Dan.com

warning I lose $42,000 on an escrow.com transaction as pdd.com, help please.

NameSilo

American

Established Member
Impact
43
Hi,
I bought pdd.com via escrow.com and the seller took the domain back on networksolutions.com after he received the money $42,000 US dollar.

for detailed information, please view http://www.drjw.com/

Any suggestions about what I can do is welcome, thank you!

If you know a lawyer who is an expert in online domain name disputes, please tell me his/her contact information, thank you very much!
 
17 0
•••
The views expressed on this page by users and staff are their own, not those of NamePros.

Name Trader

formerly @stubTop Contributor
Impact
11,262
OK I edited (deleted) this post. I thought I had read this post. But when I clicked on the link, I was put on the first page for some reason. This conversation has gone way beyond anything I could add.
 
Last edited:
Impact
4,727
How does the seller take the domain back after you got it in your account??

That shouldn't be possible. If that's possible then no one would use that registrar.
 

Daehler Ralph

Established Member
Impact
95
similar story happened to me with the domain cwr.com. i tell everybody. NEVER BUY A DOMAIN WITH NETWORKSOLUTION REGISTRAR. i have found a lot of awful stories of thousands of accounts hacked and buying hacked accounts and so on. i have transfered all my domains to godaddy now
 
Last edited:

EASYPICKINGS

Established Member
Impact
115

ben pedri

Top Contributor
Impact
1,296
Hi,
I bought pdd.com via escrow.com and the seller took the domain back on networksolutions.com after he received the money $42,000 US dollar.

for detailed information, please view http://www.drjw.com/
lawyer
Any suggestions about what I can do is welcome, thank you!

If you know a lawyer who is an expert in online domain name disputes, please tell me his/her contact information, thank you very much!
Your link goes to a blank page ,so it seems like this is BS to me if not why not just get in touch with verisign ,if you have the proof of sale you don't need a lawyer , the domain was not drugged and taken out of the country its sitting in a computer at verisign. Start there they have been excellent for me in the past with some issues ive had good luck
 

Daehler Ralph

Established Member
Impact
95
great. but the base problem of all is that everybody can backtransfer a domain on registrars like network solutions to their accounts monthes later. every sales plattform should have to block a sale from this registrars or to transfer to a serious registrar and waiting till the registrar lock is over. but sales plattforms like sedo are not interested in that.
 
Last edited:
Impact
16,121
Impact
930
Tags
2960125 Watch tag
Congratulations! If you made it this far, like me, you've wasted a lot of time you will never get back or be paid for.

However, to make it a little worthwhile, I have collected a few quotes which might, at least, be of help to you in the future...

In the last year, I have seen the most amazingly incompetent things done at Escrow.com.

Having seen a number of instances of this sort of thing since you left, Brandon, I would suggest that practices have changed markedly.

Twice in the last year, I have seen instances in which Escrow.com falsely confirmed receipt of funds and then, to cover up their error, started flinging bizarre accusations at others.

Here's a real beauty, and I apologize for the digression, but people should know what kind of outfit Escrow.com has become.

The scenario is that the parties set up a payment transaction with Escrow.com. Escrow.com then confirmed receipt of payment In reliance on Escrow.com's confirmation, the domain name is transferred.

Then, a month later Escrow.com realizes they screwed up, so they actually send this to the registrar (and see my comments after):

----------------------------------
Dear Sir/Madam,

RE: STOLEN DOMAIN NAME - XXX

We refer to the domain name XXX which Mr XXX has had in his possession since XXX, 2017 and understand that you are the registrar for that domain name.

Mr XXX still has an outstanding amount of $1,594.50 owed by him to our company, Escrow.com <http://Escrow.com> (“Escrow”).

We have tried to contact Mr XXX multiple times by way of several email addresses and a telephone number. All attempts have been unsuccessful.

Mr XXX is in possession of this domain name, not having paid for it. Mr XXX must pay this amount immediately or we will be forced to commence legal proceedings and/or contact the relevant governing authorities to recover the outstanding amount of $1,594.50.

We ask that you please lock XXX until Mr XXX pays Escrow the outstanding amount.

We look forward to hearing from you.

If you have any queries, please do not hesitate to contact us.

Yours Faithfully,

Syan Olsen.


--
Syan Olsen
In-house Legal Counsel

Level 20,
680 George Street
Sydney, NSW 2000
Australia

-------------------------------------

The operative question here is if Mr. XXX didn't pay escrow.com, then how does he have the domain name?

This was Escrow.com transaction ID #2960125 should Ms Olsen ever decide to respond to my reply to her ridiculous email (which was sent to a party that was neither the registrar, buyer or seller in the actual transaction).

What Ms. Olsen neglected to mention in any of this was that on Mar-17-2017 in that transaction, Escrow.com confirmed receipt of the buyer's payment. A month later they go claiming that the domain name was stolen because they didn't receive payment.

From the "you have one job" department, you might think, and I'm pretty sure the California Financial Code Section 17414 assumes, that the business of a licensed escrow company is to accurately confirm whether they have been paid or not, before they issue a confirmation of payment.

No, Ms. Olsen, as an escrow provider, you do not "confirm receipt of payment" to the parties to a transaction, then a month later realize you didn't get it, or else you lost it among your other interesting accounting oddities, and claim that the name was "stolen" as a consequence of the parties' reliance on you to do the only job you had.

I mean, just take a look at Olsen's email, and construct in your mind a set of facts under which (a) someone would have taken possession of a domain name before Escrow.com got paid, and (b) anyone in their right mind, let alone Godaddy (to whom the email was directed) would give two sh*ts about an email from an Australian lawyer making unverified claims over threatened "legal action" for an amount of $1,594.50.

I suppose the reaction by GoDaddy was supposed to be "Oh, gollly, an escrow company screwed up their job. We'll get on this one right away!"

But Escrow.com has a curious definition of "stolen":

1. Parties agree on terms at Escrow.com.
2. Escrow.com confirms receipt of payment.
3. Parties transfer name.
4. A month later Escrow.com changes its mind, decides they weren't paid at step 2.

No, that's not "stolen", that's monumental incompetence and a violation of California law by Escrow.com.

What's truly amazing to me from the "your job, do you know how to do it" department, is that Escrow.com screwed up in the amount of $1500 and some change. Instead of eating their mistake, they decide to advertise their incompetence to others, on the assumption that losing $1500 is somehow worse than sending an email saying "We don't know what we're doing." (and on top of that, copying the email to someone who wasn't even involved with registration or transfer of the domain name)

This thread is kind of eye-opening to me, as I was unaware of the pervasive naivete among many members of this forum on how things can go wrong, or what sorts of things might be useful when things do go wrong. If anything, I guess part of that is the way that Escrow.com markets its service, which may convey a broader impression of security than many people believe.

Escrow.com has a very narrow job. Their marketing probably makes people think that they are immune from being scammed through them. You are not immune from that. Escrow.com has no duty or obligation to look at the history of the name, whether or not the domain data and their seller payment data make any sense, or the numerous other warning signs that were obviously present here. Escrow.com is not going to inform you of these kinds of things either, because it detracts from the impression they are trying to convey, in order to get a fee out of you.

Hi John,
Escrow.com takes the confidentiality of customer data extremely seriously and will not release another customer's data based on accusations but does comply with requests from law enforcement.

Our Chinese language support team is in touch with the buyer and assisting, by no means would we ignore a customer or their requests because their transaction has closed.

Jackson Elsegood

And, yes, your Chinese language support team is assisting the buyer in understanding that the buyer is well and truly screwed.

I am certain that your Chinese language support team has informed the OP that they can file a lawsuit and subpoena the information from you. Yes?

As for "requests from law enforcement" I suppose you will also clue in the OP as to the FBI's monetary threshold of "we don't care", which is well in excess of $42,000.

Escrow.com did not check its own bank account to see if they had received the money,

Escrow.com did everything they were supposed to do here, within the limit of their contractual obligation. I like to give Jackson a hard time to keep him on his toes, but neither he, nor Escrow.com are obligated to do diddly-squat. That's where the "legal" part of this picture begins and ends. I participate here for free, and I just want to make sure that if Jackson is reading Namepros while getting paid, he has to earn it.

In other words, you were dishonest and lied to Escrow.com about who you are, and you expect... what?

Just a quick story form the "wayback" machine you might find interesting and not an implication that this couldn't/wouldn't have happened on my watch. And please understand I do not know anything about the current policies and management accountability at the company since it has been over two years since my departure.

We had a transaction in late 2015 just prior to freelancer taking over. It was a three letter .com selling for $48,000. At the time all transactions over $15,000 had to be reviewed by my before funds were released. Sandra Gordon came to me with a concern over a transaction. Buyer and seller had passed KYC requirements and the domain had been transferred to the buyer who accepted it, our job was done once we paid the seller. But the seller was from Tennessee and the funds were being sent to eastern Europe. It didn't pass the smell test. Looking further I found the domain was actively being used as a redirect by a company in Tennessee. I called the company at the number on the website, explained I was the president of escrow.com calling about the sale of their domain. The woman that answered the phone listened patiently and said the domain wasn't for sale and hung up. I called back a second time and asked to speak to a manager. After explaining the situation again I got the same response and click. The letter .coms were very hot back then and they must have been getting a lot of calls. The third time I called before I could say anything the reply was "The domain is not for sale", click. Now at this point it was more of a challenge and I was getting pissed. On the website there were contact emails and I sent a very detailed email to everyone I could find. Within fifteen minutes I received a call from the CIO who confirmed my suspicions, their account had been hacked. In the end the domain was transferred back to the owner and the funds were returned to the buyer. I received a very nice letter from the CEO of the company that was later shared with me.

I do want to conclude by saying that it is not the responsibility of the escrow company to do the due diligence for the buyer. If you know the deal is too good to be true stay away from it, regardless of whether of not you are using an escrow company.
 

barman

Top Contributor
Impact
1,480
Damnit i read this whole thread ... should've just skipped to the end. Berry Hill's comments were good though.
 

Chris Hydrick

Top Contributor
Impact
10,105
VDG.com sells via sedo auction.10 bids. USA Seller. 2017 sedo creation date.
94697_1b3c81e6969128f3335380a589c2feb8.png


A month later Patrick offers OP VDG.com for $16k...

94696_0c3b8c72fcb2c8968431353327266286.png


On or around 7 Jan 2018 -- VDG.com WHOIS updates to LWCRST MRKTNG. VDG.com transfers out of NetSol, and into GoDaddy

Looks like a UDRP was filed about a year after the above quoted post.

Date: January 25, 2019

https://www.wipo.int/amc/en/domains/search/text.jsp?case=D2018-2236

Van der Graaf Inc. v. Privacydotlink Customer 3564326 / DUBAI DOMAINS
Case No. D2018-2236 [VDG.com]


The Respondent maintains that it is Lowcrest Marketing Ltd. d/b/a Dubai Domains, and that it paid 14,600 US dollars to acquire the disputed domain name on December 22, 2017

The Complainant also raises the question ... why Lowcrest Marketing LTD was able to purchase the disputed domain name in December 2017 for only 14,600 US Dollars, when the seller had acquired it only two months before for 19,500 US Dollars.

The Respondent has submitted evidence that Mr. Kalfayan has paid to Afternic an amount equal to the purchase price for the disputed domain name, reflected in the Afternic purchase receipt dated December 22, 2017.

Decision the Complaint is denied
 

Attachments

  • upload_2019-12-10_7-12-29.png
    upload_2019-12-10_7-12-29.png
    12.3 KB · Views: 102
Last edited:
Impact
16,121

slaich

Established Member
Impact
21
Read this post for the first time. Sorry to hear buyer lost USD 42,000 buying PDD.

I read upto 3 pages. In the gist have the buyer got the Domain Name or he got the payment refunded?
 
Impact
16,121
Its really astonishing to read such story happened long time ago...
Hi 672,

Welcome to NamePros. :)
It is astonishing, isnt it?

Did check out the entire thread?
Its a good one.
Pay special attention to @jberryhill 's posts.
Who do you think was at fault?

Ever hear of something like this before?

Again, Welcome to Np. Hope to see you on the boards.

Peace,
Kenny
 
Last edited:

672com

Established Member
Impact
13
Hi 672,

Welcome to NamePros. :)
It is astonishing, isnt it?

Did check out the entire thread?
Its a good one.
Pay special attention to @jberryhill 's posts.
Who do you think was at fault?

Ever hear of something like this before?

Again, Welcome to Np. Hope to see you on the boards.

Peace,
Kenny
Hi Kenny, thanks very much for greetings! especially to someone newbie here like me.

I spent around 2 hours to read every details of this thread from page 1 to page 14, based on my previous impression, both Escrow.com and NS are supposedly quite trustable and safe place to transact. if there is no such major breach or loophole being utilized , the victim 'Americans' would not have been trapped. Really can not figure out who really at fault as I did not see full pictures.
 

LoveCatchyDomains

Top Contributor
Impact
1,264
One simple question comes from this experience.
If using the Escrow.com concierge service, is it far less likely for something like this to happen. And even if a fraudulent domain does slip through, would their extra services provide protection for the buyer?
There are many pages to this story, but the basic fact was that escrow.com was used, without the concierge services. I'm curious whether this could have eliminated the problem.
 

672com

Established Member
Impact
13
One simple question comes from this experience.
If using the Escrow.com concierge service, is it far less likely for something like this to happen. And even if a fraudulent domain does slip through, would their extra services provide protection for the buyer?
There are many pages to this story, but the basic fact was that escrow.com was used, without the concierge services. I'm curious whether this could have eliminated the problem.
Agree concierge service is the key to prevent such from happening.