.tv Thoughts and personal views needed about existing premiums .tv domains

[Makis.TV]

Its time to have a dedicated topic for this special matter.
Many of us registered .tv's with premium prices before the resent landrush, that leave us in an uncertain position because we don't know any of the following critical data:

1. Will they leave old premium prices as before, charging premium reg fee per yr?
2a. Will they offer us a buyout and if so how much will it be? Recent Landrush shows that many .tv's characterised as premiums before with mid $$$$ reg fee per yr, had a discounted reg fee during the landrush period, for example munich.tv from $5000 per yr dropped to $319 one time with name.com(Samit beat me over this :kickass
2b. If buyout is the case then when will this happen, since many of us have premiums expiring over a wide period of time, any delay will mean additional costs or even dropped domains and negative publicity(at least).
3a. Will they let us renew domains in normal reg fees since most of us paid already lots in renewals
3b. Like 2.a if this is the case then when will this be applied?

There is already open a conversation at watch.tv blog with Chris Sheridan from eno.com, take a look for yourself and why not add you comment too:
.tv Premium Announcement « Watch.tv Blog

- What do you think its more fair from this options?
- What do you think Verisign will finally decide?
- What will be your actions if Verisign leaves premium fees per yr or ask you for a buyout?

I d love to see your thoughts and personal views over this case, I d also love to see Jeff replying on subject as well.

 

[antonis12]

Onspot.. that really isnt a plausible "exit" strategy for any serious premium holder. By now they would have already invested thousands into the name and would not be willing to wager on 1.) enom's / verisign repricing. 2.) losing it to somebody else, and enom / versign knows these facts and that is why they will keep the old premium structure in place. Its a "cash cow" for them and they know it.

Virtuali, there are plenty of folks like me with very large premium portfolios where most of the names have not gone into development yet.

Given the awesome availability of lower priced good domains now in the secondary market, I won't lose any sleep about dropping some of my existing premiums and registering or purchasing other, better value domains. The fees paid to date are sunk costs. I spend NO time worrying about what I already spent; I just look at where I can spend my money this year and I can say, relative to the values out there in the marketplace right now, a good chunk of my portfolio is overpriced.

Sure, I doubt MTV.tv is going to drop to save $750 but most end-users have only 1 domain and aren't really paying a lot in fees. The whole issue is going to be what happens with guys like me who write very big checks every year to VSGN and in that discussion, at best, the balance of power between them and me is equal because if I drop a name, their ongoing revenue stream is gone.

They have taken the first big (and very healthy) step and let their existing premiums find the market clearing price which is, as many predicted, a lot lower than what they thought it was. But once you have done that, you can't be half-pregnant. The price will clear for all .tv domains in time.

And leaving our interests aside, there is value to VSGN to be able for the first time every to go to the market and give a simple explanation.

"All .tvs are now $20+/- renewals; come to .tv without fear" without 5 footnotes explaining "Except for"

 

[StargateCapital]

Here's a fair and reasonable solution that I think we should all get behind and lobby for:

Existing premiums that expire in less than one year from now pay one more year at their current rates and then revert to standard regfee. Names that have more than one year reg on them ought to be recognized as already haven fulfilled the one-more-year requirement and revert to standard effective immediately.

:sold:

RL

 

[virtuali]

Sorry guys.. but one thing you can "believe in" is that as long as verisign is still making money hand over fist on the current premium owners that scheme is not going anywhere anytime soon. The only thing that will prompt them to change is the loss or acceleration of income which is why we have seen the recent changes.

It isnt about universal acceptabiltiy etc.. its about money.

 

[antonis12]

Sorry guys.. but one thing you can "believe in" is that as long as verisign is still making money hand over fist on the current premium owners that scheme is not going anywhere anytime soon. The only thing that will prompt them to change is the loss or acceleration of income which is why we have seen the recent changes.

It isnt about universal acceptabiltiy etc.. its about money.

You are assuming all the current .tv premium holders aren't willing to drop and rebalance their domain portfolio.

Pretty sure that is not a correct assumption...

 

[MillersCrossing]

If all .tv owners with renewals over 10k a year get together as one and put pressure on Enom, the minimum I see happening from this pressure is a 50% discount on all your current premiums and if you have paid years in advance, their renewal date stretches out for every year you get another free.

That is the absolute least they could do from an equitable , not legal point of view.

But I feel it would still not solve the problem of uniformity or uncertainty of the .tv ext - which will do more harm monetarily to Verisign in the long run, then the profits they are making from .tv premium holders in the short run......

Perhaps I will be getting another $100 gift card for a telephone survey - this time it could start something like:

"what do you think we should do about the clients of ours who have faithfully stood by the extension and paid the wages for enom's employees for the last four years and now want to be rewarded for that faith, not shafted..."

 

[antonis12]

If all .tv owners with renewals over 10k a year get together as one and put pressure on Enom, the minimum I see happening from this pressure is a 50% discount on all your current premiums and if you have paid years in advance, their renewal date stretches out for every year you get another free.

That is the absolute least they could do from an equitable , not legal point of view.

But I feel it would still not solve the problem of uniformity or uncertainty of the .tv ext - which will do more harm monetarily to Verisign in the long run, then the profits they are making from .tv premium holders in the short run......

Perhaps I will be getting another $100 gift card for a telephone survey - this time it could start something like:

"what do you think we should do about the clients of ours who have faithfully stood by the extension and paid the wages for enom's employees for the last four years and now want to be rewarded for that faith, not shafted..."

The only model that helps VSGN thinking about the problem more broadly is something that eliminates the issue in its entirety. Half-measures will still leave the same confusing structure in place.

 

[Dr. Mindwrecker]

Everybody should just chill out and wait a few weeks, i'm sure it will get sorted out.

 

[virtuali]

I am not assuming "all".. I am assuming "most"... it really depends if the names were bought for speculation or development etc

 

[Vito]

Ya know,
I have watched this conversation from the sidelines and kept thinking to myself...
Verisign HAS to drop the existing Premiums.
I don't have any premiums by the way,
I have a love/hate relationship with Premiums, and can't afford the gamble.
but the thing I keep thinking about as you all discuss what is going to happen with the existing premium Holders and the existing Premium renewal rates...
is the current housing situation.

My house went down about $100,000+,
as I am sure most everyones has dropped in the past year or 2.
My mortgage Company still wants my monthly payment for an item they said was worth...so much.
I signed a contract and agreed.

Well, there are houses in the neighborhood that are similar, and selling for about $150,000 less.

Mathematically it almost makes more sense to throw the keys on the counter,
Walk away from the house and commitment take whatever penalty,
and go buy that house next door that is identical for $150,000 less.

So, do I feel cheated for buying the house during the pinnacle of thje housing bubble?
No.

Will the Mortgage Company actually renegotiate the loan, doubtful.
So, I guess what I am saying is that our dollars can buy more today
than they could have bought us yesterday.

So no matter what Verisign chooses to do, Either way, it is a win-win.

They keep screwing existing premium holders, then you guys decide to walk away,
and spend your saved money on new premiums that you will hold onto forever,
then Verisign loses money, and you win.

If they renogiate some sort of fair buyout terms, then you win also.

I dont know...
Thats just what this whole mess reminded me of.

 

[GoneWalkabout]

If all .tv owners with renewals over 10k a year get together as one and put pressure on Enom

Agree

Looks like the early seed of this getting together is happening right now.

The combined force of several hundred thousand a year in renewals walking through your door might just affect attitudes.

Individually, we are just pawns. Collectively, we could 'kick-ass' if the need arose.

 

[Jeff]

Everybody should just chill out and wait a few weeks, i'm sure it will get sorted out.

It's not going to be a matter of us chilling ... the .TV Sedo auction is scheduled to end in a few weeks time; I don't think you'll see any decision one way or another on this MAJOR LEAGUE ISSUE (MESS) until after the results of the auction (Verisign/Sedo make money from volumes of registrations and then the auction, itself), IMHO. While there's still a dark cloud of uncertainty, there's more money to be made at the expense of .TV domainers and investors! :yell: :imho:

All the best,
Jeff

 

[antonis12]

I am not assuming "all".. I am assuming "most"... it really depends if the names were bought for speculation or development.

My sense from having spent years in the premiums is that there are very few high $ renewal premiums that are active sites...

The examples that everyone likes to use as examples of Big Companies Using .tv are all pretty low dollar $ renewals:

TNT
MTV
Mercedes-Benz
MLB
Vogue
GM
Sex
Gay
Broadway
UFC
Blinkx
WE
Fuse

etc,

are mostly either reg fee or <$500 renewals so the $ at stake are below pocket change both for VSGN and the companies that registered them.

If there is a large development on very expensive renewal, I am curious to know what it is. I can't offhand think of one (And while I am sure there are one or two, it is certainly not common).

BTW, this is not a coincidence. The high renewals fees inhibit development, partnerships, investments, etc. Even if the $ volume is not that high in the scheme of the development, it leaves a bad taste in a lot of people's mouth: 'wait, why are we spending $5K / year for this? Can't we get something similar but cheaper?'

 

[Makis.TV]

Onspot.. that really isnt a plausible "exit" strategy for any serious premium holder. By now they would have already invested thousands into the name and would not be willing to wager on 1.) enom's / verisign repricing. 2.) losing it to somebody else, and enom / versign knows these facts and that is why they will keep the old premium structure in place. Its a "cash cow" for them and they know it.

Check Qoof post here:
http://www.namepros.com/dot-tv/646063-premium-renewal-name-holders-will-they.html
Its all about roi

 

[MillersCrossing]

Everybody should just chill out and wait a few weeks, i'm sure it will get sorted out.

Jack, You've been listening to too much Eminem..

Lets see how I do.

Yo Veisign what is this?!
been four years, given you plenty of business

took the crap, the BS, the flak
people pointin at me, saying its jackshit....

but who knows what u knows
when selling us mofos....
that this shit is dope
Remember you told us
It aint no soap

this is muvafuckin real
I swear by the pope

Now i have these all these premos,
So get me a rope
kick the chair, say goodbye
cause this is it, I d rather fuckin die
And all this shit..why?..
I'll tell you why, now that Im high

Its all cause of Verisigns lies...
Its all because of .....ugggghhhhhhhhhhhh

 

[Jeff]

^ :music: :hehe:

 

[Makis.TV]

I m going to mention this topic on watch.tv blog where I commented this issue:
.tv Premium Announcement « Watch.tv Blog

 

[snoop]

Virtuali your scenario has an exit solution, people drop their premiums and try to register them through one time fee, of course thats like having a big window in your house for fresh air while you are living in a neighborhood full of gangs.
I m sure many will take this chance, since many have already some premiums under their portofolio for reg fee so they feel more secure dropping one that doesnt fit.

I wont drop any of my premiums, I had in mind to drop just one but after this frenzy I m going to keep it.

It is a good strategy I think. Assuming there are no free kicks for premium renewal holders then the best thing they can do is rule a line under most names and let them drop, either try and buy it back or buy something else. People have already been dropping of course but now it is even more clear how mispriced those names really were. The money would be far better spent on the standard reg fee names. Dropping those names is basically the final stage of Verisigns failed model. They'll get repriced and resold as regular names and it will be a good thing.

If there was any sort of market for premium reg fees names last week I think that market has taken a huge dive with the latest news. Why on earth would anyone buy an aftermarket name with say a $1000 renewal now? I think really only an enduser would do it unless it was something of stunning quality.

---------- Post added at 03:04 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:01 PM ----------

I don't see how they can continue to charge premium pricing for premium names already registered. If a premium owner drops a name do the registrars then continue to charge the premium fee year after year to the new owner? I think not and that's why I believe they will drop the pricing to standard reg fees on all names

In my view a key issue is going to be some people would keep paying: endusers. So they are giving up a revenue stream by making changes. It won't be an easy call for Verisign.

 

[antonis12]

In my view a key issue is going to be some people would keep paying: endusers. So they are giving up a revenue stream by making changes. It won't be an easy call for Verisign.

Snoop, but to take a point you usually make: how many developed sites/end-users are there on premium domains, particularly those with high renewals?

Off hand, I can't think of a single high-renewal premium that is in use at a well-developed site.

The majority of the BigCo .tv sites I can think of are in the reg fee to $500/year range. AKA peanuts.

So, I think VSGN is going to discover a lot of their premium renewal income stream is much more theoretical than actual now that the market has repriced.

 

[gr8trfoo]

...

 

[snoop]

Snoop, but to take a point you usually make: how many developed sites/end-users are there on premium domains, particularly those with high renewals?

This isn't a point I've ever made. I've been saying for years these names make no sense for domainers. Never said endusers don't own premium names.

The majority of the BigCo .tv sites I can think of are in the reg fee to $500/year range. AKA peanuts.

What matters is Verisigns total revenue from enduers on premiums. Personally I doubt it is peanuts.