Offering .com domain to an established ccTLD domain? Good or bad move?

[Fuadiansyah]

What is the chance to succesfuly sell .com domain to an established company who currently has ccTLD domain such as co.uk? Or is this UDRP dangerous move?

Story behind this, I've found expiring domain on GoDaddy Expired Auction that has exact word .com of an established retail company in my country. Their current domain is co.id. After checking WIPO for trademark, their date of registration of TM is 2010, where the .com domain registered in 2001.

If I intend to acquired this domain and offered to them, is this a good or UDRP dangerous move?

 

[Fuadiansyah]

There are no absolutes, people like to speak in them because it makes them feel good and or safe.

If the name is CoconutWater.com and you see CoconutWater.co.id in your country of Indonesia being advertised, well there are a few outcomes.

You don't have to worry going in that you are acting in bad faith, you have a generic name that is a real thing, plenty of other extensions and businesses might be using this keyword combination. You contacted the co.id owner first because they are in the same country as you.

They could buy it from you or simply decline because they don't plan on expanding outside of Indonesia.

If the name of the company is Ragozozo.co.id well that's a different story, more than likely you have registered that name in bad faith, it is an invented name with no generic meaning, you registered it or purchased on GoDaddy auctions simply because of the co.id company.

If you price it at $500 to $1,000 looking for a quick score, knowing full well no one else on this planet of 7 billion wants the domain name. Maybe they buy it, it's cheaper than a UDRP.

They don't need it and politely tell you no thank you.

You piss them off and they file a UDRP or worse file under the ACPA seeking $100,000 just to make an example out of you.

The truth is, you don't know what someone will do. The second truth is that you don't know what an arbitrator will do, most in the second example will look at you as a bad faith actor.

I believe if you feel you must pitch it, then you pitch it for a very reasonable price, $500 and look at it as found money.

The registration date means little in a UDRP, arbitrators look at when you acquired it. The days of "Pay me because your tm is in 2010 but this name was registered in 1999, even though I acquired it in 2014." are over.

Again IMO

So, it's too much gambling here in this case and gambling need much much luck...
And gambling also prohibited in my religious faith. So ya, it's better to leave it than execute it...

 

[HKIBC]

So, it's too much gambling here in this case and gambling need much much luck...
And gambling also prohibited in my religious faith. So ya, it's better to leave it than execute it...

Given such an orthodox interpretation of the principle, perhaps you should reconsider domaining, or any other business venture for that matter. Any business is a big gamble. Good thing, too, otherwise everyone would be a business owner, with nobody left over to employ

Back on topic...

Why? I don't spoil any specific name...
It can also be a lesson or advice if there is someone who have similar plan....

Sure. Except for not too many UDRP complaints - should it come to that - initiated by .co.id domain holders, who might or might not employ a good lawyer. Right or wrong, discretion is paramount when contemplating sailing close to the wind, that's all

 

[Fuadiansyah]

Given such an orthodox interpretation of the principle, perhaps you should reconsider domaining, or any other business venture for that matter. Any business is a big gamble. Good thing, too, otherwise everyone would be a business owner, with nobody left over to employ

Back on topic...

Sure. Except for not too many UDRP complaints - should it come to that - initiated by .co.id domain holders, who might or might not employ a good lawyer. Right or wrong, discretion is paramount when contemplating sailing close to the wind, that's all

As long as the "gambling" has benefit to other people such as doing a kosher business, it's OK, include domaining. In domaining we give idea and help people choose the brand for their business somehow, which is good.
In case of this UDRP matter, I think it's more like gambling in narrower term with "pure-luck" such as poker or casino which is the prohibited one.

OK back to topic. Honestly, I rarely heard any case regarding UDRP in my country. Local company is just like don't give any concern about domaining. I also doubt any lawyer here have any knowledge about domaining.

The only one case that I know is BMW case which is global company. Someone here just acquired BMW.id, it's the abbreviation of his name, Benny Muliawan Wahyudi. He use that domain just for emailing purpose and BMW filed claim against him....

 

[d-e-x]

So, now you have the .COM. What will you do with the name? Just wait for them to approach you after they start to think about doing business more globally or try to approach and reach for them?

Nope, I will wait. When they come to me (if) they are mine.

 

[d-e-x]

Many domainers get this thing about TM wrong. It is not that scary
Every "old Domainer" will go for .COM if ccTLD or nGTLD is taken and protected, this is not a gambling - this is business
There is 2 kind of Domainers - flippers and investors. If you are Domain investor than you invest in bunch domains and wait, wait.... thats why we are Domain investors

 

[Fuadiansyah]

Many domainers get this thing about TM wrong. It is not that scary
Every "old Domainer" will go for .COM if ccTLD or nGTLD is taken and protected, this is not a gambling - this is business
There is 2 kind of Domainers - flippers and investors. If you are Domain investor than you invest in bunch domains and wait, wait.... thats why we are Domain investors

Interesting, so what if the company approach but not to buy the domain, instead filed UDRP...
So, just give and transfer them the name? Is that it?
I have this friend who has completed her law master degree. I think I need to ask her about this...

 

[d-e-x]

First of all, I don't encourage any of you to invest in TMs - that is forbidden
Second, if you got some TM name buy accident (it happeneds ) don't be afraid, there is a legal procedure. First you get CDL by mail, than you got real Letter... enough time to decide what next.
There is many examples where people loose their domains for nothing, only because they was afraid.
What if some Domainer want your domain and he send you CDL via email? Or some another scammer ? You will transfer your domain to him without checking? No, always check and wait for old fashion paper Letter with all Insignias etc.

 

[Fuadiansyah]

First of all, I don't encourage any of you to invest in TMs - that is forbidden
Second, if you got some TM name buy accident (it happeneds ) don't be afraid, there is a legal procedure. First you get CDL by mail, than you got real Letter... enough time to decide what next.
There is many examples where people loose their domains for nothing, only because they was afraid.
What if some Domainer want your domain and he send you CDL via email? Or some another scammer ? You will transfer your domain to him without checking? No, always check and wait for old fashion paper Letter with all Insignias etc.

OK, What is CDL btw? I am not used to many terms here...

 

[d-e-x]

OK, What is CDL btw? I am not used to many terms here...

cease desist letter

 

[HKIBC]

First of all, I don't encourage any of you to invest in TMs - that is forbidden

Forbidden? Where are you from, North Korea?
TM's are like, hmmm... sacred cows... in India only. Elsewhere, they're, well, beef! This is to say, a TM is limited by jurisdiction and Class it's registered in. Newsflash: there are 200+ jurisdictions plus 45 TM Classes! A wee bit wriggle room for... domaining, I should think

Second, if you got some TM name buy accident (it happeneds ) don't be afraid, there is a legal procedure. First you get CDL by mail, than you got real Letter... enough time to decide what next.
There is many examples where people loose their domains for nothing, only because they was afraid.
What if some Domainer want your domain and he send you CDL via email? Or some another scammer ? You will transfer your domain to him without checking? No, always check and wait for old fashion paper Letter with all Insignias etc.

Great advice!