The religious discussion thread

[Archangel]

This thread was created to bring a local new story to light, which can be viewed below:

JACKSON, Ohio (AP) — An Ohio school district decided Tuesday night to keep a portrait of Jesus hanging in the school where it's been 65 years, denying a federal lawsuit's claim the portrait's display unconstitutionally promotes religion in a public school.

The Jackson City Schools board offered a constitutional justification of its own in voting 4-0 to keep the portrait up in its middle school, saying it must protect students' free speech rights. The vote drew cheers and applause from the dozens of people gathered in the elementary school gymnasium.

Read all of it here: http://news.yahoo.com/ohio-school-b...xzBHB0A3N0b3J5cGFnZQR0ZXN0A1Rlc3RfQUZD;_ylv=3

I posted his here @ NP to see what ppl had to say on the issue. As it turns out, this sparked many debates. I've considered closing this thread but after multiple suggestions, I decided to keep it open. Feel free to join in the topics but per forum rules, please refrain from obscene, threatening, rude, or insulting posts.

 

[JB Lions]

Well, we're talking about gay marriage in the U.S. I know a lot of fanatic/fundamentalist types that don't like gays, even to the extreme of wanting to kill them.

"if the muslims in the USA could get sharia enforced"

C'mon, be serious. Muslims in those other countries you mentioned don't even like that. But nice of you to generalize a whole religion.

 

[Archangel]

What criteria? That the parents are "straight because gays would be terrible parents"? Who is to make this criteria?

Fine with me, as long as they meet the criteria

 

[enlytend]

Fine with me, as long as they meet the criteria

But those children wouldn't have a mother AND a father either?

Actually, since this is the religious thread, I'd like to hear what you have to say about the other half of my comment:

if God is omnipotent, then God could surely fix things so that nobody was gay if (s)he wanted to do so - save everyone the speculation of what was or was not intended.

As for Muslim and gay - this is an interesting interview ...
http://dailycaller.com/2011/07/28/gay-and-muslim-—-is-that-even-possible-one-imam-says-‘yes’/

 

[Archangel]

On a somewhat lighter note.

 

[DU]

\
Actually, since this is the religious thread, I'd like to hear what you have to say about the other half of my comment:

Free will and all that; however, on judgment day thou will be accountable for your own actions.

A true God could make people to be free of God's omnipotence because being free is the ultimate and greatest reward that can be bestowed upon a soul.

When we get to heaven we will be able to experience and enjoy God directly without influence or knowledge of sin and evil that was given to us by Adam failing to put his trust in God.

Or something like that.

Maybe God got addicted to his subjects and wanted to see more and more depraved acts... I mean think about it, the world is essentially the internet to him... perhaps he got addicted to voyeur porn and needs an intervention.

 

[iowadawg]

Well, I see someone has no clue about muslims in America, in Canada, in Europe, and the rest of the world.

Oh well, to liberals ignorance is really bliss.

 

[Archangel]

God gave us all free will. We are not as 'puppetized' as some think.

Free will and all that; however, on judgment day thou will be accountable for your own actions.

A true God could make people to be free of God's omnipotence because being free is the ultimate and greatest reward that can be bestowed upon a soul.

When we get to heaven we will be able to experience and enjoy God directly without influence or knowledge of sin and evil that was given to us by Adam failing to put his trust in God.

Or something like that.

Maybe God got addicted to his subjects and wanted to see more and more depraved acts... I mean think about it, the world is essentially the internet to him... perhaps he got addicted to voyeur porn and needs an intervention.

 

[DU]

 

[JB Lions]

Well, I see someone has no clue about muslims in America, in Canada, in Europe, and the rest of the world.

Oh well, to liberals ignorance is really bliss.

That would be you. The reality is most people in this world, whether they're Muslim, Christian, Atheist, whatever, wake up each day just wanting the best lives they can possibly have for themselves and/or their families. You make it seem like Muslims just want to run around the earth, enacting Sharia law and killing gays.

I'm curious, what percentage of Muslims do you think are just good decent, people? Do you think decent Muslims exist, or are they all just evil in your mind? Looking for a number.

 

[DU]

 

[Kate]

They forget that the one bunch of people they love so much and will protect so much (the muslims)....
KILL GAYS!!!!!!

Well guy,
Try reading about Iran, Iran, Afghan, blah blah...

Where there they kill gays.

These countries aren't democratic, but the divide between democratic/undemocratic nations does not run along religious lines.
For instance, there are countries in Africa that are violently anti-gay, even when christianity is the dominant religion.
Examples: Cameroon, Zimbabwe.
I think there is a problem with religionS in general, and intolerance.

Am sure, if the muslims in the USA could get sharia enforced, they would go on a gay killing spree.
When they are not too busy with their honor killings.

I would be more concerned about the many Christian fanatics and Jesus camps. There is no shortage of Christian nutjobs in the US.

 

[GILSAN]

As for Muslim and gay - this is an interesting interview ...
http://dailycaller.com/2011/07/28/gay-and-muslim-—-is-that-even-possible-one-imam-says-‘yes’/

The guy is a Black Gay American Muslim who spent 3 years in Saudi Arabia. Here's part of his interview:

You lived in Saudi Arabia for three years—were you afraid of being gay there? I mean, they impose the Death Penalty [for homosexuality].

Yeah, but I wasn’t there to have sex with people. I was there to work.

Sure, but you didn’t date at all the whole time?

No, I had a partner here. I would work 12 weeks and then have about three weeks off, so it worked out really well.

Now can you imagine if he admitted that he was gay during his stay in Saudi Arabia. He'd have his throat slit in the wink of an eye, that's for sure.

---------- Post added at 01:54 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:44 PM ----------

These countries aren't democratic, but the divide between democratic/undemocratic nations does not run along religious lines.
For instance, there are countries in Africa that are violently anti-gay, even when christianity is the dominant religion.
Examples: Cameroon, Zimbabwe.

Africa is a dangerous place for Gays. Very little tolerance there and it's mostly a cultural thing and less to do with religion.

I would be more concerned about the many Christian fanatics and Jesus camps. There is no shortage of Christian nutjobs in the US.

Really? So 9/11 is not something to be concerned about? :o

 

[enlytend]

Now can you imagine if he admitted that he was gay during his stay in Saudi Arabia. He'd have his throat slit in the wink of an eye, that's for sure.

I'm not disputing that there are muslim countries which impose a death penalty for being gay. My point was that there are gay muslims and gay muslim communities and that the Quran doesn't condemn gays.

As an Arabic expert, he says if you understand the vernacular of the time in which the Quran was written, it doesn’t condemn homosexuality. All of God’s instructions about marriages are written in gender-neutral language like “pair” and “couple,” and of the seven things listed as abominations, homosexuality isn’t one of them.

 

[Kate]

Really? So 9/11 is not something to be concerned about? :o

Do you mean the 9-11 terrorists are representative of all Muslims ?
It's like saying that the extremists that kill gays in Cameroon in the name of God are representative of all Christians on Earth. Or the KKK, or the Westboro Church.

Tolerance is not a cultural thing per se, it's a question of education first. Tolerance and intolerance are both found in all societies.
But when hatred is taught at school and defines official state policy (like in Iran) what can you expect.

 

[GILSAN]

I'm not disputing that there are muslim countries which impose a death penalty for being gay. My point was that there are gay muslims and gay muslim communities and that the Quran doesn't condemn gays.

Quote:
As an Arabic expert, he says if you understand the vernacular of the time in which the Quran was written, it doesn’t condemn homosexuality. All of God’s instructions about marriages are written in gender-neutral language like “pair” and “couple,” and of the seven things listed as abominations, homosexuality isn’t one of them.

That's what he says. Read more: http://www.answering-islam.org/Authors/Arlandson/homosexual.htm

Yes there are gay Muslims but they are as good as dead if they come out of the closet.

 

[Archangel]

GILSAN has nothing left in his arsenal, as everyone showed him to be riddled with errors, so he's rehashing old arguments (ones that failed when he 1st made them lol) and is trying to accuse us of being 'brainwashed' (though he himself is trying to brainwash us. Irony?) & ends his refutes with propaganda declaring that he's right, we're all wrong, and that's it. Yeah, I don't understand his failed logic, either, though I nevertheless welcome it.

Do you mean the 9-11 terrorists are representative of all Muslims ?
It's like saying that the extremists that kill gays in Cameroon in the name of God are representative of all Christians on Earth. Or the KKK, or the Westboro Church.

Tolerance is not a cultural thing per se, it's a question of education first. Tolerance and intolerance are both found in all societies.
But when hatred is taught at school and defines official state policy (like in Iran) what can you expect.

 

[GILSAN]

Do you mean the 9-11 terrorists are representative of all Muslims ?

When I watched on the news images of people in Palestine, Iran, other countries in the Middle East, Pakistan, various countries in North Africa (all of them Muslim countries) then I would have to say, yes, not 100% but a very high %.

It's like saying that the extremists that kill gays in Cameroon in the name of God are representative of all Christians on Earth. Or the KKK, or the Westboro Church.

Tolerance is not a cultural thing per se, it's a question of education first. Tolerance and intolerance are both found in all societies.
But when hatred is taught at school and defines official state policy (like in Iran) what can you expect.

And who says the the extremists that kill gays in Cameroon are Christians and not Muslims, or maybe both, or maybe, just like I said earlier, it's mostly due to their cultural beliefs?

If hatred is taught in Iraqi schools then it's aimed at Christians, Jews and Americans mostly, I would imagine.

It's funny that the Westboro Church is often brought up as an example of Christian intolerance, when they don't even represent (in terms of size) a drop in the Pacific Ocean. If you want to make comparisons then use large churches, with millions of followers, not a supposed church with a half dozen nut cases.

 

[JB Lions]

I always thought it was interesting how people cherry picked the bible. I was working one Sunday, when my friend messaged me saying I should have my head chopped off for doing so, and linked to the bible passage.

Saw this one just posted, and one of them I talked about above:

ala - https://www.facebook.com/RichardDawkinsFoundation?ref=stream

 

[iowadawg]

http://www.thecommentator.com/article/3079/christians_slaughtered_world_yawns

Including some on namepros...because hey, they got to love them christian haters.

http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/...tml?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

For those of you with your head up your asses when it comes to the muslims in the USA.

 

[JB Lions]

http://www.thecommentator.com/article/3079/christians_slaughtered_world_yawns

Including some on namepros...because hey, they got to love them christian haters.

http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/...tml?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

For those of you with your head up your asses when it comes to the muslims in the USA.

You skipped the question:

"I'm curious, what percentage of Muslims do you think are just good decent, people? Do you think decent Muslims exist, or are they all just evil in your mind? Looking for a number."

Is that supposed to impress somebody because you found some story of somebody killing somebody? Can find that kind of thing in all directions. All that shows is religion sure is involved in a lot of hate/killing/problems in the world.