domain-name.1035543/

I agree with their decision but I don't support their decision. Free speech is free speech even if you don't agree with what's being said.

 

[Haris]

I would say that GoDaddy and other registrars should not only cancel the 'neo-nazi' sites but also cancel sites with hate speech against any race/religion/etc.

 

[Recons.Com]

Godaddy did not CANCEL the website or TAKE IT AWAY. They gave 24hrs to MOVE IT OUT to another registrar, basically denying the service to neo-nazis, but not taking the domain away. Basically, they told them they don't want their business.

 

[bmugford]

Update: Google will also cancel domain.
https://www.theverge.com/2017/8/14/16145064/google-daily-stormer-ban-neo-nazi-registrar-godaddy

“We are cancelling Daily Stormer’s registration with Google Domains for violating our terms of service,” the company said in a statement."

I find that rather troubling.

If a domain is allowed to exist under Verisign policy, then a registrar should not be able to just arbitrarily cancel a domain on their own whim.

Stopping hosting is one thing, cancelling the domain is another entirely.

Brad

 

[Joe Styler]

Godaddy are famous for a shoot first, ask questions approach to registrants and accounts - there has been plenty of discussion and experience of that on here. Just possibly they did not want to lose money or time responding to complaints and media interest. I wonder if a number of hate domains will now transfer out in a hurry?

Actually we have been getting complaints and bad press on having this domain for quite a long time. It is only this week that the domain was told that is must be moved. It was not a split second decision.

 

[Joe Styler]

Thanks for joining the conversation Joe!..........According to the Southern Poverty Law Center there are currently 917 hate groups in the United States alone.
Many of those groups are currently delivering content deemed to incite criminal behavior on GoDaddy domains.....What does GoDaddy intend to do with those groups/domains?

https://www.splcenter.org/hate-map

I'd defer to our legal team to make those decisions on when activity is deemed illegal. That is why they are paid the big bucks

 

[equity78]

Read their ToS here:
https://godaddy.com/agreements/ShowDoc.aspx?pageid=reg_sa

Exactly, registrars can do what they like, most never read the TOS. And GoDaddy cares about how they look in a bigger picture, most people don't care about domain names or domainers, they will applaud GoDaddy for doing what they think is right. Most will say "I don't care because I would never do this, run this kind of website, so great job GoDaddy."

Now a slippery slope would come into play, if GoDaddy tried doing that to someone running a political website that did not espouse hate in anyway but went against their political beliefs at GoDaddy HQ. That's where people wonder if it's right, not about this website, but does it move to areas where they are not offended.

Let's say the conservative ex Google employee that just got fired, if he had a blog I do not believe but again just my opinion, that they would tell him to move his blog, but some worry it can turn into that once the egregious sites are gone.

 

[Kate]

I don't think private companies should be forced to host a platform for hate speech. Remember that hate speech is the enabler of hate actions. Even words have consequences. Those sites embolden people with extremist leanings, brainwash them into thinking they are not alone and that their radical views are almost mainstream and acceptable.
Give me a break with your First Amendment rights: freedom goes hand in hand with responsibility. You are responsible for what you write and advocate even online, especially when it can influence deranged individuals.

I run private companies too, if I find out that you use our hosting services for crap I will politely show you the door. This is what GD did. They didn't touch the domain.

All those offensive site owners will create their own registrar for hosting offensive websites

Why not. There are rogue registrars that exist for the sole purpose of spamming.

 

[biggie]

free speech, is not free

if, it has a cost

because that cost is always summed up, in the reactions to it.

and when the dust settles.... who pays the price?

imo....

 

[carob]

Read their ToS here:
https://godaddy.com/agreements/ShowDoc.aspx?pageid=reg_sa

You acknowledge and agree that GoDaddy and registry reserve the right to deny, cancel or transfer any registration or transaction, or place any domain name(s) on registry lock, hold or similar status, as either deems necessary, in the unlimited and sole discretion of either GoDaddy or the registry: (i) to comply with specifications adopted by any industry group generally recognized as authoritative with respect to the Internet (e.g., RFCs), (ii) to correct mistakes made by registry or any registrar in connection with a domain name registration, (iii) for the non-payment of fees to registry, (iv) to protect the integrity and stability of the registry, (v) to comply with any applicable court orders, laws, government rules or requirements, requests of law enforcement, or any dispute resolution process, (vi) to comply with any applicable ICANN rules or regulations, including without limitation, the registry agreement, (vii) to avoid any liability, civil or criminal, on the part of registry operator, as well as its affiliates, subsidiaries, officers, directors, and employees, (viii) per the terms of this Agreement, (ix) following an occurrence of any of the prohibited activities described in Section 8 below, or (x) during the resolution of a dispute.

GoDaddy may also cancel the registration of a domain name, after thirty (30) days, if that name is being used, as determined by GoDaddy in its sole discretion, in association with spam or morally objectionable activities. Morally objectionable activities will include, but not be limited to:

• Activities prohibited by the laws of the United States and/or foreign territories in which you conduct business;
• Activities designed to encourage unlawful behavior by others, such as hate crimes, terrorism and child pornography; and
• Activities designed to harm or use unethically minors in any way.

 

[Internet.Domains]

Read their ToS here:
https://godaddy.com/agreements/ShowDoc.aspx?pageid=reg_sa

Thank you....I find it interesting in the terms that there is mention of 30 days, yet according to some articles they were given 24 hours.

Disclaimer (In no way, shape or form do I agree with or condone the content of the domain that was cancelled)

 

[Kuffy]

Just another thought. Did google have links to the site whilst it was registered with Godaddy?

 

[bmugford]

So what happens if a domain is allowed to exist under Versign policy, but zero registrars are willing to allow it to be registered there?

The content is one thing, the domain itself exists independently.

It is easy to defend this decision when the content is morally repugnant to most people, but once again it is a subjective decision. What happens when this same standard starts being applied to other content people don't like?

Brad

 

[Haris]

All those offensive site owners will create their own registrar for hosting offensive websites

offensivewebsites.com & offensivedomains.com available for reg

 

[carob]

I have never looked at the site. What I can say from secondhand reports is that if it was inciting violence then it would be being used for criminal purposes - incitement is a crime, so a registrar or law enforcement would have a valid reason to get rid of it.

 

[Internet.Domains]

I have never looked at the site. What I can say from secondhand reports is that if it was inciting violence then it would be being used for criminal purposes - incitement is a crime, so a registrar or law enforcement would have a valid reason to get rid of it.

Yes, it appears a crime has happened on the site. This is a job for law enforcement and not the pandering PR teams of Tech companies.....Let law enforcement handle the criminals.

 

[carob]

Godaddy are famous for a shoot first, ask questions approach to registrants and accounts - there has been plenty of discussion and experience of that on here. Just possibly they did not want to lose money or time responding to complaints and media interest. I wonder if a number of hate domains will now transfer out in a hurry?

 

[Kuffy]

I wonder if Milo is using GD.

bummer if that name gets cancelled.

 

[equity78]

I think YouTube taking down their channel is a big deal too, while I have no problems with that kind of hate being extinguished, there are a lot of channels on YouTube that espouse hate. So Google needs to get to work and close a lot of channels.

 

[Joe Styler]

There is an interesting question coming up here about free speech and domains. Speaking or giving out hand-printed leaflets in the street truly is free, but on the internet you need a platform.

You can carry on publishing on the internet if you lose your domain, you just lose all your links and probably initially recognition while you establish a new domain. Without some kind of hosting you can't continue.

I also wonder about free speech applied narrowly to domains - say your domain makes a statement such as PersonXisacrook.com - should or would that be allowed? Is the domain itself libellous or only when it is used?

The domain we are talking about here was expelled by Godaddy, not cancelled, because of the way it was being used, not because of the words it contains. If Google have now cancelled the domain it will take 30+ days to drop - or is it just disabled?

A LOT of .co.uk domains used for fraud were just cancelled outright by the authorities in one big operation a few years ago.

Which makes sense then as the UK was cancelling domains due to a legal concern. As I stated we allowed the content to continue for a long time with many complaints so this is not a speech issue, we allowed that, it was a legal reason we gave for requiring them to leave us.

 

[Internet.Domains]

We did not cancel the domain. We told them to find another registrar within 24 hours. The reasoning behind it was that it was inciting violence which is against the law. People do things that are illegal on domain names and we need to step in as our lawyers see fit. For instance we do this with things like child porn. It is one thing to object to the content (which speaking for myself and not as a GoDaddy employee, I strongly do in the strongest terms, with no exceptions or caveats) but it is important to note that this removal was not done for moral reasons or PR reasons but for legal reasons as our legal team saw fit. I'm not a lawyer, I won't pretend to speak for what is legal or illegal but I think it is important to note that our legal team said that the content was deemed illegal and that is the reason it was removed in violation of our terms of service.

Thanks for joining the conversation Joe!..........According to the Southern Poverty Law Center there are currently 917 hate groups in the United States alone.
Many of those groups are currently delivering content deemed to incite criminal behavior on GoDaddy domains.....What does GoDaddy intend to do with those groups/domains?

https://www.splcenter.org/hate-map

 

[equity78]

I don't think private companies should be forced to host a platform for hate speech. Remember that hate speech is the enabler of hate actions. Even words have consequences. Those sites embolden people with extremist leanings, brainwash them into thinking they are not alone and that their radical views are almost mainstream and acceptable.
Give me a break with your First Amendment rights: freedom goes hand in hand with responsibility. You are responsible for what you write and advocate even online, especially when it can influence deranged individuals.

I run private companies too, if I find out that you use our hosting services for crap I will politely show you the door. This is what GD did. They didn't touch the domain.

Why not. There are rogue registrars that exist for the sole purpose of spamming.

Kate I get your point, but it's not just cut and dry as things move from the despicable to just the "I don't like that" category. First off let me be crystal clear I am against all extremist groups, of every kind, I have never been on the website GoDaddy turned away and wouldn't even link to it.

I think people are worried about things moving slowly astray, it always starts slowly, get rid of all the content that every, decent civil human being believes is abhorrent, everyone on the same page. Then it moves to well this guy has a vlog that he thinks men are superior to women when it comes to coding, ( I don't believe that) now he is not espousing or inciting violence, that's a misguided assumption on his part, imo but I do think he has the right to believe that, he does not have the right to discriminate against a woman if he is in the position where he can hire and fire. But if it's just his personal belief, I believe more people will see him as a fool and ignore him. But if a bunch of people at Google say, "Hey I hate this idiot, he thinks men are superior to women when it comes to coding, let's close his YouTube channel!" That's a problem, I know, I know it could never happen. Or could it?

We are slowly becoming a society that believes in Freedom of speech with an * needed, I believe in a person who believes what I believe having the right to Freedom of speech. Confirmation bias makes people feel warm and cozy, before we would at least hear someone and then say what an asshole, if we vehemently disagreed. Now there are large numbers who believe that speech must be stifled if it's against what they believe, again I am not talking about this instance, I hope everyone here is against Nazis. The concern for many is will this instance start the Penguin sliding off the slippery slope?

If you want people to give you a break with Freedom of speech well you are entitled to that belief, but there might be a time where someone says that with regards to something you want the freedom to express. The only people in favor of Nazis are Nazis, the rest of the world is vehemently opposed. But there are topics where many different ideologies could come into play and a domino effect takes place for shutting down freedom of speech. Just my opinion.

 

[Kate]

There is a lot of censorship in the US too, more than you think. The registry has even revoked .us domains because they contained one of the so-called 7 dirty words. In America, showing nudity or breast on TV is taboo while other countries are more relaxed. On the other hand, hate groups are allowed to prosper and the US is a haven for hate speech. You know, it's like that hysterical war on terror yet guns are killing 30K people every year in America, much more than all terrorists attacks combined, and nothing gets done. It's not very rational and a strange sense of priorities.

This is not discrimination here. If you refuse to serve people because they are black, women, gay or transgendered it is discrimination, when you discriminate people for what they are. They got the boot not for what they are but for what they do, out of their own free will. And as a private company you have no duty to support their repulsive aims, even through simple logistics.