discuss The new dot everything showcase and discussion

[Keith]

Well it appears as though it's happening. The launch of .land, .bike, .this, and .that is here and many more to come.

Show off your new .whatevers here and discuss why these are or are not good investments. Keep it cool, calm, and productive

I'll start with my new regs... absolutely none!

 

[forge]

Golf.academy has $2,000 bid on Sedo!

YAY NEW GTLDS! RAH! RAH! GO NEW TLDS!!!

I have seen the light, everything is crystal clear and this Brave New TLD World is BEAUTIFUL!

p.s. .email is still shit

 

[scandiman]

When registries start acting like domainers instead of registries, there is a major problem.

They are effectively in competition with a section of the market that initially drives some of the growth in the early phase of a TLD's existence.

And once word gets around that the game is rigged, then the pros won't want to play. Pretty soon, that attitude spreads to most domainers and the TLD is left with relying on the mom and pop businesses who are using .COM or .ccTLD. And they have no real reason to switch.

So what happens is this: No landrush boost (or a very flat one) followed by disenchantment and the DotWhat? effect. The public does not even recognise or remember the TLD.

After that comes the Junk Dump (first anniversary when the highly speculative domains that could not be flipped are dropped). The percentage dropped can vary but there might be a few newbies ready to pick up the dropped domains but there may be no natural drops as the deleting domains might be hoovered up for auction by the registries or by large registrars.

The second anniversary is sometimes more lethal as it is the Hold'em or Fold'em time for those hanging on to their domains hoping for an increase in value.

Development and usage runs in parallel with all of this. If there is no significant development in the first six to eleven months, then the perception that the TLD is a Dead Zone will grow amongst prospective registrants. If you see registries providing dodgy figures about usage and PPC landing pages for undeveloped domains claimed to be simple redirects, then it is almost certain that there is a problem.

Regards...jmcc

---------- Post added at 05:03 AM ---------- Previous post was at 04:47 AM ----------

For a large TLD with global appeal, this tends to happen after the first six months of operation. I'm not an expert on market values but there are compressed landrush phases visible with some of the new gTLDs and trends that take months to show up (e.g the big weekend slowdowns) are appearing within weeks.

With the variable registration fees and renewal rates, some of these new gTLDs will have a battle ahead to break 100K registration in a year.

Regards...jmcc

Using .mobi as an example, do you think the current market would be dramatically different if the registry had no held back Premium domains?

 

[Keith]

Using .mobi as an example, do you think the current market would be dramatically different if the registry had no held back Premium domains?

No, and it won't be different with this cash grab attempt either.

That's the problem. It's only a play to get money by forcing companies to protect their brand and sucker newbies who don't know any better. There isn't a long term strategy involved. But if we want the truth behind these extensions, just look at how much icann made!

Do you think it's wise for 1000 restaurants to open on the same block? A few might weather the storm but odds of success are slim :imho:

 

[jmcc]

Using .mobi as an example, do you think the current market would be dramatically different if the registry had no held back Premium domains?

No. They are not generally the same thing. The .mobi was massively promoted and backed. There's no sign of most of these new gTLDs being backed to the same extent. Some of them are extrapolations of domain tasting trends and the TLD string acts as a limiting factor. With TLDs like .com (and .mobi), the bulk of the creativity occurs left of the dot and the TLD string is only part of the name when it is a domain hack. The problem for many of these new gTLDs is that they are domain hacks. Using premiums to create some kind of initial market buzz might help their registration volume but the biggest problem for these new gTLDs will be public confusion and indifference.

Regards...jmcc

 

[scandiman]

No, and it won't be different with this cash grab attempt either.

That's the problem. It's only a play to get money by forcing companies to protect their brand and sucker newbies who don't know any better. There isn't a long term strategy involved. But if we want the truth behind these extensions, just look at how much icann made!

Do you think it's wise for 1000 restaurants to open on the same block? A few might weather the storm but odds of success are slim :imho:

Premiums and trademarks is two very different issues. I agree that the registries are likely hoping for a certain amount of default registration volume from the likes of apple, but that is far different from them holding premium keywords like dating, games, or whatever may be a strong keyword when paired with the given extension, and importantly what the registry does with them and their ongoing efforts (if any) long term.

But if you feel there is no change to the fate of a tld with or without a Premium name list then why does it matter either way to you?

Your restaurant example though is very interesting, there are plenty of examples of the benefits of clustering together competitors that lifts most boats. Take a malls food court for example, by bringing together 10-20 dining options the public views the court as a whole as a food destination as opposed to just one food vendor. It often works the same in neighborhoods as well, and zoning laws reflect the fact, at least that's how it works around these parts. We can visit certain neighborhoods around here that offer a multitude of dining options. Yes the various restaurants must compete but together they bring in many more customers for each as a dining destination than one could alone. A thousand restaurants is a totally different scale though. What this has to do with Premium names though escapes me, hopefully you cam connect the dots since its your example to begin with.

 

[scandiman]

No. They are not generally the same thing. The .mobi was massively promoted and backed. There's no sign of most of these new gTLDs being backed to the same extent. Some of them are extrapolations of domain tasting trends and the TLD string acts as a limiting factor. With TLDs like .com (and .mobi), the bulk of the creativity occurs left of the dot and the TLD string is only part of the name when it is a domain hack. The problem for many of these new gTLDs is that they are domain hacks. Using premiums to create some kind of initial market buzz might help their registration volume but the biggest problem for these new gTLDs will be public confusion and indifference.

Regards...jmcc

Yes, I agree there will be some initial confusion, that happens with any change. But the indifference aspect really comes down to useful content which is kinda the whole point of the web anyway. The public is indifferent to .anything until the content offered there is what is desired. In another thread I described how I regularly visit non-com websites on .aero, .coop, .mobi, .edu, .org, .gov, .net, .us, .travel, etc. I do so because that is where I find the desired content and don't struggle with the tld in the least. The landscape is already changing, this mass release will only push things further since useful content is bound to appear on these tlds. The public couldn't give a rats ass about a premium name list, it's just something domainers love to whine about and label a cash grab just because they themselves couldn't reg the name by hand and sell for their own profit.

 

[mjnels]

pretty much, and this nonsense about the public getting familiar with an extension, comfortable enough to use it... thats over. its done with. it had its chance when there were only a handful. it'll be about content... there can be "popular" content on a TLD with only 1,500 registrations - it doesnt matter and there isnt some time limit aside from the registry staying alive financially.. even that doesnt really matter since the TLD will likely get swallowed up by a donuts.co like entity thats already operating hundreds of TLD's... not gonna cost anything extra to add several more .weird's to their inventory

now with thousands about to exist the whole IDEA of getting familiar with a TLD is some weird domainer way of thinking from the past.

you guys that are obsessed with registration volume dont get it. registrations mean nothing. just like pretending whether its different that a domainer is holding all the valuable terms or the registry is holding all the valuable terms - it makes no difference.

also most of you guys talk like you're a stockholder in the registry or something... take a step back from your "numbers" and realize its not about volume anymore, it never really was.

 

[JB Lions]

pretty much, and this nonsense about the public getting familiar with an extension, comfortable enough to use it... thats over. its done with. it had its chance when there were only a handful. it'll be about content... there can be "popular" content on a TLD with only 1,500 registrations - it doesnt matter and there isnt some time limit aside from the registry staying alive financially.. even that doesnt really matter since the TLD will likely get swallowed up by a donuts.co like entity thats already operating hundreds of TLD's... not gonna cost anything extra to add several more .weird's to their inventory

now with thousands about to exist the whole IDEA of getting familiar with a TLD is some weird domainer way of thinking from the past.

you guys that are obsessed with registration volume dont get it. registrations mean nothing. just like pretending whether its different that a domainer is holding all the valuable terms or the registry is holding all the valuable terms - it makes no difference.

also most of you guys talk like you're a stockholder in the registry or something... take a step back from your "numbers" and realize its not about volume anymore, it never really was.

You're posting the same stuff that has already been taken apart. Numbers don't matter nonsense. Numbers are one of the reasons you aren't touching them and think (rightfully so) they're a bad investment for domainers.

Can the public visit any site regardless of extension? Can you find sites on any extension? YES. But from a domainer perspective, investing, you notice we're on a domaining forum, good? NO and you acknowledge that. Yet you still argue.

"there can be "popular" content on a TLD with only 1,500 registrations"

There can be but there is a better chance on TLDs with higher registrations. Again, stuff we've already gone over.

Since mj is a big number fan, some from yesterday from new gtlds, 20 and under

0 - voyage
3
3
3
4
4
4
4
6
7
7
8
9
9
10
10
11
11
12
13
13
14
15
16
17
19
20
20

tel had 275 with a net of 169

 

[mjnels]

You're posting the same stuff that has already been taken apart. Numbers don't matter nonsense. Numbers are one of the reasons you aren't touching them and think (rightfully so) they're a bad investment for domainers.

Can the public visit any site regardless of extension? Can you find sites on any extension? YES. But from a domainer perspective, investing, you notice we're on a domaining forum, good? NO and you acknowledge that. Yet you still argue.

"there can be "popular" content on a TLD with only 1,500 registrations"

There can be but there is a better chance on TLDs with higher registrations. Again, stuff we've already gone over.

well, you already posted this stuff too. you can "go over" stuff as much as you like.. it doesnt mean a consensus was reached.

you still have the wrong angle.

 

[Cool.Ventures]

I think it is a bad strategy for two reasons:
First, shelving "premium" inventory means that lots of domains will not be available to qualified end users (possibly through a RFP process), that could otherwise develop them into meaningful websites and enhance the standing of the TLD. TLDs don't shine without development.

Second, the market value can go down very quickly past the launch phase and when the excitement and initial interest has waned.
.mobi is the best known example.
In the first two years, a number of premium keywords sold for 6 figures (you remember one guy was actually willing to pay 600K for music.mobi until the auction crashed).
Then poof - nothing.

A few months ago, .mobi domains like realestate, properties, hotels have dropped and were snapped easily.
In the history of domaining, there has been never a TLD losing so much of its value.
The registry has retained an inventory of domains like sex.mobi, that could have fetched good money back in the day. Now they could barely give them away.

In other younger extensions, the value has not appreciated either: .biz .us or .info are worth even less than in the past.

.mobi is obsolete forever replaced by subdomains such as m.facebook.com and website design that is friendly for mobile devices as well as large monitors.

 

[JB Lions]

well, you already posted this stuff too. you can "go over" stuff as much as you like.. it doesnt mean a consensus was reached.

you still have the wrong angle.

What it means, when you actually think like a domainer, is that you agree with me on whether these are good investments or not. This is a domaining forum. Most people here are interested in the market. Buying, selling, investing, making money. Your posts are a bit Jekyll Hyde sometimes. Sometimes you get what I just posted. Other times you're like, sales are an old way of thinking. They matter. In your business, you don't care about sales?

 

[mjnels]

What it means, when you actually think like a domainer, is that you agree with me on whether these are good investments or not. This is a domaining forum. Most people here are interested in the market. Buying, selling, investing, making money. Your posts are a bit Jekyll Hyde sometimes. Sometimes you get what I just posted. Other times you're like, sales are an old way of thinking. They matter, in this business. In your business, you care about sales, do you not?

you keep twisting what i say. im saying the phrase.matters

the TLD itself doesnt.. the 2 words put together do. its why keeping track of registration numbers per TLD doesnt mean anything except how much money the registry is or isnt making.

in your world, a TLD with 10,000,000 registrations would be a better investment than a TLD with 500 registrations. im saying your wrong, none of these TLD are going to gain "critical mass" because they dont need to when you can now put nearly any word+word together with a dot in the middle.

 

[Keith]

Numbers matter, regardless of what business you're operating. In fact, numbers are really the only thing that matter. If you're not profitable, you won't last long.

1000 new restaurants, each getting a few customers spells doom. There's only so many patrons to go around. The internet is no different.

 

[mjnels]

Numbers matter, regardless of what business you're operating. In fact, numbers are really the only thing that matter. If you're not profitable, you won't last long.

1000 new restaurants, each getting a few customers spells doom. There's only so many patrons to go around. The internet is no different.

so when a registry doesnt make enough to cover their 185k fee and they give up - and another registry buys it for 1 penny or is given the rights to run it, for no cost - how does that matter to anyone but the registry that lost money?

it doesnt. its all crap happening during the meantime. domainers are under the illusion that a good portion of these are going to ultimately be deleted from the root.

i doubt that will happen when another registry can add it to their inventory management for nothing. the 185k fee doesnt matter - its already sunk.

 

[Keith]

so when a registry doesnt make enough to cover their 185k fee and they give up - and another registry buys it for 1 penny or is given the rights to run it, for no cost - how does that matter to anyone but the registry that lost money?

You're assuming another registry is going to want to take on hundreds of worthless tlds. Since when does a failing business get an automatic buyout?

 

[mjnels]

You're assuming another registry is going to want to take on hundreds of worthless tlds. Since when does a failing business get an automatic buyout?

when that business is simply a data file on a server that doesnt cost anything to run to a registry that is already running 200 TLD's. you really think integrating 10 .weird's is going to cost an already existing registry anything to run?

you reaaaaaaaaaaly think like half of these are just going to be deleted from the root? :lol:

 

[Keith]

when that business is simply a data file on a server that doesnt cost anything to run to a registry that is already running 200 TLD's. you really think integrating 10 .weird's is going to cost an already existing registry anything to run?

you reaaaaaaaaaaly think like half of these are just going to be deleted from the root? :lol:

Let's try this a different way.

There's lots of gold coins in the ocean that nobody will ever find. It's something that could have value but as it sits is really worth nothing. Most of these new tlds will never be found. So yeah, basically worthless.

 

[scandiman]

Numbers matter, regardless of what business you're operating. In fact, numbers are really the only thing that matter. If you're not profitable, you won't last long.

1000 new restaurants, each getting a few customers spells doom. There's only so many patrons to go around. The internet is no different.

The web is about as non zero sum of a game as there is right now

 

[Keith]

The web is about as non zero sum of a game as there is right now

For who? Lots of angles to be covered by such a statement.

 

[jmcc]

now with thousands about to exist the whole IDEA of getting familiar with a TLD is some weird domainer way of thinking from the past.

No. It is how the hosting business tends to think of the business. If a TLD is popular then they will sell it. If it is not popular, then there is little point becoming a registrar for that TLD. If there are too few registrars for a TLD, then the TLD becomes more difficult to register. And if a large retail hoster does include it in its mug-out page of TLDs, then the chances of that TLD gaining significant market share is low. If a TLD is not on Godaddy's list, then it is going to find it nearly impossible to get significant numbers of registrations in the North American market. This pattern of key webhosters is replicated in each mature country level market. If the key registrars/hosters in that country don't offer the TLD for registration, then the TLD will not make significant inroads.

you guys that are obsessed with registration volume dont get it. registrations mean nothing.

I don't look at things as just a domainer. I have to be able to see things from the registry, registrar and web hoster's viewpoints too. For these, registration volume and upsells are critical.

just like pretending whether its different that a domainer is holding all the valuable terms or the registry is holding all the valuable terms - it makes no difference.

It is actually a lot more serious in the early phase of a TLD because the concept of a rigged game might filter through from domainers to the ordinary mom and pop businesses that might be prospective registrants and developers.

also most of you guys talk like you're a stockholder in the registry or something... take a step back from your "numbers" and realize its not about volume anymore, it never really was.

For registries and registrars, it is part of the bigger picture as is content (usage).

Getting back to the idea of getting familiar with a TLD, it is not as weird as it sounds but if your only experience has been in .COM or gTLDs then it will seem weird. In ccTLDs the idea that people become familiar with their local ccTLD and begin to identify with it. They see it every where and people begin developing sites in the TLD. It is a virtuous circle of awareness -> development -> usage -> awareness.

Regards...jmcc