Why and how Epik allows CoronaVirus domains to be listed

[Rob Monster]

Epik has a history of standing for responsible free speech that is within the bounds of the law. As such, when it comes to the topic of Corona Virus domain names, I doubt there will be a large change on that position.

This is not a light matter, and we certainly will remain vigilant to acceptable use. However, to pre-judge that every Corona-related domain is to be used for evil is akin to Dystopian Minority Report pre-crime.

May rational heads prevail and may orderly free speech be used to accelerate progress and to encourage those who are suffering in one way or another.

For additional context, I posted a short video on Twitter:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1243196903581499397

 

[Rob Monster]

Allow me to illustrate something.

This is my city's website about CoronaVirus:

https://www.sammamish.us/government...-management/covid-19-coronavirus-information/

There is no way anyone is going to remember that. So, instead they will go to a site that they can remember which is probably not run by anyone with local perspective.

If my city management was on top of the matter, they would set up a mobile-friendly resource site for critical local info:

- Local updates
- Incident reports and current statistics
- Quarantine practices
- Emergency procedures
- Local food delivery
- Donations and Foodbanks
- Testing locations
- Advice and counseling
- Benefit programs for business continuity
- Unemployment programs
- Crime mitigation and neighborhood watch
- Postal delivery
- Sanitation and Hygiene

Etc.

As a guy who spent 3 years working with city managers, I can tell you that cities are slow to deploy technology solutions. Nevertheless, I expect many cities will take action and it will be ONLINE.

And for all the folks who choose to judge, I suggest you call your city first and see if they need help with their digital strategy, and then you can come on here and tell me why I am wrong.

Good luck to all.

 

[Internet.Domains]

My local hospital profits on tragedy......but, are we really going to cry about someone trying to profit on a domain?

If you condemn someone for trying to profit on a "corona" name you are doing no different when you sell any other name. Its hypocrisy to blame a domain investor for "profiting on tragedy" when an oncologist surgeon profits on unsuccessful surgeries.

How many companies can you say profits on tragedy? The Dow Jones is full of them. Over the last few days the top performers were companies that are speculatively going to profit on the virus.

When this is all over there will be plenty of companies, large and small, that you could accuse of "profiting on tragedy". Many of those companies are in your stocks, IRA portfolio, mutual funds, etc. Be careful when you throw stones.

 

[Rob Monster]

@Rob Monster you missed it big time, this is not about free speach or free trade or whatever "free" term you will through in , this about an unethical practice that makes coronavirus domain investors no better than those who sell hand sanitizers & masks at astronomical prices, both are taking advantage of the epidemic by unethical monopoly.

It is perfectly legal to buy coronavirus domains, but it is not ethical in current circumstances. We as human can distinguish between what is ethical and what is not.

In these tough times all of us must help and contribute in fighting this virus, domainers must contribute by donating these domains to communities or at least leaving them unregistered so that others can use them to save lives. This is a duty not a favor, think about how many lives would have been saved if coronavirus domains were available at afordable prices, the economy is collapsing and yet some chose to sell epidemic related domains at 6500 these money could have been spent on medical equipments, masks, medicines..etc.

Well, FWIW, I just bought CoronaPrayer.com for $99 on Godaddy. I used an account credit that we had there. Godaddy apparently sells Corona domains still. And I am glad they do. The person who sold the domain had an asking price of $99 which I was fine to pay.

I see that someone else is already using the plural for a multi-faith approach to model prayers:

https://coronaprayers.com/

I think that's great.

Does anyone have a problem with that?

 

[Rob Monster]

I disagree with ya on this one Rob, and seldom disagree with you, COVID, Coronavirus names were registered out of greed, just that reason alone is enough to ban them IMO

Thanks.

So, in your view, in a world of post-GDPR WHOIS destruction, these domains that were registered should now be unsellable. Genius move.

I think the main thing is just for COVID domain owners to just lower their expectations and make a best effort to get domains into the hands of reputable end-users.

As for greed, let me know when you start donating all of your domain sale proceeds to charity.

 

[NickB]

There we go - everyone who is trying to profiteer from this pandemic can hide behind "free speech" & "free enterprise" your morally safe to continue as you see fit......

Appealing to rational heads means you are appealing to the minority, most people do not know the meaning of that phrase

 

[Rob Monster]

There we go - everyone who is trying to profiteer from this pandemic can hide behind "free speech" & "free enterprise" your morally safe to continue as you see fit......

Appealing to rational heads means you are appealing to the minority, most people do not know the meaning of that phrase

There is a difference between owning a domain and using it responsibly.

To own a domain and invite inquiries is an acceptable form of use.

Yes, there will be some additional work related to processing abuse complaints.

As usual, we'll apply due process in an orderly way.

If someone has codified acceptable use for this class of domains, I would love to see it. However, to blanket ban all of them from getting into anyone's hands in the wake of GDPR WHOIS obfuscation is not right.

 

[Rob Monster]

That is a subjective line. Who decides where that line is?

Brad

In the absence of a legal statement, we'll be governed by our terms of service.

Your own example illustrates the problem with case of "Corona de Tucson".

It takes more work to use a lighter hand, but so be it.

To ban all Corona domains is a cop-out.

 

[Rob Monster]

A few days ago I sold the domain name UVSanitizer.com for $6500. Demand for this domain was clearly driven by COVID. The appraised value is actually higher. I certainly could have held out for more. However, our cost basis was low so fine to sell it and hopefully it gets used for a good purpose. We shall see!

There are plenty of ways to add value in the war on this plague. However, if we start drawing a line on a term like COVID or Corona, then soon we'll also be moving that line so that anything that is private sector that seeks to address the problem of containing a modern plague would be off limits.

To the free market advocates and free thinkers, thank you for holding the line.

 

[wwwweb]

I have always believed the internet should stay neutral, and everyone who is intelligent enough to use the internet, should be intelligent enough to form their own conclusions, and fund their own purchases. If marketplaces can judge before a domain is used, that what are we all doing here.. it is a tough one given the circumstance, but I feel Epik is very net neutral, and I have been online since the start, and am starting to see how people are starting to take interest, and try to influence, and govern it, which takes away from the internet in itself.

There are many millions of offensive things online, and nobody here wants corona virus names to be used in bad context, or in the wrong hands, but we all have to use common sense. I get apple store receipts all the time from gtld extensions, trying to get me to click etc... Hopefully this will pass soon, but the keyword corona has orgins dating wayback.

Borrowed from Latin corōna (“garland, crown”), from Ancient Greek κορώνη (korṓnē, “garland, wreath”), from ... corona (plural coronas or coronae or coronæ).

 

[bmugford]

Your own example illustrates the problem with case of "Corona de Tucson".

It takes more work to use a lighter hand, but so be it.

To ban all Corona domains is a cop-out.

I agree, but at the same time it sure does save a lot of resources vs. manually going through a list of maybe tens of thousands of domains.

Outside any moral stance, 99%+ of these are just terrible investments anyway.
There are only a handful of valuable terms now, which are likely to fade over time.

Also, people peddling these need to realize many other people will have a problem with this behavior and it will reflect poorly on them.

Brad

 

[bmugford]

My assumption is that the fallout of Corona will be with us for the next 12-24 months in some capacity or another, which is why I don't pre-suppose to know how various organizations might use domains to empower or inform stakeholders. All I know is that a lot of people are going to need a lot of help.

Yes, this is a serious issue and not going away any time soon.

But let's not pretend the vast majority of people registering these are trying to do humanitarian work or something. They are basically just trying to profit off a tragedy.

Brad

 

[wwwweb]

Something doesn’t sit right with me with this whole thread, everything from the title “Epik allows Coronavirus domains to be listed” and even all the follow up comments.

I think we need to call this thread what it is. Epik know other platforms are banning Coronavirus domain names so they are making very clear (publicly) ‘come sell your Coronavirus domains with us’ – Therefore encouraging these domains to be still in circulation when other platforms and many in the domaining industry are trying to stop it.

Same time though, Epik are also profiting from this pandemic, as you will be taking percentage of any Coronavirus domain sales sold on your platform so I don’t buy it all this ‘free speech’ stuff as a reason for doing this, let's have it right the only reason for Epik doing this is for money.

If Epik said ‘we will allow Coronavirus domain sales on our platform, but we will donate our cut to charity (ie. ventilators/finding a cure for Coronavirus), that is a totally different story, but you are not!

Epik are attempting to profit from a hole in the market and profit from a global pandemic in the same way people are who trying to sell these domains, which makes you just as bad (possibly worse) than people holding these domains as you are knowing hosting a platform for people to sell these controversial domains, for (as said) profit yourself.

I think you have taken in out of context. Epik is not encouraging people to register them, but if people have them listed, they are not taking it upon themselves to say they are all for bad purposes.

Let's face it, these names are really hard to sell, I have seen so many domainers over the years chase these type of trends, they just end up dropping them year after year. After a while, you learn your lesson, and just stop, and shake your head when you see newbies running to register, and sell them. Most of the people selling them are not true domainers, they are just trying to do a one, and done type deal.

 

[Bernard Wright]

I like interesting discussions! Thank you Rob, as always.

I posted this in another thread, but I'll post here, and add a bit more.

If someone were to want to create a website to provide a service that would help inform the public about the virus, or similar ...like help source PPEs for hospitals... how are the site developers supposed to acquire the name if the seller has no means to sell it?

Are those who would not side with Rob's "free speech" not just assuming a zero sum game where the domainer is exploiting a crisis and all other parties (including those who would visit the site once it were developed) stand only to lose from the transaction?

Are the doctors working for free? Nope. Are the n95 masks being manufactured for free? Nope.

My hypothetical website is not free to run, and the developers' time is valuable. Are they not going to get paid? Is the site not going to run ads? Of course money will exchange hands. The site adds economic value, even if only as an externality.

So, why should the domain investor not be afforded the freedom to operate?

 

[karmaco]

I have mixed feelings on this topic. I don’t think people should be registering Covid or Corona names in the first place period (I did not) but on the other hand this is very typical of domainers to jump on trends, unsavory or not, and register.

There isn’t a domainer out there who is pure and innocent on what they have registered or bought. It is always with the intent to profit, hopefully greatly, no matter what the niche. We monitor trends and pounce on keywords (hopefully before they are in demand).

To say a domainer chasing these types of names is “greedy” or a “bad person” is unfair and hypocritical. Everyone is in this business to find opportunities and maximum profit. Everyone wants more sales and the occasional windfall.

Just because I didn’t chase this niche and don’t like that people did that does not make them bad people or any greedier than any other domainer looking for a profit.

I can disagree with the action without condemning the people involved. They will learn to avoid controversial registrations when nobody buys and they drop alot of names next year.

 

[Rob Monster]

Dumb analogy. Additionally, that is a straw man argument as no reasonable person would ever seriously suggest that.



I have mixed feelings on this. I am pro capitalism, to a point.

There is a reason though in capitalism, there still needs to be rules. Some people just have very low morals and ethics, and without limits in place the system could be highly abused.



Not really. It sanitizer is $50/bottle it just means the already richest people will have it and everyone else won't. The higher the price goes the fewer people have access to it.

With that said there is clearly a difference between a tangible staple good, and an intangible good.
You can't survive without food, medicine, water. You can survive without domains.

Brad

As stated prior, I would encourage folks to price with Make Offer pricing and tailor their response depending
on who wants the domain. That is the ethical approach to pricing domains in this category.

In my particular case, I owned UVSanitizer.com for many years. The appraised value was above $20K. I sold it for $6500 and was hoping to see it in use. So far it is still parked. I guess I sold it too cheap.

The world is going to need as many entrepreneurs and capitalists as possible to get out of this self-propagated mess. When US employment hits 30%, you will be thankful for the ones who never gave up.

 

[bmugford]

There is a difference between owning a domain and using it responsibly.

That is a subjective line. Who decides where that line is?

To own a domain and invite inquiries is an acceptable form of use.

That is your opinion. Others might feel differently.

Also, there is a difference between "acceptable use" and doing sleazy things.
Just because something is allowed doesn't mean doing it is always a good idea.

I see both sides of this. A private market place is also allowed to block anything they want.
I had Corona De Tucson blocked on SEDO, but it has nothing to do with either the virus or the beer and was later fixed.

Brad

 

[Rob Monster]

Something doesn’t sit right with me with this whole thread, everything from the title “Epik allows Coronavirus domains to be listed” and even all the follow up comments.

I think we need to call this thread what it is. Epik know other platforms are banning Coronavirus domain names so they are making very clear (publicly) ‘come sell your Coronavirus domains with us’ – Therefore encouraging these domains to be still in circulation when other platforms and many in the domaining industry are trying to stop it.

Same time though, Epik are also profiting from this pandemic, as you will be taking percentage of any Coronavirus domain sales sold on your platform so I don’t buy it all this ‘free speech’ stuff as a reason for doing this, let's have it right the only reason for Epik doing this is for money.

If Epik said ‘we will allow Coronavirus domain sales on our platform, but we will donate our cut to charity (ie. ventilators/finding a cure for Coronavirus), that is a totally different story, but you are not!

Epik are attempting to profit from a hole in the market and profit from a global pandemic in the same way people are who trying to sell these domains, which makes you just as bad (possibly worse) than people holding these domains as you are knowing hosting a platform for people to sell these controversial domains, for (as said) profit yourself.

That was not really the motive.

This was more about holding the line on a slippery slope of systematic censorship under the banner of political correctness.

If you think that is about profiteering, you likely would advise to never "Shoot the moon", a topic that I addressed yesterday specifically:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1242939103630561281

ICYMI, pretty much all of our cash flow goes towards empowerment projects. I rarely pay myself.

 

[Rob Monster]

Yes , They should be 100% unsellable , there is actually to much coverage of the virus as it is, the people who feel a real need to cash in on this virus, are not good people IMO

Agree to disagree.

When I get to know these price-gouging scoundrels, I might try and talk some sense into them. As you know, we encourage "Make Offer" pricing which is probably the best way to avoid scandals and rebuke.

As I see it, thoughtful info on life in the time Corona is still in short supply which is why I am not on board with the idea of bulk null-routing of these domains, for example.

In the meantime, feel free to condemn the folks with cancer domains, rehab domains, divorce domains, etc.

In case you are wondering, we'll happily empower those folks too.

If some registrars and marketplaces want to PC themselves into tiny boxes, so be it.

We'll use proceeds to help domainers feed their families and use our modest margin to keep growing Epik, provide great value money, and fund cool empowerment projects.

 

[HotKey]

As more and more folks are forced to move their activities online, we have to be careful of these people from places like Dan or Namecheap, whom are going to take advantage of their positions in the domain name industry to control what can or can't be allowed in the face of "morality" or whatever. It is one thing to have a viewpoint on something like this, it is another to take stance on it and then force it upon others.

Dan does not matter so much as Namecheap, as they are not a registrar. But when we start condoning registrar actions that limit our rights to naming, then we've opened up floodgates to a slew of other control methods. Like a stepping stone. It happens slowly, and soon we are chained. It's not like it's a some grand plan by the companies either, really, they get sucked into this stuff themselves, and before they know it, they are victim to their own actions.

So be aware, when we might applaud these kinds of decisions by digital companies to restrict certain items, we are moving the onus of freedoms from the individual and into the laps of the faceless.

This doesn't just affect investors, it also affects netizens. What about my right as an internet surfer to pick and choose crappy corona virus domains to go click on and visit? People are like that, they will click anything and trust anything that shows up in results. Instead of protecting stupid, we should focus on educating smart. This keeps everything truly free. It's already happening in other areas of our lives. Digital is 0's and 1's, try governing it before it does you. Maybe it already does. If you think your fridge telling you you're out of milk is freedom, think again.

 

[The Durfer]

Where does an entity stop being judge, jury, and executioner though also. Are they not just taking the issue on themselves and saying after we defend we attack with the same lesson. No, the domains are not the virus and vice versa, viruses are viruses. This one sucks!!! Love you, Memas and Papas!

 

[koolishman]

There are real consequences when you try to ban a very generic keyword, this is an actual heavily populated city in CA in itself, I am sure their are countless property, lawn service, pet care type names associated with it. I am sure it's great PR, but the bigger picture is who are you really hurting with all these bans.

(Spanish for ''Crown'') is a city in Riverside County, California, United States. As of the 2010 census, the city had a population of 152,374, up from 124,966 at the 2000 census. The cities of Norco and Riverside lie to the north and northeast, respectively, Chino Hills and Yorba Linda to the northwest, and the Cleveland National Forest and the Santa Ana Mountains to the southwest, and unincorporated Riverside County along the rest of the border. Corona is approximately 48 miles (77 km) southeast of Los Angeles and 95 miles (153 km) north-northwest of San Diego.

Corona beer is taking a lot of flak these days.

 

[Rob Monster]

You still don't get it, don't you?

It is unethical to profit from a global epidemic especially when economy is collapsing.. no example you will give will change that fact.

What should domainers do? Stop registering coronavirus domains and donate what you already registered to community.

I totally support Dan & Sedo decision to ban these domains, it was the right thing to do and Epik should follow there are no excuses!

Actually, I am the one who gets it.

Do you care for this?

I don't.

It is one thing to cancel a lot of mindless entertainment, and force people to cook at home and spend more time with their families.

It is another thing to systematically take away the capacity for private enterprise to function or to treat responsible humans like mindless cattle.

Those who think that a pandemic with 1-2% mortality rate is a license to roll out a worldwide police state are certainly empowered to do so.

At the same time, I reserve the right to empower others to respond with:

- Local news and information
- Peer to peer commerce for goods that are in short supply
- Prayer, counseling and encouragement

At the end of the day, there are risks of emission (do something) just as their risks of omission (do nothing). Some providers have erred in favor of omission. Epik has a bit more faith in humanity.

If you object to that decision, it is your prerogative to do so, However, don't think that this choice is without consequence.

 

[HotKey]

Ostrados, my man, you are equating junk domains to life and death. Monster is stepping up to the plate, and trust me, it's not about DN he's stepping up to.

Do you honestly think anyone that's in dire straights with the covid gives two hoots about bogus corona domains registered by bandwagon trendees? They're going by advice of doctors. People that are prone to rumours, they will go to whatever lengths anyways to satisfy their appetite. Are these the people you want making your DN investing decisions for you? Come on now.

 

[Rob Monster]

I think that's a brilliant idea
which in this case as the human race is threatened as a whole
could do much good

unless it's misused of course

It is one thing to say: "please update your website to show this text. We would really appreciate it".

It is another thing to say: "you must update your site immediately or your site won't resolve."

The latter is censorship.