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.tv GEO Question: How small of city would you go?

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What sort of minimum population would you require before you register a GEO?

All big cities are taken. Now there are towns here and there that have sizeable populations, but will require intensive ground work to generate the advertising leads to support it. Still, it could be worthwhile to someone that is on the ground locally.

I would love to hear your perspectives on this.
 
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AfternicAfternic
who knows.

ballpark? personally, i would be wary below 100K if I don't live there and it isn't a big-time tourist destination.

i haven't been perfectly consistent with this in the past, but the last 6 months I have.

I passed up boisecity multiple times and it is above 150K because when I thought to myself, realistically, is the day ever going to come when I wake up and think: "Today I have enough time and energy to go crack into the local BoiseCity market and this is going to be worthwhile" or recruiting someone in Boise City to do it for me. And I have concluded "no". Now it certainly would be worth the time of someone in Boise City who knows in about 10 seconds who are the only likely 40 firms that might advertise in this thing...

By that theory, I have lots of small GEOs around New York where I live, e.g. "LongIslandCity.tv" because I figure if need be, I can hire a college student to traipse around there and give it a shot. I also own a bunch of town names in Cyprus where I am from partially because it is more practical and partially because of sentimental value. But mostly I have stayed pretty to big cities, countries, etc.

Beyond that, my riskiest hand-regs GEOs tend to be foreign (e.g Aqaba in Jordan or Fortaleza in Brazil or SanSebastian in Spain). Now these are even harder to manage from New York, but they are important enough, 2nd tier places that it might be worth someone relatively serious locally's time to work on this with me. But foreign has been picked over for quite some time...actually, oddly, before the US.

Overall, I think small vertical product categories have more potential than small GEOs. To take one of my silliest names, I have smokedsalmon.tv (yum, delicious!) But in all seriousness, that is easier to develop than BoiseCity, IMO. You can figure out who the major providers in 30 minutes with Google, you can reach them remotely and pretty quickly get a sense of how much, if anything, they are willing to do with you and your audience is national, even international.

Caveats:

1 / I think more from a development standpoint, though I think some of the same applies to resale. The market for Houston.tv (which I do not own) will always be 10x more liquid than for XYZville.tv. And I don't just mean "worth more", but "worth more and a lot easier to sell if needed"

2 / I don't mean to start a flame war. I am sure some will do just fine with small GEOs but it will take a lot of hustle
 
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You need to go with where you know...
Or get it to flip...
 
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antonis12 said:
who knows.

ballpark? personally, i would be wary below 100K if I don't live there and it isn't a big-time tourist destination.

i haven't been perfectly consistent with this in the past, but the last 6 months I have.

I passed up boisecity multiple times and it is above 150K because when I thought to myself, realistically, is the day ever going to come when I wake up and think: "Today I have enough time and energy to go crack into the local BoiseCity market and this is going to be worthwhile" or recruiting someone in Boise City to do it for me. And I have concluded "no". Now it certainly would be worth the time of someone in Boise City who knows in about 10 seconds who are the only likely 40 firms that might advertise in this thing...

By that theory, I have lots of small GEOs around New York where I live, e.g. "LongIslandCity.tv" because I figure if need be, I can hire a college student to traipse around there and give it a shot. I also own a bunch of town names in Cyprus where I am from partially because it is more practical and partially because of sentimental value. But mostly I have stayed pretty to big cities, countries, etc.

Beyond that, my riskiest hand-regs GEOs tend to be foreign (e.g Aqaba in Jordan or Fortaleza in Brazil or SanSebastian in Spain). Now these are even harder to manage from New York, but they are important enough, 2nd tier places that it might be worth someone relatively serious locally's time to work on this with me. But foreign has been picked over for quite some time...actually, oddly, before the US.

Overall, I think small vertical product categories have more potential than small GEOs. To take one of my silliest names, I have smokedsalmon.tv (yum, delicious!) But in all seriousness, that is easier to develop than BoiseCity, IMO. You can figure out who the major providers in 30 minutes with Google, you can reach them remotely and pretty quickly get a sense of how much, if anything, they are willing to do with you and your audience is national, even international.

Caveats:

1 / I think more from a development standpoint, though I think some of the same applies to resale. The market for Houston.tv (which I do not own) will always be 10x more liquid than for XYZville.tv. And I don't just mean "worth more", but "worth more and a lot easier to sell if needed"

2 / I don't mean to start a flame war. I am sure some will do just fine with small GEOs but it will take a lot of hustle


All fair points, but whatever happened to the good old fashioned flip?!

You dont need to live in Boise City to sell it to someone from Boise City?!

PS. How much for SMOKEDSALMON.TV??!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
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MILLERSCROSSING said:
All fair points, but whatever happened to the good old fashioned flip?!

You dont need to live in Boise City to sell it to someone from Boise City?!

PS. How much for SMOKEDSALMON.TV??!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

i know, i know. i am oddly conservative. i saw oddly because my purchasing has not been conservative, but I still always think about development.

I don't want to count on the flip...

SmokedSalmon.tv is definitely not for sale. Most people laugh when I mention it, but I think it will do just fine. Google the term and see the AdWords in action.

And anyway I really like smoked salmon so I get a kick out of owning the name...
 
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antonis12 said:
i know, i know. i am oddly conservative. i saw oddly because my purchasing has not been conservative, but I still always think about development.

I don't want to count on the flip...

SmokedSalmon.tv is definitely not for sale. Most people laugh when I mention it, but I think it will do just fine. Google the term and see the AdWords in action.

And anyway I really like smoked salmon so I get a kick out of owning the name...

You're greek, stop stealing what is rightfully my heritage...stick to the hummus!!!!!

I understand where you are coming from on owning that particular name - if I never made a dollar from the name for the rest of my life, I would still get a kick out of owning it.......!!
 
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IMO population is way too simplistic of an approach and in many ways can be misleading.

First off there is the population within the city limits, the MSA population (Metropolitan Statistical Area) or Combined Statistical Areas (CSA) as well as Micropolitan Statistical Areas to consider and the Primary Census Statistical Areas to consider.

In other words, context is a key. The geographic area in relation to other cities.

The per capita income of the particular city. Which goes along with the type of commerce and companies based in that city.

Most importantly, combining all the above data with the population trends, real estate development trends, and search numbers before deciding the viability of a geo city, whether you plan to hold long term, as an investment, flip, or for development purposes.

Examples of this.

One recent purchase I made was littleton.tv outside of Denver (you may remember from the Columbine shootings)
Now if you go by population alone Littleton has 40,396 which according to many is too small of a city to buy.

But if you dig a little deeper, you find that...

Is a very high socioeconomic city right outside Denver that is growing.

It's search numbers on OVT are as follows:

Count Search Term
18645 littleton
10992 littleton co real estate
2268 littleton coin
2121 littleton coin company
1373 littleton ma real estate
1347 littleton colorado
1200 littleton real estate

Which happens to be higher OVT numbers than many cities with populations of 100K to 150K

Another example of a city I recently picked up is bentonville.tv

In 2000 the pop was 19.730 In 2006 it is 29,538 The headquarters of Wal-Mart Stores, the largest retailer in the world, as well as that of The Whistler Group, a major US manufacturer of radar detectors, are located in Bentonville. So you know major money is pouring into the development of the city and there is an educated high income group of people that live there.

Another big factor if you go small is clustering smaller cities in a certain area with bigger cities to feed traffic off of one another. I've been doing this in concentrated areas across the county.

In Texas For example, I currently own the following cities:

Texas

abilene.tv city pop 115,930 - MSA 158,063
euless.tv pop 51,226 Part of Dallas/Fort Worth International Airport, which serves the cities of Dallas and Fort Worth, is inside the city limits of Euless.
carrollton.tv pop 122,699 in Dallas County, partially in Denton County, and partially in Collin County Also, in 2006, Carrollton was selected as the 19th best place to live in the United States by Money magazine.
cedarhill.tv pop 40,000 located sixteen miles from downtown Dallas
coppell.tv pop 35,958 city in Dallas County, Texas, a suburb and bedroom community of the DFW Metroplex
corpuschristi.tv pop 281,196 MSA 446,565
desoto.tv pop 45,514 in Dallas County
denison.tv pop 22,7723
frisco.tv pop 100,00+ one of the fastest growing us cities As of the 2000 census, the city population was 33,714, while 2006 estimates place the population over 100,000. It is a northern suburb of Dallas
garland.tv pop 216,346 in Dallas County
grandprairie.tv pop 145,600 in Dallas County
kerrville.tv pop 20,500 +
killeen.tv pop 100,233 home of fort hood
laredo.tv pop 213,615
leaguecity.tv
pop 61,490
portarthur.tv pop 60,000 + within the Beaumont-Port Arthur metropolitan area
sanangelo.tv pop 88,439 msa 105,752
universitypark.tv pop 23,324 in Dallas county Home to SMU
waxahachie.tv
pop 21,000 + in Ellis County
wichitafalls.tv pop 107,635


This gives me leverage to package the smaller cities and the bigger cities together for any aggregator that I want to make a deal with. In other words, these little cities combined with bigger cities make way more sense for development purposes that looking at one small city by itself when you see how they fit together in the bigger picture.

My main point is that IMO the days of having to live in or near a city to make money off of a city are gone. There are a few companies that are very aggressively consolidating geo cities in the .tv arena in an effort to monazite traffic similar to the way that associated cities does in the .com arena. This isn't a matter of if it will happen, but when.

I've had talks with interested parties and when taken into account they ARE interested in deals for these smaller cities as well.

So to answer the obvious question. My future plans are all of the above. I will hold the ownership to the cities, license them out, collect a monthly check and from time to time flip them and get a premium price for them based on the revenue they are already bringing in.

Not only will you be able to make money from owning them, but you'll make money while owning them and licensing them out. In other words the best of both worlds. Just ask all the companies that operated drive in movie theaters where ultimately the huge money came from. The answer, from owning the land my friends.

more on my plans and the cities I've acquired later...
 
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yes, your right, its not just the city population, its the greater area, surrounding towns and cities.

Another play is to take the state, and go with either southern or northern or central.
Which can work in some states...
 
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My feeling is the following

I run a small geo for a town of 1,000 people. Every homeowner is on the site. 100% participation.

There is no such thing as a town that is too small. The issue is for towns below a certain size, you need to do something BEYOND simple internet marketing to penetrate and hold an audience.
 
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I just regged Hyannis.tv the other day. It's the main "city" on Cape Cod where I live. LOTS of tourist traffic and some very pretty sites but I didn't reg it right away. Not sure of it's value but I figure it's worth more than $25.
 
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I reg'd one and then gave it back. (Love tasting!)

It's a beach city of about 34K people, but even I have heard of it. Nobody bit at it and I just was looking for a quick flip.
 
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localexperts said:
I run a small geo for a town of 1,000 people. Every homeowner is on the site. 100% participation.

There is no such thing as a town that is too small. The issue is for towns below a certain size, you need to do something BEYOND simple internet marketing to penetrate and hold an audience.


1/ is it a .com or a .tv?

2/ what the value prop to homeowners and how do you monetize

BUT MOST IMPORTANTLY

3/ how far are you from the the town in question?!

Thanks!

poodleman said:
IMO population is way too simplistic of an approach and in many ways can be misleading.

First off there is the population within the city limits, the MSA population (Metropolitan Statistical Area) or Combined Statistical Areas (CSA) as well as Micropolitan Statistical Areas to consider and the Primary Census Statistical Areas to consider.

In other words, context is a key. The geographic area in relation to other cities.

The per capita income of the particular city. Which goes along with the type of commerce and companies based in that city.

Most importantly, combining all the above data with the population trends, real estate development trends, and search numbers before deciding the viability of a geo city, whether you plan to hold long term, as an investment, flip, or for development purposes.

This makes perfect sense to me

Not only will you be able to make money from owning them, but you'll make money while owning them and licensing them out. In other words the best of both worlds. Just ask all the companies that operated drive in movie theaters where ultimately the huge money came from. The answer, from owning the land my friends.

more on my plans and the cities I've acquired later...

Have you successfully leased any .tvs and how have you done it? independently or through a 3rd party firm?
 
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3/ how far are you from the the town in question?!

DING DING DING

We have a winner.

I live in the town and I know everybody.

That was my point, beyond simple internet marketing
 
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