status-resolved Now Escrow Fees MUST ALWAYS be paid by Seller in NP sales threads?

[SlimPickins]

i just got an "update" via PM that posting in a sales thread that "escrow fees are to be paid by BUYER" (or even split) is a violation of Namepros rules: https://www.namepros.com/threads/official-rules-of-namepros.848752/#section-060107

I KNEW that we had clarified that PAYPAL fees could NOT be passed onto the buyer since is a violation of Paypal terms itself, but I find that stripping out a BUILT IN part of basically EVERY escrow service, ie the option to choose whether buyer, seller or both pay the fees, is a really unfortunate blanket solution on "transaction fees".

And, one that apparently is NOT common knowledge since there are SEVERAL threads where the seller states "escrow fees paid by buyer"....

Thoughts on this?

I will update my thread to put fees on seller but I really do not see why a issue that is the result of PAYPAL's policies should be applied to an unrelated service like escrow.....

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Answer: https://www.namepros.com/posts/5239708/

 

[S-B]

Their response will be: "build it into your price."

 

[cocaseco]

I don't understand it either. IMO escrow fees are an important and NEGOTIABLE part of the transaction. It is something you can give to the buyer, or hold back, that has a higher perceived value than actual. I typically don't even mention the issue until I have an offer as who pays becomes part of my counter.

 

[SlimPickins]

yup.... yet one of the "perks" of putting fees on buyer when using escrow is that it allows the buyer flexibility in whether to pay with wire transfer or use credit card/paypal at a higher fee to them. That can be a big difference in fee amount for the seller to absorb.

 

[Dylan Andersen]

agreed. Doesn't make sense

 

[Asfas1000]

I agree..

And I believe, if the sale does not complete, the party who is responsible for the escrow fees, must pay, regardless of who is to blame for the failed sale ?

 

[Keith]

The remedy...don't sell your domains here. Plenty of other ways to find buyers!

 

[SlimPickins]

The remedy...don't sell your domains here. Plenty of other ways to find buyers!

That would, similar to this "transaction fees" solution, be throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

Or maybe your solution

Payment via escrow.com. Fees will be discussed upon offers.

is the way to go as long as there is no BIN price actually posted in the thread to be nailed to by a buyer...

 

[Michelle]

There is a thread already about this let me link you

https://www.namepros.com/threads/buyers-do-not-pay-any-fees.891402/

One more: https://www.namepros.com/threads/who-pays-the-fees.891393/

 

[SlimPickins]

yes, i read that thread and it seemed at least to me to still be focused on PAYPAL fees, which was an issue since it is against paypal TOS to tack on fees.... but with the "update" it now applies to ALL transaction fees, including escrow, which seems over the top and counter-intuitive given that assigning fees to buyer or seller is built into the escrow process. I can understand that it must be clearly POSTED who would have to pay fees but barring sellers from sharing or putting fees on buyer seems like lumping escrow and paypal together although adding fees for buyer is a violation only for the latter.....

Seems like we have a bunch of threads lately with people saying that the buyer pays fees. That is against Namepros and Paypal rules, trying to enforce that will result in your sales threads being closed.

If someone pms you that you need to pay fees report immediately to @Eric Lyon and a mod.

Namepros Marketplace in place for over a decade:

6.1.7. Per PayPal TOS, all transactions must have fees charged to the receiver of funds by default. One is not allowed to avoid taxes by asking for payment in the form of a gift. Sellers must either willingly accept fees or clearly include them in the price.

UPDATE:
6.1.7. Sellers are responsible for paying all transaction fees.{/QUOTE]

 

[Obtain Domains]

I am now fighting the same battle. Little ridiculous if you ask me. Paypal makes sense, not escrow.com. Especially when the buyer has the option of paying by wire (lower fees) or CC (higher fees); which is something I, as the seller, do not control. It is hard to "build it into your price" if you dont know what to build in. Do you say "add XXX to your payment if you choose to use a CC, not wire the money" That is unworkable.

Bottom line, I will not be able to accept escrow.com anymore for marketplace listing, which effectively makes NamePros a small transaction marketplace. Disappointing.

I have asked for an explanation or rationale. Am still waiting (but it has only been a few hours). Still, why the change, seems crazy. I always provide the option of using PP or escrow, but because escrow is more expensive, you pay fees. I am not the only one doing this.

 

[forge]

The "rules" aren't being enforced and in fact ultimately CANNOT be enforced IMO, which makes the published rules on fees doubly frustrating.

 

[Obtain Domains]

Well, I (re) read the thread referred to above. Seems pretty clearly to only have to do with Paypal fees. Escrow.com fees are discussed and the mods said nothing about.

"I don't find the rule ridiculous. It is the risk of selling a domain at the auction. When we speak about Escrow, we know the transaction is big, and the buyer, in most cases, is the end-user who needs the domain badly. However, even Escrow offers the possibility to split the fee or be paid by either seller or buyer.
But, when we speak about Paypal, we are almost sure both the buyer and the seller are resellers. So, when the seller wants to sell the domain, he has to take the risk and responsibility for the fee."

In fact, the actual tag for the thread is "PayPal fees"

I dont care what the rule is, just want some clarification so I can conduct business. There is no way I am selling a $200 domain via escrow when the Buyer can chose to pay by CC and I am on the hook for another $300 in transaction fees. I wonder if they have thought this through.

 

[cocaseco]

I dont care what the rule is, just want some clarification so I can conduct business. There is no way I am selling a $200 domain via escrow when the Buyer can chose to pay by CC and I am on the hook for another $300 in transaction fees. I wonder if they have thought this through.

Can you explain to me how this scenario is possible? The Escrow.COM fees on this $200 sale would be approximately $25? What am I missing?

 

[Obtain Domains]

More on this. Seems Eric Lyon agrees that fees can be shifted, but must be disclosed:

@EricLyon Not all processors charge the same fee. I think that it would be adequate to state the payment method and next to it something like "Buyer pays fee's" or "Winner pays fee's" . Other than that, you'll need to reference the payment method source (Escrow.com, Paypal, etc.) to get updated on their current fee structure and rules to make sure you are complying with them.

As stated before, NamePros can only enforce it's own rules and is not authorized to enforce anyone elses terms of use. That is between the buyer and the seller to work out.

This is different from what is being enforced now.

 

[Obtain Domains]

Can you explain to me how this scenario is possible? The Escrow.COM fees on this $200 sale would be approximately $25? What am I missing?

You are correct. I have only used escrow.com on large transactions, so have had premier service in the $150-$300 range. After checking their fee calculator for a $200 transaction, I agree with you. I normally would check things out before I post, but am fired up about this one, so my fingers were moving faster than my brain.

Regardless, personally I am not paying 12% in transaction fees ($25 on a $200 sale) for a similar small sale.

 

[SlimPickins]

i can accept and respect it as a decision made for the sake of the community if need be, but other than the sake of simplicity I don't see the necessity to make a blanket rule on transaction fees unless it is a situation where remaining silent on it could be possibly construed as condoning or even enabling the violation of another companies tos like could be the case regarding paypal.

i was just surprised that it applies to escrow and wanted to bring it up for discussion. For me personally it won't change anything dramatically, except probably to be more inclined to list more expensive domains or packages as make offer instead of fixed price threads. but, then again, even doing that and leaving the payment details to pms would still effectively be breaking the rule if a deal was reached where buyer pays the escrow fee or even some, regardless of whether that was the sellers choice of terms or the result of a buyer making their " best offer + fees" and the seller accepts... it may not be out in the open, or even an actual violation of the transaction providers tos but it is nonetheless skirting a np rule, and so basically removes it from the negotiating table. So, I can live with it and will roll escrow fees into the prices.

I really appreciate the job mods and team do here and know they have to make choices they feel are in the best interests of the community. If this is something that can be further discussed and/or modified that is great. If is best to keep like it is now that is alright too.

 

[Obtain Domains]

I really appreciate the job mods and team do here and know they have to make choices they feel are in the best interests of the community. If this is something that can be further discussed and/or modified that is great. If is best to keep like it is now that is alright too.

I do too, and don't mean for them to take offense. Just need some clarification because it will change the way I do business here. For now, escrow is no longer an option for me at NamePros - at least for auctions

 

[johname]

The "rules" aren't being enforced and in fact ultimately CANNOT be enforced IMO, which makes the published rules on fees doubly frustrating.

They can be enforced on the back end, banned from selling on NP.

This is about:

a) The forum rules needs it to be the same for all transactions. This helps mods too.

b) Like ebay where the buyer protection comes first, NP is following that path.

c) Seller, if just pushing the domain to the other member after getting paid not good enough, then tack on escrow fee to the price.

Example. This rule protects the guy that buys a name for $5 and the sellers says 'You have to pay the escrow fee on Escrow.com because you live in a certain place or your trader rating not high enough, or you just joined NP" All of a sudden a $5 domain is a $30 domain. Not too buyer friendly (ebay)

 

[iowadawg]

I find this amusing.
Domainers excited about a few dollars.
Way I see it, if you do not like the rules here, then leave and go where you believe the rules are better just for you.