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Aged domains question

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Bob Hawkes

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I have a question that I hope someone more experienced in domain investing can provide insight on....

Very frequently I see mention in domain name sales that the domain is aged or how many years old it is, as though this is universally a good thing.

I understand completely how if the domain has been used in a website in a positive way, has received meaningful links from other websites, etc. that being aged is a plus that will make the domain more valuable.

However, what if the domain was first registered say 12 years ago, but has essentially sat parked for most or all of that period? In this case I don't see how being aged is positive, and maybe even it could be negative if an unsuccessful attempt has been made to sell the domain over years. Of course, you may have new ideas for promotion and hope to find success where others have not with the domain name, but I still don't see why per se being aged is always positive and meaningful.

Or am I missing something? Thanks for any insights.

Bob
 
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The views expressed on this page by users and staff are their own, not those of NamePros.
In the early days of the Internet almost all names were available for hand reg even names that eventually were worth millions.

It stands to reason that the longer ago the name was registered the more likely that it is a superior name. As more and more people use the internet and more and more people become involved with needing a domain name - needing it for whatever purpose - stands to reason that the names being more recently hand registered will be the dregs only. Inferior.

You’ve heard about how an infinite number of monkeys typing on an infinite numbers of typewriters will produce all the works of Shakespeare? Well as the amount of people dreaming up domain names increases it will get harder and harder to come up with any decent name that has not already been registered. What’s available to hand reg today is definitely crappy compared to many years ago.

So whether the domain has been parked or not all these years still if it was hand registered 15 years ago it came from a superior pool than what is available today.
 
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Nothing you may hand reg today compares to the best domains that were registered years ago.

Now, weird misspelled or made up names of today may acquire distinctiveness and value but they will never, straight from registration, compare to the best names from the past. It’s absurd to argue otherwise. Stuff like sex.com x.com those were available once to hand reg, and not today. Real word domains, one word and two ones, are pretty much all spoken for. Those are the best. The newer domains can’t compare until after they have acquired distinctiveness through branding or use.

So, saying that a brand new hand registered domain can be great - simply means that through use, it may acquire greatness, but straight out the gate it is not on par with the best names of the past, that are great simply because of what they are even before use.

If you want to look at it this way - beer.com is great because it’s a word that has been in use in language for over two thousand years, and refers to a beverage that has existed for over seven thousand years. Made up domain names just came into existence and by comparison have a long way to go.
Except that new technologies and new terminologies are being created that weren't around years ago. There are still opportunities to make 5, 10, 15 times your money with domain names. The best domain name investment is the one that sells.
 
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Age is a funny thing. Some Investments are good when they are aged, and some Investments are good when they are new.

I have heard, that a domains age can command more money. A person that has paid renewal fees for 15 years, can reasonably ask for a minimum of 15 years of renewals.

Additionally, as others have mentioned, more valuable domains were available years ago.

As far potential revenue from a domain name, with an aged domain, traffic statistics can be validated.

Other than those points, a brand new hand registered domain can be great too.
 
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boker, again - general comments, and perhaps valid, and much appreciated, but what do they have to do with the thread, which is about whether there is value in the age of a domain?
No, the question was if a domain registered 5-10 years ago is more valuable than a domain registered yesterday. It's not about beer or other premium commercial words. I can show you tens-hundreds examples registered 5-10 years ago, even before 2000 and which they don't have any value at all and also domains registered this year that were sold for xxx-xxxx or which they had at least inquiries. In conclusion, even if the domain was registered 15 years ago and the domain is jgkjbkjhhbhbkhj.com, it will have no value just based on age.
 
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Thank you to all who replied. I found a number of helpful insights in your responses.

So I would summarize as follows:
(a) The value of domain age is somewhat subjective.
(b) Since there were more valuable names in the early days, in general an aged domain may represent higher quality. The fact that people renewed it over and over is also an indication of perceived value.
(c) There will be at least a few cases where newer domains have high value (e.g. related to technology not present for many years).
(d) A domain that has been held and registered for many years will have the owner feel that it is worth at least the holding cost, perhaps justifiably so.
(e) Not all aged domains will increase in value - e.g. domains related to technology and trends of a bygone era.
(f) As with collectable items, a very old domain may hold some special value related to its age beyond the simple quality (although age as a positive or negative is in eyes of beholder). Others might take the opposite view and find some aged but unsold domains as stale.
(g) Of course domain names with positive website history have special value (links, etc.).
(h) Every now and then someone will discover a gem not yet registered, but in general this would only be in the mid value range of .com and is rare with so many registered domains and active domainers.

Thanks again. It was interesting following the twists in the thread, and I have learned from your posts.

Bob
 
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I think the value of a domains age is subjective. It matters to some people and to others it doesnt matter.

Much like estibot values....whilst we all know they are not accurate, just browse around the domains wanted section and you will see the same thing..., some people make specific mention a domain having x amount of estibot value. You will also see many listings where people ask for domains that must be at least x years old.

Also from an SEO perspective an aged domain does have a little more clout than a brand new hand registered domain.
 
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My view is that age is a great proxy for quality, but it doesn't actually contribute to value.

For example, a useful way to sort a list of expired domains and not have to weed through as much junk is to sort by age. Most of us probably do this, as the odds of finding a really strong domain is significantly higher if you're looking in a pool of 20-year-old domains as opposed to a pool of domains registered within the past year. But there are plenty of garbage domains in that pool of old domains.

The reasoning for this is obvious, when everything is available people will take the best domains before they take the mediocre ones. Insurance.com will be taken before CarInsurance.com which will be taken before CarInsuranceQuotes.com. I could tell you that with near 100% certainty without even looking up the WHOIS. Value directly followed age.

So there is a strong correlation between age and value, just as there is with length, number of TLDs registered, etc. But none of these factors actually determine value. Literally the only thing that determines the value of a domain name is demand; how many end users would want to buy it and how much could they afford to pay for it based on its potential uses.

If a domain like Cars.com deleted and had the creation date reset, its value would not be impacted in the slightest. Conversely, a domain like BMCOMillwork.com, which is on the current drop list and was continuously registered since 1999 has no value even though it is 18 years old. Lack of age doesn't hurt a good domain, and having age doesn't help a bad domain. Period.

Take number of TLDs registered I mentioned earlier to further this idea. If a domain is registered in every TLD odds are high that it is a good domain as there are lots of other people who see value in the SLD and would want to own it in .com. But now imagine that all of those TLDs were registered by a single person who wanted to protect their brand. Now does being registered in every TLD mean much of anything? It's possible, but the odds of it being a strong indicator of value just dropped significantly. So it doesn't determine value, it just hints at it.

Age used to be considered an SEO benefit so it might have resulted in some actual value being attributed to a domain. But I don't think that is the common belief any more, and I don't think it was ever actually a ranking factor to begin with.

So now it is just a sales tactic for the most part, a way to try and increase interest in a domain. But I have never heard of an end user telling a broker, when listing criteria for a domain and trying to come up with candidates, that they want an old domain. And I've never heard of a buyer who was interested in a specific domain walking away because they found out it wasn't old enough.
 
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Basically if I'm selling an old domain, i say age matters.
If l'm selling a newer domain, i say age doesnt matter.
Depends on what I'm selling. :)
 
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Really? Surely you've met a collector or hobbyist before..

I said end user specifically. If someone finds the right domain for their project and they fall in love with it, they're not going to walk away from it because you just registered it last year. And someone who is in search for the right domain for their project is not going to have their main criteria be "I want it to be old". They care about number of words, length, the feeling it gives, how memorable it is, etc. You should care about what the end user cares about.

Sure, domainers/collectors/hobbyists care about age. But they shouldn't, it is silly noise. If you find a good domain and it isn't old, go ahead and pass on it so I can have it. And buy up every crap domain just because it is old so you can blow your budget and not spend it competing with me on good names. Please :)

I get a fair number of emails where people ask me to appraise domains. Many times I tell them reg fee because the names are genuinely crap, and they reply "But it has age!" I can't help but shake my head. Yes, most good domains are old and most new regs are crap. But a LOT of old domains are crap, and a small number of new regs are good. It's that last statement that proves that age doesn't determine value, it's just a decent predictor of value, but the only thing that really matters at the end of the day is demand. Plain and simple.

Basically if I'm selling an old domain, i say age matters.
If l'm selling a newer domain, i say age doesnt matter.
Depends on what I'm selling. :)

Exactly, lol.
 
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I have a question that I hope someone more experienced in domain investing can provide insight on....

However, what if the domain was first registered say 12 years ago, but has essentially sat parked for most or all of that period?

In this case I don't see how being aged is positive, and maybe even it could be negative if an unsuccessful attempt has been made to sell the domain over years.

Or am I missing something? Thanks for any insights.

Bob

I've excerpted the part of your post I'll respond to, as the owner of maybe a 75 or so domains aged between 12 - yes, 20 -ish years.

Their value IMO as " aged domains " is their long term unavailability to interested persons seeking those domains over the years.

Many are small niche market EMD or highly descriptive names that could have been or still are desirable in their marketplace.

Realistically many of the early potential name suitors have long since used many other domains or, have retired or relinquished their websites.

And as the years have passed without their availability, should an opportunity to acquire the
" aged names " arise a potential buyer would recognize this is likely their only opportunity to acquire the name or names - hence a perceived value to an " aged domain ".
 
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What’s available to hand reg today is definitely crappy compared to many years ago.

I sold a domain that I hand regged today
for $500 USD a few minutes later

crappy ?

yeah I should have asked for more
 
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Some pay for aged domains as a collector's item... like if it was reg'd in 1993 for example.
 
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Psychology

For enduser - Age doesn't matter, they only want good domain name.
For reseller - Age is one of the positive factor
 
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.. I still don't see why per se being aged is always positive and meaningful.

Or am I missing something? Thanks for any insights.

Bob

Age adds value. The reason is simple: Value is derived from scarcity. Age = time = money. Time is a scarce resource, so it's valuable, even the most valuable resource for many people. Time is money, money is time. Anything aged is more valuable by default unless it's a dead or extinct product (example: horse carriage, spear, telegraph). Every product has a life, is born, lives and dies like humans. Internet is still young, so age will add value to internet based products until internet dies and becomes extinct like telegraph.

Even older humans are more expensive than younger ones. Seeing a 50 years old doctor is more expensive than seeing a 35 years old doctor or an advocate, technician, accountant, etc. Because you can't revert back the time, accelerate it or stop it or slow it down. Little children want to become adult faster, want to get rid of childhood but time passes in its own speed. Elderly people miss the old days when they were child or young but they pass away like all the other previous humans. We don't control the time. We can't produce more time, can't consume it faster or slower (eg: you can't shave your beard when you are 5 years old :) ) Time is not only scarce resource but also fully out of our control. Gold supply is scarce but you can decide how much gold you will demand. Land supply is scarce but you can live in a smaller house when you have to. So time is the most valuable thing as its quantity is fully out of our control in both, supply and demand sides.


Age alone has a value. Assume beer.com is available and someone hand registered it today. It would be cheaper if it was registered today.

However, what if the domain was first registered say 12 years ago, but has essentially sat parked for most or all of that period? In this case I don't see how being aged is positive, and maybe even it could be negative if an unsuccessful attempt has been made to sell the domain over years.

Being parked or failed sales attempts in the past are not good indicators in an appraisal. Age always adds value. Because you can't turn back to the past, say, turning back to 1990's and being able to hand register 3 letter domains like sex.com. You can safely assume randomly chosen older domains are known by more people, need less promotion than randomly chosen newer domains. This is the main reason of why aged websites rank better in search results: They need search engines less as they receive more direct traffic (type-in or via browser bookmarks). Conversely search engines need aged, premium domains more than the need of aged domains for search engines. Because the search engines I know -specifically google- don't operate on good domains, so they have to provide reliable, quality search results to survive. As they aren't confident to survive merely based on search service, they added different services in addition to their initial search service. In my opinion, the reason is mostly related to bad choice (or not a perfect choice) on domain. In my opinion search.com would be a better choice than google.com if it was available to hand register.

Another striking proof: If you renew your website domain for longer 1 year in advance it ranks better in search results. I personally verified this on my own websites. Register a domain today, develop it today and renew its domain for 5 years, till 2022. By renewing its domain for 5 years, you are announcing everyone (including search engines) your site will certainly become 5 years old in 2022. Therefore your site deserves enjoying some portion of the authority of a 5 years old domain as it gives a guarantee to become a 5 years old domain.

Age isn't just a number. Even in the emerging markets of today (bitcoin, virtual reality, artificial intelligence, robotics) older domains will be always more valuable than the new ones. I saw some threads on this forum which started to buy 1+ year old crypto-bitcoin domains. Age adds value to everything you see. For instance you could buy 1 bitcoin for $1 in the past. But today you have to pay almost $6,000 for the same 1 bitcoin. Age isn't just a number. Of course everything dies after getting old enough. But internet is still young and is still growing.

Early adapters, first entrants skim the market (any market, not only internet-domain market). This rule never changes. Can you hand register 3L com's today? I remember the times when people were discussing if hand registering 4L com is a waste of money as most of 4 letters you can think of are meaningless random combinations. Now, the train missed, you can't hand register any 4L com. Is it important if your 4L com was parked or didn't sold after many attempts? No. Age is still adding value to 3L and 4L domains. 4L domains have value as they are scarce. Some smart, forward looking people saw this fact before the most people and hand registered 4L com's while it was possible. So we turned back to the beginning of this post. Value is derived from scarcity. Air is the most valuable thing to live but air has no economic value as it's not scarce. 4L or 3L is valuable as they are scarce. Being forward looking is valuable as it's scarce. Anything valuable is scarce. Age adds value until the product dies, becomes extinct, or until human can control quantity of the time.
 
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Anyway, I'd rather have my pick of 1000 names that were available to register say, twenty or twenty-five years ago, than a portfolio of 1000 of the names that are available to hand register today. Or even comparing what you could buy 25 years ago for fifty or a hundred bucks versus what you could get today for fifty or a hundred, still I'd take the 25 year old domains. No question. Which means that the pool of available names was superior back then. Which means that age matters.
 
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Age can be relevant and increase the value of a domain name if you have stats or relevant metrics ie: previous inquiries, past offers, web traffic etc. that would INCREASE the value of a domain name when you are trying to SELL it to an end-user. (if you kept track of all those metrics over the years you have owned it)
 
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Nothing you may hand reg today compares to the best domains that were registered years ago.

Now, weird misspelled or made up names of today may acquire distinctiveness and value but they will never, straight from registration, compare to the best names from the past. It’s absurd to argue otherwise. Stuff like sex.com x.com those were available once to hand reg, and not today. Real word domains, one word and two ones, are pretty much all spoken for. Those are the best. The newer domains can’t compare until after they have acquired distinctiveness through branding or use.

So, saying that a brand new hand registered domain can be great - simply means that through use, it may acquire greatness, but straight out the gate it is not on par with the best names of the past, that are great simply because of what they are even before use.

If you want to look at it this way - beer.com is great because it’s a word that has been in use in language for over two thousand years, and refers to a beverage that has existed for over seven thousand years. Made up domain names just came into existence and by comparison have a long way to go.
 
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"Except that new technologies and new terminologies are being created that weren't around years ago. There are still opportunities to make 5, 10, 15 times your money with domain names. The best domain name investment is the one that sells."

That's just a general statement, meaningless, and doesn't support your claim that a newly hand registered domain can be just as good as say, beer.com , straight from the gate.

Anyway, I think you're speaking in generalities. Show me any hand reg of today that is good as beer.com , straight from the gate, worth just as much on the day it was invented through these new technologies and new terminologies.

Which anyway, new terminologies are not what are being created. Made up names acquire distinctiveness through use they are not in existence at the time of creation. Your statement is very general and not really on point to this discussion, of what the value of time has for a domain name. As time goes on, even all of those made up names will be eaten up and unavailable. :xf.grin:
 
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come on

age has nothing to do with domain value

only value matters not age

and value is different in the eyes of different people

I hand reg most of my domains for more then 15 years
it takes a while sometimes
before somebody else recognises the value
 
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Doesn't entirely address your question, but I did post this:
https://www.namepros.com/threads/lo...word-domain-names.1045621/page-3#post-6396689

Our experience has been that after we turn down lower offers eventually someone comes along and buys enough of these same domains for which there were low offers, at much better prices.

Also, if you're going to accept low offers, then you will be doing it across the board. Your thinking is flawed. So you "lost" 100K from not selling domains where you received low offers and did not sell, and have not sold those domains yet. Okay. Well what if you had sold ALL of your domains at comparably very low prices? What if you had put buy it nows for all of your domains at low prices? How much less would you have received then, from your closed sales?

Let's say: You have 20 domains that should sell for $3000. each.

Scenario A.
10 domains, received 1000 offers for them, did not accept, never sold. So you "lost" $10,000. according to your thinking.

10 domains, that you did sell for $3000. Received $30,000.
Net receipts: $30,000.

Scenario B
You accept every $1000. offer immediately, do not try to get more, and sell all 20 domains at $1000. each
Net receipts: $20,000.

You see what I mean? You can't have it both ways. Either you hold out for the higher price on everything, or you just dump everything cheap.

If you're going to accept low offers, then you will lose out on higher sales. You must have a consistent policy. Either just dump everything cheap, or wait for the higher offers. Usually, the higher revenue you receive from the sales at market value (Scenario A) will more than make up for the "lost" revenue of unsold domains (Scenario B).

You can't know which domains will receive higher offers later, which will not, doesn't work that way.
Everything is true what you just said and for sure you can't know for which you will receive the higher offers and when. Let's take scenario B, when you accept the 1k for each domain. you have 20k and you can reinvest them again and repeat again. If you want to wait for the 3k offer( highest offer in our case) than probably your waiting time should be 3-5 years if not more. In this time you can make several times 20k, by accepting the lower offer, so in the same time, with the same investment, you can make 50-60k in 5 years, when in the other scenario you make 30k, waiting. In the same time, you have liquidity, don't need to be stressed if the higher offer will ever come. It's like some are selling thousands of items at xx-xxx and others are selling one luxury car at xxxxxx, everybody has his strategy, but one can sell cheap and reinvest and the other will sell high, but keep the cash locked all the time.
 
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This domain sold for 5K when it was just 2 days old.

flippa.com/9199038-skriptsell-com

Case closed. Aged is just a number.
 
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Aged domains rank better in google thus that is a huge advantage.
 
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This domain sold for 5K when it was just 2 days old.

flippa.com/9199038-skriptsell-com

Case closed. Aged is just a number.

This transaction was removed from namebio as an illegitimate sale. It apparently never happened, according to namebio's follow up research, there never was any sale - the domain did not change hands.
 
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if I look at my personal sales over the past few years many of them are aged over 10 years. I feel like when i sold them I didnt realize the age and wanted to make sure I had a way to take age into account if an offer came in.
we include age in our store for every domain because it does matter to some. with an aged domain my opinion is the price paid is more justified knowing that this wasnt something I could have picked up a few months ago (parked or not ) it was never available to reg. but thats just me. obviously newer names like drone, AI, VR and crypto names are younger and have amazing value as well.
 
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Aged domains must still be trending -- if they aren't sold on trend, they become useless relics. Take for example a domain about floppy disk drives from 94 -- aged yes, but relevent? Maybe to extreme collector..
 
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