Undeveloped.com Experience

[JudgeMind]

Has anyone used undeveloped.com to sell domains? They claim to be able to increase a domainers sales by 54%.

 

[wizard]

I'll wait around till tomorrow

They don't take days they are the quickest out of all the rest

 

[NYJimbo]

Yup, its late evening there.

I just reached agreement on a sale of a .biz a few minutes ago and it shows its 9pm in Undeveloped Land.

 

[NYJimbo]

Actually, I received the "payment received with invoice" mail, 15mins after I reached an agreement with the buyer (inbound). Then they asked which I would prefer: Push or Auth code. I told them push at GoDaddy and asked for the details.

Pretty sure that email is automated. Just did the same thing in the middle of the night and got the "Push or Auth code" message, answered right back, but did not get a response to do the actual push until much later. So some are automated messages, some are human.

 

[NYJimbo]

Well, that was fast. Just got the payment for the little .biz I sold last night. Took about 2.5 hours between push and paypal payment. Nice.

 

[wizard]

Well, that was fast. Just got the payment for the little .biz I sold last night. Took about 2.5 hours between push and paypal payment. Nice.

What name ?

 

[NYJimbo]

What name ?

cooling.biz - no more info please

I normally dont list sales anymore because I do a lot of pattern name sales, but this one was just a weirdo that had "buyers" that didnt pay in the past and I wanted it gone so took a lowish $xxx offer.

I sell a lot of 4-6L .org and 5-7L .com pattern names and stopped posting sales last year. I sold a 4L pattern .org two days ago for low $xxx on UD, but its a netsol, so am waiting 3 days for stupid transfer code.

 

[wizard]

cooling.biz - no more info please

I normally dont list sales anymore because I do a lot of pattern name sales, but this one was just a weirdo that had "buyers" that didnt pay in the past and I wanted it gone so took a lowish $xxx offer.

Nice i don’t have many biz but well done !

 

[FolioTeam]

Well, that was fast. Just got the payment for the little .biz I sold last night. Took about 2.5 hours between push and paypal payment. Nice.

Congrats. Also got my payout sent some hours ago. But since it's international wire, I expect to see it later today or sometime tomorrow.

 

[Jurgen Wolf]

International wire (SWIFT) should be delivered to you within 24-48 hours during business days...
Today is Friday... so you will get it on Monday/Tuesday...

 

[wizard]

Congrats. Also got my payout sent some hours ago. But since it's international wire, I expect to see it later today or sometime tomorrow.

next week you will see it

 

[carob]

When domains are sold with payment by instalments, the domain is held by Undeveloped, presumably in escrow.

In the event that Undeveloped went bankrupt, would you get your domain back? How? Where is this spelled out? I don't think the accounts show a list of domains in escrow.

I may have missed it, but I can't find a clear answer to this on the @Undeveloped site or ToS, just this:
https://undeveloped.com/legal/terms-of-use

14.1 In addition to the provisions of article 4.5, the Contract terminates with immediate effect by cancellation by the other party if the Contractor or the Client has been declared bankrupt or suspension of payment has been granted. The Contractor is due to this termination never obliged to refund any received amounts or pay compensation.

14.2 The Contractor shall be entitled to terminate the Contract if they are not able to implement it because of force majeure on this contract without any obligation to pay compensation.

 

[alcy]

When domains are sold with payment by instalments, the domain is held by Undeveloped, presumably in escrow.

In the event that Undeveloped went bankrupt, would you get your domain back? How? Where is this spelled out? I don't think the accounts show a list of domains in escrow.

I may have missed it, but I can't find a clear answer to this on the @Undeveloped site or ToS, just this:
https://undeveloped.com/legal/terms-of-use

yes, domain held in escrow by them.

I am not sure if they make it official what happens if a company goes bankrupt.. whether it is to unpaid funds or escorw names or other things. of course the official statement from undeveloped is that they will not be going bankrupt.

but you bring intrresting point.. do companies in general have to make official statemts in tos or other, what happens to assets, money or other, in case of bankrupcy.

I suppose not. as I never saw companies talk much about what happens in bankrupcy.

 

[xynames]

A real escrow company must have insurance, a bond posted to cover any such event as insolvency.

 

[DAN.COM]

@all, want to meet at Namescon? Send

When domains are sold with payment by instalments, the domain is held by Undeveloped, presumably in escrow.

In the event that Undeveloped went bankrupt, would you get your domain back? How? Where is this spelled out? I don't think the accounts show a list of domains in escrow.

I may have missed it, but I can't find a clear answer to this on the @Undeveloped site or ToS, just this:
https://undeveloped.com/legal/terms-of-use

Hi Carob,

Undeveloped's "escrow" (we see escrow more as a reliable transfer service than a traditional escrow service) division is operated from a non-profit officially known as "Stichting Undeveloped" that we set up years ago.

As you might know, we're currently also wrapping up our domain automation network and once that goes live (we're launching this month), all (smart) contracts around escrow, keeping domains in escrow for installments, rentals etc are created between you and the non-profit that manages the domain transfers etc. In the edge case where the marketplace (Undeveloped) goes bankrupt, only our commercial division would be hit by such an event and no funds or domains will be lost.

So in essence, what we've done at Undeveloped is to modulize our business and sort of detach the "escrow" part from our core business (Domain Market). Here's a piece from the DNJournal that explains a bit what I mean with that: https://www.dnjournal.com/cover/201...xWycjfvPA7GkVwZy8gHJh5qrFnXP8SHwQap3E4_GeRWmc

We're most excited about launching our blockchain powered Domain Automation Network in early 2019. With the Domain Automation Network, we're solving some of the most significant problems in our industry by creating a new backend infrastructure to handle both simple and complex domain transactions and transfers, fully automated.

We aim to offer access to this network to anyone via a simple API. The Domain Automation Network has its own registrar to keep domains in escrow and its own payment gateway. You could see the Domain Automation Network us as the Stripe of the domain industry. Anyone can easily build their own domain marketplace for example and use the Domain Automation Network's API to handle all their domain payments & transfers from one person/registrar to another.

Another unique solution we've built is to use our public ledger to showcase how we'd like to see WHOIS evolve. In what we dubbed as WHOIS 2.0, our system will know and show if a domain is under a payment plan or is currently rented. This way the owner of the domain from a legal point of view isn't liable for the content on the rented domain anymore but the rentee is.

Our Domain Automation Network also introduces an entirely new WHOIS functionality where domains can have multiple legal owners. This introduces new opportunities for domain investors to sell for example 10% of their entire portfolio to external investors, or crowdfunded domain purchases. By introducing fractional domain ownership, we want to attract more capital to our industry by turning all steady revenue generating portfolios into great and accessible investment vehicles.

All features mentioned will be available at Undeveloped in early Q1 of 2019, while in Q3 we'll open up our Domain Automation Network for anyone to leverage the core technology that we've built. Some partners might use the network already before that timeframe. By introducing this powerful but open network, we believe we can accelerate innovation in our industry, create more value to all stakeholders in the market and make the market more efficient by replacing and automating manual processes.

 

[xynames]

A real escrow company must have insurance, a bond posted to cover any such event as insolvency.

Undeveloped's "escrow" (we see escrow more as a reliable transfer service than a traditional escrow service) division is operated from a non-profit officially known as "Stichting Undeveloped" that we set up years ago.

As you might know, we're currently also wrapping up our domain automation network and once that goes live (we're launching this month), all (smart) contracts around escrow, keeping domains in escrow for installments, rentals etc are created between you and the non-profit that manages the domain transfers etc. In the edge case where the marketplace (Undeveloped) goes bankrupt, only our commercial division would be hit by such an event and no funds or domains will be lost.

So in essence, what we've done at Undeveloped is to modulize our business and sort of detach the "escrow" part from our core business (Domain Market). Here's a piece from the DNJournal that explains a bit what I mean with that: https://www.dnjournal.com/cover/201...xWycjfvPA7GkVwZy8gHJh5qrFnXP8SHwQap3E4_GeRWmc

That “solution” would be laughed out of the California Department of Business Oversight, among other licensing and regulatory divisions. Given also that UnDeveloped charges 9% escrow fees - the highest on the planet - (or at least 5% if you bring the buyer to them - which means that at least 5% of the “cut” is indisputably escrow profit) declaring their escrow division a “non-profit” sounds Trumpian fraudulent.

Take a look at all of the regulatory and licensing divisions overseeing escrow.com
https://www.escrow.com/escrow-licenses
and its level of compliance.

What UnDeveloped describes is a sort of free wheeling Marx Brothers approach to licensing and bonding - i.e. no licensing no bonding no insurance to cover potential escrow losses? Is that what UnDeveloped is saying? I’m sure they must have some kind of liability insurance (at least). I hope.

Part of why these companies like UnDeveloped spring up overseas is the lack of regulation. It’s costly to do business in the U.S. because it is so regulated.

I will add that the likelihood of an issue arising as far as insolvency for a domain escrow business is slight but for the same reason that cemeteries must own their land outright (no mortgages so that the likelihood of losing the land is minimized) and real escrow companies must be licensed and post bonds, any entity that holds valuable property in trust should be licensed and bonded in every U.S. state and foreign country where it conducts business.

 

[DAN.COM]

That “solution” would be laughed out of the California Department of Business Oversight, among other licensing and regulatory divisions. Given also that UnDeveloped charges 9% escrow fees - the highest on the planet - (or at least 5% if you bring the buyer to them - which means that at least 5% of the “cut” is indisputably escrow profit) declaring their escrow division a “non-profit” sounds Trumpian fraudulent.

Take a look at all of the regulatory and licensing divisions overseeing escrow.com
https://www.escrow.com/escrow-licenses
and its level of compliance.

What UnDeveloped describes is a sort of free wheeling Marx Brothers approach to licensing and bonding - i.e. no licensing no bonding no insurance to cover potential escrow losses? Is that what UnDeveloped is saying? I’m sure they must have some kind of liability insurance (at least). I hope.

Part of why these companies like UnDeveloped spring up overseas is the lack of regulation. It’s costly to do business in the U.S. because it is so regulated.

I will add that the likelihood of an issue arising as far as insolvency for a domain escrow business is slight but for the same reason that cemeteries must own their land outright (no mortgages so that the likelihood of losing the land is minimized) and real escrow companies must be licensed and post bonds, any entity that holds valuable property in trust should be licensed and bonded in every U.S. state and foreign country where it conducts business.

Based on your response I have to conclude you didn’t understand what I said. A non-profit is a legal entity not an utopian idea.

Our non-profit is called Stichting Undeveloped and is registered in the Netherlands as an subsidiary of Undeveloped.

If you re-read my post, I state that our escrow division is separate from our conmercial business. The commercial business has a contract with our escrow division in place which grants it the right to subtract the commission from the payments received. The rest of the purchase amount belongs to the escrow division and so isn’t touched or impacted by a potential default of Undeveloped (this would also be extremely unlikely since we’re running a profitable business).

Ps: I didn’t knew we charge the highest commission on the planet . You have a bad tendency to make things up.

 

[Laguna]

Based on your response I have to conclude you didn’t understand what I said. A non-profit is a legal entity not an utopian idea.

Our non-profit is called Stichting Undeveloped and is registered in the Netherlands as an subsidiary of Undeveloped.

If you re-read my post, I state that our escrow division is separate from our conmercial business. The commercial business has a contract with our escrow division in place which grants it the right to subtract the commission from the payments received. The rest of the purchase amount belongs to the escrow division and so isn’t touched or impacted by a potential default of Undeveloped (this would also be extremely unlikely since we’re running a profitable business).

Ps: I didn’t knew we charge the highest commission on the planet . You have a bad tendency to make things up.

That's what I thought too sedo and afternic are 20% I believe

 

[xynames]

That's what I thought too sedo and afternic are 20% I believe

Uniregistry Afternic etc. charge for BROKERED deals, where a broker gets on the horn and calls the buyer over and over. All UnDeveloped does is give you a landing page and escrow the transaction (for 9%). If you bring the buyer to them they still charge 5% just for escrow. That 5% just for domain escrow is the highest on the planet.


Creating a non-profit, which I can't see how an entirely FOR profit division that charges fees with an end goal towards making profit could be a legitimate non-profit (except in a Trumpian
New York Attorney General Sues Trump Foundation After 2-Year Investigation
Lawsuit Against Trump and His Nonprofit Allowed to Proceed
world) is not a legitimate solution to avoiding liability, or even if it somehow is, is not at ALL a legitimate alternative to licensing bonding and insurance requirements for an escrow company. I get it, you're saying "but we're not an escrow company," but...if it walks like a duck, quacks likes a duck...the law says that.... Anyway, Real escrow companies must be licensed and post bonds, any entity that holds valuable property in trust should be licensed and bonded in every U.S. state and foreign country where it conducts business.

Anyway, as I mentioned, the chances of an insolvency issue arising for domain escrow transactions is slight, so I'm not entirely knocking your solution, but I am smiling at its cleverness. Trump would approve, even if I don’t.

 

[ecomslice]

Since ive also whined on here, thought id add past few sales went very smooth, and beyond grateful for UD being available for landing pages and service. A+++

 

[oldtimer]

Uniregistry Afternic etc. charge for BROKERED deals, where a broker gets on the horn and calls the buyer over and over. All UnDeveloped does is give you a landing page and escrow the transaction (for 9%). If you bring the buyer to them they still charge 5% just for escrow. That 5% just for domain escrow is the highest on the planet.


Creating a non-profit, which I can't see how an entirely FOR profit division that charges fees with an end goal towards making profit could be a legitimate non-profit (except in a Trumpian
New York Attorney General Sues Trump Foundation After 2-Year Investigation
Lawsuit Against Trump and His Nonprofit Allowed to Proceed
world) is not a legitimate solution to avoiding liability, or even if it somehow is, is not at ALL a legitimate alternative to licensing bonding and insurance requirements for an escrow company. I get it, you're saying "but we're not an escrow company," but...if it walks like a duck, quacks likes a duck...the law says that.... Anyway, Real escrow companies must be licensed and post bonds, any entity that holds valuable property in trust should be licensed and bonded in every U.S. state and foreign country where it conducts business.

Anyway, as I mentioned, the chances of an insolvency issue arising for domain escrow transactions is slight, so I'm not entirely knocking your solution, but I am smiling at its cleverness. Trump would approve, even if I don’t.

You bring up some good points which perhaps have gone unnoticed, but your posts will be more valuable and constructive if you do it with a little less animosity towards Undeveloped. IMO

I don't see anyone complaining about the fees currently being charged for selling their domains and many domainers don't mind paying a little higher escrow fees if it means that they can make quick and hassle free deals especially since the domain can be transferred to Undeveloped and they don't have to wait on the buyer making the payment before they can receive the money for their domain which from what I understand usually takes place the same day. Even if the domain itself pulls in the buyer there is still a level of trust and efficiency that Undeveloped provides which makes it worth while to most people to use this platform. IMO

Disclaimer: I have some domains at Undeveloped since the first of Jan, but haven’t received any offers yet, and that is the extent of my relationship with this company.