Dynadot needs to fix expired auctions problem

[Erdy]

Dynadot sends their expired domains to auction on their site. The auction starts on day 32 after expiry and closes 6 days later on day 38. At the same time they allow the previous owner to recover his domain until day 40 at regular registration fee (about $8).

Read the rest here:
http://www.namecatch.com/main/dynadot-expired-auctions-problem

Dynadot needs to fix this problem. Hopefully when will do so when more people contact them. I'm asking all domainers to send an email to [email protected] and tell them to fix their misconfigured auctions playform.

Thanks
Erdy

 

[Erdy]

I'm looking for more support on this issue. Please let me know if you have emailed them.

This is a unique problem to Dynadot that does not exist elsewhere. There is no other registrar that allows reg fee recovery after an expired domain auction. This creates a loophole for the domain owner to let his domains expire on purpose to watch and get a realistic valuation at the auction with no additional cost than he would have paid if he didn't let his domain expire and go to auction. Auction winners lose valuable time end up with nothing but frustration.

20% of won auctions at Dynadot end up being reversed whereas it is less than %1 at Godaddy because Godaddy does not allow reg fee recovery after the auction.

The percentages are from my personal experience of auctions that I have won on both sites.

 

[DU]

I emailed them.

I'm writing to suggest that you change your expired auction format.

In this auction you are able to generate revenue that would otherwise be lost. You sell a domain that is expiring for $20 and you can pocket the extra $12 (if the registration/renewal is $8).

I can tell you that I and others simply do not even bother to bid on your auctions because a number of times we have won and the the domain has been renewed by the original registrant!

Worse? We can only get account credit which is simply not good enough.

I suggest you DO NOT ALLOW renewal of domains that you have sold in Auction. This can easily be fixed by changing the T&C of your registration.

This would (A) Make people willing to bid on expired auctions (B) Bid FAR MORE knowing that it won't end up as account credit and (C) YOU MAKE ALL THE MONEY!!!

Thanks for listening.

We don't necessarily totally agree... but I think we agree in principle that the renewal of domains post auction is NOT something that makes sense.

 

[Erdy]

Thanks dude. You are an old friend and I remember you from lots of old topics when your username was defaultuser. I have now removed you from my ignore list. It would be a shame.

Some domainers want more grander solutions than it is possible. Those arguments are theoretical. However this problem is easily fixable. I know all about randomly dropping expired auctions, killing dropcatching etc. It doesn't work. See the .de registry who drops randomly. Anyway, this is off topic. We can discuss that elsewhere.

I'm still waiting for Tippy to change his mind. He made me really really crazy the last time around this issue was discussed.

Come on people, Dynadot is close to fixing this problem. A few people have emailed them. We need a little more support on this. Don't wait until you win an auction and the domain is taken from you. Because it didn't happen so far doesn't mean it won't happen to you. It happened me 4 times during last few months. Join me on this issue please.

Thanks
Erdy

 

[DU]

Thanks dude. You are an old friend and I remember you from lots of old topics when your username was defaultuser. I have now removed you from my ignore list. It would be a shame.

Not sure many people know I changed my name. I'm thinking of changing it back.

You weren't ever really on my ignore list

J.

 

[Erdy]

There is another topic where somebody who doesn't understand the problem keeps writing rubbish.

The issue is not whether or not a domain owner should be allowed to renew until the last moment.

The issue is whether or not a domain owner should be allowed to watch the expired auction, see the auction closing price, AND THEN make a decision to renew his domain and waste the time of all the bidders.

That's the current problem which exists only at Dynadot because only they allow reg fee recovery after the expired auction.

Namecheap allows only 27 days for reactivation:
http://namecheap.simplekb.com/kb.show?show=article&articleid=242&categoryid=35

Name.com gives only 25 days and they clearly day they will sell the domain after that:
http://www.name.com/faq/retrieve-my-domain-after-the-expiration

Godaddy allows 19 days reg fee recovery.
http://help.godaddy.com/article/608?locale=en

Nobody allows 40 days reg fee recovery but Dynadot which pushes the recovery day after the auction end.

 

[DU]

So the solution that meets both of your desires (mostly):

Dynadot can allow renewals UP TO 32 days with no concern.
Dynadot can allow renewals UP TO 40 days UNLESS the domain was sold in Auction.

They would need to change their T&C to support this but this would make sense.

You get maximum renewal time.
You get more renewal time than most registrars.
If someone wins the domain they win the domain and the registrant loses the domain.

It's a Win-Win solution - essentially removing free domain appraisals which they can get through listing at auction anyway if they want.

I don't know that the other thread is rubbish. They just have a different opinion on what is the most important aspect. In their opinion the prior registrant is more important than the auction scavengers.

Neither argument is rubbish and there are many ways to skin a cat.

 

[Erdy]

Yes that would work. However there are even easier solutions that don't require changing terms such as running the auction until day 41 instead 38. Registrars get 45 free days from the registry. Many auction sites run auctions until day 42.

 

[DU]

Yes that would work. However there are even easier solutions that don't require changing terms such as running the auction until day 41 instead 38. Registrars get 45 free days from the registry. Many auction sites run auctions until day 42.

Even better. Then the renewal period is the same and the Auction winner wins.

Sounds fair. I'd email that.

 

[Erdy]

Today I found somebody admitting to exploit the dynadot expired auctions, just like thought they would do. This real life example shows the problem better than I tried explain.

"Link to external forum deleted. Please avoid linking to external forums"

jacksonm admits he likes dynadot because he can use the expired auctions as a free valuation tool even though it is a waste of auction winner's time and creates lots of frustration.

Please join me on this issue. Email Dynadot at [email protected] and tell them to change reg fee after auction recovery. This problem does not exist elsewhere because other registrars either don't allow after auction recovery or they don't allow it at reg fee.

I'm looking for more contribution on this issue. Dynadot does not want to upset big portfolio holders and therefore they don't mind screwing the small domainer. This is wrong.

 

[Erdy]

I'm disappointed with the domainer community and namepros members because of the lack of contribution to solve this problem.

 

[Kate]

Well, what you depict as a domainer-adverse policy is actually registrant friendly. Being a domainer and a Dynadot customer I would rather have Dynadot favor my interest.
So I'm not fighting over this.
If you want to do something, there are more serious issues with Icann right now, for example. In fact, there are policies being discussed that potentially could affect all domain holders, not just domainers.

On a side note, I buy expired domain names at many venues including GD but I seldom see any quality domains expiring at Dynadot, so I admit I do not feel strongly affected personally.

The thing I agree with is, Dynadot should do full refunds, and not just account credit.

 

[lothos]

I'm disappointed with the domainer community and namepros members because of the lack of contribution to solve this problem.

I don't see it as a problem. It is very domain-owner friendly and I agree with their policy.

If you want something to rally around, I would suggest Godaddy's violating ICANN policies with their 60 day lock periods, or the proposed new dispute policies for .net.

 

[DU]

Well, what you depict as a domainer-adverse policy is actually registrant friendly. Being a domainer and a Dynadot customer I would rather have Dynadot favor my interest.

So you consider it domainer friendly to be able to let your names expire AND go to auction and then recover the names after they are sold?

It's nothing but absurd.

 

[Kate]

What is absurd ? I said registrant-friendly, not domainer-friendly.

Some people just forget (their fault, but they are entitled to a recovery period anyway) or change their minds.
Of course some people are gaming the system too. That's unfortunate for domainers.

The prerelease game is such that registrars have an incentive to screw you, and not remind you of your expiring domains. If one registrar is giving priority to the interests of the registrant I'm okay with it.
In fact domainers complain a lot about the lack of ethics of registrars, so why not look at it from a different angle.

 

[DU]

What is absurd ? I said registrant-friendly, not domainer-friendly.

Some people just forget (their fault, but they are entitled to a recovery period anyway) or change their minds.
Of course some people are gaming the system too. That's unfortunate for domainers.

The prerelease game is such that registrars have an incentive to screw you, and not remind you of your expiring domains. If one registrar is giving priority to the interests of the registrant I'm okay with it.
In fact domainers complain a lot about the lack of ethics of registrars, so why not look at it from a different angle.

You did say registrant friendly. Sorry.

Perhaps if they REALLY wanted to be registrant friendly they wouldn't change the email whois the second it expired. Perhaps they wouldn't LOCK your domain on expiration and tell you that you can't transfer it but you can renew with them.

They don't remind you up until the last day. The only people who would wait that long are people with sites containing no content and who might like to see auction results... hmmm...wonder who that is.

If they were registrant friendly they would sell your domain and give you the profits.

BUT

Let's not confuse the issues here. The issue is that your name goes to auction.. it gets BOUGHT by someone else... and then you can renew.

But whatever. It is what it is. All registrars suck in one way or another.

 

[Erdy]

stub,
you posted this comment elsewhere today:

Well they are no different to GoDaddy over this issue.

and I want to answer you here.

Dynadot is very different than godaddy and I will explain exactly why.

http://www.godaddy.com/agreements/showdoc.aspx?pageid=REG_SA
The Renewal Grace Period is currently twelve (12) days ... pay Go Daddy a Redemption fee and redeem your domain name. The Redemption fee is currently $80.00 USD

Let's say you are a domainer and you have 2000 domains. There are 52 weeks in a year. You will have 2000/52= 38 domains expiring every week. It might be hard to decide which domains to let go and which to keep.

Therefore you want to let all 38 domains expire and go to auction and you will decide after the auction if you want to keep any of them. You want other people to do the hard worth on researching whether a domain is worthy or not.

With godaddy you can not do this because the extra $80 fee to recover. You must review your domains and make a decision to renew or not before the auction (in fact you have only 12 days) if you don't want to pay $80 extra fee for each after auction recovery.

With dynadot you can do this because there are no fees at all. You will let all 38 domains expire and go to auction on purpose. Then you sit back and watch the auctions. Then you recover domains that are sold to other people. You pay only what you would pay normally which is the regular renewal fee.

At Dynadot you have 41 days to recover at regular renewal fee which extends beyond the expired auction that closes on day 38.

At godaddy you have 12 days to recover at regular renewal fee and it does not extend beyond the auction. You can not decide to renew at regular reg fee after the auction.

So as you see dynadot and godaddy are very different unlike you said in your comment.

I'm a researcher. I check expired domain auctions. I don't like my time being wasted. I won 4 domains at dynadot that were recovered after I won them. I have a problem with that because the auctions closed on day 38 and they were recovered on day 41. Why? Because the domain owner was watching the auctions to decide whether to keep or not.

Those dynadot people are bloody idiots.

 

[Name Trader]

I just came across this thread after replying to your PM. The only difference between GoDaddy and Dynadot with regards to renewing after an auction has completed is that at Dynadot you can renew for reg-fee, whereas at GoDaddy you transfer to another registrar for reg-fee up to 41 days after expiry (or until you get their email on day 42). This is long after the domain auction has completed.

 

[Erdy]

Transfering away is not exactly a method to manage your portfolio efficiently especially if the domain owner is a lazy bastard who can't be bothered to decide what domains to let go. It is too much work. You would need to get all transfer codes beforehand or you need to contact somebody at godaddy to get the transfer code. If you do this on a regular basis, lets say you let expire 38 domains every weak and recover 10 of them then the godaddy people will be pissed with you. Imagine calling somebody and asking for 10 transfer codes for already expired domains. You would have to do that every weak. Whereas at dynadot it is much more convenient just to renew your domain for $8. You dont need to call anybody.

I have been using both auction sites for years. I buy maybe 10 times more domains at godaddy auctions than I do at Dynadot. However at dynadot I had 4 reversed auctions and none at godaddy. This alone shows that there is a problem with the dynadot system.

The recovery rate at dynadot between day 38 and 41 is too high. If you regularly buy domains at dynadot auctions you will definitely experience a reversed auction.

It is easy for you to support dynadot if you don't buy their expired domains. Naturally you wouldn't have experienced this problem. If you put a lot of effort to scan those lists daily and to be present exactly at the auction closing time, you wouldn't want your time being wasted because of a misconfiguration that doesn't make sense.

 

[daj]

I don't like their 30 day expired auction waiting period until you can transfer/push a domain after an auction ends. Seems too long. That's my only complaint so far.