.tv .TV & end user buyers

[garptrader]

I have no idea how SEDO marketed this auction and who may be bidding on the 115 premium .TV domains Verisign/ENOM is auctioning off. I suppose in a few weeks we can check the WHOis if privacy registration is not selected. But I am sure only a small percentage of Namejet and Snapnames sales for domains which end up at $500+ are actually bid on by end users. End users are normally not in the business of scanning domain drop lists. While I prefer to sell to an end user I have had several sales (not .TV) high $XXX+ to investors which still generated a nice ROI.

 

[Vito]

Garp,

Nice Post...seriously.
But does it really honestly matter who buys it, and for what purpose, NO.

Have you ever questioned anyone who has made you an offer...
Well, I can't sell you this .TV unless you are gonna put $100,000 into developing it the correct way, and only if up to my standards...

It's not like we are getting rid of a family pet that didn't work out with our new born child,
and we really care about that pet getting a warm, caring home...It's a Friggen Domain!

I mean come on, seriously, there is only one DIQ (Domainer in Question) here who gives a shi!
and he has not provided any one of us with one tiny bit of helpful information...EVER.

 

[Jeff]

End users (plural) substantively developing and promoting Premium auctioned ".TV's" (and, thus, its "ecosystem") ... and NOT again domainers trading in and amongst themselves ... will do more for the .TV niche extension than anything that has been done in the past 10+/+ years of its checkered history, IMHO. :gl:

Best regards,
Jeff

 

[equity78]

I think Snoop has written many times, auction houses don't market to end users. They spend little time if any. In the big live auctions people ask about that and comment on blogs like thedomains.com, Why is there no marketing to end users?

I think the auction houses have seen that it does not work, is time consuming and can be expensive.

If you want a name marketed to an end user you will have to do it on your own most of the time.

 

[freedom30]

I think the auction houses have seen that it does not work, is time consuming and can be expensive.

If you want a name marketed to an end user you will have to do it on your own most of the time.

How have they "seen" that it does not work if they haven't done it? Of course it is time consuming. It is called marketing and can be as expensive or cost-effective as you want it to be. Fact of the matter is the clearing house parking lots are too complacent to think otherwise, in effect they developed a culture of mental laziness and just want the mountain to come to them, if one catches that drift..

This I agree with you, though, do your marketing to endusers on your own.

 

[GoneWalkabout]

I think Snoop has written many times, auction houses don't market to end users.

The fact Snoop says something really doesn't make it worthy or factual. It is merely a view. If he did suggest such a thing then he has never come across the likes of Bonhams or Christies. They have massive PR commitments for almost every auction they hold.

I think the auction houses have seen that it does not work, is time consuming and can be expensive.

If this is true then it proves how massively BAD the auction houses are at their choice of PR company. Effective PR has been shown time and time again to be the least cost/most effect part of the marketing mix.
The PR by Verisign and SEDO over the recent auction has been non-existent. For less than $5,000 they could have got massive consumer and industry interest. Hell, for $500 they could have got a story in hundreds of newspapers, radio stations, blogs, magazines, etc

If you want a name marketed to an end user you will have to do it on your own most of the time.

Yes, very true - and would still be true regardless of whether the auction company promoted their auctions or not.

Fact of the matter is the clearing house parking lots are too complacent...
...they developed a culture of mental laziness and just want the mountain to come to them

This is unbelievably true - they get a percentage of the pie without having to do any baking.

If only they would realise that with just a little effort they could actually make the pie bigger.

 

[gr8trfoo]

The fact Snoop says something really doesn't make it worthy or factual. It is merely a view. If he did suggest such a thing then he has never come across the likes of Bonhams or Christies. They have massive PR commitments for almost every auction they hold.

They market to buyers. The domains auction houses do that too. But imagine bonhams cold calling a bunch of insurance companies to tell them about the remarkable selection of antique actuarial tables, or pitching some other business about bidding on some warhols or other art. while thats not a perfect analogy, domains are after all a solid business asset, it fits. I dare say that even now most business owners/managers that *should* care about domains don't. So cold calling them is pretty much a waste of time at this point.

Nonetheless if I had a great domain in a visible public auction I'd be making some selective calls.

 

[equity78]

Good points Jimbo, this is from what I have read on other blogs focusing on the live auctions. Many posted especially on thedomains.com, when Mike has done a post on a TRAFFIC or DomainFest Auction. They have asked why doesn't Moniker call end users and the reply back by others who claimed to be in the know, was it does not work, its not worth the time, it costs too much. So I don't know but I don't think SEDO has ever really marketed an auction and hired PR like you said. It would be nice if they did put some pr into the auction but I guess they figure if an end user wants a name they will go after the name and not participate in an auction.

 

[twomoon]

Why should Sedo market the auctions to endusers? It’s illogical for Sedo.
Sedo will get fees ($$$ or $$$$) for the domains sold in auction now, and can get them again, when domain name would be sold by the Buyer (Domainer) to an Enduser – also via Sedo

 

[antonis12]

I highly doubt it is cost-effective to cold-call random large corporations (because that is what we mean by 'end-users') in the hope that someone there is in a position to rapidly authorize the purchase of a domain, just in case they needed one that day. It reflects a misunderstanding of how large corporations work. Once you allocate the cost of the salary of the person calling to the commission from the auction, I doubt this is worth it for any but the largest domain sales.

the best thing that could be done is:

(a) Ensure 'This domain is for sale' is clearly marked with a price (though that could raise UDRP issues)

(b) Ensure secondary market domains appear in registrar search results as is starting to happen

the person who sells by far the most domains to end-users is BuyDomains.com. The reason?

(a) they have a lot of inventory
(b) they price openly
(c) they price aggressively low for the most part. Very little of 'I am hoping for 'XX,XXX' for my XXX domain.

And I have yet to meet an end-user who even knows of BuyDomains.

In theory, once all the rest in in place noted above, educating the ad agencies would be helpful but they are fairly technophobic.

It goes without saying that having, on top of this, 4 different types of .tv domains all that work differently and expecting an end-user to figure it out, is even greater lunacy.

The realistic options:

(a) Sell to another domaineer

(b) Accept a low turnover rate on your portfolio with possibly doing some targeted marketing by yourself

(c) Develop yourself if you have the capability (most don't)


The only person that perhaps could make a some impact cost effectively with general marketing and PR is the registry because they win across all domains in the TLD. But again, in this case, marketing is a long way away from VSGN's strengths.

 

[biggie]

one thing i have noticed is that


many like to assume or post what they think.. an end-user does or thinks like

they act like they know whether or not end-users visit places like namejet/snap or sedo

i know for a fact that there is a user on namejet named "enduser"


endusers, can be domainers too


one reason why i think many auction markets won't contact "outsiders" in mass, is because of "fear of retaliation or bad publicity" from making unsolicited phone calls to businesses or sending unsolicited emails (spam).

for an individual to do that is one thing, but for an online entity where selling domains in their biz....it could pose some risks.

as for .tv, don't forget that the extension is ruled by a little island, who could change the rules of the game at anytime


imo...

 

[equity78]

Nice post Antonis.

And .tv is ruled by Verisign and that's until 2016 Tuvalu is ruling nothing currently.

 

[snoop]

How have they "seen" that it does not work if they haven't done it? Of course it is time consuming. It is called marketing and can be as expensive or cost-effective as you want it to be. Fact of the matter is the clearing house parking lots are too complacent to think otherwise, in effect they developed a culture of mental laziness and just want the mountain to come to them, if one catches that drift..

This I agree with you, though, do your marketing to endusers on your own.

It has has been tried by auction houses many times, magazine, newspaper ads, contacting potential buyers, everything. You can't expect them to spend large amounts of money on marketing for a 10% commission. An auction is a wholesale environment. It is much like you can't expect to get an exorbitant price for something on ebay.

---------- Post added at 04:21 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:14 PM ----------

i know for a fact that there is a user on namejet named "enduser"

endusers, can be domainers too

Probably just a weak attempt by a domainer to put other bidders off. Like turning up to a property auction in a Ferrari. I doubt "endusers" are even familiar with the term they have been branded with.

 

[freedom30]

It has has been tried by auction houses many times, magazine, newspaper ads, contacting potential buyers, everything. You can't expect them to spend large amounts of money on marketing for a 10% commission. An auction is a wholesale environment. It is much like you can't expect to get an exorbitant price for something on ebay.

---------- Post added at 04:21 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:14 PM ----------

At the risk of sounding redundant, these clearinghouses have harvested amongst themselves a culture of mental laziness and just want the mountain to come to them, period.

 

[Jeff]

as for .tv, don't forget that the extension is ruled by a little island, who could change the rules of the game at anytime

Hi Biggie,
Tuvalu is indeed a teeny isle ... but I don't think they can change the rules at their whim IMHO.

However ...

And .tv is ruled by Verisign and that's until 2016 Tuvalu is ruling nothing currently.

... what happens after 2016 I think is an important and relevant question? :imho:

Hope all's well,
Jeff

 

[snoop]

At the risk of sounding redundant, these clearinghouses have harvested amongst themselves a culture of mental laziness and just want the mountain to come to them, period.

An domain auction is what it is and that is an easy way of getting liquidity. If you don't want to sell for auction prices wait (perahps for a very long time) or be prepared to do a lot of legwork yourself. The lazy people are the domainers who expect auction houses to try and find endusers for a 10% commission. Those people need a big reality pill.

 

[gr8trfoo]

Tuvalu is indeed a teeny isle ... but I don't think they can change the rules at their whim IMHO.

sure they can. teeny isle they may be they are also a sovereign nation. if they decide to do something unruly to our interests, like suddenly repudiate the contract with verisign and seize all existing domains as their own what power could legally thwart them??? many nations have nationalized many things in the past, including multi-billion dollar industrial investments, without compensation to their former owners. so there is something that ought to scare the holy crap out of every serious investor in this space. same goes for any ccTLD investment in any land where individual property rights are not absolutely respected by law and or where domains are not considered "property".

i doubt this is very likely but i would not think it impossible.

 

[snoop]

sure they can. teeny isle they may be they are also a sovereign nation. if they decide to do something unruly to our interests, like suddenly repudiate the contract with verisign and seize all existing domains as their own what power could legally thwart them??? many nations have nationalized many things in the past, including multi-billion dollar industrial investments, without compensation to their former owners. so there is something that ought to scare the holy crap out of every serious investor in this space. same goes for any ccTLD investment in any land where individual property rights are not absolutely respected by law and or where domains are not considered "property".

i doubt this is very likely but i would not think it impossible.

I think it is highly unlikely given they are quite reliant on the contract for their revenue.

 

[freedom30]

An domain auction is what it is and that is an easy way of getting liquidity. If you don't want to sell for auction prices wait (perahps for a very long time) or be prepared to do a lot of legwork yourself. The lazy people are the domainers who expect auction houses to try and find endusers for a 10% commission. Those people need a big reality pill.

I concur that the same standard you would expect from a reputable auction house applies to the domain owner as well as a matter of course. But I am not giving these clearinghouses a pass for their laziness and complacency, either.

Money without effort seems to be their mantra.

 

[RPK]

With the live auctions I think you should target specific names that fit the theme of the auctions. For example, for Rick Latonas upcoming auction in Italy I have Mafia.tv going in the auction because I think that that is the best chance I have at getting the best ROI for that name. And even though I own mobster.tv and sportscar.tv that you would think may do well in Italy I did not even suggest them as I think I could do better by holding on to them. I saw snapnames is having an auction with a gaming theme coming up so I submitted a few of my gambling names for that auction since again the name fits the theme.

The beauty about .tv names now is that the renewal is affordable.