Threatened By Afternic/BuyDomains

[user-166914]

I received the following message from Afternic/BuyDomains:

"If your names do not have pricing in our system by the end of this week, we will have to suspend your Afternic account."


This is when I have already actually paid to list my domains on their platform for one year!


I am curious to know if anyone else who owns any of the thousands of unpriced domains has been Threatened By Afternic/BuyDomains ?[/B]

 

[Jaco]

No, but I support this move for all domain sales platforms.
"Make Offer" is the biggest waste of time, ever*. I hope SEDO follows suit.

* - For about 95% of domain names that just aren't of the caliber and magnitude to warrant that sort of selling tactic. If the "domain name aftermarket" is to survive as an operating entity, then sales and liquidity must occur at a brisker pace than they have been. Places like Afternic and SEDO cannot continue to employ people to create and maintain infastructure, the majority use of which only goes to subsidize the dreams of the delusional (I own FantasticMortgagesInNortheastAlabama.net- that's a $50,000 name, easily!!!!!).

It's high time someone took this step- I guess I'll start shopping at Afternic more.
I like buying and selling. I hate 'pricing games' like "make offer".

 

[DomainTalker]

If you set prices for all domains....there'll be no domain auctions, will there?....You against auctions, too, dongsman?


Or, should only what some employee at Sedo, or Afternic, determine what domains are 'good enough' for a 'Make Offer/Auction' listing?...With their track record - no thanks.


I'm happy to deal with 'Make Offer' negotiations, personally.

.

 

[wwwweb]

I received the following message from Afternic/BuyDomains:

"If your names do not have pricing in our system by the end of this week, we will have to suspend your Afternic account."


This is when I have already actually paid to list my domains on their platform for one year!


I am curious to know if anyone else who owns any of the thousands of unpriced domains has been Threatened By Afternic/BuyDomains ?[/B]

how many domains have you sold on afternic in the past year? If 0 does it really matter, auction houses realize that offer only compared to fixed price do not sell as well, it is a revenue generating move, it is hard to set the end user / reseller price point, domainer is at a disadvantage as domains are speculative, and so is the pricing on them, hard to find that sweet spot without chasing end user away.

 

[SpareDomains]

If someone inquired about one of your domains then they will ask you to provide a buy it now and floor price so they have room to negotiate. If they are asking you to price all your domains although this usually produces more sales I don't think this is right if you paid $19.99 and that wasn't the rule when you joined. If they wanna change the rules they should exempt you from pricing all your domains until your fee comes up for renewal as those were not the terms when you joined. If Sedo made this rule I could understand as it's a free service but when you charge someone to list you shouldn't change your terms after they have paid assuming this is true.

 

[Jaco]

If you set prices for all domains....there'll be no domain auctions, will there?....You against auctions, too, dongsman?

Obviously, selling an item at a fixed sale without a price isn't the same thing as an auction, so, you're basically off on a tangent with that point.

Or, should only what some employee at Sedo, or Afternic, determine what domains are 'good enough' for a 'Make Offer/Auction' listing?...With their track record - no thanks.
I'm happy to deal with 'Make Offer' negotiations, personally.
.

A separate issue entirely, but yeah.
Right now, I'm sensing there's a market for a moderated, fixed price domain sales platform that is managed by people who actually comprehend what constitutes quality in a domain name and thusly, they strictly limit the listings to those types of names. This means that a lot of 'domainers' will get their feelings hurt when their "premium" iFantasticLaptop-SalesWEbsite4.tel doesn't get accepted, but no worries- they already have BIDO...

It also means that whoever runs such a place will have to resist the temptation to lower the bar of quality for the sake of more (lower quality) listings and more profits, but from a buyers perspective, a central market for names of actual, vetted quality with actual prices would be a great place to shop. Hell. I'd even let the dreamers who own great names come along... The only barrier to entry would be owning solid names. You could price them as stupidly as you wish- I'd even be open to some sort of negotiation process- but you first have to own good names to get in the door and you MUST price them with a BIN of some kind.

I could actually see this happening with the right pitch to the right large portfolio holders to generate the initial inventory.

---------- Post added at 11:53 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:44 PM ----------

Oh, as an aside- let me add...

My own disdain for stupid domain "make offer" pricing games aside, I do think that if they changed the rules on you mid-game, then yeah, you did get kinda screwed and should be entitled to a refund of whatever you paid.

 

[labrocca]

It's high time someone took this step- I guess I'll start shopping at Afternic more.
I like buying and selling. I hate 'pricing games' like "make offer".

Ironic because my other thread is complaining about Buy Domains and how they don't price domains.

Yeah they demand their sellers on Afternic place a price but on their seller account (Buy Domains) they don't follow that practice themselves.

What a croc of crap!

It also means that whoever runs such a place will have to resist the temptation to lower the bar of quality for the sake of more (lower quality) listings and more profits, but from a buyers perspective, a central market for names of actual, vetted quality with actual prices would be a great place to shop.

You mean like Latona? He would be a good guy imho to lead that type of market.

 

[SpareDomains]

Ironic because my other thread is complaining about Buy Domains and how they don't price domains.

Yeah they demand their sellers on Afternic place a price but on their seller account (Buy Domains) they don't follow that practice themselves.

What a croc of crap!

domains on buy domains can be domainers domains as I have a few hundred on there, got lazy and never finished listing the rest, expanded or premium gets them on there Afternic Promotion Upgrades

 

[Jaco]

You mean like Latona? He would be a good guy imho to lead that type of market.

Definitely. He's deeply connected in the industry- meaning, heavy hitting portfolio holders wouldn't hesitate to list their quality names with him- and he knows what constitutes a good name (even though a few stinkers occasionally slip through on his email list, but that's a different format, and in that format, the bar can be lower)

The quality-vetting part would definitely take a human eye- there is no automated way to appraise all good names, simply because a lot of very desirable names aren't based on their reflecting a major search term- but if someone were to invest the time and effort into creating a truly "premium" listing interface with a fine mesh quality screen and BIN prices for all names, it would probably become very relevant, very quickly.

There are people out there who want premium domains and would like to have a look at 'what's out there' without any keyword specificity, but that's now impossible to do, since the major listing services have been contaminated by so much garbage. We've arrived at- and surpassed- the threshold for peak domaining. Maybe someone should create a market reserved strictly for those names that represent actual quality, rather than a free-for-all where the diamonds are buried beneath a pile of crap.

 

[RTM]

We've actually experimented with both approaches (notably at SEDO) having a minimum reserve price (which isn't shown to the end user but can be figured out as it will reject any "offers" without forwarding the bid) and a fixed published sale price. Invariably, the ones with listed sale prices had the max price we felt the name could / should be going for; given research on similar transactions, sectors, etc. didn't sell...

As for the domain brokerages not making money because they invest in infrastructure to host the platform, well, they also monetize the names listed (through contextual advertising, rev-share parking programs, etc)...

The platforms could help pricing decisions (for both buyer & seller) by using thesauri to show similar terms listed (and recently sold) next to each name; not all brokerages seem to do this well.

I think a published selling price - along with an "or best offer" and min price is the way to go...

Just my $0.02...

Rob

 

[DubDubDubDot]

Invariably, the ones with listed sale prices had the max price we felt the name could / should be going for; given research on similar transactions, sectors, etc. didn't sell...

The only explanations are that you didn't have the selling reach or you simply got the price wrong.

Looking at the sales history of similar domains can be very deceiving. There could be 2 strong sales, but 300 much weaker sales that you won't ever hear about because the industry brushes weak sales under the rug.

Not many domainers run to the forums telling about how they shopped a domain around and got $75 for it, and DNjournal certainly isn't going to report a sale like that. So what we are left with are reports that are mostly fairly strong. It creates a false impression over the value of most domains.

 

[Jaco]

Not many domainers run to the forums telling about how they shopped a domain around and got $75 for it, and DNjournal certainly isn't going to report a sale like that. So what we are left with are reports that are mostly fairly strong. It creates a false impression over the value of most domains.

Spot on.
The illusion has been created that all domains are worth XXXX or more. This just isn't the case. Since there is no way to firmly quantify the 'value' of any given domain (short of the fantastic work the guys are doing at estibot, which isn't nuts accurate, but it is very relevant IMO), this causes sentiments of resellers to be unduly enthusiastic, as far as prices go. The consequence is that names that could be sold for a lower Price X are let to expire, simply because the owner held out for some unrealistic Price Y and assumed that since no one would pay their ridiculous price, they should let it drop.

Kinda off-topic case in point: Just recently, one of the largest dn portfolio holders let drop a large number of small city pure geo .biz names, registered in 2002. Like, City.biz.

One of them was my childhood hometown, so obviously, I had to have that one (it being the only .biz name I own and probably the only .biz I'll ever own, barring a real freak opportunity). I didn't even bother placing a backorder and just snapped it with desktop software for registry fee.

The thing is, as stupid a TLD as I personally consider .biz to be, if I had seen (hometown).biz listed for sale at afternic for $200 or $300, I would've EASILY payed that without thinking twice, but seeing as it had been listed for sale without a price and considering who owned it- and how they're apt to price the names they sell- I didn't even bother to inquire. So, instead of recouping their renewal fees and turning a profit, they lost money (and I wound up getting the name for pennies on the dollar under what I would've been willing to pay)... and this is coming from a large, experienced seller of names. Small-timers are 100X worse about this.

 

[garptrader]

Yes, as a community we are guilty of pricing inventory at margins one would never see in other industries. If you can make a $100 sale of a reg fee domain with little marketing effort (passive sale), that may be a very nice ROI compared to what one sees in other industries. Of course quite often there is research, administrative and marketing required to sell a domain in addition to commissions which seem to be moving upwards.

 

[DomainTalker]

Some interesting thoughts in this thread.

I guess the reality is that - apart from specifically an auction - or, a set-price listing - every sale is actually an 'make offer/negotiation' process....which means the 'Make Offer' dynamic kick-starts a vast number of sales negotiations (both direct, via email, and, via, say, a Sedo)....plus....all sellers, in that scenario, have to, ultimately, determine a value for their domain, at some stage - by either quoting a price in response, or, agreeing to sell at a price.


I think the move by listing services towards listing domains with a set price, is all about the listing service houses' profit - but, not necessarily in the seller's interests at all.

The quality-vetting part would definitely take a human eye

I agree. And, a place where good quality, well set-priced, domains could be found would be useful.

Funnily enough, I was on a site just the other day (annoyingly, I can't now recall which site!) which listed a fair few really top quality domains for sale - with a set price. But, in every case, the price set was fantastical, imo......Massively high.


It'd take a special kind of individual to be able to get the quality/price right on your idea, dong...

.

 

[exsedo]

So when someone buys one of these fairly priced, fixed price domains, what is in the buyers head ?

Is it :-

1) If I buy that domain I can resell for $xxx profit.

In this case, the domain was never fairly priced to begin with.

2) If I buy that domain I can invest money in it and build a nice online business.

In this case, all advice I have ever seen is to not leave any money on the table, so auction is probably the best option anyway.

3) If I buy that domain I can add it to my other domains and wait until it's value goes up.

In this case, I think the biggest risk is taken. No-one can read the future markets.

There are probably other scenario's but to me, fairly priced/fixed price domains can only mean underpriced domains which someone else will make a profit on, and the people calling for fixed price/fairly priced domains are pretty confident that there will be plenty of domain sellers who will unwittingly set the fixed price well below what is a fair price.