question When a domain has a $0 Estibot value...

[Vivi]

... does that necessarily mean it has no resale value (beyond reg fee)?

I've started reading on the forum and know that a domain is only worth as much as someone is willing to pay for it. I realize also that a high Estibot value isn't necessarily an indicator that the domain name is actually worth that price. Keywords, traffic, etc all factor into it, but at the end of the day the Estibot value is just one indicator of price, and not always an accurate one.

But in the converse situation, a domain with a $0 Estibot value, does that necessarily mean it has no resale value beyond reg fee? I'm asking because I have a 2 word phrase .com domain from a blog I started which is minimally-developed and has an Estibot value of $0. I'd like to auction off the domain, but am I correct in assuming that no-one would want it with a current Estibot value of $0? Or does the phrase itself matter? Any insights?

 

[Nerevar]

Estibot valuation means nothing.
However, it is not very easy to register a domain that has resale value above regfee, if you are new in this.

 

[Vivi]

Thanks, Nerevar. Concise, helpful, answered the question to the point.

I really appreciate this... I'm definitely a beginner. I will probably then work on developing it more before auctioning it off. I realize I may never get my time back in terms of $ at sale, but maybe I can make a little income off of the domain in the meantime and have fun developing it. As opposed to just letting it expire or selling it for $1. Thanks again for answering my question.

 

[AndyM]

I reg'd a domain the other day.... estibot says $4,300. The pros here say, max $50. Go figure. I also have a domain which estibot says $40, A pro from here says to the right end user $5k plus!!

 

[frank-germany]

I have registered quite a few domains where the estibot is like -lets make up a number-
$500 and after I caught them ( dropping domains ) estibot 2 weeks later gives me a value of $1500

( price just an example )

this happens quite often to my domains

so what do you think the evaluation is worth?

 

[80-20]

One day, estibot will disappear completely from the domainer's armor - remembered as a statistical tool with projecting false reality.
It's departure however is seriously slowed down by the "establishment" keen to receive a few silver coins for promoting it.
Newbies beware!

 

[Vivi]

Wow... I enjoyed your answers @Nerevar , @domainivate , @frank-germany , @80-20 (just started remembering in my responses to tag people who gave me helpful answers - not just repeat their names). Am still a newbie, still getting to grips with the forum & with forum etiquette. (And if I'm doing things wrong please feel free to let me know!)

Taking on board what you've all said, I find the lack of a consistent clear consensus on pricing any specific domain to be actually pretty fascinating, as weird as that sounds! It's so intriguing. Also I can see why it helps to get input from those of you with experience - since experience counts for a LOT in the absence of any sort of reliable 'automatic' domain name valuation.

The $0 Estibot-valued domain I was asking about, I'll probably wind up working on some more first, partly just for the fun of it and partly to see if it increases the value.

But point taken from all of you that it's a gamble either way - I could auction it off and find it only sells for $1, or find it sells for something higher, I just don't know. Being a newbie I'll just be cautious and develop it more because as Nerevar said, when auctioning off a $0 valued domain it's probably best to have some experience in the field. Maybe not solely because of its actual value (which I totally realize may still be $0 anyway for my domain!) but because of what 80-20 mentioned about Estibot strongly influencing the perceived value in the field.

Wow, this is a great community! So glad to receive input here!

 

[Nerevar]

Estibot strongly influencing the perceived value in the field.

Only among newbie domainers during they first weeks in the industry End users are not aware of Estibot. And 99.9% of domainers stop paying attention to it after the first weeks. At best, they use it as a tool to spam end users (this is a paid feature).

 

[korganian]

Estibot is dangerous. I lost a lot of money from using it's valuations when I was a noobie domainer. What I found out was that the owner of Estibot touted high accuracy rates of evaluation from his software by saying that if some domains were valued at 10% of what they later sold for and other domains were valued at ten times what they later sold for, then the result showed Estibot to be vary accurate. He was able to take his very inaccurate valuations and by using large bulk comparisons, make bad valuations cancel each other out in the group comparison.

 

[Vivi]

Only among newbie domainers during they first weeks in the industry End users are not aware of Estibot. And 99.9% of domainers stop paying attention to it after the first weeks. At best, they use it as a tool to spam end users (this is a paid feature).

Ah. I'm not sure now whether I should be relieved (that the $0 Estibot value is not meaningful to potential buyers) or concerned (that further developing the domain to increase its Estibot value will probably not help sale value in the eyes of the experienced buyers). In either case, I've got time so I will probably continue developing for the fun factor.

 

[Vivi]

@korganian - thank you so much for the warning and for pointing out why Estibot had gotten traction in the field to begin with. I am learning so much in this forum.

 

[Kate]

Do yourself a favor, don't use automated tools for appraising domain names. Otherwise you'll never learn what makes a name valuable. Yes, it's true only the newbies pay attention to "guesstibot" (plus Berkens routinely quoting estibot values, never understood why).
People who rely on estibot for their purchases are not being more successful at selling domains, in fact pretty much any domain will be appraised at regfee minimum. So it's like you have nothing to lose and you can't go wrong with such generous valuations. Wrong !

 

[domix]

Do yourself a favor, don't use automated tools for appraising domain names. Otherwise you'll never learn what makes a name valuable. Yes, it's true only the newbies pay attention to "guesstibot" (plus Berkens routinely quoting estibot values, never understood why).
People who rely on estibot for their purchases are not being more successful at selling domains, in fact pretty much any domain will be appraised at regfee minimum. So it's like you have nothing to lose and you can't go wrong with such generous valuations. Wrong !

can you provide examples for manual estimation and methods? thanks.

 

[frank-germany]

can you provide examples for manual estimation and methods? thanks.

manual estimation are worthless too

 

[Nerevar]

One thing that helps manual estimation (although does not define it) - is to see how similar keywords have sold in the past. There are sereval websites where you can do it, for example:
http://dnpric.es/
http://www.dnsaleprice.com/
http://namebio.com/

Remember that .net is seen as about 10 times (or more) less valuable than .com

For shorter names:
http://www.llllsales.com/
http://www.3character.com/price-guide.html

But ultimately, you have to learn to think like endusers (startups and corporations, high-paid self employed professionals, serious web developers) because the lucrative market with $x,xxx sales is there. For this, read the recent sales thread of this forum. Then the only "manual" estimation you need is the feeling that the name has a use to many end users who have good business budgets.

 

[aramyus]

I have never tested, but I'd be surprised that a sellable domain has no estibot value.

You can see for yourself by checking the estibot value of sold domains reported at namebio.com: I tested a couple, and all had an estibot value.

From what I know, estibot is an automated estimate based on
- the length of the domain and it's pronounceability
- the extension (.com, .net...)
- recognition of the keywords or may be patterns within the domain
- the value of keywords based on G adwords (or similar)
- probably the number of advertisers reported on tools like spyfu or similar
- the age of the domain and may be the number of drops
- may be they also check for trademarks

These are some of the factors that domainers are systematically watching for. So I have a hard time to think of a good domain name without an estibot value.

Now of course, estibot value is notoriously inaccurate, but a zero-value might be a quick indicator to reject a domain (for example when you inspect a list of dropped keyword domains)

 

[Nerevar]

I have never tested, but I'd be surprised that a sellable domain has no estibot value.

Brandables, especially non-keyword.

 

[Ralph2472]

Estibot only values domain names and not web sites; so if you have a site on the name the value will be zero. I think you'll also find there are no statistics shown if you try to value a site.

Regards

Ralph.

 

[DomainVP]

Two mistakes every beginner makes:
#1 Trusting automated appraisals like Estibot
#2 Getting excited when a buyer with a 'big budget' needs an appraisal (appraisal scam)

 

[aramyus]

Brandables, especially non-keyword

I thought of that too. But brandables are short and highly pronounceable

Do you have examples ? I also tried a few on namerific. I could not find any with zero value on estibot (but, many domains are underestimated)

 

[Branded Domains]

estibot doesn't matter to domainers..I sold two domains with estibot $0 for $200 and $85..
the only thing matters to domainer is the domain name...

 

[Vivi]

Thanks for the warnings about valuation methods, @Kate , @DomainVP , and @frank-germany .

Thank you for bringing up the question about what are good methods/factors to consider, @domix . I appreciated the great pointers given to answer that from @aramyus and @Nerevar - I am learning more and more from all of you.

 

[Vivi]

One thing that helps manual estimation (although does not define it) - is to see how similar keywords have sold in the past. There are sereval websites where you can do it, for example

you have to learn to think like endusers (startups and corporations, high-paid self employed professionals, serious web developers) because the lucrative market with $x,xxx sales is there. For this, read the recent sales thread of this forum.

You can see for yourself by checking the estibot value of sold domains reported at namebio.com

OK, these were incredibly helpful practical tools and pointers that I had not thought of. A huge thank you to both of you for this.

I had started reading the domain appraisal threads on the forum here to get an overall feel for domain values, but I think for my question the ideas that Nerevar and aramyus brought up above were much better approaches for the specific situation at hand for my particular domain.

 

[Vivi]

@Ralph2472 and @gbs domain , great points there, I can see that developing my site further will not necessarily be all that helpful if I'm just selling the domain name (i.e. and not the site). Still thinking about what to do. Thanks so much to all. I am so happy to have received so much great input to this question.

 

[Kate]

can you provide examples for manual estimation and methods? thanks.

No, it is more art than science. It's not something you learn overnight.
There are many parameters to be considered, and then there is gut feeling. But the name has to make sense, preferably it should be commercially viable because domain names are usually bought for business use.
The best you can do is hang around here, read everything that you can but you also need to sort the wheat from the shaft. Also, analyze reported sales, what sells and why.

Don't look for shortcuts, take the time to read and learn, domaining is much more difficult than it sounds, and it's very competitive too.