Broker Vertical Axis asking $1500 - Help!

[sethc]

Hey guys, just want to first say hello and that I am a newbie to the forum, but not too much of a "newbie" in terms of domain purchase/website building.

I have bought 2 separate domains in the past for 2 separate personal websites I developed. Thus, I'm pretty in-tune on how to deal with most of the "standard operating procedure", so to speak.

However, I am totally new to dealing with 3rd party brokers - specifically Vertical Axis by way of namebrokers.com. I was forwarded to the namebrokers website and asked to make an offer on the domain I am seeking to buy and just sort of entered a random offer and the site instantaneously rejected it because it said the buyer was seeking ~$1,500

The domain name I want is by no means "premium" and consists on 3 words that are not general/common usage or anything like that. Can anyone shed some light on what I should do to try to get this domain or possibly negotiate to get it? I'm willing to pay a fair price, but I'm fairly confident that $1500 is much too steep and also that there most likely has not been that many offers on the name I'm seeking, at least from all of the research I gather. If they won't budge from $1500, that's fine I'll move on.. but what should I do or who should I contact?

Thanks in advance and I will be glad to clarify or answer any questions that might aid you guys in helping me out!

 

[Makis.TV]

Since owner of the domain doesnt want to negotiate or sell as low as you want then either pay the price or move on.

 

[Kate]

Vertical Axis = Kevin Ham = big domainer.
I am surprised they even bother with 'low' sales in that range

 

[sethc]

Ah ok, I get it. So, basically this VerticalAxis (or Kevin Ham personally) actually owns the domain as opposed to, say, John Q. Citizen using VerticalAxis as a broker. Is this correct?

Assuming what I said to be accurate, it sounds like this guy doesn't bargain or negotiate at all and basically the sticker price (~$1,500) is not going to be reduced no matter what, realistically?

 

[Name Trader]

If the whois isn't private you could make an offer through the whois.

 

[sethc]

Yeah, that's sort of what I did. I sent the [email protected] an email expressing interest. I mean the domain has been registered since 2002 and isn't something incredibly common/valuable like "shoes.com" or "chat.com" etc. and though I am admitted newbie at this e-real estate thing, I honestly have a hard time believing he has had tons of offers on this thing. I could be wrong, but there's no traffic data that I can find.. the only thing substantive is some google-keywordsearch data that might indicate pageviews, but I'm not even trying to profit from this thing one iota.

 

[snoop]

If you think it is worth less make a lower offer or move on. Not much point trying to rationalise everything and there is no point saying it isn't like shoes.com, that is obvious from the asking price. If you are just approaching people for names you want that were registered say 9 years ago (it is probably an ok name) I think not many are going to sell to you for less.

 

[silentg]

If you don't have the budget to buy it then buy a .co version of it and move on.

 

[Name Trader]

Yeah, that's sort of what I did. I sent the [email protected] an email expressing interest. I mean the domain has been registered since 2002 and isn't something incredibly common/valuable like "shoes.com" or "chat.com" etc. and though I am admitted newbie at this e-real estate thing, I honestly have a hard time believing he has had tons of offers on this thing. I could be wrong, but there's no traffic data that I can find.. the only thing substantive is some google-keywordsearch data that might indicate pageviews, but I'm not even trying to profit from this thing one iota.

Personally, I think expressing an interest is the wrong approach in this case. I'd make a bid somewhere close to my final offer. If they bite, they bite. If not, move on.

 

[snoop]

If you don't have the budget to buy it then buy a .co version of it and move on.

 

[sethc]

Yeah, you guys are absolutely right and I'm not stuck on it or anything. I've looked into .net & .org and stuff, so hopefully those pan out. I was mainly hoping for some insight or more specific details as to VerticalAxis and that whole outfit so that way I would be at least educated & informed enough to try and negotiate or bargain. No harm in trying. If it's a 9yo domain with scant offers over the years, I can't see how the sensible thing to do would be at least try to work out something that would allow the broker/owner to break-even on registration costs and such.

Alas, that's business I know, just hoping you guys could give me more scoop on who this Kevin Ham + his businesses are. References or other resources would be fine, if there's any out there -- I couldn't find any from a moderate Google search.. but then again, I'm a newbie.

Also, if anyone would be willing to do some kind of rough personal appraisal/estimate on how much the domain would be worth - please PM me. I'd really appreciate some kind of guidance on this thing. Thanks in advance again, you guys are really helpful.

 

[mis_chiff]

Also, if anyone would be willing to do some kind of rough personal appraisal/estimate on how much the domain would be worth - please PM me. I'd really appreciate some kind of guidance on this thing. Thanks in advance again, you guys are really helpful.

Hello, Just a reminder you cannot ask for appraisals here for
names you do not own.

 

[sethc]

Sorry, apparently I missed that when I was trying to skim through the rules. Apologies. However, my former question is still out there if anyone knows any detail about who this Kevin Ham character is and/or VerticalAxis?

Thanks!

 

[snoop]

If it's a 9yo domain with scant offers over the years, I can't see how the sensible thing to do would be at least try to work out something that would allow the broker/owner to break-even on registration costs and such.

Alas, that's business I know, just hoping you guys could give me more scoop on who this Kevin Ham + his businesses are. References or other resources would be fine, if there's any out there -- I couldn't find any from a moderate Google search.. but then again, I'm a newbie.

He's a multi millionaire, probably in the hundred of millions of dollars.

Waste of time hoping to get it for whatever reg fees were paid. I don't really follow the logic in the strategy (and I know people try it). But if this guy has renewed it for 9 years, he must see some value in it.

Who is ever going to be swayed by someone who suggests something should be sold for renewal fees paid, but has sought you out to buy it anyway? In my view it would be more logical to tell them it is a great name but your budget is only $____. That is both upfront and believable and may just get them on side, personally that is what I have always done when I'm buying domains. The aim to to convince them they are getting a very high price for it even if they aren't.

Price wise most domainers would probably find it easier to drop a name than spend time selling it for $60, let alone the millionaire types. So again my advice is come up with a figure that works for you and offer it or look for another name.

 

[sethc]

That makes sense. I'm hoping he contacts me. I'm not necessarily implying that I'm aiming to reimburse him for flat cost with no profit - I get that he's in business to make money, like most people. I just think that cost vs. what he has invested is nowhere remotely close to $1,500 and if he's had it for 9 years with few or zero offers, then considering the vast # of domains this guy no doubt has, if he's a sensible guy then profit is profit. Now, if it's one (which I doubt) that has gotten 100s of offers for over the years, I can understand.

I used to operate a pawn shop and it's sort of a good analogy. You paid X-dollars for an item 2-3 years ago and buyers/customers haven't shown much interest, so sometimes you're willing to drop your profit margin quite a bit just to cash in since it's "old money".

That said, I haven't outright made him an offer other than the random one I typed in which I presume he wont' see unless it's near what he's asking. I just sent an email trying to establish some communication first.. no point in making the initial offer in a sincere email if he isn't going to take the time to respond to a serious inquiry.

 

[snoop]

That makes sense. I'm hoping he contacts me. I'm not necessarily implying that I'm aiming to reimburse him for flat cost with no profit - I get that he's in business to make money, like most people. I just think that cost vs. what he has invested is nowhere remotely close to $1,500 and if he's had it for 9 years with few or zero offers, then considering the vast # of domains this guy no doubt has, if he's a sensible guy then profit is profit. Now, if it's one (which I doubt) that has gotten 100s of offers for over the years, I can understand.

You are making assumptions which are potentially bad ones. It isn't known if there is zero interest, just looking at a creation date and thinking something mustn't be good because it is old and owned by a speculator is flawed.

I used to operate a pawn shop and it's sort of a good analogy. You paid X-dollars for an item 2-3 years ago and buyers/customers haven't shown much interest, so sometimes you're willing to drop your profit margin quite a bit just to cash in since it's "old money".

That said, I haven't outright made him an offer other than the random one I typed in which I presume he wont' see unless it's near what he's asking. I just sent an email trying to establish some communication first.. no point in making the initial offer in a sincere email if he isn't going to take the time to respond to a serious inquiry.

It doesn't work like that with domains, if they are worth something (big if because most names are not worth anything) then over time they tend to appreciate, it is not like toasters or tv's. The older stuff is better than the newer stuff generally.

Whereas a pawn broker buys something assuming it will sell quickly a domain investor will often buy with the expectation that something might take 50 years to sell, because they are working on the assumption that the item doesn't go stale and that it will sell on a big markup when it does sell. That is the model most of the big domainers have adopted. Sell 1% of inventory of less each year and hang on to the rest.

So there is a positive relationship between age and value. The extreme of this is people buying a domain just because of an old creation date. That happens a lot though probably more like Year 2000 and older names.

I think if you want the name you should make an offer, that is the easiest way to actually get someones attention and buy a domain. If you think it is not that great though....buy something else.

 

[Name Trader]

I think you have no chance with this domain. Move on.

 

[Name Trader]

Kevin Ham is the biggest domain investor in the world, last time I checked. He owns domains like GOD.COM

 

[Kate]

Religion too ?