legal coronaprevention.org seized from seller...

[ikhub]

COVID-19 domain seized from seller who attempted to sell it using bitcoin, hinting at probable misuse or fraud.
Full news:
https://www.ice.gov/news/releases/c...ed-seller-who-attempted-sell-it-using-bitcoin

 

[Nick]

The seller stated that it was “genius” to sell “fake testing kits” using this domain.

That's where he screwed up.

 

[mindways]

Wait what really?! It shouldn't be possible to seize a domain just for a reason like "the seller said it was genius to sell fake testing kits using it". Even that is said at a "hacker forum" by the seller, the seller directly hasn't done anything at all. This is pretty messed up on many levels.

 

[branding]

Wait what really?! It shouldn't be possible to seize a domain just for a reason like "the seller said it was genius to sell fake testing kits using it". Even that is said at a "hacker forum" by the seller, the seller directly hasn't done anything at all. This is pretty messed up on many levels.

The seller stated that it was “genius” to sell “fake testing kits” using this domain. The seller further stated that the seller “wanted to do that but I couldn’t get enough cash to bulk buy them from Alibaba [a Chinese e-commerce site].” The seller recommended directed the undercover agent on how to set up a new website on the domain using a foreign-based service, so as to prevent U.S. authorities from being able to shut it down in the future.

Punishable offence. Personally I'd categorize it as planning on to perform an act of terror.

 

[mindways]

The seller stated that it was “genius” to sell “fake testing kits” using this domain. The seller further stated that the seller “wanted to do that but I couldn’t get enough cash to bulk buy them from Alibaba [a Chinese e-commerce site].” The seller recommended directed the undercover agent on how to set up a new website on the domain using a foreign-based service, so as to prevent U.S. authorities from being able to shut it down in the future.

Punishable offence. Personally I'd categorize it as planning on to perform an act of terror.

In that case, everyone on every hacker forum on the internet, would be considered as criminal who is planning to perform illegal acts. Such topics and discussions are what hacker forums are for. Its not like the seller said all that in some media channel. He said that in a hacker forum, where you can find millions if not billions of such posts.

 

[Nick]

In that case, everyone on every hacker forum on the internet, would be considered as criminal who is planning to perform illegal acts. Such topics and discussions are what hacker forums are for. Its not like the seller said all that in some media channel. He said that in a hacker forum, where you can find millions if not billions of such posts.

But he had intent to perform terroristic acts - just not the funds to do so.

 

[mindways]

But he had intent to perform terroristic acts - just not the funds to do so.

I understand. What I'm trying to say is that if he can be considered as someone who has done punishable offence or fraud, then everyone on all the hacker forums would be considered so.

 

[Nick]

I understand. What I'm trying to say is that if he can be considered as someone who has done punishable offence or fraud, then everyone on all the hacker forums would be considered so.

If they’re planning to harm people, too, yes. I agree - they should also be punished.

 

[mindways]

If they’re planning to harm people, too, yes. I agree - they should also be punished.

While that could be arguable under a different topic, I don't believe that anyone has been sued or punished due to what he has stated on some "hack forum".

I don't find it logical that seller's intent was determined to be fraudulent because of what he stated on a Hacker's Forum. Again, it is a Hacker's Forum. If this was done on a place, where speech of a person matters, then it would be a different matter.

Again, let's say that they have considered seller to be guilty, then they should be considering everyone on all hacker forums as guilty.

 

[Nick]

While that could be arguable under a different topic, I don't believe that anyone has been sued or punished due to what he has stated on some "hack forum".

You keep saying "a hack forum", like it's some type of sanctuary and anything written is protected.

And did you even read the entire article?

the seller engaged in conversations with an undercover agent from HSI about the sale of the domain

I don't find it logical that seller's intent was determined to be fraudulent because of what he stated on a Hacker's Forum.

Couldn't be any more crystal clear to me:

The seller stated that it was “genius” to sell “fake testing kits” using this domain. The seller further stated that the seller “wanted to do that but I couldn’t get enough cash to bulk buy them from Alibaba [a Chinese e-commerce site].”

Was this your domain??

 

[mindways]

You keep saying "a hack forum", like it's some type of sanctuary and anything written is protected.

Are you not reading my posts at all? I'm saying that "hacker forum" is where all users are stating similar statements and hence all of them can be considered as guilty, if the seller was considered to be so.

The conversation that he engaged, was done through hacker's forum by the agent in secret, I believe.

Couldn't be any more crystal clear to me:

Again, it is a hacker's forum... whatever people are stating isn't relevant. Otherwise, just arrest them all.

Was this your domain??

I doubt that if I was seller I would come here and try to prove myself right.

I just find the reason of domain being seized to not be logical at all. It's weird that their agents are looking up Hacker Forums to see if someone is planning any fraud. These are Hacker forums, so obviously all of people there would discuss about hacking.

 

[Nick]

Again, it is a hacker's forum...

ok, you're right.

 

[mindways]

ok, you're right.

Thx!

 

[branding]

Are you not reading my posts at all? I'm saying that "hacker forum" is where all users are stating similar statements and hence all of them can be considered as guilty, if the seller was considered to be so.

The conversation that he engaged, was done through hacker's forum by the agent in secret, I believe.



Again, it is a hacker's forum... whatever people are stating isn't relevant. Otherwise, just arrest them all.



I doubt that if I was seller I would come here and try to prove myself right.

I just find the reason of domain being seized to not be logical at all. It's weird that their agents are looking up Hacker Forums to see if someone is planning any fraud. These are Hacker forums, so obviously all of people there would discuss about hacking.

Actually, they're constantly monitoring and engaging in hacker forums. This certainly isn't an unique case.

Just because you're on a hacker forum doesn't make it less of an offence.

Not that hacking is always wrong. There are white hat hackers. But being on an hacker forum does not excuse any intend to willfully deceive and harm others. Registering a domain alike and proceeding with planning on ways to sell fake corona tests is comparable to planning on first degree murder in my books. I'm not a lawyer but would hope it doesn't end by just seizing the domain.

 

[lock]

Enough people protesting to say virus is fake so may have few angles to fight it but probably was going to scam all they could. Every other site on same forum mentioned would be guilty of something. Flavor of the month is all perhaps an eye opener for the other posters.

 

[mindways]

Actually, they're constantly monitoring and engaging in hacker forums. This certainly isn't an unique case.

Just because you're on a hacker forum doesn't make it less of an offence.

Not that hacking is always wrong. There are white hat hackers. But being on an hacker forum does not excuse any intend to willfully deceive and harm others. Registering a domain alike and proceeding with planning on ways to sell fake corona tests is comparable to planning on first degree murder in my books. I'm not a lawyer but would hope it doesn't end by just seizing the domain.

If this is not a unique case, and people posting statements that "Hey, I know a software by which you can hack into wifi servers" or "If you mix bleach with vinegar then you can make Chlorine" or "I've written a script which can hack wifi networks" and such were getting punished on regular basis, then certainly what you've said makes sense.

Maybe, I've been ignorant but I haven't seen a majority of such cases. Also, doesn't punishing the owner of forum makes much sense? If there is any actual potential threat, then it would the makers of website who actually gathered all these people. Not the people who are ignorantly making statements on website.

I'm just stating my personal opinions, but an action of seizing a domain, just because the seller, while trying to sell the domain, said that you can make profit from it in bad faith, without taking any actual steps to accomplish it, (like making such website) seems to be an over exaggeration. To me, it seems like government just wanted to show to the people that: Yes, we are working for great cause by going undercover and stopping any potential threats that could cause harm to the community.

 

[mindways]

I'm just stating my personal opinions, but an action of seizing a domain, just because the seller, while trying to sell the domain, said that you can make profit from it in bad faith, without taking any actual steps to accomplish it, (like making such website) seems to be an over exaggeration. To me, it seems like government just wanted to show to the people that: Yes, we are working for great cause by going undercover and stopping any potential threats that could cause harm to the community.

I'll emphasize on the last part again.

A seller while trying to sell his domain, was suggesting that you could use this (a totally legal) domain in illegal ways, at a hacking forum. (Really no one will take him seriously!). While the domain name itself doesn't pose any threat, neither has the seller taken actual steps to use domain in bad faith. It could be an ignorant person trying to make deal by impressing hackers or whatever. HSI agents determined his intention to be threat based on what he said on his post in hacker forum, where you can find millions of such posts.

Futhermore, they put up their two big logos on landing page, claiming that they've seized it, in their undercover investigations, to prevent a potential threat. That they have been doing disguised undercover operations to find the intentions of some random seller on random hacker forum. (Wow, we didn't know you were working so hard for us!!)) I mean really.

They are just using the situation to make their impression. To show that they are doing undercover operations and disguised investigations to protect us. Its all just a big exaggeration. The domain is composed of generic keywords, I believe many people will find out about their good deed while searching about coronavirus.

I personally think that they were feeling left out, so went ahead to attract attention.

 

[Abdullah Abdullah]

Owner was simply stupid and he would be lucky to lose the domain only.

 

[branding]

If this is not a unique case, and people posting statements that "Hey, I know a software by which you can hack into wifi servers" or "If you mix bleach with vinegar then you can make Chlorine" or "I've written a script which can hack wifi networks" and such were getting punished on regular basis, then certainly what you've said makes sense.

Maybe, I've been ignorant but I haven't seen a majority of such cases. Also, doesn't punishing the owner of forum makes much sense? If there is any actual potential threat, then it would the makers of website who actually gathered all these people. Not the people who are ignorantly making statements on website.

I'm just stating my personal opinions, but an action of seizing a domain, just because the seller, while trying to sell the domain, said that you can make profit from it in bad faith, without taking any actual steps to accomplish it, (like making such website) seems to be an over exaggeration. To me, it seems like government just wanted to show to the people that: Yes, we are working for great cause by going undercover and stopping any potential threats that could cause harm to the community.

I agree on some points. There's too much to go into and past the scope of this thread so I'll just save myself some time and leave it

https://www.ice.gov/news/releases/over-million-websites-seized-global-operation

Way more examples to be found if you research.

 

[mindways]

I agree on some points. There's too much to go into and past the scope of this thread so I'll just save myself some time and leave it


Way more examples to be found it you research.

Yes, I might have gone too far in my posts. Not trying to go off-topic and start another argument on this thread, however the link that you posted mentions about copy-righted or trademark infringing domains which were actually involved in sales of goods. However, this case is different.

Regards

 

[branding]

Yes, I might have gone too far in my posts. Not trying to go off-topic and start another argument on this thread, however the link that you posted mentions about copy-righted or trademark infringing domains which were actually involved in sales of goods. However, this case is different.

Regards

Yeah, that's usually the case. I'm sure with some digging you could come up with similar cases.

Just pull all domains from the root and list the ones using NS1.SEIZEDSERVERS.COM and NS2.SEIZEDSERVERS.COM as nameservers. I'm pretty sure you'll be surprised at what you find

 

[bmugford]

File this under don't say dumb shit to authorities.

Brad

 

[gabri3l]

File this under don't say dumb shit to authorities.

Brad

Like he knew to whom he was talking and domainers are known to not fabricate when pitching.

 

[Nick]

Like he knew to whom he was talking and domainers are known to not fabricate when pitching.

You’re right. File it under dumb shit to do. Full stop.

 

[Abdullah Abdullah]

They should arrest him with the intent being clear