Buyers DO NOT PAY ANY FEES

equity78 · Nov 7, 2015

Seems like we have a bunch of threads lately with people saying that the buyer pays fees. That is against Namepros and Paypal rules, trying to enforce that will result in your sales threads being closed.

If someone pms you that you need to pay fees report immediately to @Eric Lyon and a mod.

Namepros Marketplace in place for over a decade:

6.1.7. Per PayPal TOS, all transactions must have fees charged to the receiver of funds by default. One is not allowed to avoid taxes by asking for payment in the form of a gift. Sellers must either willingly accept fees or clearly include them in the price.

UPDATE:
6.1.7. Sellers are responsible for paying all transaction fees. Sellers should take fees into consideration when choosing sale prices or starting bids. Multiple sale prices and multiple starting bids may be set based on specific criteria. Learn why.

Keith · Nov 8, 2015

Eric Lyon said:
The rules exist to resolve disputes/issues. If the buyer and seller agree to something else and no one involved have issues, then there is no dispute. In that case, there's no involvement by NamePros.

How could a dispute arise if I create a sales thread and clearly state that all transaction fees are paid by the buyer? Seems reasonable if the seller is upfront about the details.

Eric Lyon · Nov 8, 2015

Keith said:
How could a dispute arise if I create a sales thread and clearly state that all transaction fees are paid by the buyer?

It's been explained to me that it is considered too confusing for some buyers and creates a poor buying experience:

If the fees are easy to determine beforehand, then they can easily be included in the price or starting bid.
If they're not easily determined beforehand, then we can see why this makes a poor experience for buyers.

This may require some getting used to, but it should cause less confusion and complaints in the long run.

NameOmnia · Nov 8, 2015

Eric Lyon said:
The rule was updated and no longer mentions PayPal. It applies to all fees.

It's not allowed, but we do not involve ourselves unless there is an issue.

Handled this way it all seems a big mess to me..basically it's not allowed but we can..as long as we do not create problems...once again, big mess big nonsense.
Leave people free to conduct their auction the way they want as long as all conditions and requirements are made clear in the opening thread.

Keith · Nov 8, 2015

Eric Lyon said:
It's been explained to me that it is considered too confusing for some buyers and creates a poor buying experience:

If the fees are easy to determine beforehand, then they can easily be included in the price or starting bid.

If they're not easily determined beforehand, then we can see why this makes a poor experience for the buyers.

This may require some getting used to, but it should cause less confusion and complaints in the long run.

I agree that fees vary depending on which payment processor is selected. It gets gray when a sales thread takes place and the seller will accept multiple payment venues. Usually this is based on a buyer's reputation here.

Maybe it would be better if sellers could ask for fees as long as they provide costs associated with the payment processors they're willing to accept.

Eric Lyon · Nov 8, 2015

To be clear, no one may create a thread/listing that is in violation of the rules.

My comment was referring to private conversations where two members may wish to conduct business in a way where they both agree to something, and to express that it is not our goal to impose on them. However, the rules are the rules, and if any issues arise, those are what we will follow.

forge · Nov 8, 2015

Keith said:
I always choose "friends or family" which charges fees to me, the sender. Can anyone explain how this affects taxes and why NP would get in between buyer/seller negotiations?

This is a clear violation of PayPal TOS. Be mindful.

Keith · Nov 8, 2015

forge said:
This is a clear violation of PayPal TOS. Be mindful.

How is it a violation to select a provided option given by PayPal? Now we're going to part hairs over the definition of friends?...

iowadawg · Nov 8, 2015

In over 20 years selling on the internet, I have never said there is an extra fee if you purchase this item.
Now domainers, the weirdest group ever, want to start imposing fees on their sales...
Geesh...think some of you should go out in real life and check out how all sorts of things are sold.

Keith · Nov 8, 2015

iowadawg said:
Geesh...think some of you should go out in real life and check out how all sorts of things are sold.

Try booking a hotel and then talk to me about additional fees. How about cable tv? Endless fees tacked on there.

The fact is, I'm selling something for $100. That doesn't mean $95 depending on how the buyer and I agree to transfer funds.

We are paying developers via PayPal now in installments to build a website. Guess what, all deducted PayPal fees are added on to our final payment. The cost of goods and services is just that.

forge · Nov 8, 2015

Keith said:
How is it a violation to select a provided option given by PayPal? Now we're going to part hairs over the definition of friends?...

Far as I can see, the onus is on the Seller. So they are the ones who should be concerned. But they're too busy being "frugal". *hack* *cough*

https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/mpp/ua/useragreement-full#3

4. Receiving Money.

4.1 Receiving Personal Payments. If you are selling goods or services, you may not ask the buyer to send you a Personal Payment for the purchase. If you do so, PayPal may remove your ability to accept Personal Payments.

Keith · Nov 8, 2015

forge said:
Far as I can see, the onus is on the Seller. So they are the ones who should be concerned. But they're too busy being "frugal". *hack* *cough*

https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/mpp/ua/useragreement-full#3

4. Receiving Money.

4.1 Receiving Personal Payments. If you are selling goods or services, you may not ask the buyer to send you a Personal Payment for the purchase. If you do so, PayPal may remove your ability to accept Personal Payments.

I'm not losing sleep over it, especially since PayPal chose to turn a blind eye to all domain name disputes in the past, as domains are considered intangible items.

forge · Nov 8, 2015

Keith said:
I'm not losing sleep over it, especially since PayPal chose to turn a blind eye to all domain name disputes in the past, as domains are considered intangible items.

If worse turns to worse, you can always turn to your so-called "friends".

You have no buyer protection using "family" pay, but obviously you're willing to take that risk.

(What you just said.)

forge · Nov 8, 2015

iowadawg said:
Now domainers, the weirdest group ever

Indisputable fact.

Keith · Nov 8, 2015

forge said:
If worse turns to worse, you can always turn to your so-called "friends".

I use PayPal tons. So much so that half the time I select friends/family there are absolutely no fees to me or the seller. To me this is good business. You sell something at a certain price, I as the buyer should make sure you get the total fee for goods.

As far as NP is concerned, the rules are silly. They should get out of the way between buyers and sellers as they aren't the domain police.

iowadawg · Nov 8, 2015

I have yet to go to a grocery store and have a fee added on because I bought apples.
I have yet to go to a restaurant and have a fee added on because i got a baked potato.
I have yet to go to any store and buy any product, from shoes to suits to legos, and have a fee added.
Now hotels/motels, airlines, cruise ships, etal....
They are like domainers, want more than what they sell.

iowadawg · Nov 8, 2015

Strange, domainers say, I won't sell here at sedo (whatever domain site) because of fees, rules.
Yet want NP to set up rules only to benefit domainers.
Like I said, domainers are a weird group.

Keith · Nov 8, 2015

iowadawg said:
I have yet to go to a grocery store and have a fee added on because I bought apples.
I have yet to go to a restaurant and have a fee added on because i got a baked potato.
I have yet to go to any store and buy any product, from shoes to suits to legos, and have a fee added.
Now hotels/motels, airlines, cruise ships, etal....
They are like domainers, want more than what they sell.

You don't pay gratuity at restaurants? You don't pay taxes at grocery stores? In reality everything has added fees, it's just a question of how much and in what form.

Domainers asking for payment processing fees are no different than every other service in the world. But stating the bottom line in a sales thread at NP is at least being up front and honest about expectations.

NameOmnia · Nov 8, 2015

Everywhere there are surcharges for paying with cards..I do not see why we are so weird

equity78 · Nov 8, 2015

Eric has updated the rule

6.1.7. Sellers are responsible for paying all transaction fees. Sellers should take fees into consideration when choosing sale prices or starting bids. Multiple sale prices and multiple starting bids may be set based on specific criteria. Learn why.

If someone tries to charge you a fee report to a mod.

Buyers DO NOT PAY ANY FEES

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