Undeveloped.com Experience

[JudgeMind]

Has anyone used undeveloped.com to sell domains? They claim to be able to increase a domainers sales by 54%.

 

[DAN.COM]

@Reza you need to add a option to know who the buyer is going blink like sedo isn't great need to have a idea who the buyer is

Hi Wizard,

I don't understand what you mean. Can you elaborate?

Kind regards,

Reza

 

[UmerK]

On dashboard where your leads/transactions are listed, they automatically get highlighted - hinting a message has been sent and received.

This happens when I reload the page, however in truth there's no message/update on the transaction being highlighted.

Can you look into this?

The only issue with this is that older transactions get highlighted and show above ones that are more recent.

 

[carob]

Showing a change of ownership has occurred, also introduces no trademark or UDRP issues according to my 10+ years in the industry.

A domain registered before a term was trademarked is normally secure from TM/UDRP claims. But when a change of ownership occurs, the clock starts over.

So if I buy a domain at Dan.com that a trademark holder was previously unable to claim, their trademark now pre-dates my ownership of the domain and they can proceed against me, and will know that is possible since Dan.com have published a change of ownership that could otherwise be kept private.

 

[carob]

Nobody, other than you and DAN are aware of your blockchain ID.

Do you mean to say that only the seller and systems admin can see the ID, or that others can see it, but only Dan.com systems admin and the seller know which person the ID corresponds to?

 

[YairDD]

A domain registered before a term was trademarked is normally secure from TM/UDRP claims. But when a change of ownership occurs, the clock starts over.

So if I buy a domain at Dan.com that a trademark holder was previously unable to claim, their trademark now pre-dates my ownership of the domain and they can proceed against me, and will know that is possible since Dan.com have published a change of ownership that could otherwise be kept private.

Can't you also see change of ownership on Whois?

 

[carob]

And yes, you give consent for us to handle transactions in the manner we do accroding to our TOS.

Will you please be kind enough to quote the relevant section of the ToS here and explain how it gives consent to publishing of sales.

 

[carob]

Can't you also see change of ownership on Whois?

Not if it is private or obscured for GDPR reasons.

If ownership of a domain under privacy changes, the WHOIS simply shows that an update occurred on that date. An update could also mean a DNS change or other change, so that does not indicate change of ownership.

 

[DAN.COM]

A domain registered before a term was trademarked is normally secure from TM/UDRP claims. But when a change of ownership occurs, the clock starts over.

So if I buy a domain at Dan.com that a trademark holder was previously unable to claim, their trademark now pre-dates my ownership of the domain and they can proceed against me, and will know that is possible since Dan.com have published a change of ownership that could otherwise be kept private.

I think you're confusing registering with buying. I'm not a legal expert but what I've seen in UDRP's is that the initial registration of a new TM'd brand is seen as a negative.

For example with the Libra domains. Facebook announces Libra, a lot of domainers after the announcement register Libra domains and in essence show proof of their bad faith registration.

 

[frank-germany]

A domain registered before a term was trademarked is normally secure from TM/UDRP claims.

not sure if that is true..

 

[frank-germany]

For example with the Libra domains. Facebook announces Libra, a lot of domainers after the announcement register Libra domains and in essence show proof of their bad faith registration.

registering a domain
even if its Libra after such an announcement
doesn't proof bad faith

as there are legitimate reasons to buy such a name
for differnent purposes other than crypto and/or selling it

 

[DAN.COM]

Do you mean to say that only the seller and systems admin can see the ID, or that others can see it, but only Dan.com systems admin and the seller know which person the ID corresponds to?

Indeed, what we do on our blockchain is to assign your domains to your blockchain ID. Only you and DAN will know which blockchain ID you have. DAN currently signs all smart contracts fro you with your blockchain ID and later down the road you can decide to sign all contracts yourself if you want to.

So no buyer or any third party will ever see or know which blockchain ID you have.

On our public ledger, we do not show the blockchain ID of anyone. That's why I mentioned that the last 20 transactions we show are only there to allow the ledger to breathe transparency and allow buyers to validate directly that whatever action executed by the DAN bot is actually conducted. This way buyers don't need to trust you, me or anyone else and can validate what we said we've done on the ledger.

Imagine having a buyer that claims to not have received the payment reminder of his/her 10th installment. Due to the above setup, we can instantly grab the public hash of the reminder sent to the buyer, query the ledger and validate exactly the time stamp on which the buyer did receive the payment reminder.

The ledger leaves no room for discussion in these cases as it's an irrefutable database and 24/7 reachable domain notary.

 

[carob]

I think you're confusing registering with buying. I'm not a legal expert but what I've seen in UDRP's is that the initial registration of a new TM'd brand is seen as a negative.

What matters is the date of ownership, not the registration date. If you acquire a domain that contains an existing trademark, your ownership starts after the trademark and greatly increases your risk of losing the domain. The previous owner may have registered the domain before there was any trademark and so had a reasonably secure hold on the domain, but they can't pass that on to a new owner. Plenty of discussion of that here on NP.

Also companies stealthily acquiring domains or sets of domains for future use usually do not want names published.

 

[domains21]

Feel free to share your background with the rest of the community here. It looks great on the landers!

Sure thing, now that the text is playing nice again.

Also created a DAN-coloured version for anyone who may want to keep a uniformed look to their pages.

Attached both the PNG and JPG versions so that you can decide between quality and speed for your pages. (PNG is high quality but a larger filesize whereas JPG isn't as sharp but is a lot smaller in filesize)

 

[Embrand]

That looks great! Thanks.

 

[DNGear]

Which nameservers should we use @Reza?

 

[Windoms]

What matters is the date of ownership, not the registration date. If you acquire a domain that contains an existing trademark, your ownership starts after the trademark and greatly increases your risk of losing the domain. The previous owner may have registered the domain before there was any trademark and so had a reasonably secure hold on the domain, but they can't pass that on to a new owner. Plenty of discussion of that here on NP.

Also companies stealthily acquiring domains or sets of domains for future use usually do not want names published.

Buyers who buy domains on DAN, usually they develop it afterwards for their own purpose or register the term under their own trademark under their own field. They don't care about existing TM and change of ownership.
If you do, I guess with your due diligence you'll decide the buy the domain on another platform. That's if the scenario with change of ownership and TM issue is true.

Then, if the pros of displaying transactions outweigh the cons, then I guess this is not a major issue when compared to the innovation being introduced.

 

[carob]

Everything so far had indicated that we could, at the very least, opt out of having sales published. I asked where that opt-out option was and got no reply. I asked to be shown where in the ToS we had consented to publishing sales - no reply. Realistically the publishing of sales should be paused until this is resolved.

Another reason people do not publish sales is to stop the buyer getting spammed by would-be sellers, and also to maintain competitive advantages.

Hi Carob,

I personally want to share all sales but the last time we did it at DNJournal we got so many negative responses from sellers that we stopped doing it. In the future, we'll make it an opt-in to share your sales so we could start publishing sales from sellers that give us their approval to share their sales.

However, the problem here is that it might look as if we don't sell many names simply because not all sellers, in that case, will publish their sales. So that could turn into negative advertising for the company.

In terms of sales volume we're now selling significantly more than Namejet and are getting close to sell as much as Uniregistry does.

Kind regards,
Reza

@undeveloped @Reza
Issues:

3) What if you need to keep a particluar sale private (NDA, etc.), how do you opt-out of using the new blockchain feature and/or the "recently sold" feed ? There should be a checkbox or something for each name to opt-out.

Hi Springs,

About item 3: we're not sure if we'll keep that element on the homepage but if we do, we'll offer a simple button the negotiation view so you can "privatize" a sale.

.

 

[carob]

They don't care about existing TM and change of ownership.
If you do, I guess with your due diligence you'll decide the buy the domain on another platform. .

I wouldn't buy a domain at Undeveloped knowing the sale will be published, and not just for TM reasons. When I buy a domain or sell a domain at Sedo it is private, always.

 

[DNGear]

Can anyone confirm they were facing these bots all the time? They have been hitting my domains since yesterday nonstop.

 

[Argentum]

I wouldn't buy a domain at Undeveloped knowing the sale will be published, and not just for TM reasons. When I buy a domain or sell a domain at Sedo it is private, always.

I wish i have such a problem as you..privacy, conspirasy.. trademark issues etc. I thing better not even to sell domains as potential buyer can disclose your talks to 3rd party and everything will be ruined.