alert The fund can't be withdrawal from Epik.com via Masterbucks wallet

[enamebroker]

It happened on 23rd Aug 2022 and this matter lasted almost one month without any process. Masterbucks.com declined my fund withdrawal and disabled the button of fund withdrawal. And I contacted Epik.com and got no further action even if Rob Monster got involved in it for two weeks. All the time I was told in email by management review.

What is wrong with Epik.com? Do you think it is normal to disable fund withdrawal? How can I get back my fund from Epik.com? Thanks for your suggestion.

 

[Derek Peterson]

On the subject of body language, there's a much better example from a trade show where Monster was explaining some new Epik product. Not sure if it was posted upthread.

Regards...jmcc

Tongue stuff? lol.

 

[jmcc]

Tongue stuff? lol.

Much worse. He was almost trying to run away from the interviewer.

Regards...jmcc

 

[D Haynes]

https://www.namepros.com/threads/epik-domain-renew.1303561/

Can we assume that precisely nothing has changed?

 

[maksimfa]

Well we do know some things from new epik's post about the new owners aside from the fact that they sound an awful lot like Monster and Royce.
1) They must be huge company currently doing lots of customer service calls & emails - they are assigning 10 new reps on Monday.

I think the buyer really is NWRA (northwest registered agent) mentioned in APA and not just them buying it on behalf of someone else. I think Monster will continue to be involved with new epik and maybe Royce and I think it was one of them that made that post on Friday.

The only way to make money with registrar is to up-sell hard. NWRA has lots of products and services to offer up these new customers. It is actually pretty smart for them, boring as paint drying for me but its a job.

No... lol. The Registered Agent is not the buyer.... The registered agent is just that, the registered agent.

NWRA is literally a small agency WHOSE ENTIRE JOB IS TO SIT THERE IN THE OFFICE, and act as "Virtual Office" for tens of thousands of companies.

There are companies like this in Nevada, Delaware, Wyoming, Montana and other states with strong corporate freedoms.

Ever wonder why nearly every RV or supercar you see has Montana plates? Lack of taxes and privacy... and all of those actual owners of cars need a Montana Company to own it. And the only way to incorproate in those states is to be domeciled there. And one such way is you get a registered agent who is there to file for you and act as the face of the company when dealing with legal matters.

That is all.

Due to Wyoming laws, we don't know who the actual owners are, publicly. The only thing we know is that if you want to sue the new company, you do service process to the registered agent.

 

[bmugford]

Rick Schwartz comment on DNW.

https://domainnamewire.com/2023/06/03/epik-is-sold/

 

[GoKaizen]

I noticed that.

Today is when they said it would be working.

"Support" doesn't seem to be back yet:

https://support.epik.com/

We all are.

Looking forward from afar to see how this unfolds, and rooting for anyone that is owed money to get paid.

 

[Derek Peterson]

No... lol. The Registered Agent is not the buyer.... The registered agent is just that, the registered agent.

NWRA is literally a small agency WHOSE ENTIRE JOB IS TO SIT THERE IN THE OFFICE, and act as "Virtual Office" for tens of thousands of companies.

There are companies like this in Nevada, Delaware, Wyoming, Montana and other states with strong corporate freedoms.

Ever wonder why nearly every RV or supercar you see has Montana plates? Lack of taxes and privacy... and all of those actual owners of cars need a Montana Company to own it. And the only way to incorproate in those states is to be domeciled there. And one such way is you get a registered agent who is there to file for you and act as the face of the company when dealing with legal matters.

That is all.

Due to Wyoming laws, we don't know who the actual owners are, publicly. The only thing we know is that if you want to sue the new company, you do service process to the registered agent.

I know what a registered agent is. NWRA is a gigantic company. Do some research on what services and products they provide.

 

[branding]

Today is when they said it would be working.

Remember remember the 10th of ... October.

Nothing changed.

 

[NYJimbo]

This is Epik LLC.

We'd like to provide an update from today:

1. JJE, TVT, and Adkisson were all paid today and released lawsuits. The sale of Epik Holdings Inc to Epik LLC was able to close.
2. ICANN was paid in full today.
3. Identity Digital was paid in full today.
4. Verisign was paid in full today, but it is not showing as cleared on their end yet. Should be by mid day Monday. Should have no problems with .com's getting registered and renewed Monday by mid day. All other endings are not in default and are able to be registered and renewed, but will be paid in full by end of day Monday regardless. These include Godaddy, Central Nic, Pir Org, and too many other vendors to list.
5. All aftermarket options were removed from epik.com today. As all of you have documented and somehow had the time to write up 299 pages about this rehashing the same thing 80 different ways, we need to focus on domains getting registered, renewed, and maintained. Support requests answered. And building the trust back of the core functions of a registrar: maintaining your trusted assets.

As all of you know, there's a big hole here to dig out of. We have shifted 10 customer support reps to support Epik.com customers starting Monday. We provide backend domain registrar services currently and can flex to as many people as needed to provide better customer service than any other option out there. It will take us some time though to learn Epik.coms software and quirks and obvious business operational problems that aren't normal. Our goal by the end of the week is to have 95% of phone calls answered live. 5% going to voicemail with a call returned in 2 hours or less. All support emails answered within 2 hours.

Our goals for Monday are to re-interview any old Epik Holdings Inc employees that would like to be rehired and that want to help us take care of the clients. Work our way through a long list of vendors and clients and start picking away at making things right. And we will not be accepting crypto as there was obviously massive operational and accounting problems in the current tech stack to properly account for it.

Once we can have domains safe and working well for our clients, we will start working through the in store credits. There's a lot there to work through. We'd appreciate your patience as we try to work through this.

There's a long history here and some weird stuff. Ok, maybe crazy stuff. Businesses make bad decisions all day every day: Montgomery Wards, Sears, JC Penneys, Toys R Us. You can watch hilco auctions to see businesses failing every day. Rob Monster might have made a bunch of bad mistakes, but he worked tirelessly for the last 9 months behind the scenes to make this deal happen and Brian Royce worked nonstop around the clock trying to save Epik and both tried as hard as possible to help as many clients as possible. There were so many problems we can't even begin to organize them into a cohesive postmortem to even attempt at speculating what caused it all. If you truly understood the mess behind the scenes what these two men pulled off is miraculous. And any of your speculation is worthless at this point also. What's important is moving forward and taking care of as many people as possible and trying to make things right for as many people as possible. We're no where close yet, but we're at least in a structure and position to try. There's a long ways to go and we recognize people have been financially hurt. We've very sorry for this, but if you'll give us time as the new Epik.com owners, we're going to try our best to help as many people as possible and right the ship. But it won't be overnight and words don't mean anything, actions will though, but it won't be fixed overnight.

Nothing we can say will fix what happened in the past prior to us, but we hope all of you will give us a shot to earn your trust. A lot of you are rightfully worried about customers not getting screwed. We care about that as well. It will be easier for us to make more people whole if there isn't an exodus of customer moving domains. Amazingly, if you look at the dumpster fire of the last 12 months and all the domains that have left. Epik still has an amazing following that believe in it and what it stands for. Epik still loses half as many domains as a percentage that Namesilo and Namecheap lose and is on par with Godaddy. There's still a very loyal following. And if the money had been there to keep domains renewing, Epik would have had a lot less get transferred out. And as a percentage done way better than Godaddy. We feel pretty confident we'll be back over 800,000 domains under management by the end of the year. We're here because the industry doesn't provide a great solution and we've tried them all and aren't satisfied with what is out there.

It might take awhile to earn your trust back, but we will keep trying, and will update this post next week as we progress.

Thank you for your time and consideration. We're here to help.

Epik LLC

Is Royce or Monster still any part of Epik ? If so, how are they connected to Epik now ?

 

[Derek Peterson]

Is Royce or Monster still any part of Epik ? If so, how are they connected to Epik now ?

That is yet to be revealed. Also, yes.

 

[bmugford]

His attorney got Adkisson paid, which was his job. The TRO motion likely played a big role in that.

I do find it amusing though how he appears to be a little incredulous that "Epik LLC" is the "buyer" of Epik's assets.

 

[jberryhill]

ICANN is only going to approve transfer of the registrar accreditation if:

https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/purchasing-2013-07-08-en

When an ICANN-accredited registrar is purchased, the acquired registrar must provide ICANN with the following:

...

2. A statement affirming that the acquired registrar continues to meet the ICANN-adopted specification or policy on accreditation criteria then in effect, and is in compliance with its obligations under the RAA;

The problem there is that the requirement assumes a compliant registrar. The registrar associated with this accreditation is already in breach, and for more than simply owing the back ICANN fees. There is a roster of operational requirements that ICANN has imposed on the original registrar.

The assignee also has to provide this information:

https://www.icann.org/2013-raa-info-spec-current-en.xlsx

"15. Full name, contact information, and position of any persons or entities owning at least 5% of the ownership interest in Registrar’s current business entity. For each person listed, please specify such person’s percentage ownership.

(NOTE: Include the city, state/province, and country of residence as part of the contact information for each entity and/or individual listed)"

"16. Full name, contact information, and position of all directors of the Registrar.

(NOTE: Include the city, state/province, and country of residence as part of the contact information for each individual listed)"

"18. Full name, contact information, and position of all senior management and other key personnel overseeing the provision of Registrar Services.

(NOTE: Include the city, state/province, and country of residence as part of the contact information for each individual listed)"

"19. For every person or entity mentioned in the answers to questions 15 to 18, indicate if that person or entity:
a) within the past ten years, has been convicted of a felony or of a misdemeanor related to financial activities, or has been judged by a court to have committed fraud or breach of fiduciary duty, or has been the subject of a judicial determination that is similar or related to any of these;
b) within the past ten years, has been disciplined by any
government or industry regulatory body for conduct involving dishonesty or misuse of funds of others;
c) is currently involved in any judicial or regulatory proceeding that could result in a conviction, judgment, determination, or discipline of the type specified in items 19(a) or 19(b); or
d) is the subject of a disqualification imposed by ICANN.

Provide details if any of the above events in (a)-(d) have occurred."


It will also be interesting to see how they get around this:

https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/approved-with-specs-2013-09-17-en

5.5 Termination of Agreement by ICANN. This Agreement may be terminated before its expiration by ICANN in any of the following circumstances:

...
5.5.8 (i) Registrar makes an assignment for the benefit of creditors or similar act;


...since that is exactly what this transaction was expressly about. The reason for this provision is that it is included in a clause that also lists bankruptcy, and so the idea was to de-accredit entities which are functionally bankrupt, have not formally declared bankruptcy, but are selling the furniture to pay creditors.

If anyone else is owed significant funds and is getting cut out, this would be the last call for filing that involuntary bankruptcy petition to unwind deals made just prior thereto.

 

[bmugford]

b) within the past ten years, has been disciplined by any
government or industry regulatory body for conduct involving dishonesty or misuse of funds of others;

Would being fined by the Washington Insurance Commissioner for offering "unlicensed" insurance services fall under this provision?

https://domainnamewire.com/2023/02/02/epik-and-rob-monster-fined-10000-in-dnprotect-settlement/

Brad

 

[tonyk2000]

19. For every person or entity mentioned in the answers to questions 15 to 18, indicate if that person or entity:
a) within the past ten years, has been convicted of a felony or of a misdemeanor related to financial activities, or has been judged by a court to have committed fraud or breach of fiduciary duty, or has been the subject of a judicial determination that is similar or related to any of these;
b) within the past ten years, has been disciplined by any
government or industry regulatory body for conduct involving dishonesty or misuse of funds of others;
c) is currently involved in any judicial or regulatory proceeding that could result in a conviction, judgment, determination, or discipline of the type specified in items 19(a) or 19(b); or
d) is the subject of a disqualification imposed by ICANN.

It is very interesting. Since Wyoming-based "registered agents" are also acting on behalf of hundreds different businesses, not only 1-week-old Epik LLC, can we guess that Epik LLC may be unable to comply with the above ICANN requirement, still hiding the real owners and managers under privacy? What If the "registered agents" were "disciplined" in the past ten years? Is it important for ICANN?

 

[GoKaizen]

@jberryhill how would we know if Epik somehow manages to get into compliance?

 

[Chris Hydrick]

Notice the domain in the email address used by Rob <[email protected]> was registered on February 8th, 2023 at PorkBun

 

[Igor Gabrielan]

Does it make sense to contact Adkisson's lawyers to make a similar claim? After all, they already have a lot of groundwork on this issue.

 

[alcy]

I'm no body language expert but I do know that when someone sticks their tongue out it is a sign of dishonesty.
Show attachment 239376

well David icke would argue its sign of lizard

 

[Chris Hydrick]

5.5.8 (i) Registrar makes an assignment for the benefit of creditors or similar act;


...since that is exactly what this transaction was expressly about. The reason for this provision is that it is included in a clause that also lists bankruptcy, and so the idea was to de-accredit entities which are functionally bankrupt, have not formally declared bankruptcy, but are selling the furniture to pay creditors.

If anyone else is owed significant funds and is getting cut out, this would be the last call for filing that involuntary bankruptcy petition to unwind deals made just prior thereto.

If I am reading this correctly, the above/below quoted paragraph is extremely important for those still owed substantial masterfucks:

"If anyone else is owed significant funds and is getting cut out, this would be the last call for filing that involuntary bankruptcy petition to unwind deals made just prior thereto."

What is an involuntary bankruptcy petition?

Involuntary bankruptcy is a legal proceeding through which creditors request that a person or business go into bankruptcy. Creditors can request involuntary bankruptcy if they think that they will not be paid if bankruptcy proceedings don't take place.

 

[jberryhill]

Would being fined by the Washington Insurance Commissioner for offering "unlicensed" insurance services fall under this provision?

https://domainnamewire.com/2023/02/02/epik-and-rob-monster-fined-10000-in-dnprotect-settlement/

Brad

No. That kind of provision is common to a lot of things, and they are typically looking for what are technically called crimen falsi - i.e. things for which there is an element of deceit such as fraud, counterfeiting, forgery, etc., and not an administrative violation like doing X without a license.

@jberryhill how would we know if Epik somehow manages to get into compliance?

If ICANN blesses the accreditation transfer.

Since Wyoming-based "registered agents" are also acting on behalf of hundreds different businesses, not only 1-week-old Epik LLC, can we guess that Epik LLC may be unable to comply with the above ICANN requirement, still hiding the real owners and managers under privacy?

It's worth untangling some things which have gotten confused in this thread.

First off, a registered agent is merely a person upon whom legal process on a corporation may be served. Registered agent services, like CSC for example, have a gazillion customers. Typical state corporate statutes require a corporation must have a registered agent and a postal address in the state. Registered agents typically have no functional role or position in the corporation itself.

Northwest is the registered agent for the LLC, but they are also apparently providing another distinct service - i.e. providing a "nominee director". It is not inherent or usual for the registered agent to also be a director of the company. There are some services which do that, but they are typically offshore companies.

Again, being a registered agent and being a director are two different things. Sometimes, RA services will provide nominee director services, but you don't see that a whole lot in the US. The problem is that even a nominee director could end up personally liable for whatever activity the real principals are trying to hide from. That said, it is somewhat common in the context of individuals or groups who are attempting to conceal their effective ownership and/or access to firearms which, for various reasons, they are either not eligible to own legally or do not want to be easily associated with. As noted previously, apart from the Epik suite of online services, JJE has a pretty narrow focus on weapon manufacturers and Royce Arms is an FFL holder. So, it's not surprising to see that they have found themselves a cooperative nominee director.

That said, there are, of course, legit reasons for a corporate agent service to want to run a registrar. Again, CSC is one of the largest and oldest corporate registration services around, and not coincidentally also run a registrar. Domain registration services are a natural fit for corporate registration services, since there are obviously customers who would want to do both - and which can then be offered in a bundle of corporate registration, domain registration, and other services like tax ID application, etc..

The ICANN requirement to provide information suitable for background checks of directors, officers, etc., does not mean that the information is published. So, they can satisfy the ICANN requirement, but that will not be publicly accessible information.

 

[jberryhill]

If I am reading this correctly

You are reading that correctly. Bankruptcy courts do have the power to reach back in time and undo deals that were designed to screw creditors.

 

[tonyk2000]

btw,

https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/purchasing-2013-07-08-en :

An ICANN-accredited registrar is purchased when ownership of the entire corporate entity is transferred. In this scenario, the registrar corporation/entity continues to exist but has new owners. This transaction is distinct from an assignment of a registrar accreditation agreement.

Also -

https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/transferring-2013-07-08-en :

The RAA includes a process that permits an ICANN-accredited registrar ("Transferor") to seek ICANN's approval to transfer (assign) its accreditation to another entity ("Transferee") that wishes to become an accredited registrar. The assignment process is distinct from a registrar purchase, which occurs when a new owner purchases or otherwise acquires an entire registrar entity (such as by purchase of the stock in a corporation).

An agreement between Epik and Epik, posted earlier in this thread, is somewhat complicated. The entire corporate entity was not transferred (masterbucks etc. were excluded). Morever, it seems it was signed without mentioning any sort of ICANN's approval. So, what of 2 ICANN links is applicable? Transferring (Assigning) an ICANN Accreditation? Purchasing an ICANN-Accredited Registrar? I'm lost...

 

[Future Sensors]

If ICANN blesses the accreditation transfer.

In your opinion, is it therefore true that Epik LLC is currently not yet allowed to offer registrar services at all under IANA ID 617, as far as ICANN accredited contracts are concerned?

 

[jberryhill]

btw,

https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/purchasing-2013-07-08-en :

An ICANN-accredited registrar is purchased when ownership of the entire corporate entity is transferred. In this scenario, the registrar corporation/entity continues to exist but has new owners. This transaction is distinct from an assignment of a registrar accreditation agreement.

Also -

https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/transferring-2013-07-08-en :

The RAA includes a process that permits an ICANN-accredited registrar ("Transferor") to seek ICANN's approval to transfer (assign) its accreditation to another entity ("Transferee") that wishes to become an accredited registrar. The assignment process is distinct from a registrar purchase, which occurs when a new owner purchases or otherwise acquires an entire registrar entity (such as by purchase of the stock in a corporation).

An agreement between Epik and Epik, posted earlier in this thread, is somewhat complicated. The entire corporate entity was not transferred (masterbucks etc. were excluded). Morever, it seems it was signed without mentioning any sort of ICANN's approval. So, what of 2 ICANN links is applicable? Transferring (Assigning) an ICANN Accreditation? Purchasing an ICANN-Accredited Registrar? I'm lost...

You raise a good point, and I provided the wrong link. This is an assignment of the accreditation, and not a purchase of the registrar.

However, as far as the ICANN considerations go, there is not a lot of functional difference, because the entity to which the accreditation is assigned still has to jump through all of the hoops required of a new registrar applicant:

Entities seeking ICANN's approval of the assignment of a registrar accreditation under the 2013 Registrar Accreditation Agreement must submit notice of any proposed assignment or any request for approval of assignment to ICANN at [email protected]. Within 30 days, ICANN may either (1) approve or deny the assignment, or (2) request additional information, which includes Registrar Accreditation application information.

The reason for the two options is that the accreditation might be assigned to an existing registrar, in which case none of the accreditation information would be required.

Either way you slice it, ICANN does background checks on the individuals who are beneficial owners of registrars. Since this accreditation is already in breach, then whether it is assignable in that condition is a new issue which I do not believe ICANN has dealt with in the past.

 

[jberryhill]

In your opinion, is it therefore true that Epik LLC is currently not yet allowed to offer registrar services at all under IANA ID 617, as far as ICANN accredited contracts are concerned?

I can't see why they should. I haven't looked at the draft agreements in the suit in detail, and don't know what transitional provisions they might have.

You could certainly have a provision under which the old Epik provides services to the new Epik in order to support ongoing registrar operations until such time as ICANN approves the accreditation transfer. However, the new Epik also will need to become accredited with the various registries or jump through whatever assignment hoops might be in the various registry agreements.

But, for example, there are registrars who do not participate in dropcatching themselves, but who effectively "lease" their ability to provide registrar functions to organized dropcatching operations. The registrars are responsible for the registrar functions and services, but the service agreements permit the dropcatchers to auction, backorder, etc., the names caught on that cred.