Turning lemons into lemonade

[Rob Monster]

From time to time, I feel moved to start a thread that I think might help one person in particular. However, considering the collective wisdom of many independent thinkers, this might also help others. This thread is about turning lemons into lemonade. As a self-described incurable optimist, it is one of my favorite topics. In my experience, the folks who figure this out early are better off than the ones who never learn it.

As context, on NamePros, I have met lots of cool people, some of whom have really amazing life stories. In fact, in 2019 alone, I have gotten to know many people here whom I now consider to be my trusted friends whose advice I keenly observe and in some of whom I now blindly trust. There are some folks here that are now practically family. And, yes, Epik also hired some folks here too.

To illustrate what I mean about lemons and lemonade, I will share a couple of examples that will be familiar to some NP members:

- Back in March 2019, a few people in the domain industry thought it would be a good idea to chastise me for protecting lawful free speech. This happened in blogs and also here on NamePros. I am not sure about their intention, but whoever was condemning me, ended up making me a lot more popular. In short, my response to being condemned was to engage with authenticity, and to let the crowd conclude for themselves if the manufactured consensus actually held any water. Well, many of you know how that worked out. Much to the chagrin of my harshest critics, Epik has gone from strength to strength as we co-create without care for who makes money or who gets credit.

- Earlier this year, Epik began to make significant inroads as a provider of escrow services for domain investors. The topic was introduced in a thread on NamePros, and within weeks, our friends at Escrow.com dispatched at least 6 state regulators to our doorstep. Although that process was time consuming, and even a bit daunting, we navigated those inquiries. One of the state regulators was kind enough to leak us the complaint. It fingered the instigator as one Jackson Elsegood. At one point when Jackson thought to engage in more of his nonsense, I let him have it, exposing Escrow.com once and for all. Matt Barrie got cute and he got a beatdown too! Our escrow business is booming, by the way and we are just getting started.


This is what I call turning lemons into lemonade. It is all about perspective. What are some principles:

- Be authentic: An early boss at P&G told me this: "First figure out the truth. Then explain truth." If you don't know yourself well enough to explain yourself, go fix that. If you know you screwed up, go deal with that. Acknowledge your faults. Everyone makes mistakes. Live and learn.

- Listen to your critics: Some of them are smart. They can teach you stuff, even if they don't really want to help you. The ones that point out your errors, probably never read Machiavelli who famously says to never interrupt your enemy when they are making a mistake.

- Try to find the upside: Is there some new circumstance that you had not considered before, consider whether you can accomplish something based on your unique situation. Most situations are not nearly as dire as you think they are. And indeed some things happen for a reason! That's providence.

- Find your tribe: Almost everyone loves an underdog. As long as you are not an unrepentant ass, people will come find you and share their wisdom for whatever you are dealing with at the moment. When the student is ready, the teacher appears. Humility is a great foundation for personal growth.


Here are a few simple examples that I know apply to some folks here:

- Spouse cheated on you? Be thankful, you are liberated. Learn from your mistakes. Up your game. Grow in grace. Have confidence that providence has a better spouse out there. Or go back, but on your terms.

- Lost a loved one? Consider setting up a charitable foundation in honor of what that person most cherished. In so doing, know that you are celebrating, preserving and extending their legacy.

- Lost your job? Perhaps that job was not right for you anyway. Assess your strengths and passions. Start a business, or find something that is more perfect for you. If you are diligent, it will work out great!

- Perpetually single? Consider becoming a Digital Nomad. Live anywhere for almost nothing and see the world. You will have way more stories to tell. I am trying to convince @franka46 to set up a Domainer Dojo.

- Sick or injured? Become an expert on personal health. Develop a spiritual practice. Make new friends. Let your light shine. Do you still think your life sucks? Listen to this guy:

The list goes on. I am sure everyone here has had their share of lemons. Curious to hear your story. If it involves domaining, even better!

 

[Ategy]

Are you talking to me? lol .. My life outside of domains has been a royal mess the last two years! Thankfully domains have started to treat me well this year at least!

I think I have two regular forms of disconnection / relaxation .. the first is walking little Steamie .. and sometimes I think going through the main daily lists in order to curate my own lists for NameCult kinda takes my focus off of other things.

One thing I've forced myself to change is allowing myself to sleep a bit more. Although with my knees issues at work, there wasn't much of a choice there .. you can push past what your body wants only for so long .. at some point you have to listen to it .. and I have to admit .. napping a little more often isn't all that bad .. particularly when you've got this little guy curled up next to you!

 

[BradWilson]

This last year has been full of lemons so much so that I've not only made lemonade but also zested them to make lemon extract - literally

I moved from San Diego to Fremont to help take care of my elderly father and stepmother when she fell and had a brain bleed last December. Unfortunately she passed away in March and I've needed to care for my father since then. Now he's having serious health issues. So things are a bit difficult right now.

I've been trying to finish a programming project but life seems to have other plans for me atm.

 

[BradWilson]

For all those who make Lemonade & Extract here you go...

 

[Mister Funsky]

Are you talking to me? lol .. My life outside of domains has been a royal mess the last two years!

I as well have been in a multi year rut...rarely even speak about it to people I know as the details are more like a really bad soap opera or low budget movie!

Domains have given me a constant variable as well as keeping me off the streets...speaking of which, I put a sign in my front yard with a stupid high asking price for my home and surrounding dirt...got an offer. If they come up with another 35 grand, I will following in the footsteps...er, tire tracks...of Eric. As a young man I took a Chevy van (like the one in the old song) and toured America...to this day some of my best memories and experiences.

 

[oldtimer]

@Rob Monster , for one thing I am glad you made this thread in the Break Room section so that you can use your freedom of speech appropriately.

I also want to congratulate you on your triumph over all those who wanted to bring you down, as you said you have actually come ahead in this ordeal by proving to everyone that you really care about helping others and that you are not motivated by wealth and material things alone.

Last but most importantly people should give thanks to God for the life that they have considering that there are many others who might have it worse.

PS: If you don't believe in God then just be thankful for your good luck for being where you are in life compare to others who might not have it as good. (I am sure God will understand in your case ).

IMO

 

[Samer]

I choose to live my life to a simple moral code;

Learn from your own and others’ mistakes,

to transcend and move forward.

Samer

 

[Internet.Domains]

Cheers to making lemonade! I wish y'all the best!

 

[oldtimer]

. You will note I kept faith out of it, since the wisdom is deliberately secular.

It's hard to keep faith out of our discussions specially since we are not talking business here, but the important thing is to have respect for everyone's faith even those who choose not to have any and want to be their own savior.

But as you wish we can keep it limited just to these couple of posts. You do know that you can set certain rules for your thread in your original post to apply from now on, as the mater of fact I recommend doing so to keep things civil. This is what I use for my threads:


Everyone’s opinions are welcomed, but keep your comments constructive, professional, and on topic. Personal attacks and belittling of others are not tolerated.

IMO

 

[Rob Monster]

@Rob Monster , for one thing I am glad you made this thread in the Break Room section so that you can use your freedom of speech appropriately.

I also want to congratulate you on your triumph over all those who wanted to bring you down, as you said you have actually come ahead in this ordeal by proving to everyone that you really care about helping others and that you are not motivated by wealth and material things alone.

Last but most importantly people should give thanks to God for the life that they have considering that there are many others who might have it worse.

PS: If you don't believe in God then just be thankful for your good luck for being where you are in life compare to others who might not have it as good. (I am sure God will understand in your case ).

IMO

Yes, my first break room thread.

I often deal with people who are dealing with adversity. I was thinking to compile a thread which could help them out in the context of the domainer life which is different than your typical salaried guy with a commute, and for which there is not a natural community as NP offers. You will note I kept faith out of it, since the wisdom is deliberately secular.

Anyway, thanks to anyone for indulging my little side project.

 

[DanSanchez]

Is this thread for me, Rob? This year has brought the lemon tree to my backyard, in all honesty, the lemonade was starting to get to me. Rob has truly helped me in ways I never expected anyone, let alone a community of fellow domainers, to come to my aid with genuine advise and true value-first reciprocity.

On the topic of economic reward, Rob deserves every penny that is coming to him. The true value for people like Rob is not rewarded enough and I truly believe we are the market to pick the winners.

 

[MapleDots]

I am the person that started the infamous topic mentioned in the opening post by Rob.

Other than a few posts I have not participated in the topic, I originally opened it to ask a question about something I saw mentioned on another website. At no point in time did I ever think it would run away and become one of the biggest topics of the year on namepros.

Do I regret opening it?

Yes and No

Yes: because I really like Rob and I often state that in my opinion he is one of the most forward thinking guys in the domaining industry.

No: Because it gave me more insight to who Rob and his company is.

So my personal opinion is that Rob is a straight up guy, true to his word. Sometimes he wears his heart on his sleeve but his personal opinions are wide and varied. He is the type of person I would love to sit down with and talk domains with.

I think a lot of people come down too hard on him but his response is usually measured and not a personal attack. As much as I agree with some of his opinions, I also tend to disagree with others but that is no different from anyone I engage on namepros.

So I will close by saying I very much enjoy reading his topics but I pretty well stay away from the one I started because I don't think it does justice to everything he has accomplished.

Good luck Rob and thank you for the lemonade

 

[Ategy]

Sigh .. this has really drifted off topic .. FYI people, just a few hours before Rob posted this, in an email exchange, I had mentioned that I will likely be losing my job of 23 years because of my knee issues and now after several weeks, my work insurance has decided I won't be getting any of that pay from that time because they've labelled my condition as chronic (even though the worst pains by far have been almost entirely limited to the specific movements I do at work).

What I've also mentioned on my blog and likely here and in preceding emails with Rob regarding things at Epik, is that I've also had multiple floodings, conflicts with my condo association/neighbours, uncooperative insurance, both my mom and dog have had serious health issues in the last two years (both doing better now thankfully), I had a non-domain import/export side-business lose a ton of money because our middle-man died overseas in the middle of our biggest transaction .. and then my side-business partner had a depression and left the country leaving me to pay and to handle everything .. on top of that .. the government thinks we actually made money and is after me for taxes .. and the paperwork I need was effectively lost when the middleman died in a country where there is no chance of getting it all resolved without paying more than what it would cost me to do nothing (and some other paper work was lost in my flooding).

But thankfully, aside from my grandfather who had a full life into his 90's, I haven't lost a loved one lately, nor did my ex cheat on me (as far as I know .. lol .. and while I am single, it's not an issue for me as I have too many other things to worry about for a while) .. and domains have been good to me in 2019 (unfortunately not well enough just yet for me to be ok with losing my job .. although I actually was envisioning leaving in another year or two) .. so I'm guessing he had other people in mind as well with his post and not just me, or maybe just didn't want to make me (or anyone else) feel singled out by the post so he added those other things? Either way, given the timing, I can say that this post was started with genuine on-topic intent (even if I don't have any lemons in my fridge).


As for the rest .. let me just say that sometimes in an argument .. both sides can be right .. and both sides can be wrong ..

Honestly @frank-germany .. the way you post it is extremely difficult to understand you. You often post 4-5 posts in a row .. sometimes with what looks like contradicting statements (although I guess sometimes that's a result of attempted sarcasm). I really suggest that until someone else posts after one of your posts, that you keep all your posts combined, and write in unbroken lines and sentences. Because while you often say good and relevant things, you really can't blame anyone for taking you out of context the way you write sometimes.

That being said .. you do have a right to be upset for having your information posted, and Rob definitely owes you an apology for that. But at the same time, you can't be taking that out of context either .. I'm just seeing what's linked above, but given the very likely context, he was using it in a way to say that neither of you are nazies, and not that he's trying to label you as one.

@frank-germany .. I really doubt you're a bad guy at all .. and I actually don't blame you for taking some of the things Rob has posted as being questionable. I too had my doubts about him, but have since had multiple exchanges which has let me come to understand him a bit more (even if we don't always agree). Ironically enough it was some of the posts by his former employee @Slanted that made me try to understand Rob a bit better (I was a bit invested in needing to come to a decision either way as I had started transferring domains to Epik the year before, when I had no clue about anything related to Rob in any way).

I really advise you to pick up the phone and call Rob. I'm not saying you should forgive him for anything .. but all this back and forth is really getting to be a bit much. Just try to listen to each other .. try to understand the other person's perspective .. and apologise to each other if there was any wrong doing by either or both parties. I'm not even saying either of you needs to accept the other's apology .. but for the sake of all future topics in NamePros, please take it off NamePros, or start a new topic and keep it focused there.

It's a little tough judging Rob, because there are two levels at play here. As a registrar operator, I respect his "I don't agree with what you say, but will fight for your right to say it" .. it's very clear that this is an established ingrained value of his far preceding anything to do with Gab or even Epik. So, whether you agree with his decision or not, I don't think it's fair for anyone to say any related decisions is just being an opportunist and wanting more business/money.

Also on that topic .. is that again .. there are two levels at play. Gab is clearly a hate-focused site. And while I 100% agree with Rob, in that the theory of Free Speech is foundationally important for a free democratic society .. at the same time it's an unfortunate reality that most of the internet is not about free speech.

"Free Speech" only works when harmful ideas (like racism, climate-change-denial and other forms of blind hate/ignorance) is openly and fairly challenged and debated (and ideally eventually proven to be wrong). Free Speech without confrontation, open/fair dialog and debate can indeed actually be harmful. In a self-contained, self-reinforcing tribe-like site like the Gabs of the world, while technically being open for all to participate, actually has the reality of mostly only containing one self-reinforcing side of a disgusting argument .. where there is no real debate .. no dialog .. it's just hate justifying and re-enforcing more hate.

But from a registrar stand-point .. it's about creating rules that apply to everyone without prejudice, and as long as Gab is technically open to all, then it's not really breaking the rules when nobody comes for the other side in a debate (although there certainly could indeed be hate speech/crimes which are indeed illegal in certain jurisdictions). So while it's an easy choice to personally hate sites like Gab, I can appreciate the challenge when it comes to global rules. But hate speech can't be ignored either ... but for that individual hate speech I mentioned, that I feel is more something for the courts, as I actually wouldn't feel comfortable with random registrar employees, inexperienced, and more importantly, untrained in such legal matters, to be deciding EITHER WAY whether something is appropriate or is not appropriate .. even if when at times it can and is obvious.

It's like the lawyer representing a criminal .. you want to hate them .. but without lawyers and a legally fair defence, the criminal in turn does not get a fair trial .. and in turn the entire justice system fails. While Free Speech differs quite a bit (Epik isn't actually the lawyer in this case .. they are actually the enabling of the right for people to talk) .. and you are free to agree or disagree .. but Epik is about making sure everyone has a right to speak .. while at the same time realising that there are some who will abuse the privilege .. but ultimately it's not up to them to make that judgement .. and that .. REGARDLESS as to if they agree or disagree with said content.

Again .. I'm not saying you have to agree or disagree with that .. I'm just trying to show how there can be a different perspective .. also please don't respond to this either way whether you do agree or not .. I actually understand and respect both sides of the coin here .. it is not as simple as most people would like it to be .. and I'm just trying to end the continuous back and forth that goes nowhere and does nothing but take discussions off-topic .. that being said .. if you do have something to say on the matter .. please do feel free to say it .. but PLEASE start a new topic!


*Going to take little Steamie for a nice long late-night walk .. where we will discuss his right to chase squirrels*

 

[karmaco]

The same people follow, troll and make off topic comments in every single thread started by @Rob Monster. It’s tiresome and childish. If you don’t like him don’t read or post. Simple.

As far as the tired ass Escrow argument: Afternic, Dynadot,NameSilo, all the brandable marketplaces, GoDaddy, NameBright, DAN, etc to ad nauseum, act as financial intermediaries in the sale of domain names without any escrow license. Note,only Epik was targeted and reported. That tells me all I need to know about that situation.

At the time of the controversies, I thought Rob should back down and stop posting. I was wrong. Obviously that is not in his nature and exactly what his critics here and elsewhere wanted. You can say what you like but I would trust he has domainers backs way more than any of the super big boys in this industry who should but don’t .

That desire to build not just his own but domainers wallets up and innovate is the lemonade in this year long battle to discredit him and Epik IMO.

 

[Blitzpotz]

The Namepros lemonade contains a lot of vitamins but also toxic stuff, I suppose Psychadelics. Interesting colorful personalities are acting in this place:

Visionaries who know years ahead of the crowd what will sell for a lot of money: LLL coms, Cloud, CBD.
Leaders who introduce many good things and play with their superiority by making others to marionettes of their subtle provocations.
Heroes of opinion who are never shy or opportunistic to post what they have to say. Freedom of speech is the right to do so, but you have to be brave and eloquent enough to use it.
Warriors who will never ever resist, be it against all odds.

I would be glad if this forum could continue as it is, with all those talented and crazy guys, as a place where you can learn so much and gain from others´ growth but if possible with a dash of less polemic in repeating loops. And I really would be happy to see the counterparts in some threads meet to drink a beer for peace, some not too far day.

Concluding I believe that this is the quote of the day for EVERY fellow member:

I think you should focus on the wars which are occuring in this world still TODAY.

And I am sure this sentence was not written to detract from former wars and crimes.

 

[JB Lions]

Everyone’s opinions are welcomed, but keep your comments constructive, professional, and on topic. Personal attacks and belittling of others are not tolerated.

Um, I hate to be the one that has to point this out but:

At one point when Jackson thought to engage in more of his nonsense, I let him have it, exposing Escrow.com once and for all. Matt Barrie got cute and he got a beatdown too!

Humility is a great foundation for personal growth.

You guys do tolerate it when Rob does it.

This is another self promotional thread.

Even the 2 examples used above. Again, talking about Gab again. Not sure how going from supporting some hate site to a bunch of conspiracy nonsense, with adults debating if the Earth is flat is a good look to the second example.

Where Rob said he gave Matt a beatdown. Linked to page 6 but:

You sent me a copy a few months ago when you approached me to sell Epik, remember?

That's good? You skipped the first 5 pages. Let me give you an alternate take.

I learned Escrow.com is an accredited Escrow, Epik is not.

An actual lawyer asked Rob specific questions and the response:

Long story short, we are simply operating a private registrar and marketplace. We are not tax advisors and would always encourage sellers to get capable advisors, especially in the case of a large sale.

Every individual is unique. People should consult with their financial advisor. We are a trusted intermediary between buyer and seller that combines marketplace and registrar.

As for John, I am definitely not avoiding him. In fact, I called his office earlier today and I am hoping to meet with him at NamesCon as we will both be there.

Although John did not return my call today he stated on the record that he does not work for Escrow.com.

Show attachment 108222

In the meantime, you will forgive me for not commenting on the record about this topic.

I'm not really sure what the need is to post you gave somebody a beatdown (when you didn't) or stuff like in the video that was posted yesterday, up on stage calling people Shamans and Witches.

 

[BradWilson]

Actually, I will disagree. There is wisdom in understanding that not all setbacks are setbacks.

You may have missed my intent a bit.

It was my weak attempt at humor using the quote "A rose by any other name would smell as sweet" from Shakespeare's play Romeo and Juliet to comment on the negative feedback which always seems to appear.

 

[Mister Funsky]

Thanks Funsky.

As I see it, we all have our role to play. Pharaoh, back in the day, got his ass kicked. He was controlled opposition. God hardened his heart so he could kick his ass. See here:

"But the LORD hardened the heart of Pharaoh, and he did not listen to them " - Exodus 9:12

So, I think God is using Frank to make sure these thread rank in the top so more folks can find them.

There is no other rational explanation that I can think of, other than:

"As a dog returns to his vomit, so a fool repeats his folly" - Proverbs 26:11

I guess we'll know in eternity.

Either way, I love Frank.

It is kind of you to show love to an antagonist (I am not singling anyone out here re: my prior post or this one for that matter). But coming in from a hard day dealing with a variety of frustrating situations, I genuinely wanted to see if anyone else had made a post sharing their 'lemonade' story/situation and I was greeted by so many off topic posts I just glossed over and went to the end. I will go back and see if someone made a post worth reading but really, can't the 'T's focus on just one or two threads and give us all a break on other threads that may have some meaningful info? May I suggest you start another thread for the 'T's so there is a place they can go to attack...possibly starting it with something like "Calling all Rob/Epik trolls...please post here". Clearly you can handle whatever comes your way, but when their obsession interferes with what could be an interesting and helpful thread it really gets my goat (no disrespect to goats intended here...they are fascinating creatures).

 

[BradWilson]

Troll Jokes

How do you stop an Internet troll?
Seize their memes of production.

What is the difference between a Nerd and a Troll.
Trolls were once Nerds but they went over to the Dork side.

How many trolls does it take to change a light bulb?
None; Trolls never see the light anyway.

And finally...

How many lemons does it take to light up a light bulb?
It takes at least 4 lemons to light a small light bulb. Hey, maybe a Troll could use this to see the light???

 

[Rob Monster]

Sigh .. this has really drifted off topic .. FYI people, just a few hours before Rob posted this, in an email exchange, I had mentioned that I will likely be losing my job of 23 years because of my knee issues and now after several weeks, my work insurance has decided I won't be getting any of that pay from that time because they've labelled my condition as chronic (even though the worst pains by far have been almost entirely limited to the specific movements I do at work).

What I've also mentioned on my blog and likely here and in preceding emails with Rob regarding things at Epik, is that I've also had multiple floodings, conflicts with my condo association/neighbours, uncooperative insurance, both my mom and dog have had serious health issues in the last two years (both doing better now thankfully), I had a non-domain import/export side-business lose a ton of money because our middle-man died overseas in the middle of our biggest transaction .. and then my side-business partner had a depression and left the country leaving me to pay and to handle everything .. on top of that .. the government thinks we actually made money and is after me for taxes .. and the paperwork I need was effectively lost when the middleman died in a country where there is no chance of getting it all resolved without paying more than what it would cost me to do nothing (and some other paper work was lost in my flooding).

But thankfully, aside from my grandfather who had a full life into his 90's, I haven't lost a loved one lately, nor did my ex cheat on me (as far as I know .. lol .. and while I am single, it's not an issue for me as I have too many other things to worry about for a while) .. and domains have been good to me in 2019 (unfortunately not well enough just yet for me to be ok with losing my job .. although I actually was envisioning leaving in another year or two) .. so I'm guessing he had other people in mind as well with his post and not just me, or maybe just didn't want to make me (or anyone else) feel singled out by the post so he added those other things? Either way, given the timing, I can say that this post was started with genuine on-topic intent (even if I don't have any lemons in my fridge).


As for the rest .. let me just say that sometimes in an argument .. both sides can be right .. and both sides can be wrong ..

Honestly @frank-germany .. the way you post it is extremely difficult to understand you. You often post 4-5 posts in a row .. sometimes with what looks like contradicting statements (although I guess sometimes that's a result of attempted sarcasm). I really suggest that until someone else posts after one of your posts, that you keep all your posts combined, and write in unbroken lines and sentences. Because while you often say good and relevant things, you really can't blame anyone for taking you out of context the way you write sometimes.

That being said .. you do have a right to be upset for having your information posted, and Rob definitely owes you an apology for that. But at the same time, you can't be taking that out of context either .. I'm just seeing what's linked above, but given the very likely context, he was using it in a way to say that neither of you are nazies, and not that he's trying to label you as one.

@frank-germany .. I really doubt you're a bad guy at all .. and I actually don't blame you for taking some of the things Rob has posted as being questionable. I too had my doubts about him, but have since had multiple exchanges which has let me come to understand him a bit more (even if we don't always agree). Ironically enough it was some of the posts by his former employee @Slanted that made me try to understand Rob a bit better (I was a bit invested in needing to come to a decision either way as I had started transferring domains to Epik the year before, when I had no clue about anything related to Rob in any way).

I really advise you to pick up the phone and call Rob. I'm not saying you should forgive him for anything .. but all this back and forth is really getting to be a bit much. Just try to listen to each other .. try to understand the other person's perspective .. and apologise to each other if there was any wrong doing by either or both parties. I'm not even saying either of you needs to accept the other's apology .. but for the sake of all future topics in NamePros, please take it off NamePros, or start a new topic and keep it focused there.

It's a little tough judging Rob, because there are two levels at play here. As a registrar operator, I respect his "I don't agree with what you say, but will fight for your right to say it" .. it's very clear that this is an established ingrained value of his far preceding anything to do with Gab or even Epik. So, whether you agree with his decision or not, I don't think it's fair for anyone to say any related decisions is just being an opportunist and wanting more business/money.

Also on that topic .. is that again .. there are two levels at play. Gab is clearly a hate-focused site. And while I 100% agree with Rob, in that the theory of Free Speech is foundationally important for a free democratic society .. at the same time it's an unfortunate reality that most of the internet is not about free speech.

"Free Speech" only works when harmful ideas (like racism, climate-change-denial and other forms of blind hate/ignorance) is openly and fairly challenged and debated (and ideally eventually proven to be wrong). Free Speech without confrontation, open/fair dialog and debate can indeed actually be harmful. In a self-contained, self-reinforcing tribe-like site like the Gabs of the world, while technically being open for all to participate, actually has the reality of mostly only containing one self-reinforcing side of a disgusting argument .. where there is no real debate .. no dialog .. it's just hate justifying and re-enforcing more hate.

But from a registrar stand-point .. it's about creating rules that apply to everyone without prejudice, and as long as Gab is technically open to all, then it's not really breaking the rules when nobody comes for the other side in a debate (although there certainly could indeed be hate speech/crimes which are indeed illegal in certain jurisdictions). So while it's an easy choice to personally hate sites like Gab, I can appreciate the challenge when it comes to global rules. But hate speech can't be ignored either ... but for that individual hate speech I mentioned, that I feel is more something for the courts, as I actually wouldn't feel comfortable with random registrar employees, inexperienced, and more importantly, untrained in such legal matters, to be deciding EITHER WAY whether something is appropriate or is not appropriate .. even if when at times it can and is obvious.

It's like the lawyer representing a criminal .. you want to hate them .. but without lawyers and a legally fair defence, the criminal in turn does not get a fair trial .. and in turn the entire justice system fails. While Free Speech differs quite a bit (Epik isn't actually the lawyer in this case .. they are actually the enabling of the right for people to talk) .. and you are free to agree or disagree .. but Epik is about making sure everyone has a right to speak .. while at the same time realising that there are some who will abuse the privilege .. but ultimately it's not up to them to make that judgement .. and that .. REGARDLESS as to if they agree or disagree with said content.

Again .. I'm not saying you have to agree or disagree with that .. I'm just trying to show how there can be a different perspective .. also please don't respond to this either way whether you do agree or not .. I actually understand and respect both sides of the coin here .. it is not as simple as most people would like it to be .. and I'm just trying to end the continuous back and forth that goes nowhere and does nothing but take discussions off-topic .. that being said .. if you do have something to say on the matter .. please do feel free to say it .. but PLEASE start a new topic!


*Going to take little Steamie for a nice long late-night walk .. where we will discuss his right to chase squirrels*

It is rarely possible to do justice to an @Ategy.com mega-post so I won't try, but short thoughts:

- This thread was supposed to encourage folks. The folks who rated this thread as being stupid are certainly allowed to do that but indeed this is in the break room and you guys are on the official #PartyPooper list but it is not too late to change your vote before it is memorialized.

- I appreciate that @Ategy.com shares some of his own challenges. ICYMI, the man loves to walk his dog Steamie but now has a bad knee. That sucks, but on the other hand, he is now perhaps forced to develop new hobbies or maybe investigate more about the meaning of life.

- The Gab thing is a somewhat frustrating part of my legacy. What some folks don't get is that I took a risk in drawing a line on lawful free speech. I engaged on that site, in part to make sure that they stayed on the right side of the line. I am not active there. I did meet some smart Christian Libertarians there.

As for the onward path of this thread, I think this is a suitable thread to just look for some encouragement from people who have stared into the abyss and went on to find out what was on the other side of that valley of adversity. Stay positive, keep learning, and believe the best is yet to come. I do.





-

 

[JB Lions]

You make a good point and I don't consider that trolling. But the question is whether all those who keep criticizing Rob mean to encourage him to correct some of his past mistakes or do they just want to destroy him as a person and as a Registrar. In all fairness Rob himself has already admited that perhaps he was wrong in supporting certain speech and actions made by some of the members of certain groups considering that there were no effective measures taken to keep those members inline and that he has now drawn some lines as to what he allows at Epik. As for the part that falls under free speech being exercised lawfully by certain groups that might be considered undesirable by the society at large then that is something for the courts to handle as far as what limits if any should be put on their activities. I personally see some improvements in Rob's judgment and behavior compare to when all this started and if people here like to see even more improvements in that regards then they should engage Rob in a constructive and friendly manner instead of badgering and attaking him all the time. And people should also understand that he is entitled to have his own political, religious, and racial views and beliefs just like everyone else here.

IMO

Me telling him to stick to business is the opposite of destroying a registrar. It's just good business sense. People telling him not to engage with that hate site or incel site was good advice meant to help him. He just made bad choices.

It's very simple, also goes to the question asked in this thread about those "this thread is stupid votes". Some could be jokes but I think some is:

Keep bringing up Gab on a domaining forum when it's old news. It never ends well, you figure people would have learned this by now.

The overly promotional threads started, many in the General Discussion forum, this thread itself.

The first post is all kinds of contradiction, even the last one is just flat out not true.

As far as good business sense, it just baffles me why he brings it up again, literally linking to the thread. Imagine new domainers not knowing about any of this and reading that thread. There are going to be some that just don't care, just focus on the business, cheap regs, helpful registrar etc. There are some that are going to be turned off by it, that's lost business.

 

[Rob Monster]

I have a case going on right now with Facebook. They locked us out of our account back in August. If you were wondering why the Epik FB has been dormant, that's the reason. None of the authorized administrators can login. All efforts to regain admin control have been ignored. I have a plan to turn that Facebook lemon into lemonade but if anyone has first-hand experience navigating the FB bureaucracy, I would love to hear from you because it is byzantine!

@Spencer Iacobelli

 

[vikki88]

Learn from your own and others’ mistakes,

to transcend and move forward.

well said!

 

[Rob Monster]

A lemon by any other name is still a lemon.

Actually, I will disagree. There is wisdom in understanding that not all setbacks are setbacks.

Sometimes it is a forced course correction through an unseen hand. On the other hand, if someone thinks all of life is random chance, that of course does not make a ton of sense.

The thrust of my OP is that not some "setbacks" can be a catalyst for positive change, or an invitation to move forward in faith, even if it is through resistance or against an opposing force.

Every situation is different so I shared some guiding principles that may or may not apply to whatever adversity someone is facing. Maybe it helps someone.

 

[biggie]

Hi

I think some like sucking on lemons, and turning that juice into $ for whom they serve

Back in March 2019, a few people in the domain industry thought it would be a good idea to chastise me for protecting lawful free speech. This happened in blogs and also here on NamePros. I am not sure about their intention, but whoever was condemning me, ended up making me a lot more popular. In short, my response to being condemned was to engage with authenticity, and to let the crowd conclude for themselves if the manufactured consensus actually held any water. Well, many of you know how that worked out. Much to the chagrin of my harshest critics, Epik has gone from strength to strength as we co-create without care for who makes money or who gets credit.

the above is mostly about me, me and then it becomes epik
yet, there seems to be no separation between the two

is that all there is to, or for you?

- Be authentic:

I don't see it, in comparison to opening paragraph below

From time to time, I feel moved to start a thread that I think might help one person in particular. However, considering the collective wisdom of many independent thinkers, this might also help others.

don't see how it's a help thread, if you revert back to a controversial subject to make an illustration.

it's your choice for sure, but why not use an experience that doesn't involve epik?
or was it because you didn't have any lemons, before yall came together?

- Find your tribe:

I think we know where the tribe is.

glad this is in break section!

imo...