Sedo wants me to unlock the domain and send them the auth code?

[poker_bears]

I just sold a domain via Sedo for high $$$. They want me to unlock the domain and send them the auth code. That doesn't sound very safe. Per their TOS, they're supposed to provide escrow.

A few months ago I sold a domain through them for high $$$$. I pushed the domain to their broker, they pushed it to the seller. I basically told them this is how it will work with this sale as well, or there is no sale.

Is this how they operate with small sales? I'm considering pulling all of my domains off Sedo.

Simply unlocking the domain and sending them the auth code seems really REALLY unsafe....

 

[discobull]

because it looks like the domain is mine and I still have control of it and own it. But it is not in my account and I do not control it.

So? In this case it would be in Sedo's account and they would know it's in their account because it's in their account even though your name shows up on the whois. If you think that Sedo would steal from you, that's another story, but in that case I'm not sure why you'd be using them as your escrow service in the first place.

 

[Bearded Goat]

I am not sure how this became a back and forth. I barely care.

 

[carob]

Can you point me to where it says this in their TOS? I'm not finding it. What I did find says:

" Sedo acts as a secure intermediary and will securely hold the purchase price for the Buyer while the
Seller transfers ownership of the Domain to Buyer. "

https://sedo.com/us/about-us/policies/terms-of-use/

5.2.2. Fees and Related Costs
The Domain Transfer and Escrow Service are provided for free to Buyers and Sellers conducting a purchase and sale on Sedo's Domain Marketplace

If they do not actually take possession of the domain it is not an escrow service.

 

[discobull]

I am not sure how this became a back and forth. I barely care.

Simple. It became a back and forth because you wrote "Because when you push from account to account, it locks the domain for 60 days." and that isn't true. I thought it worthwhile to point out that the 60 day lock can be avoided. There was nothing personal about it. Cheers.

 

[discobull]

https://sedo.com/us/about-us/policies/terms-of-use/



If they do not actually take possession of the domain it is not an escrow service.

Ok, thanks, but I'm not sure your argument holds up legally since they further define what their escrow service does and doesn't include.

 

[Bearded Goat]

@discobull ..... I have myself offered to push a domain to sedo without changing whois details as I had a buyer who we were waiting and waiting and waiting to reply if they had a godaddy account and sedo said no. So while technically you can avoid the lock, sedo does not seem to like to do this either. Every sale I have had with a godaddy domain where buyer wanted domain elsewhere, I have had to provide the code for transfer.

 

[discobull]

@discobull ..... I have myself offered to push a domain to sedo without changing whois details as I had a buyer who we were waiting and waiting and waiting to reply if they had a godaddy account and sedo said no. So while technically you can avoid the lock, sedo does not seem to like to do this either. Every sale I have had with a godaddy domain where buyer wanted domain elsewhere, I have had to provide the code for transfer.

I understand, and I'm not debating that. I just wanted to clarify for those that don't know it that you can in fact move domains from one account to another without triggering a 60 day lock.

 

[Domainace]

When doing a sale via Escrow, you always push the domain to the Escrow account, then they push it to the buyer.

Not entirely true. The last name I sold via Escrow.com was unlocked and transferred directly to the buyer, as you are doing with Sedo. The only difference is that Escrow is a USA bonded service, whereas Sedo (as far as I know) is not.

If you trust Sedo enough to push names through their account, then I don't see much difference between that and transferring direct to the buyer while Sedo holds the funds. Pretty standard stuff. If you don't trust Sedo to handle this, then you probably shouldn't be using their service.

 

[m0ss]

There used to be no lock on a domain when you push a domain at Godaddy. Recently they have instituted a 10 day lock to prevent domain theft.

 

[carob]

If you trust Sedo enough to push names through their account, then I don't see much difference between that and transferring direct to the buyer while Sedo holds the funds. Pretty standard stuff. If you don't trust Sedo to handle this, then you probably shouldn't be using their service.

I don't think the issue is whether you trust Sedo, it's whether you trust that the buyer will take control of the name in a way that Sedo can verify so that Sedo can then pay you. And that the buyer will do so in a timely way - some have trouble with transfers and even don't collect names they paid for.

If the buyer delays taking control of the name, payment to you is delayed until they do.

If buyer's details do not appear in whois, or yours stay there, Sedo can choose not to pay you.

BTW, someone on here caught an expiring name dropped by Sedo's transfer/escrow service after an 8k reported sale. The domain was then happily sold again for 8k. And the other day I saw a domain sell in a live auction at Sedo where the whois showed Sedo's transfer service as the registrant during the auction.

 

[discobull]

BTW, someone on here caught an expiring name dropped by Sedo's transfer/escrow service after an 8k reported sale. The domain was then happily sold again for 8k. And the other day I saw a domain sell in a live auction at Sedo where the whois showed Sedo's transfer service as the registrant during the auction.

I don't know if you're talking about someone else's sale, but that exact thing happened to me just a couple of weeks ago. What's interesting to me about that scenario is that the only explanation I can imagine for Sedo escrow dropping a domain is that some buyer apparently paid $8k for a domain that he never bothered to collect ( If anyone can suggest another explanation, I'd love to hear it ). I guess your point is that since Sedo was in possession of the domain, the seller got paid and that that would not have happened if the seller had been transferring the domain directly to the buyer since the buyer would never have received it. My own experience, however, suggests that that isn't the case.

I once sold a domain for $5k where the buyer paid Sedo and I was supposed to transfer the domain directly to the buyer, but after 2 weeks of waiting and repeatedly badgering Sedo I still hadn't received a transfer request. According to the Sedo escrow agent, the buyer was claiming that he was in fact initiating the transfer and even resubmitting it repeatedly but that I wasn't authorizing the request. Since the transfer in question was from GoDaddy to Moniker, I attempted to transfer another of my domains between those two registrars to see if there were any problems. There weren't. My test transfer happened smoothly within an hour. The paranoid in me was suspecting that the buyer had had a change of heart and was deliberately trying to sabotage the deal so that he could get his money back and blame me for not delivering the domain, but I can't know for sure if that's what was going on.

In any case, what happened next is that Sedo asked me to change the email address in the whois to their own address so that they could approve the transfer request themselves. Of course, they didn't get one either since none was ever being emailed. Once they were able to confirm that the problem was on the buyer's side, Sedo asked me to push the domain into their own account after which I did get paid. So yes, there was a delay of a couple of weeks before I got my money, but I didn't end up getting screwed. I think that once Sedo gets paid, it's a pretty sure thing that the seller is going to get paid too no matter what. I agree that it would be better if Sedo took possession of the domain 100% of the time, but I'm not at the point yet where I worry that not doing so presents a major problem. I'd be interested to hear of stories that suggest otherwise...

 

[poker_bears]

I don't think the issue is whether you trust Sedo, it's whether you trust that the buyer will take control of the name in a way that Sedo can verify so that Sedo can then pay you.

Thank you. I'm stunned at some of the replies in this thread saying that you should simply trust Sedo. You can absolutely trust Sedo if you push the domain directly to them. If you blindly unlock the domain and email the auth code, there are numerous ways you can get ripped off. I'm amazed that people don't see that.

I'm not going to list them all, but the classic scam is that the buyer takes the domain, changes the who-is back to the seller's info and claims they never received the domain. Buyer gets refund plus domain. This is impossible if you push directly to the Escrow service as the seller has proof that the domain has been delivered.

 

[discobull]

I'm not going to list them all, but the classic scam is that the buyer takes the domain, changes the who-is back to the seller's info and claims they never received the domain. Buyer gets refund plus domain.

I'm skeptical that that could be pulled off so easily. Do you know of any instance where that scam was successful, or are you just concerned about it because it seems possible?

 

[poker_bears]

I'm skeptical that that could be pulled off so easily. Do you know of any instance where that scam was successful, or are you just concerned about it because it seems possible?

I'm not here to do your homework. This should be common sense...

 

[discobull]

I'm not here to do your homework. This should be common sense...

I'm guessing that your gratuitous rudeness is due to the fact that no, you don't know of any instance that this scam was successful, but that you lack the character to acknowledge this fact. Noted.

 

[poker_bears]

I'm guessing that your gratuitous rudeness is due to the fact that no, you don't know of any instance that this scam was successful, but that you lack the character to acknowledge this fact. Noted.

Hey, I'm sorry if I hurt your feelings, it's 3am and I'm up with a sick toddler here.

That said, figure it out on your own. Just wow...

 

[discobull]

Hey, I'm sorry if I hurt your feelings, it's 3am and I'm up with a sick toddler here.

That said, figure it out on your own. Just wow...

What's to figure out? You've either heard of a case or you haven't. I'm not a mind reader and since I've never heard of a case myself despite researching it, I'd be interested to know if such a thing has ever actually happened. I'm sure other people would be interested too so I'm not sure why you're reluctant to answer.

Anyway, good luck with the toddler.

 

[carob]

You've either heard of a case or you haven't. I'm not a mind reader and since I've never heard of a case myself despite researching it, I'd be interested to know if such a thing has ever actually happened.

I'd also be interested to know - I don't know of a known case either but that does not mean it hasn't happened or couldn't happen. There are threads on here about people actually getting scammed on Paypal and the risks (are there cases?) of being screwed selling via Escrow.com. Nothing stops scammers reading threads like this.

Really this thread is about risk - I prefer to get paid as fast as possible with as little risk as possible, but others may be ok with accepting more risk and responsibility and slower payment. I've also sometimes had things go very slowly due to incorrect authcodes and having to re-request, regenerate or resubmit authcodes.

BTW to change the registrant name on a .co.uk domain costs £12 so changing it to Sedo and then the buyer's name would cost £24 and similar could apply with some other extensions, so I wouldn't assume all extensions work the same.

Could this thread be made sticky?

 

[discobull]

I'd also be interested to know - I don't know of a known case either but that does not mean it hasn't happened or couldn't happen. There are threads on here about people actually getting scammed on Paypal and the risks (are there cases?) of being screwed selling via Escrow.com. Nothing stops scammers reading threads like this.

Really this thread is about risk - I prefer to get paid as fast as possible with as little risk as possible, but others may be ok with accepting more risk and responsibility and slower payment. I've also sometimes had things go very slowly due to incorrect authcodes and having to re-request, regenerate or resubmit authcodes.

BTW to change the registrant name on a .co.uk domain costs £12 so changing it to Sedo and then the buyer's name would cost £24 and similar could apply with some other extensions, so I wouldn't assume all extensions work the same.

Could this thread be made sticky?

I agree that it would be better if all domains went into escrow, but the reality that we live in is that that option is not available on some deals handled by most of the marketplaces. It's not just Sedo that operates this way, it's also Afternic and DomainNameSales and Flippa, etc.. So, before deciding to forego income in the interest of avoiding risk, I think it's worth exploring whether the real world risk is as high as the perceived risk. That's why I'm asking whether these seemingly possible scams ever actually happen, and, if so, to what extent.

I think it's also worth remembering that in the case where these scams were successful and money was refunded and domains essentially stolen, that in addition to our own losses Sedo et al would also be losing out on their commissions. That suggests to me that if this was really a widespread problem, these marketplaces would no longer be conducting business this way since it would be hurting their bottom line.

At the end of the day, I'm not happy to be put in the position of having to deliver domains this way, but since alternative options are not really available and since I've so far managed to successfully complete many transactions this way without incurring any losses, to me it's worth taking the risk. Others can decide for themselves whether they feel the same way...

 

[DNVantage]

If you blindly unlock the domain and email the auth code, there are numerous ways you can get ripped off.

I'm not going to list them all, but the classic scam is that the buyer takes the domain, changes the who-is back to the seller's info and claims they never received the domain. Buyer gets refund plus domain. This is impossible if you push directly to the Escrow service as the seller has proof that the domain has been delivered.

This is too easy a scam and if it has not been happened/reported, it will. Even if it has happened a few times, which escrow service is going to blog about this.

I have raised this before in First time Escrow.com transaction, Need help!!

Take the other side, whats preventing a rogue seller from giving the auth code to the buyer but having the domain transferred to someone else and claiming buyer transferred the domain away?

For a sale of $xxx to low $x,xxx, which escrow service or bank ( based on complain from an escrow service ) will put time and effort to prove the buyer has the domain or the seller did not transfer the domain to the buyer. AFAIK, In countries like USA, banks favor the buyer and will revert the amount back to their card unless the escrow service can prove the buyer got the goods. This probably is the case with other developed countries.

For high value sales, say $10K+, I doubt an escrow service will ask they seller to provide EPP directly to a buyer. So why skip this responsibility for low value sales, when fees charged are same percentage.

From the replies in this thread, it is clear, many seller's are comfortable with this, but it does not mean this might not happen. Guess it is about how much risk one wants to take.

I can understand all tlds cannot be escrowed but if an escrow service does not escrow a domain that can be escrowed (specially .com/.net/.org domains), to me it is like saying that only the buyer can be trusted, which is pretty much insulting the seller. This by itself is offending.

This is a question, sellers need to ask themselves, why are they OK with this? Why do they not insist with escrow provider, the domain also be escrowed ( for tlds possible ). Does the escrow provider not want your sales? This is a major point and the escrow provider that always does domain escrow by default for same/reasonable fees, will see seller preferring their platform.

As for me, I am not rich enough to take this risk, I will decline the sale to an unknown end-user if escrow service does not care to provide domain escrow.

Maybe seller should get 50% discount on fees when domain is also not escrowed.