Confused with RickLatona's Domain Pricing. Am I missing something??

[holdem8]

Hi all...

I an subscribed to RickLatona.com's newsletter which emails me supposedly good domains with good prices and I am very confused. I did some research on the domains and I cannot find any reasons why they are priced so high..anybody have a clue?

I thought these are supposedly good generics to be even priced so high and yet, from my research, I am baffled...am I missing something or are there any other intrinsic values in the domains that I am not aware of?

Some examples below...

ChristmasForum.com "christmas forum" : Google Global Exact search 480, CPC $0.19. Price: $12,500

FormalEvents.com "formal events" : Google Global Exact search 210, CPC $2.68. Price: $37,500

LatinComics.com "latin comics" : Google Global Exact search 260, CPC $0.19. Price: $11,000

BankWatchlist.com "bank watchlist" Google Global Exact search 210, CPC $0.19. Price: $8,700

 

[owntype]

Because most of the sellers thought there are lots of deep-pocket end users in Rick's subscribers.

 

[Jingles]

Because most of the sellers thought there are lots of deep-pocket end users in Rick's subscribers.

I think there's a little bit more to it than that. Check the whois on some of these names that pop up with the higher prices.

Being a big wig in this industry somehow makes it more ok to ask ridiculous prices for mediocre names.

 

[tristanperry]

The number of results for exact searches means very, very little to the actual value of the domains.

Sometimes the domains are over-priced a little, but sometimes they are fairly priced.

Remember, Rick isn't aiming to sell these domains at mid-recession domain reseller prices.

FormalEvents.com seems a very desirable domain from an end user perspective, hence the price seems fair.

Same as most of the others you mentioned.

If you want to understand the prices of the domains in Rick's newsletter, don't go to the NamePros.com sales forums for your research.

 

[Billy!]

I sent a list of good names to Rick, like backpack.info, backpackers.org, backpackers.info etc and they said they were not worth listing with Rick, apart from backpackers.org for $1300.

Worth more than that imho.

 

[InsanerDomainer]

What I see in common with the first three names, is that they all strike me as names that someone with deep pockets might be interested in. Someone with financial resources to spend plenty on advertising a website as well as the names themselves. Or someone with a high-value, established website that would use those names for a spin-off. They aren't names for a micro-niche developer. Their value comes more from the brand-ability of instant recognition and timeless public interest in their topics. That's my best guess, anyway.

BankWatchlist baffles me though, because it doesn't seem like something that will be in the news much longer. I hope not, anyway.

 

[SprewellPJ]

bottom line: appraising domains is extremely subjective. Rick does have a good handle on the market, much better than most since he is actively selling, and probably prices his domains based on whether a sector has deep-pocketed potential endusers, traffic, and the memorable/brandable nature of a name.

 

[hawkeye]

...If you want to understand the prices of the domains in Rick's newsletter, don't go to the NamePros.com sales forums for your research.

LOL, and 'dead on'!

rep.

 

[biggie]

if you think like a small fry, then you'll always be one...

and if you're not buying, there is no reason to understand pricing method

because if explained for one domain, then it will have to be explained for every domain that exceeds where you think it should be priced.

one also has to consider what each owner originally paid for the domain, traffic, revenue, potential, etc.

but that's if you really want to understand how pricing may have been calculated.

imo...

 

[Billy!]

not every domainer can afford to lash out an invest 100,000k in ten or more domains, most of us rely on hand regging and hoping for the best.

if you think like a small fry, then you'll always be one...

and if you're not buying, there is no reason to understand pricing method

because if explained for one domain, then it will have to be explained for every domain that exceeds where you think it should be priced.

one also has to consider what each owner originally paid for the domain, traffic, revenue, potential, etc.

but that's if you really want to understand how pricing may have been calculated.

imo...

 

[WordWalker]

The number of results for exact searches means very, very little to the actual value of the domains.

I'm not sure I understand the above comment unless you are talking about a non-generic name that the owner will brand exclusively with advertising and promotion. But for generics, it seems to me that exact search frequency has everything to do with the value of the domain name.

If a generic gets 200 exact searches per month, it's not difficult to determine that you're not going to be getting 20,000 site visitors in that same time period. However, if the exact search for the generic is 100,000/month and you've got page one search result placement with Google, 20,000 visitors could be realized. But with 200 exact searches per month, you could be number one on the first page of results, and it's not going to change your potential upside.

If you haven't read this response from Mark to a June 11, 2009 blog post (5th comment down), it might help clarify this - except for his mini-sites comment.

Mini-sites represent little more than a stop-gap solution in the search engine site visitor value wars. They may temporarily stop the parked page bleed-out, but don't fool yourself into believing this is a long term, sustainable solution. No doubt that in the future, those mini-sites Mark refers to will need to evolve into fully developed, content rich portals that become the ultimate source of information for the product, service or subject matter represented by the keywords of the domain name.

 

[JoshuaPz]

Search volume is everything? The expression "trip guide" is Googled 590 times monthly and "banana bread recipe" 110,000 times per month. Yet it's fairly obvious which one of these domains most folks would rather own. In case you feel it isn't obvious, search on Moniker.com and note that "trip guide" is registered in twice as many TLDs as "banana bread recipe".

There are far, far more factors to valuating domain names than search volume and PPC, as SprewellPJ's and biggie's responses hint. In fact, on a scale of 1-10, where 1 is a nominal factor you should consider in assessing a domain name and 10 is a critical factor, I would rate search volume / PPC around 3-4 apiece.

 

[WordWalker]

Search volume is everything? The expression "trip guide" is Googled 590 times monthly and "banana bread recipe" 110,000 times per month. Yet it's fairly obvious which one of these domains most folks would rather own. In case you feel it isn't obvious, search on Moniker.com and note that "trip guide" is registered in twice as many TLDs as "banana bread recipe".

There are far, far more factors to valuating domain names than search volume and PPC, as SprewellPJ's and biggie's responses hint. In fact, on a scale of 1-10, where 1 is a nominal factor you should consider in assessing a domain name and 10 is a critical factor, I would rate search volume / PPC around 3-4 apiece.

We'll just have to agree not to agree, but I appreciate your viewpoint.

 

[JoshuaPz]

We'll just have to agree not to agree, but I appreciate your viewpoint.

Could also be that we're talking apples and oranges. Keyword search volume is far more critical factor, for example, if you're choosing a domain name to build a minisite on than if you're cherry-picking a domain to flip to an end-user. In the former case I'd say search vol / PPC are the most important factors. When selecting domains flipping to end-users, however, it's more important to research the market cap of the underlying industry first. For example, "motorcycle refinancing" and "arts and crafts supplies" have similar search volume but clearly end-users would be willing to pay substantially more cash for the former than for the latter. (Side-note: PPC does not correlate with market cap but rather with expected profits per click, e.g. "porn" has PPC of merely $0.30 but the industry is obviously quite vast.)

 

[WordWalker]

Could also be that we're talking apples and oranges. Keyword search volume is far more critical factor, for example, if you're choosing a domain name to build a minisite on than if you're cherry-picking a domain to flip to an end-user. In the former case I'd say search vol / PPC are the most important factors. When selecting domains flipping to end-users, however, it's more important to research the market cap of the underlying industry first. For example, "motorcycle refinancing" and "arts and crafts supplies" have similar search volume but clearly end-users would be willing to pay substantially more cash for the former than for the latter. (Side-note: PPC does not correlate with market cap but rather with expected profits per click, e.g. "porn" has PPC of merely $0.30 but the industry is obviously quite vast.)

I think you're spot on. It's all based on the objective, and flipping is going to carry a much different criteria than development. Rep'd!

 

[tristanperry]

Sorry, I meant exact search results - as in, the number that Google comes up with when it says "Result 1-10 of ....."

Yes, exact searches (via Google Keywords Tools) is pretty important for domain value research.

My bad!

 

[Jingles]

My confusion with domain pricing comes from the fact that the "rules" for it seem to change daily. One day search count is important, the next day, search count is out, brandability is in...the next day we're back to search count.

Most seem to think $12,500 for ChristmasForum.com is reasonable, are you kidding me?? A few weeks back I had my HollywoodBars.com basically beat into the ground here, alot felt it was a poor name.....So then tell me all you wise domainers, what makes ChristmasForum.com so much more valuable than HollywoodBars.com?? Seriously, I really want to know, I want specifics.

I stand by my first post in this thread.

 

[JoshuaPz]

My confusion with domain pricing comes from the fact that the "rules" for it seem to change daily. One day search count is important, the next day, search count is out, brandability is in...the next day we're back to search count.

Like WordWalker said, the weights of factors you take into account when assessing a domain name differs based your usage intent: development, flipping, starting a business on it, park and hold, blog, etc. If you or I were starting a blog, for example, we would probably opt for a creative, catchy domain over a domain containing keywords (very, very few of the top blogs out there, even domaining blogs, have keywords with high search vol); the novelty of your content will determine your search engine rankings and AdSense click-throughs. A name like ChefPatrick.com is much more fun and memorable than a name like DomainingBlog.com. But if you're purchasing a domain with intent to park and hold, you should absolutely stick with "strong" (high market cap, strong PPC, decent search volume) keywords as these are 10x more likely to receive offers than catchy brandables.

Domainers on this forum (myself included) don't indicate which school they're coming from before they state which factors ring most important. Some NPers (e.g. Federer) achieve much success through quick-flipping keywords, some (e.g. wot) through reselling IDN domains, and others (e.g. Esa of Estibot.com) through mass development. Success really depends more in the person than on the strategy, and on this forum it's usually quite clear which folks are succeeding and which are not.

Most seem to think $12,500 for ChristmasForum.com is reasonable, are you kidding me?? A few weeks back I had my HollywoodBars.com basically beat into the ground here, alot felt it was a poor name.....So then tell me all you wise domainers, what makes ChristmasForum.com so much more valuable than HollywoodBars.com?? Seriously, I really want to know, I want specifics.

I stand by my first post in this thread.

As a flipper-type domainer I'm not crazy about either domain because -Forum names, portal oriented names (directories), and food industry-type names are all extremely low market cap. As for why ChristmasForum.com was priced at $12,500 -- probably because (Major keyword)Forum type domains have generally sold very well (too well) in past years and so the price isn't so difficult to justify based on past sales. All you need is one attractive-sounding falsehood (e.g. There exists a God who is omniscient and created the universe -- IMHO a falsehood) and millions of others swiftly arise from it.

 

[Jingles]

Like WordWalker said, the weights of factors you take into account when assessing a domain name differs based your usage intent: development, flipping, starting a business on it, park and hold, blog, etc. If you or I were starting a blog, for example, we would probably opt for a creative, catchy domain over a domain containing keywords (very, very few of the top blogs out there, even domaining blogs, have keywords with high search vol); the novelty of your content will determine your search engine rankings and AdSense click-throughs. A name like ChefPatrick.com is much more fun and memorable than a name like DomainingBlog.com. But if you're purchasing a domain with intent to park and hold, you should absolutely stick with "strong" (high market cap, strong PPC, decent search volume) keywords as these are 10x more likely to receive offers than catchy brandables.

Domainers on this forum (myself included) don't indicate which school they're coming from before they state which factors ring most important. Some NPers (e.g. Federer) achieve much success through quick-flipping keywords, some (e.g. wot) through reselling IDN domains, and others (e.g. Esa of Estibot.com) through mass development. Success really depends more in the person than on the strategy, and on this forum it's usually quite clear which folks are succeeding and which are not.



As a flipper-type domainer I'm not crazy about either domain because -Forum names, portal oriented names (directories), and food industry-type names are all extremely low market cap. As for why ChristmasForum.com was priced at $12,500 -- probably because (Major keyword)Forum type domains have generally sold very well (too well) in past years and so the price isn't so difficult to justify based on past sales. All you need is one attractive-sounding falsehood (e.g. There exists a God who is omniscient and created the universe -- IMHO a falsehood) and millions of others swiftly arise from it.

Thanks Josh, I always appreciate your thoughtful posts. I think my problem is that I actually spend TOO MUCH time reading this forum. I see the constant contradictions, day in and day out and let myself get totally baffled and confused by them all.

Not personally picking on you Josh, but your post above is a perfect example. You mention a possible reasoning for the price of ChristmasForum, keyword + forum names have sold for good amounts in the past. So many times I see this type of reasoning...yet turn around 2 minutes later and will see someone else come along and say why this ISN'T logical reasoning for determining domain price.

Anyway, getting myself stressed out over this is a stupid way to spend a Sat. All I know is that if ChristmasForum.com was in the appraisal section right now, owned by some noob stating he is hoping for $XX,XXX, that noob would be getting laughed at....I still stand by my first post in this thread.

 

[JoshuaPz]

Not personally picking on you Josh, but your post above is a perfect example. You mention a possible reasoning for the price of ChristmasForum, keyword + forum names have sold for good amounts in the past. So many times I see this type of reasoning...yet turn around 2 minutes later and will see someone else come along and say why this ISN'T logical reasoning for determining domain price.

I agree. I personally wouldn't pay more than $250 for ChristmasForum.com, hence my statement about subsequent falsehoods building on prior falsehoods. But Rick's goal is to sell as many domains as possible, not offer what is *authentically* best value for the buck, so of course it's in his best interest to capitalize on this illogical premise so many domainers hold that e.g. because CasinoForum.com sold for $18,000, and domain values have increased since that time, surely $12,000 must be an excellent bargain for ChristmasForum.com. Yet, the purchaser of CasinoForum.com might have bought the name for so much because "it contains the keyword Casino, Casino777.net sold for $20,000, and this is a .com domain! etc. etc."

Use the set of values you've built up throughout life to determine who you consider an expert in this field, then consult with those experts privately. For all you know, what a self-proclaimed expert says in public might not correspond to what they actually believe but merely service to suit an agenda, e.g. pumping up the values of ccTLDs so they could liquidate their failing ccTLD portfolio for a decent amount.