discuss Appraisals 2018 What do they mean? How can they help?

[ThatNameGuy]

I own about 1,850 domains of all kinds that appraise for a little over 1.5 Million dollars. I use a combination of appraisals from Go Daddy and Estibot to value my portfolio. What I find hard to believe is that I just found another company, Nokta Domains, that if I were to run all my domains through their appraisal program, I'm sure my portfolio would appraise for a little over 3 Million dollars.

I asked the question in the title of this thread...What do they mean? It's my opinion they mean very little, but I do find them good enough to rate or score my domains compared to others. Generally, the higher the appraisal from someone like GD, the better the domain

So how can they help?...if you're lucky enough to be able to meet and speak with a lot of end users, appraisals can be a powerful enough tool to help close a deal. How do I know? I'll tell you...but you know what I'll have to do if I tell you

Seriously, I was just telling someone who sent me a DM that end user "domain education" is, and will be the key to my success in this industry. I'm employing sales strategy and sales technique that have proven successful for over 100 years, and selling domains is absolutely no different than selling houses, auto's, boats, computers, B2B or B2C products or services. Common sense, and Sales and Marketing 101 is by far the best teacher.

How do you see industry appraisals helping you to make better buys?... better sales? Thanks, and have a great week. Cheers!

 

[Andrew Knox]

zje dot com (domain I sold) estibot valuation: $62k / GoDaddy instant appraisal: $16k, choose one

Depends if I'm buying or selling :p

 

[ThatNameGuy]

zje dot com (domain I sold) estibot valuation: $62k / GoDaddy instant appraisal: $16k, choose one

I'll throw in another one for you....NoktaDomains $22,835 Eurorealtor, I guess that was your sale 10/30/2016 listed at Namebio for 60K? Nice!

I'll share a quick story...yesterday I joined a friend I hadn't seen for 50 years for a bike ride around Williamsburg. He just retired from a company called GL Communications. His company email address was, and still is; xxx.gl.com. Yes, his three initials, and gl .com. Before I met him for breakfast, I checked Estibot, and the appraisal for GL .com was $2,080,000. My friend was blown away when I told him this because he was real good friends with the founder of the company who just loved an old time movie from 1940 called Gaslight (thus the GL name). The founder recently passed away, but my friend who was senior management will share it with his former associates. I don't know if they know what they own in the way of a domain name, but I just found it to be an interesting story.

 

[eurorealtor]

I guess that was your sale 10/30/2016 listed at Namebio for 60K? Nice!

Yes, and that's where you should focus, instead of spending for hand regs. I know, it's just $1,99 to $10 per domain, but in 10 years you will figure out you've just flushed $50k down the toilet and made just peanuts.

 

[ThatNameGuy]

Yes, and that's where you should focus, instead of spending for hand regs. I know, it's just $1,99 to $10 per domain, but in 10 years you will figure out you've just flushed $50k down the toilet and made just peanuts.

Actually I disagree. I'm a big believer in diversification, and within reason, diversification has served me well in business. I've been told by more than two leaders in the domain industry that I'm a pretty innovative and creative guy, especially when it comes to "names". You might not think that my having started, named, bought and sold 25 plus businesses in my lifetime doesn't count for much, but I know better. I've made a lot of money in my lifetime, and I've lost a fair amount. However, in the big scheme of things, I've invested "peanuts" in a diversified portfolio that appraises for over 1.5M. I also know I'm a good enough sales guy that the return on my "peanuts" will be far better than your prediction. Stay tuned

 

[bmugford]

Actually I disagree. I'm a big believer in diversification, and within reason, diversification has served me well in business. I've been told by more than two leaders in the domain industry that I'm a pretty innovative and creative guy, especially when it comes to "names". You might not think that my having started, named, bought and sold 25 plus businesses in my lifetime doesn't count for much, but I know better. I've made a lot of money in my lifetime, and I've lost a fair amount. However, in the big scheme of things, I've invested "peanuts" in a diversified portfolio that appraises for over 1.5M. I also know I'm a good enough sales guy that the return on my "peanuts" will be far better than your prediction. Stay tuned

You say appraisals don't mean anything then at the same time constantly state them to justify the value of your portfolio.

If the appraisals are worthless why do you feel the need to mention them? It makes no sense.

Actual offers and sales are the test of true value, not some automated appraisals.

Brad

 

[ThatNameGuy]

You say appraisals don't mean anything then at the same time constantly state them to justify the value of your portfolio.

If the appraisals are worthless why do you feel the need to mention them? It makes no sense.

Actual offers and sales are the test of true value, not some automated appraisals.

Brad

Brad...seriously, why do you waster your time with me. I started this thread titled, "Appraisals 2018, What do they mean? How can they help? How many times have I said that appraisals in this industry are a joke? Then I've gone on to explain there's a "caveat" involving the joke....how many times have I said that? Do you know what a caveat is Brad? Now if you would like to contact me personally, I'd be more than happy to explain again to you how I'm exploiting the appraisal joke to sell domains. This apparently has gone over your head because others seem to understand. Cheers!

 

[JB Lions]

Brad...seriously, why do you waster your time with me. I started this thread titled, "Appraisals 2018, What do they mean? How can they help? How many times have I said that appraisals in this industry are a joke? Then I've gone on to explain there's a "caveat" involving the joke....how many times have I said that? Do you know what a caveat is Brad? Now if you would like to contact me personally, I'd be more than happy to explain again to you how I'm exploiting the appraisal joke to sell domains. This apparently has gone over your head because others seem to understand. Cheers!

I understand what you're saying, you're using appraisals to help get sales. People who have no clue about domains, might be swayed by seeing an appraisal by GoDaddy or another known name. It's like somebody wanting to buy a classic car but has no clue what they're worth. If they see some certificate or something from a Classic Car appraisal company, it might make them feel better in spending the money.

So I get that part.

The part where you say your portfolio is worth X, no. Because it's just not. Even moreso with domains you seem to be buying more of, new gtlds. Just look at the horse.vacations examples I used, crazy. There just isn't enough data (sales) for them to use on top of them not being that reliable in the first place.

And yet again, with industry leaders saying nice stuff to you and all that other stuff, just refer to previous posts. Get sales first. A simple:

I sold (insert domain) for $$$$, maybe a few sales first, then (this is how I did it) It would hold more weight. To this point it's all just marketing fluff, ideas that haven't been realized yet. To this point, you're basically just telling everybody how hard it is to sell new gtlds, the opposite of what you're probably wanting to do. I have all this past experience, yet I'm really not selling anything.

 

[ThatNameGuy]

I understand what you're saying, you're using appraisals to help get sales. People who have no clue about domains, might be swayed by seeing an appraisal by GoDaddy or another known name. It's like somebody wanting to buy a classic car but has no clue what they're worth. If they see some certificate or something from a Classic Car appraisal company, it might make them feel better in spending the money.

So I get that part.

The part where you say your portfolio is worth X, no. Because it's just not. Even moreso with domains you seem to be buying more of, new gtlds. Just look at the horse.vacations examples I used, crazy. There just isn't enough data (sales) for them to use on top of them not being that reliable in the first place.

And yet again, with industry leaders saying nice stuff to you and all that other stuff, just refer to previous posts. Get sales first. A simple:

I sold (insert domain) for $$$$, maybe a few sales first, then (this is how I did it) It would hold more weight. To this point it's all just marketing fluff, ideas that haven't been realized yet. To this point, you're basically just telling everybody how hard it is to sell new gtlds, the opposite of what you're probably wanting to do. I have all this past experience, yet I'm really not selling anything.

JB....are you Brad? Excuse me, but I NEVER said how much my portfolio is worth because honestly I don't know. I know how much I paid for it, and I I know how much it appraises for. And finally, I'm NOT trying to sell my domains to other domainers like you or anyone else in the industry. Unless you're afraid, send me a private message, and I'll share with you the domains I've sold to investors who have invested in me and my business. However, I don't expect to hear from you for obvious reasons

 

[JB Lions]

JB....are you Brad? Excuse me, but I NEVER said how much my portfolio is worth because honestly I don't know. I know how much I paid for it, and I I know how much it appraises for. And finally, I'm NOT trying to sell my domains to other domainers like you or anyone else in the industry. Unless you're afraid, send me a private message, and I'll share with you the domains I've sold to investors who have invested in me and my business. However, I don't expect to hear from you for obvious reasons

Why don't you simply reply with:

domain sold for $$$

Very simple. You don't talk about your past history and sales technique etc. in private.

As far as:
"And finally, I'm NOT trying to sell my domains to other domainers like you or anyone else in the industry."

That's most people. Most are not trying to sell domains to other domainers, end users would be their first choice, and many do. But domainers have money as well and buy domains for resell or even an end user themselves sometimes.

 

[ThatNameGuy]

Why don't you simply reply with:

domain sold for $$$

Very simple. You don't talk about your past history and sales technique etc. in private.

Ok...this should make you very happy....Bob Schaeffer, realtor bought two domains from me, H2OFrontRealty.com for $2,500 and SexSea.Realty for $2,500. Then Milt Martin, developer and investor bought FirstCarMemories.com for $2,500, and H2ODiet.com for $2,500. For any further information contact me personally. Very simple...there you have it....like it, or ???????????. Cheers!

 

[Josh R]

Ok...this should make you very happy....Bob Schaeffer, realtor bought two domains from me, H2OFrontRealty.com for $2,500 and SexSea.Realty for $2,500. Then Milt Martin, developer and investor bought FirstCarMemories.com for $2,500, and H2ODiet.com for $2,500. For any further information contact me personally. Very simple...there you have it....like it, or ???????????. Cheers!

I won't look at them all, but FirstCarMemories.com doesn't seem to have moved since you registered it last year.

You should get the buyer to update their contact details.

 

[ThatNameGuy]

I won't look at them all, but FirstCarMemories.com doesn't seem to have moved since you registered it last year.

You should get the buyer to update their contact details.

Hey there Tiger...would it make you happy if I did that? I think we're friends on Linkedin. I'd feel better sharing details of the transaction with you on Linkedin if you care to know. I might even provide you with snipets of information of the business model/plan to develop FirstCarMemories.com if you're real nice. Cheers!

 

[Josh R]

Hey there Tiger...would it make you happy if I did that? I think we're friends on Linkedin. I'd feel better sharing details of the transaction with you on Linkedin if you care to know. I might even provide you with snipets of information of the business model/plan to develop FirstCarMemories.com if you're real nice. Cheers!

That’s not necessary, but thank you.

Just helping out you and the buyer so that it’s properly transferred. Not updating WHOIS used to create a variety of problems. Now that GDPR is in place, that may no longer matter as much.

 

[Bob Hawkes]

I feel that there is value in Estibot and GoValue, but one must never regard them alone as an indication of even relative value. I feel that just because they are automated, does not mean that they are necessarily inferior to human estimates of worth. If you think about it, Google uses automated techniques to do many sophisticated things countless times every second, and we do trust them, for example, to point to the best search results or suggest the best bus or car route between two points. Modern ML/DL results from Google research and others have now become better than medical professionals in predicting certain health results.

So how should one use Estibot and GoValue?
*As a second opinion after your own analysis of the worth of a domain name using information such as inherent name quality, prior sales, search statistics, etc.
*As an easy way to get some of the search and advertising data (Estibot)
*As an easy way to get some related sales (GoValue) beyond those in NameBio, DNPric.es etc.
*As an automated order of thumb estimate that is not subject to your personal biases.

Many domain name buyers will never consider the automated appraisals, but in some cases the information may be helpful in convincing a buyer that the price requested is supported by a view other than your own. I think that by making GoValue openly available, GoDaddy have changed the landscape, and more and more end users are at least checking GoValue before or during negotiations.

Even if you hate automated appraisals (and I know only too well that many NamePros users do!), I feel that if you don't make yourself familiar with the main automated tools, you are missing information that you need to know to be a fully educated domain name investor.

Thanks for reading, and best of luck to you all in your domain investments!

 

[Beezy]

I can't wait until the next week's "Appraisal 2018 Week 26" thread.

This comes up literally every week.

 

[ThatNameGuy]

I feel that there is value in Estibot and GoValue, but one must never regard them alone as an indication of even relative value. I feel that just because they are automated, does not mean that they are necessarily inferior to human estimates of worth. If you think about it, Google uses automated techniques to do many sophisticated things countless times every second, and we do trust them, for example, to point to the best search results or suggest the best bus or car route between two points. Modern ML/DL results from Google research and others have now become better than medical professionals in predicting certain health results.

So how should one use Estibot and GoValue?
*As a second opinion after your own analysis of the worth of a domain name using information such as inherent name quality, prior sales, search statistics, etc.
*As an easy way to get some of the search and advertising data (Estibot)
*As an easy way to get some related sales (GoValue) beyond those in NameBio, DNPric.es etc.
*As an automated order of thumb estimate that is not subject to your personal biases.

Many domain name buyers will never consider the automated appraisals, but in some cases the information may be helpful in convincing a buyer that the price requested is supported by a view other than your own. I think that by making GoValue openly available, GoDaddy have changed the landscape, and more and more end users are at least checking GoValue before or during negotiations.

Even if you hate automated appraisals (and I know only too well that many NamePros users do!), I feel that if you don't make yourself familiar with the main automated tools, you are missing information that you need to know to be a fully educated domain name investor.

Thanks for reading, and best of luck to you all in your domain investments!

I've been playing on the domain playground for less than 365 days, and a day doesn't go by that I don't learn something new. I've registered four new domains in the last two days, a .com, a .club and 2 .golfs. The .com appraises for $1,191, the .club for $187 and the two .golf for $4,240 combined. The total for all four is $5,618 for an "average" of $1,404 per domain. I spent slightly over $18 for all four domains for an "average" cost of $4.50 per.

These appraisals all came from GoValue aka GD, but I can find similar appraisals elsewhere. The point I want to make here is, where else on earth can you buy "intellectual property" that has this much potential? Unlike a lottery ticket, I have plans for these domains, or I wouldn't have wasted my precious crumbs. Anyone who doesn't use them to their advantage fails to realize their true value Thanks Bob

 

[Kate]

You can't really use them 'to your advantage', because different appraisal sources will yield very different results. That is only muddying the waters. Quite frankly this is not serious.

For the most part, appraisals are useless because end users are not impressed. They have a budget and they will pay only what they think the name is worth. Hundreds of millions of domains are registered, and sales are very rare exceptions. Appraisals don't drive prices up or increase demand and liquidity.

An end user could also turn this against you, and quote another appraisal that is to your disadvantage. How do you prove who is right when both of you are wrong ?
You should never let another party (especially black box software) dictate the price of your assets.

I once dealt with a gentleman from the UK interested in a domain that we owned. He told me had ordered two appraisals (sources unknown) and the appraised price was around 1.5K and 2.5K respectively. I told him the price was firm at $6000, and sold the domain.

However, there is at least one party using appraisals to their advantage: registrars. Because they want you to buy more domains from them.

 

[ThatNameGuy]

First Kate...who is "we"...Evergreen? Inquiring minds would like to know? Sorry if you don't know how to use appraisals to your advantage...my 50 years of sales and marketing experience says otherwise. In case you hadn't noticed, I wasn't born yesterday, and the majority of "end users" that I intend to sell domain names to aren't nearly as domain educated, or sophisticated as your customers. Thus, because I'm an honest guy, I'm more than happy to educate my customers about domain appraisals. Why? Because I want an "end user" to respect my honesty, and they'll become a customer for life

 

[biggie]

GD appraisals are much better than the others as they back their appraisals by similar past sales. May be helpful for keyword domains only.

for the young jedi's in training


when, appraisal sites/tools become your standard, as the value indicator.
then eventually....
they, the people behind the tool or it the tool itself, will dictate domain pricing...
not you.

take the blue pill

imo....

 

[ThatNameGuy]

for the young jedi's in training


when, appraisal sites/tools become your standard, as the value indicator.
then eventually....
they, the people behind the tool or it the tool itself, will dictate domain pricing...
not you.

take the blue pill

imo....

Thanks...so in the mean time, I guess that makes me the standard

 

[hookbox]

2,000 domains appraised at $1,000 each would value this hypothetical portfolio at 2 million dollars. Now think of how many absolutely shit domains you see in Godaddy expiring auctions that they appraise for that much or more that no one buys and ultimately drop into oblivion never to be registered again.

Bottom line, automatic appraisals are useless. Take what you think are your best 100 domains and post them here and let the crowd give their opinion. Then you will really have a good idea what the portfolio is worth.

 

[ThatNameGuy]

2,000 domains appraised at $1,000 each would value this hypothetical portfolio at 2 million dollars. Now think of how many absolutely sh*t domains you see in Godaddy expiring auctions that they appraise for that much or more that no one buys and ultimately drop into oblivion never to be registered again.

Bottom line, automatic appraisals are useless. Take what you think are your best 100 domains and post them here and let the crowd give their opinion. Then you will really have a good idea what the portfolio is worth.

Oh...I couldn't do that (against the rules), and even if I could, I wouldn't trust the valuations I'd get from other members since they'd be biased and tainted. Having learned from some of the best, and some of the valuations tools available, I believe I'm best at valuing my own portfolio,just like I'm best at valuing my home that I've owned for 40 years, and some of the businesses that I started and sold over the years.

Thanks for the idea....Cheers!

 

[Kate]

The best appraisal (and the only valid one actually) is a sales invoice.

 

[Satyajit Adhikary]

The best appraisal (and the only valid one actually) is a sales invoice.

So you are suggesting that past sales (invoice) of similar domain names sold can be a helpful info.

 

[Satyajit Adhikary]

for the young jedi's in training


when, appraisal sites/tools become your standard, as the value indicator.
then eventually....
they, the people behind the tool or it the tool itself, will dictate domain pricing...
not you.

take the blue pill

imo....

It's not a newly discovered idea.. It's a universal truth that domain appraisals are worthless and almost evry domainer knows this.
I was talking in terms of 'theory of relativity'.

So, the question isn't, which is the best appraisal service; the question is, which appraisal is the 'least garbage'.

Namebio is popular among domainers coz it shows past sales. Therefore, I like GD appraisals, coz it shows us similar past sales. (Sometimes, sales which are not listed on Namebio). Whereas, I cud never figure out how estibot operates and why sites like Namejet displays estibot valuation..!!

But no doubt, appraisals are in general worthless.