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Suggestion for stopping fake buyers

Labeled as discuss in Domain Buying and Selling Discussion, started by topdom, Apr 22, 2020

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  1. topdom

    topdom Top Contributor VIP

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    I buy a domain, and let's say it has 10 percent chance of being sold for 1K in the first year. So it is worth $100 to me. A fake buyer shows up and I "sell" this domain at Sedo or AN for 1K, but it remains unpaid, and let's say 1 month of waiting time is wasted and in that period I may have missed some real offers. So it is like, anyone can steal my $10 (corresponding to 1 month of $100/year), and marketplaces help such fake buyers with their fake purchases.

    This needs to be stopped !!!
    It is very easy.

    1. A user should pay $10 to the marketplace just before placing a bid.

    2. It will be refundable if the user closes his account, or if there is no active negotiation or transaction.

    3. If a deal is made, but cancelled, and the buyer is the guilty party, then that $10 should be taken
    form user's account and should be paid to the seller.

    This would be a legitimate earning for the seller, because
    he is wasting his time, and may be missing real offers, because of such fake transactions.
    And "buyer"'s account would be closed after second violation.
    If the buyer wants to cheat again, he will know that he will have to pay another $10. More than one cheating, should mean permanent ban, if detected.

    I believe/suspect, marketplaces are not willing to do this, because sometimes they act as broker,
    instead of a marketplace. This explains tons of lowballs and unpaid sales.

    If marketplaces are honest, and they are just getting the percentages, and not playing some other dirty games (more dirty than shillibidding), then making such a change in their system should be to their advantage as well. Because the more and better sales we make, the more money they make, because their earnings is just a percentage of ours.

    By not making such a change, I suspect, marketplaces are admitting being fraudsters.
     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2020
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  2. DirkS

    DirkS Dutchman.info VIP

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    There are already venues requiring a payment to be able to request a quote.
     
  3. 7363824

    7363824 Restricted (Market)

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    Car salesmen have to deal with people coming on their lot kicking the tires taking a test drive of that fancy new sports car that have no intentions of or means to buy.

    Its just the nature of selling things.
     
  4. biggie

    biggie GreenFriendly.com VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    Hi

    your scenario starts with a flaw

    a year is 12 months, so 1 month = $12

    still, even if you are waiting to get paid.... that doesn't stop offers from coming via email, phone, etc
    as it has happened to me recently

    and if, they did, it's up to you to decide from there, but the possibility is not removed.

    additionally, it's not a fake buyer or a fake purchase, if and when, the transaction isn't completed.

    so, as @Ryan217 pointed out, it's just the nature of selling

    imo….
     
  5. Furquah

    Furquah Brand Ambassador INDIA Epik.com Staff VIP

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    You are selling something. So yes you get fake buyer, you get low baller and yes you get a real buyer.
     
  6. topdom

    topdom Top Contributor VIP

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    If half of sales are fake, then there is a serious problem.
     
  7. biggie

    biggie GreenFriendly.com VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    don't know about your deals, but...

    all of my sales, were paid for in US currency
    and none of those dollars were fake.
    therefore, all of those sales were real.

    imo...
     
  8. TheBuyerz

    TheBuyerz Established Member

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    Sincerly, it happened to me for one of my domain names.

    I got around 4 offers but they were all fake and no continuation from the buyers' side.

    But there is no problem with it, since there were interests on the domain, this will bring also real buyers.
     
  9. draco

    draco Upgraded Member Blue Account ★★★★★★★★★★

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    There are some people that won't pay just to place a bid, even if they'll get their money back eventually. So that will hurt the marketplaces. What about multiple bids? There are some months when I'll make offers on 50 or more listings. (Yes, I can pay for them all if they're all accepted.) Do I need to put down a deposit for each one?

    Fair is fair. Are you going to put down a deposit for every domain you list to go to the buyer if you're the one that doesn't complete the sale?
     
  10. stub

    stub DNStore.com PRO VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    I would try an alternative seller, like Afternic. I don't know for certain, but I don't recall this kind of thing happening to me there. Sorry I have no recent experience with Sedo. I stopped using them years ago. In DAN, they ban sellers who don't sell to a buyer. I would presume they would do the same with buyers. Or at least it gets resolved sooner. Like in 1-2 weeks. There are probably others. I'm not recommending anyone here. I'm just saying there are lots of options. You just need to go out and do your research.
     
  11. topdom

    topdom Top Contributor VIP

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    By fake sale I mean, legally binding deal made, but not paid for a month even after a fake legal action by Sedo (debt collection, do they really do it, of course not, they pretend).
     
  12. topdom

    topdom Top Contributor VIP

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    Good, ok then I make a small change. You will have to keep $10 at Sedo when you have an active bid, $20 for bids on two domains , and less or none for the rest. After two cheatings your account would be closed, and remaining deals would be cancelled.

    Also if you are making 50 bids then you are a domainer, or you represent a registrar or another marketplace
    then discouraging such bids would make sense. For example if whenever Godaddy receives an inquiry on one of our domains , they bid at Sedo instead of informing us, then blocking such a thing would be a very good thing.

    Brokers selling domains which they don't own need to be stopped.
     
  13. Abdullah Abdullah

    Abdullah Abdullah Top Contributor VIP

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    Venues like Domain Agents require the potential buyer to pay $20. Try to communicate with the marketplace you have the name listed if you suspect the buyer is fake and will not proceed with the sale.
     
  14. lock

    lock DomainUsed.com VIP

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    I can see the loop hole delay and others will keep doing it till change tactics.
     
  15. AnthonyD

    AnthonyD Optimal Names VIP

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    Next exactly the same thing. The buyer has agreed to make a payment. In doing so they have taken the asset off the marker. The car remains on the lot whether you test drive it every day and kicks its tires. Someone else can come buy 5 minutes before closing time and buy the car. Its there. Available.

    Similar for a house - you can get your agent to show you the house every day if you want, it still remains available to anyone else to look at and purchase. In fact, if I want to make an offer on a house in the country I am in I need to put some money down. Same with the car. They want to see that you are serious or that contract doesnt come out. If I dont buy that car or house I lose my earnest money for taking their asset off the market for x-days.
     
  16. biggie

    biggie GreenFriendly.com VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    Hi

    my reason for disputing these occurrences expressed here
    is because I've used sedo for over a decade
    during that time, had only 1 offer that I accepted, which wasn't completed because "Sedo" canceled the transaction.... due to buyers inability to secure payment.

    so when i read fake this and fake that, and other accusations/insinuations which are thrown out without concrete evidence and or a string of what if scenarios.... then I have to raise the questions

    is it just some people have, or get, all the bad breaks more often than others
    or do they put themselves in these positions recklessly,
    then fault the platforms built to serve your interests and intents?

    not saying it is, either way, for anybody in particular, but if or when it becomes a pattern...

    imo….
     
  17. AnthonyD

    AnthonyD Optimal Names VIP

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    I am not sure how a seller could "put themselves in these positions recklessly". Please explain.
     
  18. 7363824

    7363824 Restricted (Market)

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    Never heard if needing earnest money fir a car 🤣. And few domains are as valuable as a house.
    The point is selling anything domain or car you are going to have to deal with time wasters. And until that cash is in your account anything can and will happen its part of doing business.
     
  19. biggie

    biggie GreenFriendly.com VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    well, for one, by using a service, without reading the TOS
    then later when you post an issue, someone else points to the terms of service

    and you're like, "oh... didn't know that"

    just saying...


    imo...


    -
     
  20. AnthonyD

    AnthonyD Optimal Names VIP

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    Come on, I am not disputing that "time wasters" are an annoying part of this or any business. I dont think anyone is. Those who go from asking "what is the price?" (negotiating), unless it was BIN, to agreeing to purchase the domain enter into a legally binding contract according to the various marketplaces. Yes, anything can and sometimes does happen, but there are legal remedies for breaching an agreement to purchase. You cant tell me that breaching contracts to purchase has become acceptable in this day and age. If it is what a sad state of affairs when we cant take people at their word anymore.
     
  21. AnthonyD

    AnthonyD Optimal Names VIP

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    What the OP is saying is that they wish for the TOS to change to better protect the seller. I fail to understand how this is an issue almost at the point of defending why it should remain as-is. Its perplexing, something as simple as wanting more protection for us domain sellers gets so much push-back.
     
  22. 7363824

    7363824 Restricted (Market)

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    I did not say it was acceptable just it happens in domaining and outside of domaining. Nothing special to domaining.
     
  23. biggie

    biggie GreenFriendly.com VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    Hi
    if, you read my first post, I stated opinion why OP's premise or scenario had flaws.

    my push-back was related to those flaws, and I posted my experience with same platform, in contrast.

    if, I use same venue, then same possibilities exist for me, as well as others.

    so, it's not about "defending a "remain as is" status quo.
    but one has to know "all the what if's" that could happen, if and when you accept an offer
    like the buyer may not pay or the funds they thought they had or were going to get, didn't materialize
    or their bank, can't or won't send or approve or sedo's bank won't approve.

    there are states in USA that escrow.com won't approve from, so if buyer live there and don't know TOS prior to, enters agreement, then tah-dah, no deal..... and seller may be on hook for fee.

    still, it's how you react to or anticipate prior to those possibilities, if and when they become realities, that matter now or in the future.

    like // i get a nice offer and accept right away,
    but in my mind i'm saying this mo-fo ain't gonna follow thru, simply because i accepted first offer.
    then, when or if they don't follow thru on the deal, it's no biggie, because i anticipated it.

    not gonna call it out as a fake buyer, because i really don't know their circumstances.
    was it preconceived deceit or just some unfortunate :poop: that happened for the potential buyer?

    just saying....


    imo...
     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2020
  24. 7363824

    7363824 Restricted (Market)

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    Interestingly enough even when buying a home there are circumstances where a buyer can back out and retain their earnest money. Sometimes there are things beyond the buyers control that happen.

    For most domains IMO it doesn't make sense to have the concept of earnest money, until you get into xxx,xxx+ deals maybe.
     
  25. biggie

    biggie GreenFriendly.com VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    Hi

    if you can sell, using lease to own option,
    then their first payment is the deposit, and...you still own the property until all installments are paid.

    so, cents it does make :)

    imo….
     

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