Bob Hawkes

Taking A Close Look At Domain Name Appraisals

By Bob Hawkes, Mar 5, 2021
  1. oldtimer

    oldtimer Do some good for humanity and the environment VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    That's why in another thread here I wrote that the future is determined in a big part by what choices we are going to make today:

    Technology + Logic + Compassion


    Technology + Greed + Lack of Empathy

    And that's why that as an activist I have been trying to create awareness around these issue for a while now.

    This is the most critical time in the history of the World as Humanity has to make a transition from one era to another, If you give up now and surrender yourself to the forces in the status quo who want to use technology to enslave you, there will be no one to blame but yourself,

    You should not allow greed and hate to cloud your judgement because if you as a somewhat enlightened and aware person surrender to the forces of the status quo for some short term monetary gains then what hope is there for the rest of the people (the so called sheep).

    And don't forget that you don't have to wait another 20 years for AI as things are happening right now as we speak.

    AI is being intentionally downplayed by the forces in the status quo and made to look like a fantasy just so that people won't realize what is going to happen to them.

    Anyone who cares about the future of the Humanity and our Home Planet should be extremely concerned about what choices are being made right now not only about AI, but also with the many other new technologies that are in the immediate horizon such as Automation or Genetic and Quantum Engineering (just to mention a few).

    The ultimate question is whether Humanity as a whole is going to be a Force For Good that is going to use all these new technologies for the good of the World or whether we are going to stand by and allow our future to be sabotaged by those who want to use technology to enslave us .

    Last edited: Apr 7, 2021 at 1:21 PM
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  2. Mike Goodman

    Mike Goodman Established Member

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    @oldtimer I agree with your sentiment but your methodology appears to be a technique similar to whistling in the wind. Substitute the simile I first had in mind for the example and you'll get wet. Unless you can govern who will adopt AI and how they will use it, or can persuade others to do so in a manner which fits your aims, it will have no effect. But you can't even influence that, let alone do it.

    Far better IMHO to talk to legislators and genuine influencers about how it would be practical to harness AI use to the wider interests of humanity and why it will be beneficial to do so.

    Banging on at us, who don't have the wherewithall to influence even the smallest registrars - see our (UK) recent Nominet experience, with the board even immediately after losing the vote simply waving two fingers at us all, and GD, a much bigger and more powerful group, backing the Nominet board as well as closing down Brent's account very effectively - is hardly going to have much of an impression.

    I am not by any means idle in these matters. But I select targets at which I am less likely to be wasting my breath.
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2021 at 2:13 PM
  3. oldtimer

    oldtimer Do some good for humanity and the environment VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    We all have our own ways to contribute to the cause of saving the future of Humanity and our Home Planet,

    No need to put down or downplay my efforts,

    Unless you are the status quo.
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2021 at 1:33 PM
  4. Mike Goodman

    Mike Goodman Established Member

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    @oldtimer we are in clear danger of drifting way off the topic of whether automated valuations are of use. Let's keep it to whether anybody is going to introduce AI into their valuation offering and who that may be?

    My point is that I am showing my serious doubts about AI in this context. Far from having a go at you or your efforts in either the ecological or humanitarian fields. I simply doubt domaining will have much impact on either. I also doubt any AI inputs into domaining will serve the purposes of any more than a minority of the major players, such as GoDaddy.

    Beyond an hitherto unseen level of collaboration among domainers to instigate an initiative collectively, we simply don't have the infrastructure or the resources to start introducing AI into our operations.
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2021 at 2:15 PM
  5. Top Member PRO VIP Gold Account ★★★★★★★★★★

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    This is a good suggestion, but unfortunately it's not possible to do without losing massive amounts of money.

    NameWorth burns a lot of fresh data each time it is run. For a $100 plan with 10,000 lookups, I probably pay around $65+ for the data. With version 3.0, this is going to get more expensive for the data. Right now users are limited by their budgets. If it was made free, there will be users running 100,000+ lookups per month.

    The fresh data is really critical as new trends can make a domain that was worth $2,500 last month, worth $25,000 this month.

    Currently, the modest revenue from NameWorth helps the tool improve and evolve. It also pays for ads at the bottom of NamePros and in the middle of DNJournal results. The progression of the tool is only made possible by the subscribers. If I did it for free, it would instead cost me $6,000 per month to provide 1,000,000 lookups.

    Besides, the old saying that "you get what you pay for" is often true. Below is a real-world example of what people do with the results. The benefit from that one sale, will pay for a Gold subscription for over 10 years. For me, I personally sold PlanToGrow(.)com last year for $24,500. Without working on NameWorth at the time, I likely would have priced it at $5,450 as many other domain investors would.


    I've been selling domains for over 17 years and you'd think I have no use for the tool, but it has made me evolve as well. During this time, I've also been implementing some of Rick Schwartz's ideology of selling domains, so it is a combination of the two. In the last year I've been buying better domains like CarSound(.)com, Undie(.)com, GlobalWest(.)com, & vyuu(.)com and dumping my bad names at the same time. Over the last 1 1/2 years, I've saved $5,903 from dumping my worst domains. I then use that money to go back and buy better domains. Besides the total, you can see the second entry below is a misspelling that I wouldn't have caught without the tool.


    I wouldn't suggest a new user solely rely on the results without any knowledge, but for me, it's been an effective tool in helping to decide how to price domains and decide what to drop if you already have some experience in selling domains.
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2021 at 8:56 PM
  6. Top Member PRO VIP Gold Account ★★★★★★★★★★

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    Thanks, I appreciate the feedback. I would add an option to do appraisals without creating an account, but it opens the floodgates to people using proxies so they can do thousands of lookups per day. Then while battling the proxy bots, you end up blocking some real legitimate users, and they get really upset. So for me, because it costs me for each lookup performed, I really don't want to create a fire-fighting job for myself where I need to monitor when the free lookups are being abused.

    For your suggestions in #2, I think it already does this and more even for the free lookups.




    I did look into this for 1-2 months at the beginning, but at least at the time (2 years ago) AI was more for very defined cases that have a true outcome. For example, in the medical industry, these 3 symptoms are likely to yield a particular diagnosis. These are very measurable. Or I could build a tool using AI to generate domains according to a users preference, based on other user's preferences. Again, very measurable and finite.

    But domain sales and pricing is a very nebulous problem. If we just look at the following example where I priced and sold the domain PlanToGrow(.)com at the NameWorth suggested price at the time it is far above any similar comps. So do you use the comps to drive the AI? How do you determine when an investor is paying $20k for a domain rather than an end user? What about determining the type of buyer for all the sales in the $1k-$2k range? I can see value in determining a piece of the data based on AI, but whenever I tried to design a core system based on this, the projected results would have been unacceptable.


    You mentioned it should learn "the inherent value and importance of the keywords", but this is already in the system along with 20+ other forms of analysis, some of which took me a month just to think of an idea on how to solve the particular issue. So NameWorth is already way beyond keyword "basic understandings and abilities", or should be in most cases. Like I mentioned, version 3.0 is expected to clean up most of those loose ends.

    But it still does have AI...Actual Intelligence built right in. :xf.wink: Some taken directly from the actions of industry leaders.

    In seriousness, I appreciate the feedback and based on this I can think of a couple areas where I can add in some AI based analysis.
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2021 at 10:52 PM
  7. oldtimer

    oldtimer Do some good for humanity and the environment VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    4,759 ,

    You already have a good system going, perhaps better than most others in the domain Industry,

    But unless you have an advanced degree in computer science and are an expert in the area of "Training AI" then I would suggest that you consult with an expert in this area.

    Unfortunately no mater how hard you try to program the AI to analyze all the different criterias and factors that you have mentioned, but it's not going to be considered to be true AI unless it can surpass its initial programming and can learn to figure things out on its own by coming np with insights that can only be visualized through having access to "Big Data" pertaining to the domain Industry which should include all the information that is available concerning domains and the English language and grammar.

    In all honesty this is more than one person can provide since at this time it pretty much falls only under the expertise of a few specialized companies or some University and academic institutions that are doing research in this area.

    So I would suggest that find either a private company or an academic institution that can at least point you in the right direction.

    Meanwhile you might google such things as Machine Learning, Big Data, Visualization, and Insights in regards to AI in order to become more familiar with the scope of what AI can do for your company.

    Good luck and I hope that you will be the first one to pioneer the use of true AI in the domain Industry.

    By the way a while back I registered the domain name but because of my ongoing health issues I never got the chance to do anything with it, but I have always been a fan of learning about AI to the point that some people might think that I am hyping the AI abilities, but the truth of the matter is that this is just an area of interest to me and I do see a lot of potential for AI once it's fully integrated into our lives. Although as I have mentioned in different threads here before we have to make sure that AI and any other technology is going to be used for the good of the World and that is not going to be misused by those who are driven by greed and lack of empathy.

    Last edited: Apr 9, 2021 at 6:19 AM
  8. kam

    kam Top Member PRO VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    Very true.
    If majority of people Lack of Empathy and don't care about it.
    Many people will lost their jobs in the next few decades. Many jobs will be replaced by AI and robots.

    At the same time, we can imagine that it will brings up another problems because growth rates are so necessary for capitalism. If the people with power are lack of empathy, they may choose to let robots became citizens and let them have the rights to shopping and upgrade themselves to ensure the growth rate is keep growing. :dead:

    I would say the next 10 years are very important and it will determined our future.
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