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advice Is there a way to get my domain back?

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Spiraldom

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Recently I sold a domain to a small web design company in Boston.

The domain was registered at Namesilo,
so I told them that the easiest way of transfer is to push the domain to their Namesilo account.
They opened an account at Namesilo, I pushed the domain, they paid, everything went fine.

A few weeks later I get an email from PayPal
saying that the buyer has stated that they have not received the item and want a refund.
This was a message from the buyer:

„I purchased a domain name from Spiraldom on Jan 22 2nd who contacted me by email. He said, the domain is going to your hosting account shortly, the domain name was ONLY pushed but not transferred. I never got the domain transferred. Please cancel the transaction and need the $75 backThank you“

I responded that I never said that I'm going to transfer the domain to their hosting account
and that I pushed the domain to their Namesilo account
and if they want they can transfer it to any other registrar.

There was no response.

Finally, I refunded the money because Paypal asked me for transaction proof
and I didn't have any, and after all, it was just $75.

After that, I sent the buyer another email
asking to push the domain back to my Namesilo account.

No reply.

So, is there something I can do to get my domain back?

Thanks
 
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The views expressed on this page by users and staff are their own, not those of NamePros.
the transaction proof is the email you get for account change/push

if namesilo doesn't send any, you can talk to namesilo support to send you something that says officially that on date X domain Y was pushed from yuo to person Z.

they are nice support. they could coopeate with that kind of info.

but they will not cooperate to push domain back to you. as no registrar gets involved in disputes.

too bad you refunded them. now its probably all closed. but its something you can remember for future. paypal doesn't require all that much as proof you delivered yuor part of deal. they are flexible and not stupid. but you gotta give them more than nothing.

cheers
 
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Thanks for a quick reply Alcy.
Yeah, Namesilo doesn't send any email after the push.
I sent a response to PayPal that I can provide the proof from Namesilo as I contacted Namesilo support and they responded very quickly.
But PayPal just wanted transaction number or they'll issue a refund.
There was no other option.
So I just refunded the money.
 
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transaction#? what does that even mean.. there is no such thing as transaction# for domain transfers and they know it.. its all about ownerships.. screenshots.. new owner vs old one.. they want emails, proof of ownership.. if applicable and changed during push or transfer, you could have even sent them screenshot of new owner whois info.

I had a couple similar situations before. as I said, paypal is not stupid and knows people can take advntage of digital good transfers. which is why they now protect people against digital goods fraud too.

usually its best to call paypal for this though. emails or even claim messages dont' work as good imo.

cheers
 
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Genuine question: Any reason why you did not use Namesilo's marketplace itself? So much easier and better...

Also, as @alcy stated, you should have provided proof to Paypal about the push and transfer. Pretty sure Namesilo could have provided proof about the push. Additionally, you should also have provided the buyer's confirmation e-mail regarding acceptance of the push at Namesilo.

This is very shitty on the buyer's part and you should let them know that you're going to go public with their name and all communication. For a small shop, reputation is important and when a high search result comes with them being marked as fraudulent, maybe it will make them come to their senses.
 
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Maybe @namesilo can explain how this happened and what can be done to ensure smooth transaction not using their marketplace. I was always under the impression if I did a push, which is a transfer(without 1 year added), I would be protected knowing namesilo can verify the change of ownership. Yes, having buyer pay thru them would have been easier but guess op figured he was safe with a push and 10$ means a lot to some people.

Name and shame, they received the product and must have had control. Any proof of dns changes or actions taken while they posess the name?
 
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Only one mistake here and that is how you used paypal. It should clearly state payment for domain.com and if possible use a paypal invoice.

I have used paypal for hundreds of transactions over the years and ask anyone who has dealt with me an invoice and description of goods sold is always present.

You cannot argue with facts and paypal will look at the invoice and description as proof.

Lesson learned for future paypal transaction.

PS. Never us friends and family, no recourse there. I would rather pay the fee myself than use that insecure way of payment. They don't give a hoot about it because it was supposed to be a friend or family. You try and cheat that system and they will hang you out to dry.
 
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transaction#? what does that even mean.. there is no such thing as transaction# for domain transfers and they know it.. its all about ownerships.. screenshots.. new owner vs old one.. they want emails, proof of ownership.. if applicable and changed during push or transfer, you could have even sent them screenshot of new owner whois info.

I had a couple similar situations before. as I said, paypal is not stupid and knows people can take advntage of digital good transfers. which is why they now protect people against digital goods fraud too.

usually its best to call paypal for this though. emails or even claim messages dont' work as good imo.

cheers
transaction#? what does that even mean.. there is no such thing as transaction# for domain transfers and they know it.. its all about ownerships.. screenshots.. new owner vs old one.. they want emails, proof of ownership.. if applicable and changed during push or transfer, you could have even sent them screenshot of new owner whois info.

I had a couple similar situations before. as I said, paypal is not stupid and knows people can take advntage of digital good transfers. which is why they now protect people against digital goods fraud too.

usually its best to call paypal for this though. emails or even claim messages dont' work as good imo.

cheers
I think Paypal has new resolution center.
The process was automated.
After no reply from the buyer, I pushed the button "escalate to PayPal" and explained to them what happened, and if they need the proof I can send them screenshots.
Then it said that the case is being reviewed by PayPal and to wait 5 minutes (?)
After 5 minutes it brought me back to step 3 which said "requiring your action" and I could only refund the money or show them the proof with some transaction number.
 
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In paypal, there are a lot of different departments that deal with everything and really their left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing. I had numerous issues with them or with my contragents when i couldnt get any sane support directly; now i already have my bitter experience so i always write and call to any paypal support contact i could ever find. Ofentimes your local country paypal can't solve what the central paypal can, and vice versa! In your case, i would just send to every possible contact my correspondence with Namesilo.
 
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Maybe @namesilo can explain how this happened and what can be done to ensure smooth transaction not using their marketplace. I was always under the impression if I did a push, which is a transfer(without 1 year added), I would be protected knowing namesilo can verify the change of ownership. Yes, having buyer pay thru them would have been easier but guess op figured he was safe with a push and 10$ means a lot to some people.

Name and shame, they received the product and must have had control. Any proof of dns changes or actions taken while they posess the name?

When I got an email from PayPal I thought that the buyer didn't get the domain, as I still didn't see the message from the buyer.
So I contacted Namesilo support and asked if the domain is in the buyer's account.
they quickly responded saying: "Yes, the domain is in that account. We strongly recommend using our Marketplace for sales as we ensure payment is made and the domain issued to the Buyer right away.
Thanks,"

There were no DNS changes, and WHOIS is now set to private
 
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You could have put a BIN for sale page on the domain through namesilo and namesilo would have handled the money and domain exchange. They act as like an escrow, much safer.

Anyway your proof to paypal is the email from namesilo with the confirmation of domain push.
 
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Only one mistake here and that is how you used paypal. It should clearly state payment for domain.com and if possible use a paypal invoice.

I have used paypal for hundreds of transactions over the years and ask anyone who has dealt with me an invoice and description of goods sold is always present.

You cannot argue with facts and paypal will look at the invoice and description as proof.

Lesson learned for future paypal transaction.

PS. Never us friends and family, no recourse there. I would rather pay the fee myself than use that insecure way of payment. They don't give a hoot about it because it was supposed to be a friend or family. You try and cheat that system and they will hang you out to dry.

I sent them an invoice, and the invoice says:
For the purchase, transfer, and full ownership rights of domainname.com
 
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Genuine question: Any reason why you did not use Namesilo's marketplace itself? So much easier and better...

Also, as @alcy stated, you should have provided proof to Paypal about the push and transfer. Pretty sure Namesilo could have provided proof about the push. Additionally, you should also have provided the buyer's confirmation e-mail regarding acceptance of the push at Namesilo.

This is very sh*tty on the buyer's part and you should let them know that you're going to go public with their name and all communication. For a small shop, reputation is important and when a high search result comes with them being marked as fraudulent, maybe it will make them come to their senses.

I didn't use Namesilo marketplace as it was only $75, I had good conversation with the buyer, and after all, I approached them first, didn't expect to get scammed ;)
 
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I know that $75 isn't much money but you could send them a nice letter to inform them that you will file charges for fraudulent activity with Boston law enforcement office. You should get proof of namesilo that you pushed the domain to their account. Give them 48 hours to pay back the money.
It's time for them to worry about their reputation! No mercy!
 
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I sent them an invoice, and the invoice says:
For the purchase, transfer, and full ownership rights of domainname.com

Did you also put that in the comment section of the paypal transaction?

If you did it's cut and dry, I have never had an issue getting funds back from Paypal when all the paper trails were intact.
 
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Did you also put that in the comment section of the paypal transaction?

If you did it's cut and dry, I have never had an issue getting funds back from Paypal when all the paper trails were intact.
No, I didn't. I just put it in the description under the item name
 
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The invoice itself will give you ammunition but putting in the description

Full Payment for Sale of domain.com

That makes it very easy and if the owner claims a chargeback all you have to do is show proof he has ownership of the domain and paypal will let you keep your funds. The invoice itself is also good to have and it should work for your claim. Make a note to always mention what you are selling or buying in the comment field.

It is also VERY IMPORTANT that you put FULL PAYMENT so that the other party cannot claim partial funds are still owed.

Cover your ASSets at all time and transactions with paypal will go relatively smooth.
 
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If you notice the fraudsters lame reason for filing it —claims you did not transfer the domain so they are taking advantage of the wording you used. You should just mention it is a sale of a domain name in the future.

They even admit you pushed the domain into their possession so I think it’s best you try to get what you need from NameSilo and then call PayPal. They have admitted to possession now you just need proof from NameSilo if that’s possible.
 
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Name the company (address/phone/email) here so that no one else gets scammed by them OR by anyone else trying this scam.

But definitely name and shame as this isnt an innocent mistake. Intent is there to scam you and use the weak paypal customer service as a vehicle by which they're going to do so. Name them so when clients seek them out for their services they also read this. Also report them to BBB and Ripoff Report.

Also, IMHO: escrow only - always, or no deal.

Best of luck, I hope you get your name ripped away from them and they have to come back begging for it. This garbage has to stop.
 
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If you were still involved in the PayPal dispute or if PP had ruled against you you actually could have reopened the dispute. Have seen that happen.

But you refunded the money - PP did not rule against you. You are done as far as PP.
 
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Name and shame please. Lets index them as fraudsters.
 
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If you were still involved in the PayPal dispute or if PP had ruled against you you actually could have reopened the dispute. Have seen that happen.

But you refunded the money - PP did not rule against you. You are done as far as PP.
PP gave me 3 options, to refund the money, to message the buyer again and to show some transaction # or they would rule in the buyers favor. so I refunded the money
 
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You did the wrong thing. You should’ve just phoned PayPal at that time. They would’ve restructured the dispute. You also could’ve uploaded screen shots of before and after WhoIs and of the record of push to something like Imgur and submitted those image URLs to the buyer via PayPal message or to the dispute itself (via comments) along with a made up transaction number, and THEN phoned PayPal. Maybe you even had a transaction number all along - the receipt for the push order might’ve had a number on it.

Keep all this in mind for the future.
 
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Let's burn the witch! :) Joking aside, I emailed them to return the domain by the end of the week
or I'll be forced to take legal action.
But the real question that I wanted to ask is how to scare them so they would return the domain? :)
 
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Start by telling him you will be publishing details including his contact information.
 
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