DAN.COM Domain Marketplace (Official Thread)

[DAN.COM]

DAN.COM (formerly known as Undeveloped.com) is on a path to be become the biggest domain marketplace in the world. We use state of the art technology to solve everyday problems buyers and sellers in the domain industry face. At DAN.COM we focus on automating most processes required to buy & sell domains to increase a more efficient and active secondary market for domains.

What sets us apart is our strong focus on product development and customer satisfaction. We leave nothing to chance and every single feature and element we introduce is professionally and carefully designed and built.

DAN.COM is ranked in the top 5 best-rated marketplaces in the world (According to the biggest review platform Trustpilot) and in the domain industry, we're the domain marketplace with the highest rating with an average of 9,4 out of 10 points.

At DAN.COM you will get the highest value for the lowest commission around. Due to our domain transfer automation, we can offer significantly faster handling of domain transactions and payouts (usually within 24 hours) at the lowest fee charged by any domain marketplace.

We've been the first on many fronts and proudly will continue to keep innovating. We were the first to offer optimized for sale pages since 2013, the first to provide payment plans in the form of lease to own and rentals and also the first and only domain marketplace offering free SSL on all domains parked with us for over a year now.

Read more about DAN and our future plans here: https://blog.undeveloped.com/a-big-leap-forward-3a3cc59ed418

This thread is created to act as an informal communication board between the DAN team and the domain community. Feel free to post feedback here and to discuss how you use DAN.

What this thread is not meant for is support. Please contact our support team here: [email protected] when you need assistance.

Previous reviews under old brand: https://www.namepros.com/threads/undeveloped-com-experience.893201/

 

[BrandVenue]

I don't think any Payoneer user will know who's the correct person to contact. We don't have any managers assigned to our accounts last I checked. And according to this page https://www.linkedin.com/company/payoneer/people/ I can see at least more than 100++ types of managers working for Payoneer. So who to go to?

The simplest & fastest solution would be to change back the bank account's name to 'DAN.com'. You used this before (before changing back to Undeveloped BV, not sure what's with this reversal), and all payments from 'DAN.com' went through without any problems.

It's very hard for users to contact Payoneer except via Live Chat, and even then there's no option to include other people into the chat line. Other than that, Payoneer is unlikely to budge unless a HUGE number of users complain on their community forum.

At any rate I've posted a thread there at https://community.payoneer.com/en/d...on-previously-undeveloped-bv-dan-com/p1?new=1 , so please directly inform the others affected to participate in that thread as well

However I will still request to change back the bank account's name. It's very likely that the word "Transfer" is a "Money Laundering red flag trigger"

I agree. Dan Domain Transfer Foundation is confusing as the name cannot be linked to Dan.com directly. We get transaction invoices from Dan.com and even there's no mention of Dan Domain Transfer Foundation. The purpose of payments received from Dan Domain Transfer Foundation would need few bit of explanations to banks. Not only "Transfer" keyword is flag trigger, "Foundation" is another word which is mostly used by nonprofit corporation or charitable trust that makes grants for charitable purposes.

 

[UmerK]

Regarding Payoneer - My bad I did not look into this and thread and now two of my Payments are on track of being reversed.

Here's a concerning excerpt from Payoneer's message ;

Unfortunately, this payment could not be delivered to you, because it came from a personal bank account. This payment will be returned to DAN DOMAIN TRANSFER FOUN in the next 7-10 business days, and you will not be charged a fee for it.

To pay you through the Global Payment Service, DAN DOMAIN TRANSFER FOUN can simply make a local bank transfer from a company bank account. Please note that this service does not accept payments from personal bank accounts.

@LaszloSchenk can you please confirm if this is true?

The simplest fix IMHO is for DAN.com to register with Payoneer as one of the platform that uses Payoneer. SH/BB and almost most companies do the same out there.

With that I am sure we will face 0 issues as there wouldn't be any wire transfer allowed.

A recent change from DAN to payment setup could be what may have triggered this but at the same time Payoneer announced some recent changes as well which may be at the issue.

At the end of the day, I expect very little from Payoneer so I request DAN to take necessary steps to register with Payoneer and allow us to add Payoneer as one of the payout options.

 

[eternaldomains]

The simplest fix IMHO is for DAN.com to register with Payoneer as one of the platform that uses Payoneer. SH/BB and almost most companies do the same out there.

The above is also what I was about to suggest, so thanks for saying it first! However the name change is still an important issue because for those getting payouts differently e.g. wires or maybe even PP, from now onwards sellers might get secretly flagged by their banks/PP.

I have also received the same message UmerK.

---

During the many years receiving direct deposits into my Payoneer, not a single properly made direct deposit was ever declined, except from 1 other company: Epik. And seeing this new info made me realize that it could've been because Epik was using the word: H/O/L/D/I/N/G/S. For those not sure why, just search this term on google: o/f/f/s/h/o/r/e h/o/l/d/i/n/g c/o/m/p/a/n/y. This problem, is also why I rarely ever use Epik to sell my names.

I'm very grateful to the people handling my Payoneer account (whomever they are) for not destroying/limiting my account all these years over silly word problems like this.

 

[DAN.COM]

I don't think any Payoneer user will know who's the correct person to contact. We don't have any managers assigned to our accounts last I checked. And according to this page https://www.linkedin.com/company/payoneer/people/ I can see at least more than 100++ types of managers working for Payoneer. So who to go to?

The simplest & fastest solution would be to change back the bank account's name to 'DAN.com'. You used this before (before changing back to Undeveloped BV, not sure what's with this reversal), and all payments from 'DAN.com' went through without any problems.

It's very hard for users to contact Payoneer except via Live Chat, and even then there's no option to include other people into the chat line. Other than that, Payoneer is unlikely to budge unless a HUGE number of users complain on their community forum.

At any rate I've posted a thread there at https://community.payoneer.com/en/d...on-previously-undeveloped-bv-dan-com/p1?new=1 , so please directly inform the others affected to participate in that thread as well

However I will still request to change back the bank account's name. It's very likely that the word "Transfer" is a "Money Laundering red flag trigger". EDIT TO ADD: It seems more dangerous to keep this name (DAN Domain Transfer Foundation) if it's going to end up triggering more red flags from other banks and potentially getting every seller marked as a launderer.

Hi Eternal Domains,

We understand that you're looking for a quick fix, however, no sane bank or service triggers a red flag due to the word "transfer" in an entity/account name.

We're using this setup for weeks now and only recently Payoneer started blocking our payments due to one of their employees likely accidentally flagging our account.

We're in contact with a senior rep from Payoneer as we speak to resolve the mistake.

Kind regards,

Dan

 

[UmerK]

Hi Eternal Domains,

We understand that you're looking for a quick fix, however, no sane bank or service triggers a red flag due to the word "transfer" in an entity/account name.

We're using this setup for weeks now and only recently Payoneer started blocking our payments due to one of their employees likely accidentally flagging our account.

We're in contact with a senior rep from Payoneer as we speak to resolve the mistake.

Kind regards,

Dan

This sounds way better than earlier response, expecting you guys to resolve this problem soon.

However, can you please confirm if the payouts are sent through individual bank account? If not; is there any possible way for us to get a document that states that the payout are being process through a bank account? That could be a fix.

Also; considering you notice that we are facing issues and a lot of us DAN.com users use Payoneer - would you consider being registered with Payoneer and allow us Payoneer payouts for a swifter outcome for all of us once you're done getting the current issue fixed?

 

[alcy]

@Dan,I thought when you import leads its 5%?Even on an installment payment .

Please clarify .I have closed transaction and it was 5% so why charge 9%.If seller uses another means of receiving payment, is this a different scenario for % charged?

dude there is no installments on import lead

just cause u add new lead and then tell buyer to go buy it via instalment page it doesnt mean u get 5%... u get whatever buyer uses to checkout . if add lead email then 5%... or 9% otherwise

also careful with 2k plus sales and paypal payout... I forget it it costs more to get it or they dont do it period... @LaszloSchenk

 

[UmerK]

The above is also what I was about to suggest, so thanks for saying it first! However the name change is still an important issue because for those getting payouts differently e.g. wires or maybe even PP, from now onwards sellers might get secretly flagged by their banks/PP.

I have also received the same message UmerK.

---

During the many years receiving direct deposits into my Payoneer, not a single properly made direct deposit was ever declined, except from 1 other company: Epik. And seeing this new info made me realize that it could've been because Epik was using the word: H/O/L/D/I/N/G/S. For those not sure why, just search this term on google: o/f/f/s/h/o/r/e h/o/l/d/i/n/g c/o/m/p/a/n/y. This problem, is also why I rarely ever use Epik to sell my names.

I'm very grateful to the people handling my Payoneer account (whomever they are) for not destroying/limiting my account all these years over silly word problems like this.

I think this has little to do with word Foundation as I have received few payments that went through despite DAN.com changing the name.

The issue as mentioned above is with someone in Payoneer team flagging the payments from DAN.com as if they were being sent by an individual bank account.

And considering this is a recent change that Payoneer implemented (to stop support payments from individuals) this is what could have triggered it.

I believe it would probably get resolved faster as long as DAN.com gives them ample proof that the payouts are being processed through a business account and not an individual account.

 

[eternaldomains]

no sane bank or service triggers a red flag due to the word "transfer" in an entity/account name.

Unfortunately, my experience with many banks & payment processors indicated that not all are sane. 1 branch can behave very differently than the other branch even for the same bank, and the same can be said between different banks in the same state/country. This is also why such speculated accidental flagging can happen easily at any time, even long after many successful payments. I do agree that it's simply ridiculous to trigger a red flag due to the word "transfer", but some banks, they really think otherwise.

Long ago I dealt with forex trading, wired to OANDA. The 1st bank says I only need to write a declaration form, the 2nd bank couldn't process at all, the 3rd bank simply tried to make me look like a criminal.

We're in contact with a senior rep from Payoneer as we speak to resolve the mistake.

Hope to see the issue resolved soon, I'm really looking forward for the clearance.

 

[eternaldomains]

Payoneer should be implemented ASAP. Even a crappy, small & new marketplace like alter.com can adopt it so quickly, so I'm sure such an established marketplace like DAN could easily adopt it as well.

 

[s.g]

I am suggesting to @DAN.COM ,to be careful when transfering names .I purchased a 4L and you guys transfered another domain to my Godaddy.I was wondering if you dont realize you are sending me someone else's domain .

Just advising you to be careful because you may also transfer my own valuable domain in your possession to another buyer. I am going to be careuful using you to trade. By the way you transfered coinverify.com when my domain was a super 4L.You need to wake and not make errors with other people's assets in your possession.

Just an advise,during transfer,look through your invoice for what one is paying for before pushing/transfer .You could have transfered my 4L to someone else.

It seems rather odd that our last request for info from DAN has not been answered during their recent visit here. Is this not important to you, @DAN.COM? It appears so; you failed to answer when Skyvisum de facto asked you to explain this, and then you failed to explain this again when we pointed out that you ignored his alarming post.

Due to your delay, we will only have to discuss the issues raised by Skyvisum next Tuesday (instead of today). We hope to hear from you by that time because—to us—this seems to be one of those biggies that are slightly more important than your upcoming site upgrade. Trust, you know ... it should be listed somewhere there too, probably right below that bug #248 you are actively dealing with these days.

Thanks.

 

[frank-germany]

We appreciate your opinion but have to agree to disagree. Some sellers from this forum know what kind of extensive product research we're performing for the next version of DAN that we're preparing to launch. We listen to every feedback we receive but might simply not agree with all feedback.

We're validating everything and anything we do, that has been our methodology from day one.

Some sellers might simply not agree with some of the features we offer or how we design our product and that's perfectly fine .

when I make claims or accusations
that's never out of the blue
but for a good reason
and I'm always able to prove

you are doing counterproductive stuff on your German LandingPage
I have tried multiple times to get your attention
and that's not an opinion

are you testing German Landing Pages separately for the German market?

means:
do you rotate slight variations in order to track results?

or is that done only for the international market?

I'm selling domains to Germans since about 20 years
and I know a mistake when I see one

 

[DAN.COM]

It seems rather odd that our last request for info from DAN has not been answered during their recent visit here. Is this not important to you, @DAN.COM? It appears so; you failed to answer when Skyvisum de facto asked you to explain this, and then you failed to explain this again when we pointed out that you ignored his alarming post.

Due to your delay, we will only have to discuss the issues raised by Skyvisum next Tuesday (instead of today). We hope to hear from you by that time because—to us—this seems to be one of those biggies that are slightly more important than your upcoming site upgrade. Trust, you know ... it should be listed somewhere there too, probably right below that bug #248 you are actively dealing with these days.

Thanks.

You've missed our reply from yesterday it seems:

We've completed a review of what caused the issue and it was caused by either human error on our end or a bug in the Godaddy selection tool which selected the wrong domain to be pushed along with the correct domain.

Our transfer process at Godaddy is adjusted after this incident and our team is getting additional training next week to make sure our team learns from the mistake.

Having said this, at DAN no seller or buyer can ever get a negative financial impact from mistakes or technical issues. We're not a perfect company and are honest enough to never claim we do not make any mistakes.

However, we take our responsibility as we've done so in the past 7 years. If the domain was lost, for example, the buyer would have received a refund from us and the seller would have kept the payout.

 

[DAN.COM]

when I make claims or accusations
that's never out of the blue
but for a good reason
and I'm always able to prove

you are doing counterproductive stuff on your German LandingPage
I have tried multiple times to get your attention
and that's not an opinion

are you testing German Landing Pages separately for the German market?

means:
do you rotate slight variations in order to track results?

or is that done only for the international market?

I'm selling domains to Germans since about 20 years
and I know a mistake when I see one

Yes, we keep track of conversion ratios per language we offer our services in. We do this because wrong translations can even impact a specific page that works really well in English but not so well in German.

Our sales ratio does not indicate any deviation from our German, Dutch, or English copy. If it did, we'd be the first to correct it.

 

[UmerK]

@DAN.COM any ETA for resolving of issues with Payoneer?

Also; are you going to allow payoneer payouts in future?

Looking forward to your response, cheers.

 

[s.g]

You've missed our reply from yesterday it seems:

Show attachment 172363

We've completed a review of what caused the issue and it was caused by either human error on our end or a bug in the Godaddy selection tool which selected the wrong domain to be pushed along with the correct domain.

Our transfer process at Godaddy is adjusted after this incident and our team is getting additional training next week to make sure our team learns from the mistake.

Having said this, at DAN no seller or buyer can ever get a negative financial impact from mistakes or technical issues. We're not a perfect company and are honest enough to never claim we do not make any mistakes.

However, we take our responsibility as we've done so in the past 7 years. If the domain was lost, for example, the buyer would have received a refund from us and the seller would have kept the payout.

That's more than fair. It sounds like a responsible business acting like its own insurer.

Sorry about overlooking that. We went to the original post and through the relevant two recent pages (since our response). As we noticed no visible reply and no answer to our post from last week, we assumed you answered all the other topics but this. Our apologies.

 

[DAN.COM]

Quick update, the great folks at Payoneer have resolved the issue. Payouts via Payoneer should process smoothly again.

Thank you for your patience!

 

[UmerK]

Quick update, the great folks at Payoneer have resolved the issue. Payouts via Payoneer should process smoothly again.

Thank you for your patience!

Thanks a tonne!

Would the payouts which were declined and are still pending refund be approved?

Do you recommend sending them a request to approve it?

 

[alcy]

people use payoneer? seriously why? what are advantages? I thought dan had a complete set of payouts with pp btc wire... alternating them as needed ..

 

[alcy]

dude there is no installments on import lead

just cause u add new lead and then tell buyer to go buy it via instalment page it doesnt mean u get 5%... u get whatever buyer uses to checkout . if add lead email then 5%... or 9% otherwise

also careful with 2k plus sales and paypal payout... I forget it it costs more to get it or they dont do it period... @LaszloSchenk

@LaszloSchenk plz briefly comment. .ty

 

[UmerK]

people use payoneer? seriously why? what are advantages? I thought dan had a complete set of payouts with pp btc wire... alternating them as needed ..

I am based in Pakistan.

Banks are quite slow and ask for invoices and what not if you use a direct wire transfer.

The rates they give are lower as well.

For me, Payoneer is a lot easier as I can hold funds and do a single withdrawal.

Payoneer debit card also means I can do reinvesting purchases a lot more easily.

In payoneer you could get funds within 3 days, with the bank it'll probably take 10 days or more.

 

[LaszloSchenk]

@LaszloSchenk plz briefly comment. .ty

Good morning,

This is correct. As our transfer department needs to perform manual labor for multiple months in a row the commission cannot be reduced to 5%. It would no longer be viable to offer a 5% commission as we:
- have to configure the domain's DNS records for the buyer which often happens multiple times during such a plan
- have our account managers chase your buyers by phone and email whenever an installment payment is delayed

Lastly, the Paypal payout threshold currently is $2000 indeed.

Best regards,

 

[FolioTeam]

I am based in Pakistan.

Banks are quite slow and ask for invoices and what not if you use a direct wire transfer.

The rates they give are lower as well.

For me, Payoneer is a lot easier as I can hold funds and do a single withdrawal.

Payoneer debit card also means I can do reinvesting purchases a lot more easily.

In payoneer you could get funds within 3 days, with the bank it'll probably take 10 days or more.

It will also go a long way if @DAN.COM can give us the option of maintaining a balance on the platform and choosing when and how much we wish to withdraw.

@LaszloSchenk is that possible?

 

[eternaldomains]

Quick update, the great folks at Payoneer have resolved the issue. Payouts via Payoneer should process smoothly again.

Thank you for your patience!

So, for the currently reversed payments, I suppose we have to wait for 7-10 business days before you resend the payments right?

 

[frank-germany]

Yes, we keep track of conversion ratios per language we offer our services in. We do this because wrong translations can even impact a specific page that works really well in English but not so well in German.

Our sales ratio does not indicate any deviation from our German, Dutch, or English copy. If it did, we'd be the first to correct it.

I'm sure
that you create doubt in some German potential customers
in displaying unusual information in regard to the VAT

and therefore shy them away

DAN is not a trusted source to a German end user
if they know any it's Sedo

you do 2 things wrong to the German market:

explaining what VAT is
nobody does so in Germany
and every German knows
what VAT is
and what is means

telling them that the end price ist an
estimate

Germans are exactly thinking people
they don't want an estimate
they want certainty

 

[DAN.COM]

I'm sure
that you create doubt in some German potential customers
in displaying unusual information in regard to the VAT

and therefore shy them away

DAN is not a trusted source to a German end user
if they know any it's Sedo

you do 2 things wrong to the German market:

explaining what VAT is
nobody does so in Germany
and every German knows
what VAT is
and what is means

telling them that the end price ist an
estimate

Germans are exactly thinking people
they don't want an estimate
they want certainty

I'll try explaining this one more time.

The assumption that you make here which is false is that we want to explain what VAT is.

You have to realize that a German buyer can either be a business buyer or a private buyer and that you need all information from the buyer and seller before you can determine if VAT is applicable or not.

That's why it's crucial to inform users beforehand about the total price picture rather than surprising them at checkout with an increase due to adding VAT, if applicable, for example.

When a visitor from Germany lands on a for sale page, we do not yet know yet if this is going to be a private acquisition or business purchase.

However, we start managing their expectations up front and we make sure the buyer does not get surprised negatively, but only positively when the VAT isn't charged due to their situation.

Some possible scenarios that clarify the above:

1: When the buyer is a company from Germany and seller from the US, no VAT is charged!

2: When the buyer is a company from Germany and the seller a company from the Netherlands, no VAT is charged

3: When the buyer is a private individual from Germany and the seller is from the Netherlands but also a private individual, no VAT is charged

4: When the buyer is a private individual from Germany and the seller is a company based in Germany, the German VAT rate is applicable

and there are plenty of other scenarios that I do not even mention which make this subject even more complex. This is why we must include that the VAT we show on the for sale page is an estimate and after step 1 of checkout, it can be updated because that's the only moment we can 100% accurately determine if VAT is applicable or not.

To conclude, when we didn't use the current model (before 2017) to show an indication that VAT might be applicable based on the data we have (buyer IP/location & Seller settings), we had a big drop off in checkout and plenty of cancelations because buyers would complain that we increased the price at checkout, while we simply added the VAT when applicable.

Since we've implemented the current model, those problems are gone because of the above described.

In the situations described above, we never surprise buyers and we have the data to back that this model works best of all models that we've tried.

Please let me know if you now understand why we do it this way. We do this not because we're stubborn as you indicate but because we operate a marketplace for almost 8 years now and have gone through quite some product development cycles to get to this point.

We talk to buyers every single day and know what friction points our marketplace has. If you sell with us, you have to trust we're competent to do what's right for you as well.

Besides that, we even offer the most extensive VAT settings provided by any online marketplace.

You can even sell in a way with us that WHEN vat is applicable that it will be calculated on invoice level so the buyer always sees one BIN price on the lander that doesn't change. For example, the buyer sees a $1000 BIN price. After submitting his/her billing details we observe that you do have to charge VAT. Then we calculate the ex VAT price and reverse calculate the VAT as being part of the total price.

You can also sell ex VAT which you now do, where we add the VAT when applicable to the BIN price shown.

We also offer the option to show no VAT at all and to not charge VAT for any transaction you have with us.

So we offer you all the options to sell it your way, but without providing any proof or proper argumentation you keep asking us to change our model.

Lastly, you mention: " Germans are exactly thinking people they don't want an estimate they want certainty"

You cannot offer certainty when you do not have all information to provide certainty. That's why we manage expectations so your German buyers do not get uncertain at checkout due to a surprise increase in price at checkout.