WHOIS, NAMESERVER, and IP History

[dreamscometrue]

I am a bit confused about the details of the data that DomainTools supplies for a particular domain.

Can you explain the difference between the WHOIS History, NameServer History, and IP History...?

In most cases, the dates are OLDER for NameServer History than WHOIS...?

So does this mean when investigating a domains age, you need to you use the NameServer date on file -- not -- the WHOIS date...?

Thanks a million for the help. I'm trying to organize a few domains and document their original registration date but obviously need to figure out which date is correct.

 

[Kate]

The true creation date is that reported by the registry (for .com/.net domains).
The domain could have been registered in the past then dropped, then registered again. The creation date is then reset. So it can have history (like backlinks, archive.org) earlier than its current creation date.

DomainTools makes 'snapshots' of the whois record from time but do not necessarily keep track of all changes. Ditto for changes made to the name servers.

 

[dreamscometrue]

Thanks a bunch for the reply. While I understand that info, I'm still unclear on where to find the "exact" date of the original domain registration. Which is more accurate? NameServer History or IP History -- or neither...?

 

[Kate]

Creation date is in whois record. For .com/.net domains check with the registry.
But again, the domain may have been registered then dropped in the past. Several times possibly.
The true creation date has nothing to do with hosting history.

 

[OnlineDomainCom]

Registry and registrar creation dates can be different in some registrars. Oldest showing is the real creation date.

 

[dreamscometrue]

I still have not learned an answer to my question.

Once again, DOMAINTOOLS, displays the following history:

NAMESERVER, IP, and WHOIS.

EXAMPLE:

DomainXYZ123.com

NS History: 3 changes on 3 unique name servers over 4 years.
IP History: 2 unique IP address over 4 years.
WHOIS History: 1 record has been archived since 2012-07-21

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Ok. PLEASE FOLLOW ME.

How can they only have WHOIS HISTORY since 2012 yet they have NS History since 2008...?

Was this domain original registered in 2008 -- or -- in July of 2012...?

Again, my question was WHERE can I found out (specifically) where to locate the ORIGINAL domain "creation" data...?

 

[OnlineDomainCom]

Why do you need the original registration date?
The current registration date is that matters in the list you are making.
If you just want to add a date then check all the available tools (DOMAINTOOLS, archive.org etc.) and pick the earliest you can find.

 

[Ms Domainer]

I still have not learned an answer to my question.

Once again, DOMAINTOOLS, displays the following history:

NAMESERVER, IP, and WHOIS.

EXAMPLE:

DomainXYZ123.com

NS History: 3 changes on 3 unique name servers over 4 years.
IP History: 2 unique IP address over 4 years.
WHOIS History: 1 record has been archived since 2012-07-21

------------------>

Ok. PLEASE FOLLOW ME.

How can they only have WHOIS HISTORY since 2012 yet they have NS History since 2008...?

Was this domain original registered in 2008 -- or -- in July of 2012...?

Again, my question was WHERE can I found out (specifically) where to locate the ORIGINAL domain "creation" data...?

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Both.

The domain was registered in 2008 and then dropped sometime between 2009-2011 and landed in domain la la land.

In 2012, someone else registered it, so the creation date was reset.

In order to find out the original creation date, you would need to upgrade your domain tools account so that you could do a historical search on this domain.

You could also try Hosterstats (not mine), which can offer domain history (based on hosting history), between 2000-present:

http://www.hosterstats.com/​

This option is free, but I don't know how accurate it is.

Hope this helps!

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[dreamscometrue]

THANK YOU VERY MUCH!

So, basically, (please confirm) every search I perform on DomainTools -- the "NS History" is the "official representation" of the "birth of the domain" in question...?

---------- Post added at 03:08 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:59 AM ----------

Curve ball...?

One of the domains has this example:

NS History: 9 changes on 3 unique name servers over 5 years.
IP History: 10 changes on 6 unique IP addresses over 7 years.
Whois History: 13 records have been archived since 2007-10-13 .

So, was this domain "originally created" in 2007 or in 2005...?

Unbelievably confusing that there is no "concrete" answer to such a small question.

I most certainly appreciate everyones help.

 

[Ms Domainer]

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The official creation date is the reset date, but a lot of good domains are dropped and then get immediately snatched by dropcatchers. The date is then reset to the new registration date, even if it's a premium domain.

Domains that get transferred (but are not dropped) retain their original creation date.

Crazy, isn't it?

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[dreamscometrue]

I see. Makes a bit more sense.

So, if I'm looking to establish a "fact-based" document, to "showcase" how old a domain is, I would merely use the OLDEST date found -- regardless if it's the NS History, IP History, or WHOIS.

I think we're on the same page, ...if my statement ^ above is accurate.

Thanks again!

 

[Ms Domainer]

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Theoretically, the original creation date could have been earlier, given that Whois records can be sketchy for the earlier years of the internet.

Each registrar maintains their own Whois records, and some registrars are better than others in keeping records up-to-date.

Verisign, the registry for .com and .net, keep what is known as "thin" records, mainly registrar, creation date (most recent), expiration date, domain status, and Nameservers. The registrars (GoDaddy, Register, eNom, etc.) are responsible for keeping the "thick" records (complete registrant info).

As far as I know, Verisign does not keep historical records of domains that have dropped and then re-registered. I could be wrong about this, though.

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---------- Post added at 11:30 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:21 PM ----------

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For showcase purposes, you could make a case for an aged domain by showing the prospective buyer the historical data from Domain Tools or Hosterstats, but the official (new) creation date will be the date of record.

The registrar where the domain is registered, for example, GoDaddy's Whois, will simply show the official registration (reset) date; Domain Tools is not a registrar, but a Whois service that gathers info from all the registrars, including historical Whois info. How they do this, I don't know.

Also, Verisign will show only the most recent creation date.

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[alien51]

Based on just logic alone, it would have been impossible to have some kind of record date attached/archived for a domain, BEFORE it even existed.

So the age of your domain should be as old as the oldest date on record you can find.

 

[Kate]

Domaintools is a data aggregator, it's not comprehensive and not real time.

The authoritative answer is the registry, that is different for each extension.
For .com/.net domains it is Verisign.
For .org it is PIR.
The ccTLDs have their own registries too.
This is where the true creation date is to be found.

.com/.net is a particular case as it operates under a thin whois model (vs thick whois), the registry has limited information on the domains, like creation date, expiry, last update + status + current name servers. The registrant info is available from the registrar.
If you do a whois lookup here: http://www.verisigninc.com/en_US/products-and-services/domain-name-services/whois/index.xhtml
You will see there is a pointer to the whois server of the registrar (to get more information, that is registrant details).

A few ccTLDs have no whois server at all, extensions like .aq, .by perhaps. But it's more or less 'exotic' extensions.

 

[Bannen]

So, if I'm looking to establish a "fact-based" document, to "showcase" how old a domain is, I would merely use the OLDEST date found -- regardless if it's the NS History, IP History, or WHOIS.

Not quite:
Let's say a domain was first regged in 2002; then the owner lets it expire/drop in a year or two, and someone else regs it and drops it, and another, until finally someone regs it in, say 2010, and keeps it. Now you have 2 basic paths of info - age and history - and to showcase the domain's stats you need to delineate between the two:

First, the 'age' of the domain refers to the latest, continuous registration time. So to accurately portray the age of the above example domain, you have to say it is regged since 2010. 2 years old.

Second, you have the 'history' of the domain. Since it has various reg/drop history dating back to 2002, you can showcase the name by saying it has 10 years of off-and-on history, as an example that the domain doesn't currently have much 'age' but that it had enough interest that people have liked it and kept regging it (though kept dropping it also) since 2002.

So you could showcase the above example by saying: it has current AGE of 2 years, but reg/drop HISTORY dating back to 2002.

Aggregators like DT are a little hit-or-miss with their stats and do not show a rock-solid definitive history of a domain's stats; for definitive you need to go straight to the horse's mouth (like Verisign etc as sdsinc mentioned) for each domain.

 

[Ms Domainer]

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Thanks, Bannen, alien51, and sdsinc. You pretty much said what I was trying to say late last night.



So Verisign does offer domain history?

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[Kate]

So Verisign does offer domain history?

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No, but in theory they could. They must have records since they are in charge of the .com registry, possibly data from the previous operators as well. But I know that the original NIC body SRI has some sketchy records of the very early days.

Nominet (.uk domains) also cannot account for all the history of the .uk TLD. Domains that have been registered in August 1996 and earlier simply show 'Registered on: before Aug-1996' in whois. Those names are known as 'preregs'. Back then they didn't keep track of original registration dates.

And there are similar stories:
http://www.namepros.com/domain-name-discussion/394362-worlds-first-100-domain-names.html

 

[Ms Domainer]

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I remember now.

The "Who Was" project.

Looks like the matching .com domain is owned by someone else (since 1999).

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