Dynadot

strategy How to Find Potential End Users?

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Hi,

Do any of you has regularly sell your domain to end users? If so, do you mind share with me in this thread on how find potential end users for your domain?

Regards,
Sjarief
 
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The views expressed on this page by users and staff are their own, not those of NamePros.
Hey guys - new here. I managed to read through this whole thread (or most of it anyway). Crazy! Amazing information which so many of you are willing to give out which is great. I have been dealing with domains for maybe two months now just basically getting little bits of money from parking. Not much at all. I am a full time college student, have my photography business which I do part time, and work as well. I am ready to try my hand at selling to end-users. Why not give it a shot, right?

So I took down all the resources which were mentioned in this thread and started doing some research. I managed to find 3-4 two word .com domains on NameJet which when searched via google come up with a business who either has the .net variant or some weird ending on it. ex : (xxxxxx2001.com)

Other then that I do not see many businesses at all with two keywords specifically in their domain name. So, what I did was search on Manta.com using the two word domain as the search. Quite a few businesses came up - some of them either came up with the keywords in their actual business name or these keywords described what their business does.

Are these legitimate businesses to send out emails to? Of course, the other concern is that most DO NOT include a web address and hunting them down can be tough.

As well - as Joshua suggested I am using my university .edu email address. Do you think this is the best move to show credibility? As stated above I am also a photographer, own my own website under my name and am heavily into social networking sites, etc. When searching for my name you get quite a few results with pages directing to me, my picture and what not. Do you think this could help or hinder me?

Again - thank you guys for everything. I have soaked up so much information and hopefully I will be able to be posting up what is working for me very soon!
 
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Nattydomain said:
I would agree.. I have MANY "101" style domains that are a PERFECT fit for any college or school but they dont even bother with .com as the .edu is the standard for most any course. Hitting a big company is ok but just dont expect a reply as it may get lost. If NASA or any "major" company wanted your domain they would find it. I think most of the info listed here is for those small companies just starting or wanting to crack open their business via the internet!


How would you go about trying to sell your domain name to a large corporation?
 
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I tend to agree with what Nattydomain said. In general the target audience is smaller to mid size companies looking to expand or upgrade their brand.

You can get big sales to large companies, but the hardest thing is getting hold of the decision makers at those companies.

Brad

john_karr said:
How would you go about trying to sell your domain name to a large corporation?
 
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BrandonAg said:
Hey guys - new here. I managed to read through this whole thread (or most of it anyway). Crazy! Amazing information which so many of you are willing to give out which is great. I have been dealing with domains for maybe two months now just basically getting little bits of money from parking. Not much at all. I am a full time college student, have my photography business which I do part time, and work as well. I am ready to try my hand at selling to end-users. Why not give it a shot, right?

So I took down all the resources which were mentioned in this thread and started doing some research. I managed to find 3-4 two word .com domains on NameJet which when searched via google come up with a business who either has the .net variant or some weird ending on it. ex : (xxxxxx2001.com)

Other then that I do not see many businesses at all with two keywords specifically in their domain name. So, what I did was search on Manta.com using the two word domain as the search. Quite a few businesses came up - some of them either came up with the keywords in their actual business name or these keywords described what their business does.

Are these legitimate businesses to send out emails to? Of course, the other concern is that most DO NOT include a web address and hunting them down can be tough.

As well - as Joshua suggested I am using my university .edu email address. Do you think this is the best move to show credibility? As stated above I am also a photographer, own my own website under my name and am heavily into social networking sites, etc. When searching for my name you get quite a few results with pages directing to me, my picture and what not. Do you think this could help or hinder me?

Again - thank you guys for everything. I have soaked up so much information and hopefully I will be able to be posting up what is working for me very soon!

Welcome to NP!

I'm glad you actually read the thread, most people just post their questions which have already been answered, unbeknownst to them.

Another great source to find endusers for you domain is Thomasnet.com - this works if you are dealing with a generic domain, manta also works. I think your school email is a good idea, it does provide some sort of validity and clout - mainly it doesnt look like your a scammer. Some people might search for you but even if they came across your site they wouldnt know that was you - unless you have some really obscure name with only 1 result. Its a tough call whether to use business email or school, i would go with the school for now.
 
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bgmv said:
Welcome to NP!

I'm glad you actually read the thread, most people just post their questions which have already been answered, unbeknownst to them.

Another great source to find endusers for you domain is Thomasnet.com - this works if you are dealing with a generic domain, manta also works. I think your school email is a good idea, it does provide some sort of validity and clout - mainly it doesnt look like your a scammer. Some people might search for you but even if they came across your site they wouldnt know that was you - unless you have some really obscure name with only 1 result. Its a tough call whether to use business email or school, i would go with the school for now.

Thanks for the reply. I will start out with my .edu email and see how it works out. Actually, my last name is somewhat unique and all my social networking profiles along with my website rank on the first page of Google. There may be one other individual with my name ranked on the first page, but besides that they are all me and most show my photo somewhere on that page. Hopefully that works in my favor to show my authenticity. THANK YOU for Thomasnet. Bookmarked it and will start using it as a resource.

**UPDATE: Just checked out Thomasnet. Amazing resource man! Mantra is nice but this is so much quicker! Again, thank you!
 
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Hi all,

I’ve been reading this thread (although I didn’t read each and every post), but as I see many people have questions, I’ve decided to take a few minutes to share my experience and I hope it will help some of you. I’ve been buying domains and reselling to end-users for a while. Actually, I do this for living, and I can say I’ve been quite successful. I usually by the names on aftermarket and sell them for 10x to 50x the price I paid. Sometimes I hand regg and sell them for at least 10x. I’ve just completed a $x,xxx sale for a domain that I paid $10 last December. Last month, I sold a name for $xx,xxx that I had paid $xxx a few weeks earlier.

Ok, how is it possible? First, I’ve been on the other side, I was an end user, I was in big corporations, so I know how the decision process works, I know how to pitch my sale, and who to talk to. But I’ve been working very hard too, and this is the most important, you have to work hard to sell to end users, since it’s you that are approaching them. It’s much more easier when an end user contacts you first. But this is not the case. So you have to be very professionnal and you need to have some negotiation skills too (don’t worry if you don’t, you can develop it).

So I’m listing below some tips and advices that come to my mind in these few minutes I’m taking to write this. They are not in order of most important or less important, as I said, it’ just some ideas that come to my mind and I put them down quickly. It’s not exhaustive, there are many other tips that I could share, but maybe later. Maybe some of them have already been posted here, but it’s always good to re-read good advice. And of course, I’m always learning, every day, so this is what I think based on my experiences that I’ve had up to date.

- Never use a free email account (gmail, yahoo, etc). Get a nice domain like DomainMedia.com or whatever, and use it as you business email. Be sure the domain you are using for your email resolves to a real website. You can be sure that the end user will check your site based on your email. You don’t need to have a real company and you don’t need to have a lot of pages on your site talking about your business. If you do, it’s better, but make sure to have at least a nice page, with a nice logo (you can buy one for $10 here on the forum), and your email, phone number and address. If you want to look like you’ve been in this business for sometime, buy a domain here that was registered a few years ago. Some endusers are smater than you think, specially those in charge of domain acquisition in big companies, and they will check the Whois for your website. So if you regged the domain last month, don’t pretend you are an established domain selling business.

- By the way, perceived size does matter, especially if you want to sell to big corporations. But even when selling to SMB it is important to present your self as an established business, and not as Joe Blow in his basemement trying to get some quick cash. I’ve been selling to some Fortune 500 companies and I know they will not do business with you if you are not a credible person or company. Get a toll-free number. I like RingCentral.com. You can have a 1800 number, with IVR, for about $120/year (includes fax). It is worth the investment. When someone calls you, they get the option to choose the extension they want to reach. You can give your extension and choose to forward these calls to your cellphone. Plus, when it is a call that has been transfered from your 1800 number, you can choose to get the call or forward to your voicemail, therefore if you are at home with your kid crying in your arms, you just forward to your voicemail and it looks like if you were not at the office. You can call back later « Sorry, I was in a meeting when you called me ». BTW, you get your message by email, which is great. Also, don’t use your home address. A PO Box is not perfect, but it is better. If you can afford, use a virtual office, there are many in in the major cities around the world. Looking big gives you more power to negotiate too.

- Don’t think you will make $xx,xxx sales very easily. If you have a domain that an end user is interested in, and you contact him to offer to buy, the math he will do is the following : Ok, this guy is asking $5X, if I fill a complaint with WIPO it will cost me $X (I have a proof that he has no legitimate interest in the domain, he is offering me to buy it, I have chances to win), so I will go to WIPO. But, if it costs $1,500 to $4,000 to go to WIPO, and the domain is « touchy » (let’s say the end user owns other extensions of the domain for exemple), you can offer it at mid to high $xxx, and he will probably buy it. Important : Stay away from trade-marks. I know some companies that even if you offer them the domain at $100, and it’s a TM, they will take legal action, and you will loose you domain and and waste a lot of energy.

- You should always buy domains at the lowest possible price (big news here?). Unless you are really sure you will sell it (it’s rarely the case), you should not invest what you are not ready to loose. If I buy a domain for $100, and I can’t convince and end user to buy, I will loose $100, and even if I resell it at cost, I will be loosing, because I spent my time for nothing.

- I always put in the subject « Domain.com is for sale ». Short and clear. In 90% of my emails I always include price too. It’s your domain, you know how much it’s worth (if you don’t, choose another business), but the important is to know how much it’s worth from the end user’s point of view. So don’t be afraid to include the asking price. Sometimes they will try to negotiate, that’s ok, and that’s why you should always ask for more than what you really want. If nobody answers, you can resend the email later saying that you have received a few offers and that you are dropping the price – and include the new price. I’ve made many sales after the second email with the lower price.

- Don’t think .com is king. I think I’ve never sold a .com. Simply because I couldn’t buy them at a price that was acceptable for me to take the risk to not resell it or to include an acceptable profit margin. All my sales have been .net, .org, .info and some ccTLDs too. If you can communicate in more than one language, you have a big advantage. The endusers market in France, Germany and Spain is very receptive, and they prefer to deal in their own language.

- How to get paid? In many cases, I ask for a wire transfer, and once I get the funds, I transfer the domain. I send an invoice of course. Paypal is fine for small transactions, but never use it for big transactions, and never offer a big company to pay you this way. First, they will not. They prefer wire transfer or cheque. It is ok to accept a check from a big business. But it may take a few weeks, and it’s normal. If the buyer doesn’t want to pay you before you transfer the name, suggest Escrow if he wants to pay the fees, since it’s he that is asking for another method of payment.

- Never look like if you needed to sell the domain (even if you do). If the buyer is asking too much, wants to lower the price, etc, tell him you are going to sell it to someone else and goodbye. But always be polite and professionnal.


Well, I have things to do, I will stop here now. Good luck everyone!!!
 
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Great Post!!



DanB said:
Hi all,

I’ve been reading this thread (although I didn’t read each and every post), but as I see many people have questions, I’ve decided to take a few minutes to share my experience and I hope it will help some of you. I’ve been buying domains and reselling to end-users for a while. Actually, I do this for living, and I can say I’ve been quite successful. I usually by the names on aftermarket and sell them for 10x to 50x the price I paid. Sometimes I hand regg and sell them for at least 10x. I’ve just completed a $x,xxx sale for a domain that I paid $10 last December. Last month, I sold a name for $xx,xxx that I had paid $xxx a few weeks earlier.

Ok, how is it possible? First, I’ve been on the other side, I was an end user, I was in big corporations, so I know how the decision process works, I know how to pitch my sale, and who to talk to. But I’ve been working very hard too, and this is the most important, you have to work hard to sell to end users, since it’s you that are approaching them. It’s much more easier when an end user contacts you first. But this is not the case. So you have to be very professionnal and you need to have some negotiation skills too (don’t worry if you don’t, you can develop it).

So I’m listing below some tips and advices that come to my mind in these few minutes I’m taking to write this. They are not in order of most important or less important, as I said, it’ just some ideas that come to my mind and I put them down quickly. It’s not exhaustive, there are many other tips that I could share, but maybe later. Maybe some of them have already been posted here, but it’s always good to re-read good advice. And of course, I’m always learning, every day, so this is what I think based on my experiences that I’ve had up to date.

- Never use a free email account (gmail, yahoo, etc). Get a nice domain like DomainMedia.com or whatever, and use it as you business email. Be sure the domain you are using for your email resolves to a real website. You can be sure that the end user will check your site based on your email. You don’t need to have a real company and you don’t need to have a lot of pages on your site talking about your business. If you do, it’s better, but make sure to have at least a nice page, with a nice logo (you can buy one for $10 here on the forum), and your email, phone number and address. If you want to look like you’ve been in this business for sometime, buy a domain here that was registered a few years ago. Some endusers are smater than you think, specially those in charge of domain acquisition in big companies, and they will check the Whois for your website. So if you regged the domain last month, don’t pretend you are an established domain selling business.

- By the way, perceived size does matter, especially if you want to sell to big corporations. But even when selling to SMB it is important to present your self as an established business, and not as Joe Blow in his basemement trying to get some quick cash. I’ve been selling to some Fortune 500 companies and I know they will not do business with you if you are not a credible person or company. Get a toll-free number. I like RingCentral.com. You can have a 1800 number, with IVR, for about $120/year (includes fax). It is worth the investment. When someone calls you, they get the option to choose the extension they want to reach. You can give your extension and choose to forward these calls to your cellphone. Plus, when it is a call that has been transfered from your 1800 number, you can choose to get the call or forward to your voicemail, therefore if you are at home with your kid crying in your arms, you just forward to your voicemail and it looks like if you were not at the office. You can call back later « Sorry, I was in a meeting when you called me ». BTW, you get your message by email, which is great. Also, don’t use your home address. A PO Box is not perfect, but it is better. If you can afford, use a virtual office, there are many in in the major cities around the world. Looking big gives you more power to negotiate too.

- Don’t think you will make $xx,xxx sales very easily. If you have a domain that an end user is interested in, and you contact him to offer to buy, the math he will do is the following : Ok, this guy is asking $5X, if I fill a complaint with WIPO it will cost me $X (I have a proof that he has no legitimate interest in the domain, he is offering me to buy it, I have chances to win), so I will go to WIPO. But, if it costs $1,500 to $4,000 to go to WIPO, and the domain is « touchy » (let’s say the end user owns other extensions of the domain for exemple), you can offer it at mid to high $xxx, and he will probably buy it. Important : Stay away from trade-marks. I know some companies that even if you offer them the domain at $100, and it’s a TM, they will take legal action, and you will loose you domain and and waste a lot of energy.

- You should always buy domains at the lowest possible price (big news here?). Unless you are really sure you will sell it (it’s rarely the case), you should not invest what you are not ready to loose. If I buy a domain for $100, and I can’t convince and end user to buy, I will loose $100, and even if I resell it at cost, I will be loosing, because I spent my time for nothing.

- I always put in the subject « Domain.com is for sale ». Short and clear. In 90% of my emails I always include price too. It’s your domain, you know how much it’s worth (if you don’t, choose another business), but the important is to know how much it’s worth from the end user’s point of view. So don’t be afraid to include the asking price. Sometimes they will try to negotiate, that’s ok, and that’s why you should always ask for more than what you really want. If nobody answers, you can resend the email later saying that you have received a few offers and that you are dropping the price – and include the new price. I’ve made many sales after the second email with the lower price.

- Don’t think .com is king. I think I’ve never sold a .com. Simply because I couldn’t buy them at a price that was acceptable for me to take the risk to not resell it or to include an acceptable profit margin. All my sales have been .net, .org, .info and some ccTLDs too. If you can communicate in more than one language, you have a big advantage. The endusers market in France, Germany and Spain is very receptive, and they prefer to deal in their own language.

- How to get paid? In many cases, I ask for a wire transfer, and once I get the funds, I transfer the domain. I send an invoice of course. Paypal is fine for small transactions, but never use it for big transactions, and never offer a big company to pay you this way. First, they will not. They prefer wire transfer or cheque. It is ok to accept a check from a big business. But it may take a few weeks, and it’s normal. If the buyer doesn’t want to pay you before you transfer the name, suggest Escrow if he wants to pay the fees, since it’s he that is asking for another method of payment.

- Never look like if you needed to sell the domain (even if you do). If the buyer is asking too much, wants to lower the price, etc, tell him you are going to sell it to someone else and goodbye. But always be polite and professionnal.


Well, I have things to do, I will stop here now. Good luck everyone!!!
 
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Dan, you make some excellent points. I especially agree with these two.

1.) Don't use a free email. That is dead on. Most end users will associate free email services and offers as scams. Using a proper email and providing contact information gives you credibility.

2.) .COM is not king, keyword is king. The vast majority of end users don't have budgets to buy category killer .COM, however are more than open to alternate extension with credibility (NET/ORG especially). Many are also open to domains with 1 well placed Hyphen. End users would take a Keyword.net any day over a mediocre .COM

Another thing I would add is buy domains with a clear use. Most end users want a descriptive domain that explains what the site will offer.

Brad


DanB said:
- Never use a free email account (gmail, yahoo, etc). Get a nice domain like DomainMedia.com or whatever, and use it as you business email. Be sure the domain you are using for your email resolves to a real website. You can be sure that the end user will check your site based on your email. You don’t need to have a real company and you don’t need to have a lot of pages on your site talking about your business. If you do, it’s better, but make sure to have at least a nice page, with a nice logo (you can buy one for $10 here on the forum), and your email, phone number and address. If you want to look like you’ve been in this business for sometime, buy a domain here that was registered a few years ago. Some endusers are smater than you think, specially those in charge of domain acquisition in big companies, and they will check the Whois for your website. So if you regged the domain last month, don’t pretend you are an established domain selling business.

- Don’t think .com is king. I think I’ve never sold a .com. Simply because I couldn’t buy them at a price that was acceptable for me to take the risk to not resell it or to include an acceptable profit margin. All my sales have been .net, .org, .info and some ccTLDs too. If you can communicate in more than one language, you have a big advantage. The endusers market in France, Germany and Spain is very receptive, and they prefer to deal in their own language.
 
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Dan B it sounds like you have done a bit more work on finding the decision maker which is a bit harder than just pulling off an email address off a website. Perhaps relying too much on email addresses from the website or Whois resulted in many of my emails being deleted. On a side note a few of the domains we promoted in January and February did subsequently receive an offer via TDNam but for $50 or less. We never mentioned TDNam in our emails. However, I still suspect that the unsuccessful campaign was due to being so heavily weighted toward the Spanish market and not having category-killer English .COM domains to offer.
 
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Tell me what your guys opinions on this is:

I've snatched a domain that is not a word (to my knowledge anyway), but that is the name of a company.

Example:

Company: Thrisher Accounting
They own: Thrisherac.com
I own: www.Thrisher.com

I've checked USPTO and the search turned up there is no Trademark under the name I have.

My question to you guys is do you find these are worthwhile names to get seeing as they can only pertain to usually 1 company and if they don't want to buy you're out of luck?
 
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BrandonAg said:
Question for you guys:

I snatched a name which belongs to a company but which is not a real word (to my knowledge anyway).

Example:

Company: Thrisher Accounting
They Own: Thrisherac.com
I own: Thrisher.com

I checked USPTO and found no trademark for the name.

Do you guys see these types of names as not worth it beings it usually can only pertain to 1 company and if they don't want to buy you are out of luck?

Some opinions would be great!

Well thats the type of name you want to buy, but the problem is the high risk. If you register your names with dynadot you grace delete for $1 if they arent interested.
 
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The answer to that question is case-by-case. If the following two conditions hold:

(a) Thrisher.com was already registered at the time Thrisher Accounting registered ThrisherAc.com -AND-
(b) Thrisher Accounting's logo text looks something like:

THRISHER
Account Services LLC

...then your chances are pretty strong and you should certainly go for it. However, ThrisherAc.com doesn't exist and typing "Thrisher" into Google brings up no results; so I presume your example was fictitious.

As a bonus, try pulling up revenue figures for Fisher Accounting on Manta.com. If it $100K annually or higher, your probability of getting a bite from them is ever stronger.
 
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JoshuaPz said:
The answer to that question is case-by-case. If the following two conditions hold:

(a) Thrisher.com was already registered at the time Thrisher Accounting registered ThrisherAc.com -AND-
(b) Thrisher Accounting's logo text looks something like:

THRISHER
Account Services LLC

...then your chances are pretty strong and you should certainly go for it. However, ThrisherAc.com doesn't exist and typing "Thrisher" into Google brings up no results; so I presume your example was fictitious.

As a bonus, try pulling up revenue figures for Fisher Accounting on Manta.com. If it $100K annually or higher, your probability of getting a bite from them is ever stronger.


Joshua,

Your first condition is exactly what I was wondering about it. Is there any resource where I am able to find that information out?

My example was fictitious :)

I did pull revenue figures for the company yesterday and they are at $400,000.


BG - thank you for that! I will definitely go with dynadot!
 
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Your first condition is exactly what I was wondering about it. Is there any resource where I am able to find that information out?

http://domain-history.domaintools.com

You'll need at least a DomainTools Silver account to use it, but it's well-worth the cost.
 
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Is anybody else getting discouraged by Dynadot's new grace deletion policy? I currently have 10 names at Dynadot that have been in the grace delete queue for the past 2 days, and haven't been deleted yet. Some of those names had 3-4 prospects but didn't receive any interest. The possibility that they might not get deleted at all and that I might get stuck with paying 7.75*10=$77.5 is making me wonder if I can stay on in this business anymore. sigh.
 
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fh08 said:
Is anybody else getting discouraged by Dynadot's new grace deletion policy? I currently have 10 names at Dynadot that have been in the grace delete queue for the past 2 days, and haven't been deleted yet. Some of those names had 3-4 prospects but didn't receive any interest. The possibility that they might not get deleted at all and that I might get stuck with paying 7.75*10=$77.5 is making me wonder if I can stay on in this business anymore. sigh.

No end-user sales effort can be considered exhaustive until you have cold-called every single one of your prospects.

Also, if you're careful about the domains you catch, then you should certainly manage to sell 1 in every 10 domains you catch. Spend $77.50 on 10 names, flip 1 for $300 (a pretty average sale), walk away with $222.50 in profits. Still not too shabby, and this hypothetical scenario doesn't even account for revenue earned by liquidating the other 9 on NP or BuyDomains.com.
 
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Thanks for the advice Joshua. I guess I need to work even harder now and keep calling endusers every chance I get.
 
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I'm curious if anyone has tried developing a minisite, positioned it well in Google or Yahoo, started generating some organic or link-based traffic off the domain and then attempted to sell to an enduser? One disadvantage is that the registrant is going to demand a higher price the buyer may not be willing to pay for their time invested in development. But the site's positioning in the search engines and traffic would have a value to that end user which would not have been possible without some development.
 
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awsome posts and advice that's why I like namepros,when you need some help most everyone gives out some great info thanks again
 
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bmugford said:
1.) Don't use a free email. That is dead on. Most end users will associate free email services and offers as scams. Using a proper email and providing contact information gives you credibility.

Why not setup google free email hosting on the domain and email directly from it? That way you can offer the potential purchaser an already setup email service at no extra cost.

Also I would imagine that if the email looks like it is coming from a competitor there would be a higher chance of it being opened and read?
 
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Trademark-related question: I drop caught a domain yesterday that I'm going to call xxxgroup.com. I found out that there's a domain name called thexxxgroup.com and it is the official website of the one of the largest steel manufacturers in the world (British company). I checked the ipo.gov.uk site to see if xxxgroup is trademarked and found that it's not while thexxxgroup is trademarked (but apparently the current trademark status is expired). Their website was registered before mine though. Am I allowed to market the name to them??
 
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fh08 said:
Trademark-related question: I drop caught a domain yesterday that I'm going to call xxxgroup.com. I found out that there's a domain name called thexxxgroup.com and it is the official website of the one of the largest steel manufacturers in the world (British company). I checked the ipo.gov.uk site to see if xxxgroup is trademarked and found that it's not while thexxxgroup is trademarked (but apparently the current trademark status is expired). Their website was registered before mine though. Am I allowed to market the name to them??

If the trademark is listed as "Dead", then you would win the case if you were brought to court. However, that wouldn't stop them from intimidating you with court action.

Are they THE only company named xxxgroup that Google shows? If they are, you're essentially cybersquatting on a very well-known steel company's name, and that puts your credibility in danger.

You might try offering them the domain name anyway, but if I were you I'd ask for $2K, max, else I imagine they would seriously consider threatening to sue your ***.

Another factor to consider: were THEY the ones who dropped that domain? Check archive.org and domain-history.domaintools.com to learn the answer. If they were, they most likely did so intentionally.
 
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The trademark isn't listed as 'dead' just 'expired', which is the same with the other 2 high-profile trademarks that this company owns which I find a little funny.

They are the only company named xxxgroup that Google shows, yes. But I found out right now that there's a small Mauritian company with a representative in the UK that owns the trademark for xxxgroup but they don't have a website or contact number.

I'm still a little unsure but I guess I'll try offering it to thexxxgroup (It's not their primary name anyway). If I sense trouble from them, I'm just going to drop it or give it to them for free.
 
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