What's going on with Epik and Rob Monster?

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MapleDots

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I'm catching the tail end of this, seems to be some kind of controversy...

https://domaingang.com/domain-news/rob-monster-off-twitter-after-christchurch-massacre-controversy/

Must be something odd to evoke this type of a response from one of our members.

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Also, what on earth is wrong with mitigating a crisis? Would it be better to foment the crisis, and burn Epik to the ground like Notre Dame? Since when is that a bad thing? Sheesh!

During the initial week when people's knee-jerk reaction was to denounce Rob as a Nazi and demand that all domainers boycott Epik, of course I wanted to mitigate a crisis. If you were working at a company you cared about – a company with a hard-working team and many happy customers – and saw such a reaction caused by the personal opinions expressed by your boss, wouldn't you step forward to defend what you've worked for?

Maybe you wouldn't. It means standing up to a lot of people who want to see me as a villain of some kind – a mercenary or a liar. It requires a spine.

Your insinuation that I am posting based on some kind of secret strategy is false. I respond to whatever I think is worth refuting or highlighting. Rob's conspiracy theories, for example, I ignore – because everybody can see they're nonsense without my needing to chime in. Misconceptions about Epik's decision to delete a domain? I was personally involved in that decision; so of course I respond to set the record straight.

Also, why must I report to you personally on my last day of work at Epik? You've got some nerve.

You speak very fondly of Epik and defend it proudly. In your own words, you care about the company. This begs the question, why are you leaving Epik if you care about the company and defend it? And why aren't other present-day team members defending the company as you are?
 
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You speak very fondly of Epik and defend it proudly. In your own words, you care about the company. This begs the question, why are you leaving Epik if you care about the company and defend it? And why aren't other present-day team members defending the company as you are?

Seriously though @TCK you need to leave the man be. He has already said he does not see eye to eye with Rob and is leaving the company. He also said he had a part in helping to build the company so you can understand he is still attached to what he helped build and he feels compelled to defend it.

He has done his part and we need to lay off him a bit. The ship has sailed and his actions have spoken much louder than his voice. He left the company, one cannot say more than that. I am sure this was a very hard decision for him and I don't think there is much more to be gained by calling him out again and again.

I would say let it be and move on.
 
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Seriously though @TCK you need to leave the man be. He has already said he does not see eye to eye with Rob and is leaving the company. He also said he had a part in helping to build the company so you can understand he is still attached to what he helped build and he feels compelled to defend it.

He has done his part and we need to lay off him a bit. The ship has sailed and his actions have spoken much louder than his voice. He left the company, one cannot say more than that. I am sure this was a very hard decision for him and I don't think there is much more to be gained by calling him out again and again.

I would say let it be and move on.

I am sorry if you read that question in an antagonistic tone. It was not meant to sound that way.

The premise of the question is simple. JP cares about the company. He defends it. I don't see anything wrong with that. But if he feels that way and enjoys working there, I also don't see any reason for him leaving. So why leave? Just stay there, JP.
 
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I am sorry if you read that question in an antagonistic tone. It was not meant to sound that way.

The premise of the question is simple. JP cares about the company. He defends it. I don't see anything wrong with that. But if he feels that way and enjoys working there, I also don't see any reason for him leaving. So why leave? Just stay there, JP.

We assume this is the reason he decided to leave but there were probably a number of reasons he come to his decision. Nobody takes the decision to leave their employment lightly, especially if they had a hand in building the company.

To stay or go were probably all questions he has asked himself many times already. When I read his responses he seems to be a well spoken in control type of an individual, so I'm pretty sure he used the same control when making his decision. We should respect it and wish him well and hopefully he will drop by to say hello once in a while.
 
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@MapleDots

Asking a question that is based on a current news item that has been reported on in mainstream domain blogs (I am not including mine for obvious reasons), is not showing disrespect. If you did not insinuate that I am showing disrespect, let me apologize in advance.

However, I would like JP to speak for himself. He is perfectly capable and I am sure would want to set the record straight. He is a smart guy.
 
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Thanks @MapleDots. When I resigned, it was a private decision that I only discussed after the fact with a few industry colleagues whom I trust. Since 1 of my goals was to prevent unnecessary damage to Epik, I mentioned my resignation here at NamePros in such a way that it would be timestamped but not become a headline or add fuel to the fire.

For a few days, nobody noticed, as intended. But then it got picked up – in part because of something Rob said, as I recall. Still, I'm glad that I did not become a distraction from the real issues. It's not that I'm afraid of exposure. Obviously, I've stepped into a public controversy and willingly taken plenty of flak for explaining "what's going on with Epik and Rob Monster". Nobody asked me to. But I'm not the story, and as "juicy" as a feud or rift between Rob and me would be, that doesn't help build consensus about real issues that needed to be addressed. Even though disagreements about those issues linger and will never be fully resolved, I think "what's going on" is now much clearer to people than it was in the immediate reaction to Rob's tweet about NZ.

3 days after I resigned on March 26, Kevin Murphy of DomainIncite asked me for an on-the-record statement explaining why. Since the cat was already out of the bag, I supplied one. I wrote my answer without consulting with anyone. After sending it, I showed it to Rob so that he'd know what to expect. Evidently Kevin decided not to publish it, which was fine by me.

Later, so many people asked me about the resignation that it would have been handy to point to a public statement. If nothing else, it would have saved me time to point to what I'd already written. Pointing people to a sprawling NamePros thread, full of bickering and tangents, wasn't very useful as a synopsis of why I quit. Meanwhile, explaining that choice repeatedly, from scratch, in a hurry, tends to be sloppy.

People are asking me directly why I resigned. It's a fair question, which I see no legitimate reason to ignore. So, even though I still have misgivings about becoming a hammer that people will use to bash Rob / Epik, I'll answer. Since the statement I wrote earlier was meant for public consumption and written close to the moment of my resignation, it seems like a suitable explanation. Here it is verbatim.

Note: I'm not asking anybody to CARE why I resigned or even to read this. This post only exists because I'm not going to sidestep a direct question.

Question: "You quit?"
Answer:

Yes, it's true that I decided not to continue at Epik. It wasn't an easy choice, since I've had a very positive experience working at the company. I like my colleagues and my boss. The job of running a registrar is interesting. No 2 days are ever alike. Epik products, features, and services are already strong and improving steadily. Customers are happy. In many areas, Epik has been an innovator. Growth opportunities are abundant, and I've enjoyed strategizing for Epik's success.

I wasn't planning to leave at all. There was scandal, it's true, in 2018 when Epik permitted Gab.com to be transferred after the domain was suspended at GoDaddy. We withstood that initial controversy. Within the Gab forum, there is racist content that I consider utterly vile and abhorrent, even dangerous. But I have always taken a hard stance in favor of free speech and advocated for due process and registrar neutrality with respect to legal content. Since my views on de-platforming and censorship coincide with Rob's, it was easy for me to support his decision, once I learned of it, to allow Gab.com to exist in public view. And I still fully support that decision.

The scandal lingered, however. Whereas for me Gab.com was just 1 domain among hundreds of thousands of domains at Epik, a controversial website that repelled me and to which I paid no attention whatsoever, for Rob the Gab forum was more important. With good intentions, Rob engaged actively with Gab members and promoted the site as part of a broader alt-tech / free-speech cause. Rob wants to make the web more open, websites more resilient, and browsing more private. Epik has developed products in those areas. Hence Rob found legitimate common ground with Gab members who distrust Big Brother and who have been exposed to censorship.

Rob being politically and socially conservative, he also found enough overlap with Gab members that he could participate in discussions and share his individual opinions. Even though Rob doesn't share the racism exhibited by some Gab members, he was able to tolerate them, perhaps as a christian with a wish to convert and soften. Unfortunately, this proximity to racist views allowed the press, which was already hostile toward Gab and angry with Epik for having kept Gab alive, to caricature Rob unfairly as an antisemite and white nationalist whose free-speech concerns were merely a subterfuge for spreading alt-right propaganda. That is false. As a progressive, my own views are very different from Rob's. But I have always observed Rob to treat others with respect, including muslim employees, jewish board members and colleagues – anyone. Diversity of opinion and background has always been actively welcomed by Rob at Epik.

None of this would have led me to resign were it not for some unfortunate public comments Rob made about the recent New Zealand massacre. Specifically, Rob disseminated a video of the shooting, expressing doubts about its authenticity. Acting as an individual, Rob has every right to share his opinion. And I'm inclined to believe, with Rob, that footage should not be censored everywhere online. But for any CEO to invite such political controversy is unwise. And this particular case was especially damaging for Epik, since we had inherited the Gab scandal after a similar shooting in a Pittsburgh synagogue. So this unnecessary action now linked the Epik brand to 2 massacres targeting minority groups.

Though Rob did not mean to give offense, this incident did bother me. Distrust of the mainstream media might lead someone like Rob to question the received narrative without any ill will toward muslims. And yet, even though Rob himself is as innocent disbelieving this footage as he is disbelieving in the moon landing, narratives dismissive of white nationalist terrorism strike me as insidious. Since Epik has multiple muslim employees and I myself have ties to the muslim community, the casualness with which Rob made these comments struck me as insensitive. One of the memes he shared inside Gab (which was later shown to me) was also insensitive toward muslims, though I must point out that such misconceptions are shared by half the population of the USA. More importantly, Rob shows himself to be tolerant and friendly toward muslims in actual life.

Insensitivity is not intolerance. Rob made a mistake and has already shown a willingness to listen to concerns raised after this scandal by muslims and others. I would not quit based on insensitivity or a mistake. Both can be fixed. Rob has always been open and receptive to input.

Rather, I came to the conclusion that some of the public identifies Epik with Gab and with alt-right politics to such an extent that repositioning Epik as a mainstream brand will be difficult. The abstract principles of registrar neutrality and free speech, which I care about as much as Rob does, are now, in Epik's case, entangled with questions of political ideology. That is to say, the public suspects that free speech has a sinister covert agenda. Disentangling free speech from political views is possible, but the explanations are long and often disbelieved. In practice, most people draw superficial conclusions without fully understanding the circumstances of Epik's involvement with Gab or even the distinction between Rob's personal views and Epik positions.

This recent scandal emerged as a result of my boss's private political views while I was focused on Epik features, products, and services. It is difficult to work effectively under those conditions. It is unclear how I should defend the Epik brand when it is being attacked for private opinions, which I don't share and which have nothing to do with Epik really. The public insists nonsensically that Rob = Epik, and I'm not Rob. Even worse, many seem to think Gab = Rob = Epik, which obligates me to distinguish between Rob's views and the views of racists in Gab, neither of which are mine or Epik's.

Dealing with the scandal has proved to be a distraction from my primary role at Epik, and it interferes with my responsibility to present Epik as a neutral registrar. Also, given Epik's investment in innovative services related to website resiliency and privacy, it is inevitable that controversial websites in the future will cause this current scandal to resurface in the media, which has already written distorted, overtly hostile articles. Given this baggage, I prefer to step down and begin fresh in some other role.

Epik is a good company that I would recommend to anyone seeking a registrar or an employer. I continue to respect Rob for taking a courageous stand against de-platforming and censorship. A registrar's role in fostering free speech online remains dangerously undervalued, and Rob's decisions and motivations deserve more support and understanding from the domain industry. Gab is only 1 domain among hundreds of thousands of domains at Epik. To ensure continuity for Epik customers and staff, I will be staying on at Epik for awhile to complete unfinished tasks and projects, hand over responsibilities, and train my replacements. Epik customers will continue to receive what I genuinely believe is the best support offered by any registrar in the industry. Rob set that standard personally.​
 
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Thanks @MapleDots. When I resigned, it was a private decision that I only discussed after the fact with a few industry colleagues whom I trust. Since 1 of my goals was to prevent unnecessary damage to Epik, I mentioned my resignation here at NamePros in such a way that it would be timestamped but not become a headline or add fuel to the fire.

For a few days, nobody noticed, as intended. But then it got picked up – in part because of something Rob said, as I recall. Still, I'm glad that I did not become a distraction from the real issues. It's not that I'm afraid of exposure. Obviously, I've stepped into a public controversy and willingly taken plenty of flak for explaining "what's going on with Epik and Rob Monster". Nobody asked me to. But I'm not the story, and as "juicy" as a feud or rift between Rob and me would be, that doesn't help build consensus about real issues that needed to be addressed. Even though disagreements about those issues linger and will never be fully resolved, I think "what's going on" is now much clearer to people than it was in the immediate reaction to Rob's tweet about NZ.

3 days after I resigned on March 26, Kevin Murphy of DomainIncite asked me for an on-the-record statement explaining why. Since the cat was already out of the bag, I supplied one. I wrote my answer without consulting with anyone. After sending it, I showed it to Rob so that he'd know what to expect. Evidently Kevin decided not to publish it, which was fine by me.

Later, so many people asked me about the resignation that it would have been handy to point to a public statement. If nothing else, it would have saved me time to point to what I'd already written. Pointing people to a sprawling NamePros thread, full of bickering and tangents, wasn't very useful as a synopsis of why I quit. Meanwhile, explaining that choice repeatedly, from scratch, in a hurry, tends to be sloppy.

People are asking me directly why I resigned. It's a fair question, which I see no legitimate reason to ignore. So, even though I still have misgivings about becoming a hammer that people will use to bash Rob / Epik, I'll answer. Since the statement I wrote earlier was meant for public consumption and written close to the moment of my resignation, it seems like a suitable explanation. Here it is verbatim.

Note: I'm not asking anybody to CARE why I resigned or even to read this. This post only exists because I'm not going to sidestep a direct question.

Question: "You quit?"
Answer:

Yes, it's true that I decided not to continue at Epik. It wasn't an easy choice, since I've had a very positive experience working at the company. I like my colleagues and my boss. The job of running a registrar is interesting. No 2 days are ever alike. Epik products, features, and services are already strong and improving steadily. Customers are happy. In many areas, Epik has been an innovator. Growth opportunities are abundant, and I've enjoyed strategizing for Epik's success.

I wasn't planning to leave at all. There was scandal, it's true, in 2018 when Epik permitted Gab.com to be transferred after the domain was suspended at GoDaddy. We withstood that initial controversy. Within the Gab forum, there is racist content that I consider utterly vile and abhorrent, even dangerous. But I have always taken a hard stance in favor of free speech and advocated for due process and registrar neutrality with respect to legal content. Since my views on de-platforming and censorship coincide with Rob's, it was easy for me to support his decision, once I learned of it, to allow Gab.com to exist in public view. And I still fully support that decision.

The scandal lingered, however. Whereas for me Gab.com was just 1 domain among hundreds of thousands of domains at Epik, a controversial website that repelled me and to which I paid no attention whatsoever, for Rob the Gab forum was more important. With good intentions, Rob engaged actively with Gab members and promoted the site as part of a broader alt-tech / free-speech cause. Rob wants to make the web more open, websites more resilient, and browsing more private. Epik has developed products in those areas. Hence Rob found legitimate common ground with Gab members who distrust Big Brother and who have been exposed to censorship.

Rob being politically and socially conservative, he also found enough overlap with Gab members that he could participate in discussions and share his individual opinions. Even though Rob doesn't share the racism exhibited by some Gab members, he was able to tolerate them, perhaps as a christian with a wish to convert and soften. Unfortunately, this proximity to racist views allowed the press, which was already hostile toward Gab and angry with Epik for having kept Gab alive, to caricature Rob unfairly as an antisemite and white nationalist whose free-speech concerns were merely a subterfuge for spreading alt-right propaganda. That is false. As a progressive, my own views are very different from Rob's. But I have always observed Rob to treat others with respect, including muslim employees, jewish board members and colleagues – anyone. Diversity of opinion and background has always been actively welcomed by Rob at Epik.

None of this would have led me to resign were it not for some unfortunate public comments Rob made about the recent New Zealand massacre. Specifically, Rob disseminated a video of the shooting, expressing doubts about its authenticity. Acting as an individual, Rob has every right to share his opinion. And I'm inclined to believe, with Rob, that footage should not be censored everywhere online. But for any CEO to invite such political controversy is unwise. And this particular case was especially damaging for Epik, since we had inherited the Gab scandal after a similar shooting in a Pittsburgh synagogue. So this unnecessary action now linked the Epik brand to 2 massacres targeting minority groups.

Though Rob did not mean to give offense, this incident did bother me. Distrust of the mainstream media might lead someone like Rob to question the received narrative without any ill will toward muslims. And yet, even though Rob himself is as innocent disbelieving this footage as he is disbelieving in the moon landing, narratives dismissive of white nationalist terrorism strike me as insidious. Since Epik has multiple muslim employees and I myself have ties to the muslim community, the casualness with which Rob made these comments struck me as insensitive. One of the memes he shared inside Gab (which was later shown to me) was also insensitive toward muslims, though I must point out that such misconceptions are shared by half the population of the USA. More importantly, Rob shows himself to be tolerant and friendly toward muslims in actual life.

Insensitivity is not intolerance. Rob made a mistake and has already shown a willingness to listen to concerns raised after this scandal by muslims and others. I would not quit based on insensitivity or a mistake. Both can be fixed. Rob has always been open and receptive to input.

Rather, I came to the conclusion that some of the public identifies Epik with Gab and with alt-right politics to such an extent that repositioning Epik as a mainstream brand will be difficult. The abstract principles of registrar neutrality and free speech, which I care about as much as Rob does, are now, in Epik's case, entangled with questions of political ideology. That is to say, the public suspects that free speech has a sinister covert agenda. Disentangling free speech from political views is possible, but the explanations are long and often disbelieved. In practice, most people draw superficial conclusions without fully understanding the circumstances of Epik's involvement with Gab or even the distinction between Rob's personal views and Epik positions.

This recent scandal emerged as a result of my boss's private political views while I was focused on Epik features, products, and services. It is difficult to work effectively under those conditions. It is unclear how I should defend the Epik brand when it is being attacked for private opinions, which I don't share and which have nothing to do with Epik really. The public insists nonsensically that Rob = Epik, and I'm not Rob. Even worse, many seem to think Gab = Rob = Epik, which obligates me to distinguish between Rob's views and the views of racists in Gab, neither of which are mine or Epik's.

Dealing with the scandal has proved to be a distraction from my primary role at Epik, and it interferes with my responsibility to present Epik as a neutral registrar. Also, given Epik's investment in innovative services related to website resiliency and privacy, it is inevitable that controversial websites in the future will cause this current scandal to resurface in the media, which has already written distorted, overtly hostile articles. Given this baggage, I prefer to step down and begin fresh in some other role.

Epik is a good company that I would recommend to anyone seeking a registrar or an employer. I continue to respect Rob for taking a courageous stand against de-platforming and censorship. A registrar's role in fostering free speech online remains dangerously undervalued, and Rob's decisions and motivations deserve more support and understanding from the domain industry. Gab is only 1 domain among hundreds of thousands of domains at Epik. To ensure continuity for Epik customers and staff, I will be staying on at Epik for awhile to complete unfinished tasks and projects, hand over responsibilities, and train my replacements. Epik customers will continue to receive what I genuinely believe is the best support offered by any registrar in the industry. Rob set that standard personally.​
I respect and honor your decision. It is your right. However, I have to fundamentally disgree with your interpretation of the events described as a "scandal."

I find using the word "scandal" is unwarranted. Completely unfair and unjust. There was no immoral or illegal activity as you describe when using the word "scandal."

Using the word "scandal" is not only unfair to Rob, but to all of those with different and opposing views.

For clarity, here is the definition of "scandal":

scan·dal
/ˈskandl/
noun
  1. an action or event regarded as morally or legally wrong and causing general public outrage.
    "a bribery scandal involving one of his key supporters"
    synonyms: outrageous wrongdoing, outrageous behavior, immoral behavior, unethical behavior, discreditable behavior, shocking incident/series of events,
 
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I find using the word "scandal" is unwarranted. Completely unfair and unjust.

No. "Scandal" is a neutral description, which is precisely accurate in this case.

There was no immoral or illegal activity as you describe when using the word "scandal."

Saying that something is a "scandal" does not imply that it is immoral or illegal – only that many people regard it that way. It's in the definition you quoted:

regarded as morally or legally wrong

Undeniably, many people have judged Rob / Epik in that way. They have said so here at NamePros. Undeniably, there was "general public outrage" following the Gab.com transfer and also following the tweet about NZ. Members of the general public complained to Epik customer support staff.

That's a scandal. Saying so is not a judgment about morality. It's just a description of people's reactions.
 
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No. "Scandal" is a neutral description, which is precisely accurate in this case.



Saying that something is a "scandal" does not imply that it is immoral or illegal – only that many people regard it that way. It's in the definition you quoted:



Undeniably, many people have judged Rob / Epik in that way. They have said so here at NamePros. Undeniably, there was "general public outrage" following the Gab.com transfer and also following the tweet about NZ. Members of the general public complained to Epik customer support staff.

That's a scandal. Saying so is not a judgment about morality. It's just a description of people's reactions.
I won't deny there was public outrage, but the circumstances had nothing to do with moral or legal reasons. Again, using the term "scandal" because of different opinions and misinterpretations is completely unfair to many.

If I disagreed with your views and called it a "scandal" while creating public outrage I am confident you would see it differently.

Best to you!
 
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I believe semantics have little or nothing to do with this thread. If we are going to agree or disagree on something, let's focus on the actual argument itself.
 
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@Internet.Domains

Members of the public were calling Rob a "monster" and a Nazi and calling for everyone in the industry to boycott Epik. If that reaction isn't a scandal, then I don't know what is.
 
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@Internet.Domains

Members of the public were calling Rob a "monster" and a Nazi and calling for everyone in the industry to boycott Epik. If that reaction isn't a scandal, then I don't know what is.
They can say and call someone anything they want. Although, that doesn't constitute a scandal. The subjects behavior would need to be morally or legally wrong which then causes public outrage. Again, by calling it a "scandal" you are unfairly labeling the subject with behavior that is immoral and/or illegal. This is extremely unfair with this situation and sets a bad precedant.
 
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Again, by calling it a "scandal" you are unfairly labeling the subject with behavior that is immoral and/or illegal.

No. You have misunderstood the meaning of the word "scandal".
 
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No. You have misunderstood the meaning of the word "scandal".
I disagree. Please don't call this disagreement a "scandal" as you seem to be calling different opinions a "scandal."
 
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They can say and call someone anything they want. Although, that doesn't constitute a scandal. The subjects behavior would need to be morally or legally wrong which then causes public outrage. Again, by calling it a "scandal" you are unfairly labeling the subject with behavior that is immoral and/or illegal. This is extremely unfair with this situation and sets a bad precedant.

I will agree here. There was an outrage. And to some, the action of challenging a narrative is scandalous. I stand firmly by the notion that humanity has been tremendously deceived, and that free speech is the only true antidote to the propaganda that has enabled it, and now wants to sear minds once and for all. I am also confident that some people have been woken from their normalcy bias from this thread which is why it was worth it to me to engage thoughtfully and tolerate vitriol from those whose minds are already seared.

upload_2019-4-16_12-58-50.png
 
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I disagree. Please don't call this disagreement a "scandal" as you seem to be calling different opinions a "scandal."

You are disregarding the dictionary definition and common usage of a basic English word and insisting it means something entirely different. So communication will be impossible.
 
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@Internet.Domains

Please study the dictionary entry I linked to earlier:

https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/scandal

All 3 examples conform to my usage of the word "scandal":
  1. The outrage or anger caused by a scandalous action or event.
    ‘divorce was cause for scandal in the island’

  2. Rumour or malicious gossip about scandalous events or actions.
    ‘I know that you would want no scandal attached to her name’

  3. A state of affairs regarded as wrong or reprehensible and causing general public outrage or anger.
    ‘it's a scandal that many older patients are dismissed as untreatable’
 
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Come on, get with the program
if you don't match internet.domains rating for scandalousness of an event, it is nNOT a scandal
He says someone has to do something morally or legally wrong, and he does not believe anything morally wrong done, so it is settled
Thanks for understanding
 
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@Internet.Domains

Please study the dictionary entry I linked to earlier:

https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/scandal

All 3 examples conform to my usage of the word "scandal":
  1. The outrage or anger caused by a scandalous action or event.
    ‘divorce was cause for scandal in the island’

  2. Rumour or malicious gossip about scandalous events or actions.
    ‘I know that you would want no scandal attached to her name’

  3. A state of affairs regarded as wrong or reprehensible and causing general public outrage or anger.
    ‘it's a scandal that many older patients are dismissed as untreatable’
When I clicked the link you provided the first use for scandal is:

"1. An action or event regarded as morally or legally wrong and causing general public outrage."

To be classified properly and not unjustly a scandal needs both immoral behavior AND public outrage.

So far in this thread there is only one of two needed to be fairly called a scandal.

By creating your own definition for a term that includes moral and/or legal behavior you are unjustly accusing.
 
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Pretty sure this whole thread was about the morality of it, and people disagreed
Then here at the end, you say "Duh it was morally fine" as if you're the arbiter of all things
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
 
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