advice Here’s Why You Shouldn’t Reveal Your Domain Acquisitions Too Soon

[Omar Negron]

This happened to me a few weeks ago and is something you should always keep in mind. It was a mistake on my part and something I think we all could learn from.

I won a domain name for a GREAT price in my opinion. I was very happy with the purchase, so happy that I went on the Namepros forum and revealed what domain name I had just won at auction.

in a nutshell, you don’t own the domain name anymore...

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[cdboard]

I would suggest waiting a week *after* it's in your account.

 

[doubleU]

don't count your chickens before they hatch !

 

[platey]

I prefer reg fee

But bought an emoji domain name recently but it turns out it couldn't be bought in the tld I chose so payment was refunded and the domain I thought I bought It now turns out I didn't

 

[ksusha64]

I might of renewed it. What was the domain?

 

[Omar Negron]

I would suggest waiting a week *after* it's in your account.

Makes sense! Thanks for the advice!

don't count your chickens before they hatch !

=)

I prefer reg fee

But bought an emoji domain name recently but it turns out it couldn't be bought in the tld I chose so payment was refunded and the domain I thought I bought It now turns out I didn't

Thanks for sharing!

I might of renewed it. What was the domain?

Send me over a PM. Don't want to put the domain out there in public.

Thanks!

 

[offthehandle]

Not surprisingly, I have a strong opinion about this "babysitting" period. As I wrote before on those other threads, once something is "on the block", that's it. NamePros doesn't do that. DropCatch doesn't do that. There is a REAL auction world that exists where physical property is sold and it works that way. The gavel hits the desk and it's sold. Done. No waiting, no excuses, it's gone. No recourse, unless it was a reserve auction. I don't think even Ebay suffers from "Sellers/ex-owners remorse" syndrome like this.

Nothing should be ever be sold in a "fake" auction, because the way business is being conducted like this in the digital world, it isn't really an auction. Why not called it a pre-sales interest and free appraisal and open interest gathering process?

Nothing should be offered for sale or auctioned, until it is available for sale. It's completely wrongheaded to give more time on these marketplaces that sell things at auction, you as a buyer waste your time and then poof. You snooze, you lose.

What if registries did that? Say you saw a drop, then you hand reg it, and then the registry says there is a holding period? "Just a moment sir, we need to verify that this is really being dropped, we need to email the previous owner".....Would that be fair? Nope. But these "Auctions" seem to work in this way.

https://www.namepros.com/threads/dynadot-auction-terms-question.1015659/
https://www.namepros.com/threads/do...is-name-is-not-dropping.1022232/#post-6184717

 

[Omar Negron]

Nothing should be ever be sold in a "fake" auction, because the way business is being conducted like this in the digital world, it isn't really an auction. Why not called it a pre-sales interest and free appraisal and open interest gathering process?

Nothing should be offered for sale or auctioned, until it is available for sale. It's completely wrongheaded to give more time on these marketplaces that sell things at auction, you as a buyer waste your time and then poof. You snooze, you lose.

You bring up good points. I checked out the threads you linked to as well.

Thanks for sharing your experiences.

-Omar

 

[offthehandle]

You bring up good points. I checked out the threads you linked to as well.

Thanks for sharing your experiences.

-Omar

My motivation is to educate those people who are not aware of what conditions of a real auction of physical property are. That perhaps might bring this to attention of enough buyers to collectively complain about the issue, and maybe someday these fake auctions might be converted to real auctions. This issue could perhaps be rectified by simply the pushing the start date out the x days out beyond the current date they use now after pending delete ends per ICANN rules.
Businesswise, I don't know why this is this way. I don't know what customer retention or acquisition costs are (perhaps high) hence the current auction holders motivation favoring the seller in this lopsided manner.

I have dealt with hundreds of auction situations in person, but then after growth, many were remote via cell ph in the 90's early days with my contracted buyers on site inspecting, appraising and proxy bidding for me.

Thanks for posting your story, its important to share this information.

 

[Pepto]

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I'm having some issues with 123-reg after buying domains still not resolved i think they explained the same situation . Seems to be a common problem they should implement a structure when a domain is passed it's expiry date you no longer have 1st dibs on it being the original owner maybe the best idea is to renew before it dropping if it's really worth it at all not after.

Is there perhaps another angle for example will it show in its price history searches could be used to say "hey look it sold before for x amount so that's what its worth ? ) Then sell it in a years time ?

Just my thoughts feel terrible for anyone the high of getting a great domain then kicked in the balls saying no you don't have it is horrible.

 

[gpmgroup]

If names get to redemption/drop there's more competition for good names so even if some get renewed there are advantages to buying from expired auctions. Some owners watch the expired auctions of their names to see if there are any bids before deciding to whether to renew or not.

 

[offthehandle]

Some owners watch the expired auctions of their names to see if there are any bids before deciding to whether to renew or not.

I blame the platforms for allowing this, and of course as a business advantage, the domainers would use this gamey loophole, so I get it.

here was my response before, and it stands.

I just disagree with this auction "babysitting" by registries... auctions should never ever be started in any situation until whatever is being sold is free and clear or considered abandoned. Period.

Imagine going to buy a used car. You drive to dealership, test drive, negotiate price, pay them in full. Then they tell you as you head out the door thinking that you are going to drive it home... but sorry... we need to wait a few more days because the car was repossessed and the previous owner might pay us. We need to call him once again to make sure. Please! The dealer had no right to offer it for sale in the first place, and they took the money.

 

[Brand Herald]

Were you refunded by account credit or refunded to your original payment source?

 

[offthehandle]

I am not sure who you are asking, but in my case I was credited, no offer of refund. I assume if I complained they would send it back to paypal.

 

[flybuzz]

Actually the result is probably the same even if you hadn't revealed your name. I have seen this happened to me so many times at GoDaddy and I never revealed the name to anyone. I also have seen post mentioning the original owner may have done it as a strategy, letting the domain expire and go to auction so he can figure out exactly what the domain is worth and then renew it. Godaddy would send so many freaking follow-up emails asking the owner to renew it, so it would be unlikely to get a good name if the original owner really had no intention of letting it go. I also thinks, who ever you beat in the auction may also try to alert the owner so if he doesn't get to have it, you don't get to have it either. I hate the practice of auctioning the domain off when the owner can still renew it. I thought only Godaddy does that but I guess Dynadot does that as well. I think they might be partners, but not sure. I have lost more than 5 good names because of this. They will refund the money back to you in a couple of days.

 

[deez007]

Not surprisingly, I have a strong opinion about this "babysitting" period. As I wrote before on those other threads, once something is "on the block", that's it. NamePros doesn't do that. DropCatch doesn't do that. There is a REAL auction world that exists where physical property is sold and it works that way. The gavel hits the desk and it's sold. Done. No waiting, no excuses, it's gone. No recourse, unless it was a reserve auction. I don't think even Ebay suffers from "Sellers/ex-owners remorse" syndrome like this.

Nothing should be ever be sold in a "fake" auction, because the way business is being conducted like this in the digital world, it isn't really an auction. Why not called it a pre-sales interest and free appraisal and open interest gathering process?

Nothing should be offered for sale or auctioned, until it is available for sale. It's completely wrongheaded to give more time on these marketplaces that sell things at auction, you as a buyer waste your time and then poof. You snooze, you lose.

What if registries did that? Say you saw a drop, then you hand reg it, and then the registry says there is a holding period? "Just a moment sir, we need to verify that this is really being dropped, we need to email the previous owner".....Would that be fair? Nope. But these "Auctions" seem to work in this way.

https://www.namepros.com/threads/dynadot-auction-terms-question.1015659/
https://www.namepros.com/threads/do...is-name-is-not-dropping.1022232/#post-6184717

This is something that I have also been complaining about for a while.

What never ceases to amaze me is how domain registrars & registries seem to operate on their own set of rules and business practices on a number of things. Business practices that would never ever be tolerated or permitted in any other industry. The people who bare the brunt of these business practices is normally, us...the domainers. I'm not sure how but something needs to be done, we are being held hostage to shocking service levels and dubious business practices by many registires/registrars and they are getting away with it purely because they know they can. Perhaps a domainers union or a domainers action group or somthing needs to be started. Again, not sure what the actual solution is but I think it's good that these issues are being raised so at the very least the right dicussions can start taking place and hopefully we can all come up with a solution.

 

[offthehandle]

This is something that I have also been complaining about for a while.

Business practices that would never ever be tolerated or permitted in any other industry. The people who bare the brunt of these business practices is normally, us...the domainers. I'm not sure how but something needs to be done, we are being held hostage to shocking service levels and dubious business practices by many registires/registrars and they are getting away with it purely because they know they can. Perhaps a domainers union or a domainers action group or somthing needs to be started. Again, not sure what the actual solution is but I think it's good that these issues are being raised so at the very least the right dicussions can start taking place and hopefully we can all come up with a solution.

Ok, I did some research- These are not auctions. They are unprofessional "fishing expeditions", or "Interest Gathering" and in my opinion misrepresented as Auctions. They are in non-compliance of standard auction practices as outlined under the "English Absolute Auction" format (Non reserve). I think we should contact the NAA for their independent opinion at [email protected] or (913) 541-8084. And see what they say.

http://www.auctioneers.org/consumers/consumer-faqs

Here is the definition:
Absolute Auction: An "absolute auction" is an auction where the property is sold to the highest bidder. There is not a minimum or reserve price that must be met to complete the auction sale.

One of the most common statements made at auction, “as is, where is,” simply means the property is being sold without warranty and that there are no contingencies based on the status of the asset being sold. It is important that you inspect all auction properties before you bid, both real estate and personal property. Photos may not show all the details or potential faults with the asset and it is your job as a well informed bidder to thoroughly inspect and know what you are bidding on BEFORE the start of the auction. Once you bid and buy an asset at auction, you are the new owner.


REAL auction houses are professional. I have a feeling the subject platforms of repossessing domains are in need of some education about REAL auctions.

 

[deez007]

Ok, I did some research- These are not auctions. They are unprofessional "fishing expeditions", or "Interest Gathering" and in my opinion misrepresented as Auctions. They are in non-compliance of standard auction practices as outlined under the "English Absolute Auction" format (Non reserve). I think we should contact the NAA for their independent opinion at [email protected] or (913) 541-8084. And see what they say.

http://www.auctioneers.org/consumers/consumer-faqs

Here is the definition:
Absolute Auction: An "absolute auction" is an auction where the property is sold to the highest bidder. There is not a minimum or reserve price that must be met to complete the auction sale.

One of the most common statements made at auction, “as is, where is,” simply means the property is being sold without warranty and that there are no contingencies based on the status of the asset being sold. It is important that you inspect all auction properties before you bid, both real estate and personal property. Photos may not show all the details or potential faults with the asset and it is your job as a well informed bidder to thoroughly inspect and know what you are bidding on BEFORE the start of the auction. Once you bid and buy an asset at auction, you are the new owner.


REAL auction houses are professional. I have a feeling the subject platforms of repossessing domains are in need of some education about REAL auctions.

Woaaaah dude!!! GOOD FIND!!!!

I think this might be worth exploring further.... they only grey area here that I'm wondering about, which is how we often get shafted with online/websites servies.. is if there is anything in any of the the registrars terms of service that covers the above mentioned scenario... if not, then maybe we actually have a leg to stand on here....

Perhaps @jberryhill would be kind enough to shed some light here. JBH, Are we being presumpteous in assuming we have some grounds to take this up or do you think we can pursue this?

 

[offthehandle]

They cover themselves with terms and conditions alright, I read the fine print. I've have been thinking about this for a couple days, and complaining but not looking at the solution. So after reading that while it defines the problem, (it's not an auction, it's b.s,,etc. ) the solution isn't as easy as I thought.

The reason is that I believe the previous registrant controls the domain "title" so to speak during the pending delete period, and not the registry- unlike in a Receivership case. If I am wrong with that, then the solution would be easy, as the registry can choose to conduct business differently. In REAL auctions- property is either consigned or purchased as an entire lot, plant, etc. The Auctioneer/Receiver has fiduciary duty to take possession temporarily "title" and dispose of the assets to the highest bidder. In some cases entire bid's are made by several receivers/auctioneers for all of the assets and the highest bidder auctioneer is the receiver and owns all the assets, and picks through them for their own sales, then sells the rest, we call that high-grading. In Gov't auctions or sealed bids, the gov't owns the property even though it is located on the premises of the contractor and the assets are disposed also by the contractor who acts as a fiduciary. These real auctions have the liberty of time to possess the property, inspect, arrange for sale, lot marking and groupings of good and junk together,etc.

So in the case of domains, and ICANN rules the registry abides by either require all names drop or they would have to "purchase" and pay the ICANN fee, for a temporary period, then provide the names up for auction and those not purchased at auction are deleted. The impractical business issue in this situation I believe is that the registry must register ALL these crazy ridiculous unwanted names along with the few worthy of auction. Or have a department to pick and choose which to possess temporarily.

I need to look further into the ICANN rules and procedure to clarify.

 

[deez007]

They cover themselves with terms and conditions alright, I read the fine print. I've have been thinking about this for a couple days, and complaining but not looking at the solution. So after reading that while it defines the problem, (it's not an auction, it's b.s,,etc. ) the solution isn't as easy as I thought.

The reason is that I believe the previous registrant controls the domain "title" so to speak during the pending delete period, and not the registry- unlike in a Receivership case. If I am wrong with that, then the solution would be easy, as the registry can choose to conduct business differently. In REAL auctions- property is either consigned or purchased as an entire lot, plant, etc. The Auctioneer/Receiver has fiduciary duty to take possession temporarily "title" and dispose of the assets to the highest bidder. In some cases entire bid's are made by several receivers/auctioneers for all of the assets and the highest bidder auctioneer is the receiver and owns all the assets, and picks through them for their own sales, then sells the rest, we call that high-grading. In Gov't auctions or sealed bids, the gov't owns the property even though it is located on the premises of the contractor and the assets are disposed also by the contractor who acts as a fiduciary. These real auctions have the liberty of time to possess the property, inspect, arrange for sale, lot marking and groupings of good and junk together,etc.

So in the case of domains, and ICANN rules the registry abides by either require all names drop or they would have to "purchase" and pay the ICANN fee, for a temporary period, then provide the names up for auction and those not purchased at auction are deleted. The impractical business issue in this situation I believe is that the registry must register ALL these crazy ridiculous unwanted names along with the few worthy of auction. Or have a department to pick and choose which to possess temporarily.

I need to look further into the ICANN rules and procedure to clarify.

Jeepers man, now that throws a spanner in the works ....lol

Hmmm, I wonder though...if the fact that domains are not actually owned, they are technically leased for a time period. I would imagine that the actual registry owns the domain so surely they could arrange for the registrar to take temporary possesion of the domain for the duration of the auction period. I have no idea as well, just spit balling ideas here... hope JBH can give us some insight here..

 

[gpmgroup]

the solution isn't as easy as I thought.... I need to look further into the ICANN rules and procedure to clarify.

Now there's a thing and not a single large font used buried in the small print I guess lol.

 

[offthehandle]

https://onlinedomain.com/2017/06/08/domain-name-news/won-godaddy-expired-auction-domain-name/

Other veterans having issues with auctions too.

 

[offthehandle]

Pending Delete code:

"This status code may be mixed with redemptionPeriod or pendingRestore. In such case, depending on the status (i.e. redemptionPeriod or pendingRestore) set in the domain name, the corresponding description presented above applies. If this status is not combined with the redemptionPeriod or pendingRestore status, the pendingDelete status code indicates that your domain has been in redemptionPeriod status for 30 days and you have not restored it within that 30-day period. Your domain will remain in this status for several days, after which time your domain will be purged and dropped from the registry database."

Summary column:

"If you want to keep your domain name, you must immediately contact your registrar to discuss what options are available."

Ok, some weasel room here is opened up to registries discretion during the 5 day pending delete period, which followed the prior 30 day grace renewal period that was previously ignored by current registrant.

https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/epp-status-codes-2014-06-16-en


http://archive.icann.org/en/meetings/lisbon/transcript-tutorial-expiring-25mar07.htm
Expiring marketplace discussion in 2007.

 

[siya]

Than you for the information so that others may not do this again.