BrandBucket Experience

[xtremex]

hello

I am new to BrandBucket. Before getting my hands on this

I wish to experience about brandbucket from my fellow members


Thanks

 

[12345]

Well - I hope so. If that's the case - it went pretty fast. The name is listed for 4 days.

Nice! Yep, BB is just going through the vetting process.

 

[slimjim270]

Been a pretty good last couple of weeks. I have sold the following on BB...

D A T A G A I N
E N E R G Y C L O U D S
R E A D Y L E N D
O U T D O O R S N O W
H E A L T H Y K I C K
L I V E B Y M E

Michael,

I appreciate your posting your sales. Congrats!

Curious... you have a large portfolio, a good data set to benchmark against as a guide... what is your %Sales to total number you have listed on BrandBucket? 1/2 % monthly? 1 % monthly? 2+% monthly?

The reason I ask is this insight would be a terrific motivator for me to crank up my volume of submissions.

I performed some "napkin" math 6 months ago and determined that a sales volume of 5 % annually (roughly 1/2 of 1 percent per month) of my total inventory being sold (subtracting commissions / logo fees) was my break even mark.

A performance of 10% or better annually would be a nice cash flow based on my current list prices.

Appreciate your feedback as you have nice volume to measure.

Thanks,

-Jim

 

[campout]

Jim, what are you using as your average sales price in your breakeven calculation?

 

[12345]

Hey, Jim,

It is a little difficult to give you an accurate percentage amount because I basically jumped from about 125 names, to around 600, and then to 1000 names over the period of about 8 months. So the number of domains that I am adding jumps pretty significantly every 2-3 months.

You mentioned that 5% is your break-even point. That seems really, really high unless you are reinvesting extremely aggressively, like every dime you make. Part of it too would also depend on the size of your portfolio. If you have 100 names and sell 5 a year and make an average of $1500 take-home off of each name then you are making $7500 a year. If you have a 1000 names and sell 5%, you are making 75K take-home. 2000 and you are making 150K take-home. That leaves you with plenty of money to reinvest while taking home a nice living.

 

[JudgeMind]

Michael, if you have 1000 names listed on bb, how many names of that were declined by bb? Or do all of your names get approved?

 

[campout]

The only real cost I see here is the cost of renewal, and using coupons to a lesser extent intial hand reg. Now if you are buying your names from others, maybe that bumps up the cost even to a significant degree.

Most of my submissions were hand regs, and a few were bought for $20 or less in GD auctions. I don't believe any cost me more than that.

1,000 domains renewed at $8.50 each = $8,500 in expenses offset by 5% sell-rate of $75,000 revenue... I agree with Michael that your breakeven analysis seems erroneous unless there is something unusual you are doing.

 

[campout]

If you don't vote, then you've got an initial $10 cost per domain -- which in the 1,000 domain example adds $10,000 in expense, but still leaves one wellll above breakeven.

 

[12345]

Michael, if you have 1000 names listed on bb, how many names of that were declined by bb? Or do all of your names get approved?

I would say that around 20% of my names aren't a good fit for BB.

 

[slimjim270]

Jim, what are you using as your average sales price in your breakeven calculation?

@licaquire -

Glad to share...

I'm testing the model using 5L and Rhyme type names. No "monsters" in my portfolio.

The Math (the model I'm testing)

Acquire 400 hand-regs at $10 each = $4,000.

25% Accept ratio = 100 Accepts. (I am averaging 28% Accept ratio when x-polinating Declines between BB/BR - each site has a different eye for what they are looking for - I never list 1 name at both sites simultaneously - against TOU - I believe in recycling)

Average list price is slightly under $1,500 overall.

Sell the names at 80% of list (20% discount when taking offers into consideration) = $1,200 average sale

$1,200 * 70% (my share) = $840

Subtract $100 logo fee = $740 (my take each sale).

5% of 100 = 5 sales X $740 = $3,700.

I sell off the other 300 Declines @ $7 each = $2,100 credit. (yes, I have been successful at selling off all my "Declines" pretty quickly outside of BB/BR at myh registrar - this allows me to recycle my capital)

Churn and burn! (those that don't make the cut ... burn'em)

Oops... guess I overstated... it only takes 3 sales the 1st year to break even if you take into account I recoupe $2,100 selling off the "deadwood" (Declines). 3 sales X $740 = $2,220. 3 sales would cover my true capital cost as the $4,000 is reduced byt the $2,100 credit.

The remaining 97 Published names renew for another year... 2nd year cost $970.

The 2nd and 3rd year only takes 2 sales each year to break even.

Anything above... 3 sales the 1st year, 2 sales the 2nd, and 2 sales the 3rd... is profit.

I am extremely appreciative to Margot (BrandBucket) and Michael (Brandroot) for developing these markets.

This is a fun hobby - a lot less expensive than collecting musty antique furniture!

-Jim

ps: Here's a funny story - I had a phone call this week on a 5L name I acquired last Sunday, Feb 15th. I sold the $10 hand reg yesterday, Feb 19th (only had it 4 days) for $400. I didn't even have time to submit it to BB or BR and I had cash coming in to recycle.

 

[Doron Vermaat]

@licaquire -

Glad to share...

I'm testing the model using 5L and Rhyme type names. No "monsters" in my portfolio.

The Math (the model I'm testing)

Acquire 400 hand-regs at $10 each = $4,000.

25% Accept ratio = 100 Accepts. (I am averaging 28% Accept ratio when x-polinating Declines between BB/BR - each site has a different eye for what they are looking for - I never list 1 name at both sites simultaneously - against TOU - I believe in recycling)

Average list price is slightly under $1,500 overall.

Sell the names at 80% of list (20% discount when taking offers into consideration) = $1,200 average sale

$1,200 * 70% (my share) = $840

Subtract $100 logo fee = $740 (my take each sale).

5% of 100 = 5 sales X $740 = $3,700.

I sell off the other 300 Declines @ $7 each = $2,100 credit. (yes, I have been successful at selling off all my "Declines" pretty quickly outside of BB/BR at myh registrar - this allows me to recycle my capital)

Churn and burn! (those that don't make the cut ... burn'em)

Oops... guess I overstated... it only takes 3 sales the 1st year to break even if you take into account I recoupe $2,100 selling off the "deadwood" (Declines). 3 sales X $740 = $2,220. 3 sales would cover my true capital cost as the $4,000 is reduced byt the $2,100 credit.

The remaining 97 Published names renew for another year... 2nd year cost $970.

The 2nd and 3rd year only takes 2 sales each year to break even.

Anything above... 3 sales the 1st year, 2 sales the 2nd, and 2 sales the 3rd... is profit.

I am extremely appreciative to Margot (BrandBucket) and Michael (Brandroot) for developing these markets.

This is a fun hobby - a lot less expensive than collecting musty antique furniture!

-Jim

ps: Here's a funny story - I had a phone call this week on a 5L name I acquired last Sunday, Feb 15th. I sold the $10 hand reg yesterday, Feb 19th (only had it 4 days) for $400. I didn't even have time to submit it to BB or BR and I had cash coming in to recycle.

How about your time? Hand regging 400 names and selling off 75% of them that dont make the cut seems like an aweful lot of work to me. Unless you dont consider time a valuable asset you need to sell a LOT more than 5 names a year. Imo.

 

[slimjim270]

Hey, Jim,

It is a little difficult to give you an accurate percentage amount because I basically jumped from about 125 names, to around 600, and then to 1000 names over the period of about 8 months. So the number of domains that I am adding jumps pretty significantly every 2-3 months.

You mentioned that 5% is your break-even point. That seems really, really high unless you are reinvesting extremely aggressively, like every dime you make. Part of it too would also depend on the size of your portfolio. If you have 100 names and sell 5 a year and make an average of $1500 take-home off of each name then you are making $7500 a year. If you have a 1000 names and sell 5%, you are making 75K take-home. 2000 and you are making 150K take-home. That leaves you with plenty of money to reinvest while taking home a nice living.

@michaeljkrell -

Thanks for your response!

Your ramp-up is where I'm heading. I have been testing/benchmarking the past 90 days to better understand the model.

Your "break-even" assessment is spot on! I originally mentioned 5%, but after taking into account credits (selling off deadwood "Declines") my target break-even is 3% asset sales in year 1.

You raise a couple great points -

1) when ramping up, you don't simply BAM have 600 published day one on the sites - it takes time and patience, so selling 3% the 1st year needs to normalize or at least recognize the ramp up differential when calculating your ROI.

2) I am testing low hanging fruit (no monster names yet) so am basing my initial take-home $$ at a lower rate of only $740 ($1,500 sale X 80% recognizing negotiating discounts = $1,200 X 70 my take = $840 - $100 logo fee = $740 take home) I do have a couple names listed at over $3,000 but I don't include them in my modeling.

Thanks for your "break-even" assessment. It's interesting to compare notes.

-Jim

ps: IMO - the "real" money in this game is year 2 and year 3... all you need to do is set your "Accepted" domains at BB/BR/NR to auto-renew at your registrar (passive) and do a domain push once or twice a week. All the submitting, selling off the deadwood, and logo designs/etc have been completed. This is a simple (reasonably passive) investment model from my perspective.

 

[slimjim270]

How about your time? Hand regging 400 names and selling off 75% of them that dont make the cut seems like an aweful lot of work to me. Unless you dont consider time a valuable asset you need to sell a LOT more than 5 names a year. Imo.

@dv82 -

Absolutely agree.

We probably should include blogging time on NamePros too... it's also a cost... it's hard for me to quantify my cost of time as there is no out-of-pocket expense associated... but I definitely agree with you that there is a cost (or loss revenue potential) when spending time domaining versus billing more hours at a client site.

I certainly enjoy my time spent on a quiet morning selecting, registering, and selling off deadwood domains - much more enjoyable than the $2.00 burrito I ate for lunch...

-Jim

 

[Optimal Names]

Does anyone know if there is a list of completed sales on BrandBucket available?

 

[JudgeMind]

Some of their sales can be seen in the clients and testimonials section

 

[campout]

@slimjim270 My understanding was that most BB names go for list price, so I'm wondering if your 20% negotiation discount is too steep. (I have yet to have my portfolio of 20 submitted domains "ruled" on.. so I can't speak from experience.)

More importantly, why aren't you using GoDaddy coupons to register your domains!? I think this will save you $1,500+ (and probably more) on 400 domains.

Thanks for the model explanation.

@michaeljkrell What is your philosophy on logo-spend on BB? My thinking is that the logical thing is to dedicate more money to a logo when the domain is higher-priced.

 

[campout]

Also, @slimjim270 what made you decide to use BR but not Namerific?

 

[slimjim270]

@slimjim270 My understanding was that most BB names go for list price, so I'm wondering if your 20% negotiation discount is too steep. (I have yet to have my portfolio of 20 submitted domains "ruled" on.. so I can't speak from experience.)

More importantly, why aren't you using GoDaddy coupons to register your domains!? I think this will save you $1,500+ (and probably more) on 400 domains.

Thanks for the model explanation.

@michaeljkrell What is your philosophy on logo-spend on BB? My thinking is that the logical thing is to dedicate more money to a logo when the domain is higher-priced.

@llcacquire -

Great questions... glad to respond...

1. 20% negotiation discount - I recall reading a post a few months back on NamePros, NameSherpa, or one of the 2 sites BrandBucket or Brandroot that mentioned that 2/3 of their sales are at list price. The remainder are a negotiated price. So I figured if 67% go at 100% list price and the other 33% I "guesstimated" at 50% of list price or greater, the math plays out to (100+100+50 = 250 / 3 = 83% ASP) ASP being Average Sale Price. Coincidentally, my 1st sale on one of the sites was a domain I acquired on Dec 30, 2014 and quickly sold Jan 30, 2015. (only owned @ 30 days) It was an offer sale that, ironically, came in at a 21% discount of the list price. I gladly accepted. [somewhat humorous I thought that was 1st sale was in the 33% group and almost spot on to my napkin math] My folks have owned a real-estate business in northern New England for the past 30 years. The offer ratio I used was similar in their business, so I felt it was a reasonable benchmark to use.

2. GoDaddy Coupons - Oh, you are SO RIGHT! Thanks for the suggestion and for calling out the strategy. I have read a few threads on this topic here on NamePros and also have a local friend who has joined BB/BR/NR recently using this approach. Phase I has been a quick start (admittedly a bit cash sloppy). Phase II will be testing a couple registrars, GoDaddy being one, and looking for ways to cut overall cost in the process. This topic is on the radar.

3. Namerific - Funny you mention them. I recently opened an account with Namerific about 45 days ago and have submitted 14 domains. During January the site was a bit spotty being down quite a bit, so initially that concerned me. I choose BB/BR/NR as those were the 3 names that I consistently observed tossed around on NamePros. Additionally, there is a gentleman named Doron (aka @dv82 on NamePros) who is active in the forums. Somehow during my research over the past 90 days I stumbled on his site vibrand(dot)com and his About page lists BB/BR/NR. I didn't see a reason to reinvent the wheel, so followed a pro who I respect his views and business acumen.

I hope the response is helpful...

-Jim

 

[slimjim270]

@llcacquire -

Just had another quick thought...

I recently joined NamePros and already met several top notch individuals who provide insightful and respectful responses.

Suggestion - you might want to subscribe (tag a couple members to "follow") on NamePros. I have a healthy respect for @dv82, @hookbox, @AGAME, @Cyberian, @photonmymind, and @JudgeMind.

There are a couple dozen others I also enjoy reading their post. I can't recall their names off the cuff.

There are also a couple members on NamePros that spew ignorance and get their kicks insulting others... ignore them... I wish they'd go piss in some other sandbox.

-Jim

 

[Optimal Names]

@llcacquire -

Great questions... glad to respond...

1. 20% negotiation discount - I recall reading a post a few months back on NamePros, NameSherpa, or one of the 2 sites BrandBucket or Brandroot that mentioned that 2/3 of their sales are at list price. The remainder are a negotiated price. So I figured if 67% go at 100% list price and the other 33% I "guesstimated" at 50% of list price or greater, the math plays out to (100+100+50 = 250 / 3 = 83% ASP) ASP being Average Sale Price. Coincidentally, my 1st sale on one of the sites was a domain I acquired on Dec 30, 2014 and quickly sold Jan 30, 2015. (only owned @ 30 days) It was an offer sale that, ironically, came in at a 21% discount of the list price. I gladly accepted. [somewhat humorous I thought that was 1st sale was in the 33% group and almost spot on to my napkin math] My folks have owned a real-estate business in northern New England for the past 30 years. The offer ratio I used was similar in their business, so I felt it was a reasonable benchmark to use.

2. GoDaddy Coupons - Oh, you are SO RIGHT! Thanks for the suggestion and for calling out the strategy. I have read a few threads on this topic here on NamePros and also have a local friend who has joined BB/BR/NR recently using this approach. Phase I has been a quick start (admittedly a bit cash sloppy). Phase II will be testing a couple registrars, GoDaddy being one, and looking for ways to cut overall cost in the process. This topic is on the radar.

3. Namerific - Funny you mention them. I recently opened an account with Namerific about 45 days ago and have submitted 14 domains. During January the site was a bit spotty being down quite a bit, so initially that concerned me. I choose BB/BR/NR as those were the 3 names that I consistently observed tossed around on NamePros. Additionally, there is a gentleman named Doron (aka @dv82 on NamePros) who is active in the forums. Somehow during my research over the past 90 days I stumbled on his site vibrand(dot)com and his About page lists BB/BR/NR. I didn't see a reason to reinvent the wheel, so followed a pro who I respect his views and business acumen.

I hope the response is helpful...

-Jim

There is a pretty nice site (I am not affiliated with it at all) that shows current pricing for most extensions across many registrars and I've found it to be pretty accurate:
https://www.domcomp.com/

Hope it helps...

 

[slimjim270]

There is a pretty nice site (I am not affiliated with it at all) that shows current pricing for most extensions across many registrars and I've found it to be pretty accurate:
https://www.domcomp.com/

Hope it helps...

@AGAME -

Great resource. Thanks!

From a quick glance and clicking on the "+ 20 more" button to the right, it appears the business model for 1&1 is a loss leader the 1st year and then they hit you with $14+ renewals. Correct?

How is their service? Has anyone used them to hand-reg the 1st year, then transfer their domains to a "main" account at another registrar prior to renewal?

Thanks for the summary chart AGAME. Insightful to see the registrar I'm using is 1/2 way down the chart on all 3 categories of New, Renew, Transfer.

-Jim