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Another Non-Paying Sedo Buyer

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I am SICK and TIRED of these Sedo deadbeat buyers thinking they can get away with their foolishness with impunity. Here is my latest Sedo deadbeat buyer story:

Read the series of communication between this deadbeat and I and let me know what you think. Feel free to add this "buyer's" information to your blogs/threads.

Here is the first email I sent after getting the buyer's contact information from Sedo aver waiting several weeks for payment that was never made:

Dear Mr. XXXX:

My name is xxxx, and I am the owner of xxxx. Sedo forwarded your contact information to me because you agreed in a legally binding contract to buy xxxx.com through Sedo, and you failed to pay for the domain name. While Sedo referred you to me for potential legal action for breach of contract, it is my hope that we can come to a resolution where both parties can be happy--you get the domain name, and I will receive payment as promised.

While looking at your website, it is evident that you could benefit from my domain name. The hyphen in your current domain is really dragging down your site's value, not to mention the lost traffic from people who forget to type that hyphen into their browsers. I am confident that you will recoup the cost of my domain name easily just from the new traffic you will receive. And you don't have to build another site. Just forward this domain to your existing site to capture that traffic.

So I am convinced that you NEED this domain, and not purchasing it would be a mistake. I will work with you, as long as you pay as agreed. I can also lease the domain to you (you make monthly installment payments) if price is an issue.

I need to hear from you ASAP so we can settle this matter. Thank you for your time and attention.


XXXX response:

I think money must be the issue on your end. I have never had anyone pursue $497.00 like it was the lotto prize before. I have many customers who are used to finding me with the hyphen. I simply changed my mind on this matter. There is nothing legally binding here so I would appreciate it if you and Sedo would quit harassing me.

Mr. XXXX


My response to this, with comments:

Dear Mr. XXXX:

My position on this matter is clear. The amount of money involved is not the issue. There is a principle here, and it is unfortunate that you as a business owner do not understand this. You made a commitment to buy the domain through the Sedo marketplace. Sedo lets buyers know that any offer made on their platform is legally binding, and you should not click "buy it now" if you are not in agreement with that. There is no "I changed my mind." That is not acceptable.

You can either pay what is owed willingly, or you will be forced to pay legally. That is up to you. I will give you 24 hours from the timestamp on this email to contact me to make payment arrangements and to submit payment to me. If payment is not made within the time period specified, the next communication you will receive will be a Summons for you to appear in small claims court concerning this matter.

Please keep in mind that amount I will be seeking from the Court will be far more than $497, and will include court costs, my travel expenses to your county in NC, and other remedies allowed by law. I also reserve the right to post your name, website, and contact information identifying you as a deadbeat Sedo buyer online until payment is made. My comments regarding the email you sent me are in bold, below.


I think money must be the issue on your end. (Why wouldn't money be an issue on my end? I am in business to make money, just as you are). I have never had anyone pursue $497.00 like it was the lotto prize before. (The amount really doesn't matter. The issue is that you made a commitment to buy through Sedo and reneged on that commitment. The same thing would happen if the purchase price was $60. I have had collection agencies come after me for $25 medical bills!) I have many customers who are used to finding me with the hyphen. (This may be true, but you, not I, went on Sedo to buy xxxx.com.) I simply changed my mind on this matter. (So commitment means nothing to you? I wonder if you are so generous as you expect me to be if a buyer makes a commitment via contract to pay for furniture and then decides to change his or her mind and not pay what is owed). There is nothing legally binding here (I would suggest reading your contract again) so I would appreciate it if you and Sedo would quit harassing me.(You are responsible for paying Sedo's commission, so they may continue to contact you or take whatever action they deem necessary to collect...I have no control over this.)


Final response from XXXX:

Do what you gotta do.

These deadbeats think they can get away with this because of the cost and inconvenience involved with pursuing them through the legal system.
 
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The views expressed on this page by users and staff are their own, not those of NamePros.
I suggest you to step back here and delete this thread,don't you know that it's illegal to post private messages and to share private info. in a public forum?He could sue you if he wanted to.
 
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I suggest you to step back here and delete this thread,don't you know that it's illegal to post private messages and to share private info. in a public forum?He could sue you if he wanted to.

lol says who?

---------- Post added at 04:09 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:05 PM ----------

:talk:

Hi

whatever obligations you decide to fullfill, are up to you as an individual. that establishes your track record.

what another person does is up to them. and that establishes theirs.

all i said was, " i wouldn't try to force someone to buy a name they no longer want"


that's my philosophy about doing business, period.

if a customer changes their mind, for whatever reason, best thing i can do is say "Thanks for your interest" and move on.

not condoning the actions of the buyer, just understanding them.

because until payment has been sent, then the domain hasn't really been sold.
this seems limited to the internet mostly. people think they can get away with whatever they want and rarely is anything done about it. try signing an agreement to buy a car from a dealer and then backing out. i bet it doesn't work.
 
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I had a 1k$ deadbeat buyer @ sedo.

Was upset but didn't give it a second thought like this!

But maybe that's the problem, imho. We have come to accept the actions of these deadbeats like it's no big deal. But it is. I need my money, and when someone purchases something, I expect to get paid. If you, as the seller, don't really care about getting paid, then why should the buyer think it is important to honor a contract? We, as domainers, only hurt ourselves when we don't hold deadbeat bidders and buyers accountable.
 
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Name and shame on every available media and move on.


You will feel better.
 
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:talk:

because until payment has been sent, then the domain hasn't really been sold.

check the difference!

I guess we have a difference of opinion about the implications of a contract. Try applying that attitude to the purchase of a home, for instance.

In any case, let's say hypothetically that you come to an agreement on price via Sedo and, before payment has been made, you get a direct offer from another buyer for a higher amount. Based on your comment above I'm wondering whether you would complete the Sedo transaction or move on to take the higher deal since you don't feel the domain has actually been sold?
 
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alien51

Take Me To Your LeaderTop Member
Impact
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I guess we have a difference of opinion about the implications of a contract. Try applying that attitude to the purchase of a home, for instance.
While we all understand the spirit of contracts, for practical purposes we cannot directly compare it with home purchases given the "global" nature of domains as a merchandise.



In any case, let's say hypothetically that you come to an agreement on price via Sedo and, before payment has been made, you get a direct offer from another buyer for a higher amount. Based on your comment above I'm wondering whether you would complete the Sedo transaction or move on to take the higher deal since you don't feel the domain has actually been sold?
I think the best solution here, is to have Sedo "Buy Now" contracts become valid only when buyer's money has already been transferred to escrow. If money is not in escrow yet, then it's up to you to pursue this wild goose chase.
 
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Something should be done about non paying Sedo buyers. Surely it is in Sedo's interests to do this aswell given they miss out on commission.

I remember I had a non paying buyer of $17,000 back when I was 18 on Sedo. This was a life changing amount of money to a kid starting out, so you can imagine my disappointment when the buyer didn't pay.
 
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Kate

Domainosaurus RexTop Member
Impact
21,729
Nobody will sue for $500, it's not worth the hassle therefore people just move on.
For 17K, it's different. But you may have to sue somebody abroad, then enforcing the ruling is another matter. But if the deadbeat doesn't have the money, it's like trying to squeeze blood out of a stone.

I once sued a deadbeat seller, and didn't reach a satisfactory settlement.
 
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Bannen

Don't say Huh? too much; pretend you understand.Top Member
Impact
3,325
As long as international, cross-border litigations remain a mixed up hodgepodge of red tape, I can't see anyone ever receiving a reasonable solution to actually getting paid by a non-paying buyer.

But people are very worried about their rep; possibly the way to go is for dn trading sites like Sedo to create a deadbeat/warning area. When a buyer doesn't pay, they can receive a final warning that if they do not at least come to some fair resolution and explanation about the discarded transaction, their name/ip/account will be permanently banned and their user name and personal name will be listed on the 'deadbeat buyers' page for all other Sedo members to see...
...although Sedo must keep peoples' personal info secure, they can easily change their TOS to include a caveat that is something like 'However, any member who makes a binding offer on a domain, does not pay for it and does not give a satisfactory reason or resolution for this, may have their personal name published publicly on our 'non-paying buyers' page.

It's not a huge step, but it's an added deterrent... anything that openly embarrasses the buyer, and ruins their rep, might contribute to them being more careful when hitting the 'accept' button when they make you an offer.

We can't expect Sedo and other trade sites to take any legal action on our behalf... but they can at least brainstorm some tactics to make it much more painful for someone to become a deadbeat buyer, rather than giving deadbeats a slap on the wrist or even doing nothing, as seems to be their policy right now.
 
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Offer and Acceptance does a contract make! I've had deadbeats on Sedo, never even got their info. Sedo never offered it and I never knew to ask. I sure was pissed though.

Aside from taking him to court, not much you can do... Maybe show up at his store, get a sofa on credit and never pay? LOL!
 
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equity78

Top Member
TheDomains Staff
TLDInvestors.com
Impact
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That was funny Ronald about the sofa on credit and not paying.

I did a blog post (with link back to here) on this thread to hopefully spark more discussion, this is a big issue no matter what side of the domaining aisle.

A Very Good Post and Lively Discussion About A Non Paying Sedo Buyer http://no_url_shorteners/14Mwamp
 
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alien51

Take Me To Your LeaderTop Member
Impact
1,337
Surely it is in Sedo's interests to do this aswell given they miss out on commission.
However, the legal costs could be much higher than whatever commission or penalty fees they could collect from it. So the arithmetic would not make any sense.



I remember I had a non paying buyer of $17,000 back when I was 18 on Sedo. This was a life changing amount of money to a kid starting out, so you can imagine my disappointment when the buyer didn't pay.
If it's too good to be true, it probably is.

Unless i see a movement of money, everything remains deadbeat to me. Talk is cheap. And unless i know the money can no longer be reversed, that's the time i know the deal is done.



Nobody will sue for $500, it's not worth the hassle therefore people just move on.
I've read stories of people actually suing Google in the Small Claims courts for closing their Adsense account that still has some $300 dollars in it.

Most of these cases, however, were pursued mainly motivated by "principles" and bruised egos.



For 17K, it's different. But you may have to sue somebody abroad, then enforcing the ruling is another matter. But if the deadbeat doesn't have the money, it's like trying to squeeze blood out of a stone.
Even creditors are having a hard time getting their money back from deadbeat countries, like Cyprus, Italy, and Greece.



When a buyer doesn't pay, they can receive a final warning that if they do not at least come to some fair resolution and explanation about the discarded transaction, their name/ip/account will be permanently banned and their user name and personal name will be listed on the 'deadbeat buyers' page for all other Sedo members to see...
That will only apply to Domainer Resellers prowling the aftermarkets.

For most End-Users, they won't really care much. It's not like they're going to be window-shopping for domains on a regular basis.
 
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But maybe that's the problem, imho. We have come to accept the actions of these deadbeats like it's no big deal. But it is. I need my money, and when someone purchases something, I expect to get paid. If you, as the seller, don't really care about getting paid, then why should the buyer think it is important to honor a contract? We, as domainers, only hurt ourselves when we don't hold deadbeat bidders and buyers accountable.

Trust me I was upset I didn't get to close the deal, I had the deadbeat buyers info but didn't contact them as I was just too busy with other stuff and I hate dealing with lawyers. I don't see it being worth it for you to go after this guy for $500 +whatever fees you may incur.
 
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As long as international, cross-border litigations remain a mixed up hodgepodge of red tape, I can't see anyone ever receiving a reasonable solution to actually getting paid by a non-paying buyer.

I think that point is only relevant if you're planning on taking legal action and, as has been noted, that only makes sense when the numbers are large enough. That being said, I don't understand the attitude that if someone changes their mind you should simply leave them alone without putting in any further effort. We're in the business of selling domains, and to me that means that we should be prepared to actually do some selling when required. The idea that we should come close to finalizing a deal and then just walk away because the buyer has a change of heart, is something that I don't understand as being consistent with good salesmanship.

As far as I'm concerned, someone that goes through 90% of the process of purchasing a domain is a hot lead and, if I can, I'm going to try and push them that final 10% of the way. Yes, it irritates me that people are willing to walk away from a commitment, but I try to set that aside and focus on what's important -- closing the deal.

I'm admittedly not a huge user of Sedo, so my experience may be exceptional, but the one time someone closed a deal with me and then walked away, I pursued it and I got paid. Moreover, it happened without the need to file suit or even have an argument. After putting the deal on the back burner for a couple of months, I sent the buyer an email with no mention of Sedo and no hint of the fact that I knew he was the buyer. I had found out that he was already in a business that related to my domain, so I sent an inquiry to see if he had an interest in purchasing it. He replied almost immediately with an offer that was a little over half of what he had previously agreed to pay. Once I had an email from him confirming that he still wanted the domain, I politely ( I even included a smiley ) reminded him that he had already offered me twice as much on Sedo. The second I mentioned Sedo he stopped responding so maybe that wasn't such a good idea. I sent 2 more emails over the course of the week ( where are we at with this deal? ). Still no response. The guy was in Spain, but I don't care, I phoned him anyway. We had a conversation and ended up agreeing on a price that was 20% lower than on Sedo, but since I now wasn't paying a commission, it was not that big a difference. Clearly the amount in question, will determine how much effort is warranted, but I can't imagine a deal being so small that it isn't even worth sending a short email to try and salvage the deal.
 
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What do you call a marketplace that ALLOWS deadbeat buyers?

A Deadbeat Marketplace.
 
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What do you call a marketplace that ALLOWS deadbeat buyers?

A Deadbeat Marketplace.

IMO, Sedo has been a deadbeat market for a long time. Even more so now. I noticed that when listing their current auctions, they have an option to show only the No Reserve auctions, but this option doesn't work. Why? Probably, because in a given week they only have 50 or so No Reserve auctions going these days...
 
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Like many others, I've had non-paying buyers in the past.

Unfortunately there's not much you can do.

The guy sounds pretty unreasonable given stories like these:
http://www.yelp.com/biz/carolina-discount-furniture-high-point-2

My advice is to move on. You've made the matter public, his already questionable reputation has been further damaged. Now that you've vented - focus your energy back on more productive, satisfying activities.
 
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Some thoughts:

1. I am glad I posted this. Although some of the responses were not what I had expected, considering this is a domaining community, I did learn that I could do a better job of dealing with deadbeat bidders. For that, I am grateful.

2. I don't personally see how any domainer could possibly side with this deadbeat bidder, but some did. I am convinced that some of you would side with the devil himself, just to be confrontational...LOL

3. I didn't bring up this discussion to debate whether buyers should have a change of heart, but rather should they be allowed to do it without penalty. I feel that there should be consequences for this. as there are in this very forum if I commit to buy a name and then back out. The seller could report me to the admins, who could sanction me according to the rules, and the the seller could theoretically sue me if he/she saw fit.

4. We are in a business, just like the buyer, who sells furniture. Our livelihood depends on customers buying items and following through with payment. When someone on Sedo commits to buy a name and fails to pay, they have messed with your income, and with Sedo, you cannot even sell the name to someone else until they cancel the transaction. You should be absolutely LIVID whenever a buyer walks. Too many of us are tolerant of deadbeat bidders and buyers.

5. The buyer "bought" a Buy It Now domain name. It was not pushed to auction, and he was not stuck with it because no one else place a bid, which, I think, makes a difference.

6. The domain was regged and parked on Sedo. I did not market the name to the buyer, nor did I register it with him specifically in mind. He went to Sedo on his own volition.

7. For those of you who may be wondering if I may have a breakdown because of this non-payer, I am fine. I am focusing on selling other names. Life goes on.
 
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I would never buy a domain from you !!

I think what you've done here is disgusting, people change there minds all the time ... Instead of moving on you post his name and business, this guy just changed his mind and you couldn't let it go ...


Pretty sad !!!

---------- Post added at 11:06 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:59 PM ----------

7. For those of you who may be wondering if I may have a breakdown because of this non-payer, I am fine. I am focusing on selling other names. Life goes on.


You've had your 1 day fame get the thread deleted -
and apologize to this buyer.


Only then have you moved on....


Btw / with a username like your's I think u need to get out and get laid.

laters.
 
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I would never buy a domain from you !!

I think what you've done here is disgusting, people change there minds all the time ... Instead of moving on you post his name and business, this guy just changed his mind and you couldn't let it go ...


Pretty sad !!!

---------- Post added at 11:06 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:59 PM ----------




You've had your 1 day fame get the thread deleted -
and apologize to this buyer.


Only then have you moved on....


Btw / with a username like your's I think u need to get out and get laid.

laters.


This just goes to show that some people don't need to need to sniff and smoke those 420 domains. It messes with their minds! Dude must seriously be on something in order to come up with nonsense like this. And we are talking about deadbeat buyers on Sedo, not my username.
 
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and now your creeping on my posts

creepo
 
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Back on topic folks.....no need to fight etc.
 
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dannyk48

New Member
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Hi I am Danny

Yes I did back out because I made it plain to Sedo who was sending me 2-3 emails a day harrasing me to buy. When I thought the situation over I decided that since everyone was used to typing my domain in a certain way it might actually hurt sales. You guys make a big deal over someone changing their mind and try to defame their character. What has the world come to. Nobody would you like a $50.00 peace offering? That seems to be what this is all about. What a bunch of immature losers.

Danny Keck

---------- Post added at 11:40 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:23 PM ----------

What a prick
 
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I agree with the OP, buyers should be accountable if they buy a name. What if I went and bought a house, signed the contract and then changed my mind, do you think the house owner would be happy to just "move on" cmon, get real people, just because its a domain doesnt make any difference..you buy something, you pay for it.

To all the domainers who think its ok, wait until it happens to you....


I would never buy a domain from you !!

I think what you've done here is disgusting, people change there minds all the time ... Instead of moving on you post his name and business, this guy just changed his mind and you couldn't let it go ...


Pretty sad !!!

Syncopy, I hope this happens to you, I can assure you your attitude will change....and dont come on and say you wouldnt, you know damn well you would. In this case it was a few hundred $$, what if it was $20K, would that still be ok for the buyer to back out, just because he had a chnage of heart....if you let people get away with it, they will keep doing it...where is the professionalism and integrity in business these days.


Mr Keck, you have a nerve coming on here, show some class would you and just pay the for the domain you bought, this little thread does a lot more damage to your reputation than that domain price ever will...and then you abuse people on here to ruin your image even more, I wouldn't even buy a hotdog from you!!


There is my bit anyway, take it how you will..
 
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Some people just don't realise that they cause damage to sellers when they back out of legally binding contracts. (and yes, when this Danny keck dude did bid at sedo, he signed a LEGALLY BINDING CONTRACT and accepted the terms and conditions at sedo).

Its the same with some of these ebay deadbeat buyers. They think its just a game and they can click whereever they want like they are playing an online browser game.

As a seller, you have to pay ebay the fees. You lose the opportunity to sell to others since often times the second or third highest bidder change their mind when you offer them the item later. You have to relist the item. You lose time because of all the reminders and emails, etc. etc...
 
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